Cirrus casino - troubles (long story)

[scrollock]

here's a proof that the account belongs to me (Daniel Wilson). This is a complemant to my other proof right down under this one.

you were called "Bengt" in your opening post

 

[Jurgent]

I know. But I've never felt them to be reputable.

jurgent no reputable casino would ever let you play under age, casinos dont set the age limit, the law of their respective country does. plus the fact that she asked if you were making a large deposit should of set off alarms bells.

Like I have mentioned before - I can die for this. I will never ever settle with less than what they owe me. There are a lot of things I can do:
contact Swedish media, media of Costa rica, Goverment of Costa rica, go down to costa rica and met these people head to head etc.
I know all these things sounds silly but all of these are worth a try.

i think you should consider yourself lucky that you have got your money back and you should leave it at that and treat the whole experience as a valuable lesson learnt.

Before I deposited, I thought Cirrus was the only one to "trust" by those. I had heard that people were getting paid and all that. I did a true mistake.

In Sweden, the age limit is 18 for internet casinos. So I dont know if their 21 rule is some law. I think it's only their policy.
I know I shouldn't have tried that proxy program since I now know these are illegal, but I used it for maybe 5-10 mins. I had just downloaded it and had no intentions of fooling Cirrus during the chat. Or what so ever.

a) dont ever play at virtual,cirrus,cool cat,prism

b) if a casino has an age limit, then walk away, no reputable casino will break the law of the country in which it resides

c) as you reside in scandinavia, dont mess about with proxy servers when playing at a casino.
.

Christine I had seen my posts at bonuswhores before I deposited and she never said anything about it.
Yes, usually they are but since I had thought people were getting paid....

d) admitting to being a member of bonus whores, will only result in you not getting paid, not the other way round

e) dont use the same handle on different forums, you will never know when a post will comeback to haunt you, ive seen it happen on here on many occasions

f) i had a look at bonus whores and seen the "bonus offer" you took with them, well simple fact is ,if something looks to good to be true then it usually is.
.

He IS a real friend. Not some kind of "gnome" or anything like that. We do not even have similiar IP, we only have same server - same broadband company.
I called my friend about this today and he said his computer had crashed (actually after playing at cirrus) so he wasn't able to do much for the moment but that he would try to fix his computer any day soon. Then he will be able to get into all of this. We'll probably meet and have a discussion about this.

g) you mention that a "friend" is waiting to be paid aswell, well you should always wait for your "friend" to be paid first before you take the plunge yourself.

simple fact is that this group and its sister casinos, make their money by offering what in effect are no risk bonuses, the bonuses are "no risk" becasue they are "no risk" for the casino as no-one is ever paid out for them.

i would put people who fall for these bonuses on the same intelligence level as those who are gullible to fall for the nigerian email scams and letters about lotteries wins for something which you had even entered.

 

[Jurgent]

you were called "Bengt" in your opening post

Easy to explain. All this have gone worse since I started to talk with Christine for the first time. One thing has lead to another and so on.

My name is Daniel BENGT Wilson. When I had the screenname "Bengt" it was only because I got the impression that Christine had closed the chat the minutes before and that she didn't wanted to talk with me. I tried to connect the chat but couldn't get any answer and got up the "leave a message" window.
What I did? well I tried one of my other names (bengt) to see if that helped. I explained this to Carlos later on the chat.
This also sounds stupid by I really thought they didn't wanted to answer me. It felt like that.

 

[Jurgent]

Proof nr.2.

 

[jetset]

Have you submitted a complaint to Montana yet?

You sound kinda immature and inexperienced despite your BW membership. If you do go to Costa Rica be advised that things down there can get hairy, especially with outfits associated with this one, as the SBR guys found recently!

QUOTE: Like I have mentioned before - I can die for this. I will never ever settle with less than what they owe me. There are a lot of things I can do:
contact Swedish media, media of Costa rica, Goverment of Costa rica, go down to costa rica and met these people head to head etc.
I know all these things sounds silly but all of these are worth a try.UNQUOTE

Good luck with all of the above - you'll need it.

 

[Macgyver]

simple fact is that this group and its sister casinos, make their money by offering what in effect are no risk bonuses, the bonuses are "no risk" becasue they are "no risk" for the casino as no-one is ever paid out for them.

i would put people who fall for these bonuses on the same intelligence level as those who are gullible to fall for the nigerian email scams and letters about lotteries wins for something which you had even entered.

I take offense at that last comment.

I've played Cirrus before and had decent conversations with Christine actually. Implying that my intelligence is sub-standard just on the fact that I've played there seems to only show the intelligence (or blanket generalization) of the poster.

I think jurgent is going to have problems because he played underage, but a "wise player" (pun intended) can play at some of these places and withdraw money with the only problem being the week to 2-week time it takes the money to make it to NETeller.

 

[scrollock]

macgyver, i wasnt try to offend anyone, as i myself have played at cirrus, in fact that was the first casino i ever played, i had a bad experience and learnt from it and have never had any trouble since as i always make sure a casino has a 100% good reputation.

but i have seen around the various boards on the internet, that when there is discussion about cirrus, virtual et al. you do tend to be a lone voice in a sea of discontent.

as for the under age business, i was quite intersted to see that on the other site, jurgent mentions that all of a sudden he has been getting some high bonus offers from virtual and others. he wonders where they have all started coming from, well jurgent they come from cirrus, yes the casino that is trying to rip you off at the moment. that is how crooked these guys are. as i said they basically work like the lottery/email scams, because you have been sucked in once they see you as an easy target and are trying to hook you in again.

so if they are not going to be paying him because he is underage , then why are the sister casinos to cirrus sending him bonus offers now, when they refusing to pay at another.

 

[Jurgent]

I have got confirmed their adress lol
at least I know where they have their head office.... it's pay time.
My search on this "cirrus-team" will continue.

 

[caruso]

The "approved" listing isn't exactly binding to the casino. They can claim, with justification or without, that since the "approval" facts came to light to change the situation. In fact, I had a similar issue in my own Cirrus dispute of 18 months ago, where a 2K installment was approved and then cancelled (disputed promo terms) - but subsequently approved again and sent.

If I dont get my money, I'll go down to costa rica myself. I'm gonna find their adress. I'm absolutely serious. Not gonna give up on this one. Never.

It may be the last thing you do. What a bunch of Costa Rican thugs can do to a group of savvy SBR journalists they can do twenty times more drastically to one Swedish fella (or lassie). In the event you were seriously contemplating this course of action, I suggest you drop it fast.

 

[Jurgent]

never mind the "declined" withdrawals. Christine had put 3k to my withdrawal request instead of the 2k I had put. Then the accounting department probably took away the 1k because they didn't know about this.

This is what I will do:

Try to reach Christine to get an explanation and then try to make piece with her. But their phone nr leads me to a fax machine and the live chat is for the moment offline.
My friend Daniel Nilsson and I will try fix his computer tomorrow and then he will send documents to them etc. We are also going to find as much evidents as we can. But like I said; I would first like to know what the reason is.

If non of this still doesnt help then hopefully Bryan can have a word with Christine. I don't know.
Otherwise I'll have to go to montana disputes.

Next step is then to do everything else I've told about.
But that's the last option.

And no, I'm not afraid of Costa rica thugs or something like that.

 

[Jurgent]

Mia has told me to tell I lied about everything. And that I should appologize for calling Christine an Idiot. I appologize.

 

[slotchik]

This is the one thing that does NOT make sense to me:

Why in HELL would you refer a friend to a casino in which you have not gotten paid from??????

I know when I refer people to a casino, it's because I've had great experiences with them.

Something doesn't seem right..

 

[slotchik]

Mia has told me to tell I lied about everything. And that I should appologize for calling Christine an Idiot. I appologize.

WHAT????????????????????? so now they are telling you to ADMIT you lied in order to be paid.......????????!!!!!!!!

 

[Jurgent]

They say I have insulted everyone and told lies about them and that I might have a chance to solve this out if I officially tell this.

So that's what I'm doing now

 

[KasinoKing]

They say I have insulted everyone and told lies about them and that I might have a chance to solve this out if I officially tell this.

So that's what I'm doing now

Wow! I guess they're really are worried about you flying out to Costa Rica and beating them up!

Seriously, I hope you get paid what you are due, if indeed everthing you say is true.

 

[Jurgent]

Wow! I guess they're really are worried about you flying out to Costa Rica and beating them up!

Seriously, I hope you get paid what you are due, if indeed everthing you say is true.

Thanks for believing me. I'll keep you updated.

Dont know if they're afraid of getting officially rouged.. I mean, they gotta be afraid of something because otherwise they wouldn't have threatened me like that.

 

[Jurgent]

Okey.. I have tried to make peace - didnt work. Christine is only telling me lies all the time. She says I have faked my personal info and age, she denys that she has given me permission to play despite the 21 rule. She has given me so many lies now and I'm sick and tired of it. It's nothing but a waste of time to speak with these people.

They think they can come up with any rule they want to (well they can in fact). Take a look at this:

 

[Jurgent]

And what about herself? maybe SHE is the one who has faked identity...

 

[GOCC]

While I have followed this thread with interest and questioned the posters "Motives" shall we say, the proffsionalism of the casino smells of a badly run sweat shop.

Just looking at the postings by Christine with the "he he he" comment just reminds of the school yard when I pick the little boy up from nursery

 

[thesmiler]

Well, I'm not really comfortable in siding with Cirrus, but something smells fishy here.
Let's forget about that underage thing, Christine might even have that character to allow that play (for a big deposit), since she still in her 20s as well. And I think other Costa Ricans allow you to play from 18, so that shouldn't be a big deal for licensing reasons as well (but I don't know really, since I'm over 21).

But then there are two other things. I never heard that any Internet provider recommends you to use a proxy somewhere out of the country. If someone does, I'd like to know the name. So the only reason to use a proxy/anonymizer whatever should be to cover your real identity.

Then there is this "friend". Well I have a friend who plays online casino, lived near me, we were on the same provider, and playing the same casinos sometimes, since we spoke about them, even ones not that reputable. And I never had anyone causing me any problems because of this, never someone claiming we were the same person. I wonder why. Perhaps because we are different persons, with different playing style, each communicating their own way via e-mail or Live Chat and on the telephone. Everyone knowing exactly what he was doing when asked because we are both genuine players.

I know Cirrus likes to call players, so did they call both of you? By doing that, and chatting a bit with you on the phone, they should be able to figure out if it was one or two persons playing. By claiming you might be the same person, they might have some reasons for that. And that proxy thing helps in suspecting.
And then suddenly, the computer of "your friend" is broken, and you will try to fix it. You couldn't have scan and sent the data from your computer, or faxing it, right? Sounds fishy as well, like you were trying to "fix" something else than his computer.

I don't know, there are so many things that time, why should we believe you in all of these issues?

 

[Jurgent]

The underage thing is ridicilous. To first give permission and then totally deny they've done so.

Since Im honest: the reason for trying a proxy was curiousity. I had heard about proxy programs and just wanted to try one, but never ever had I any intention at all to fraud any casino or anyone else. That's why I shut down the program when I realized it was on.

We have never had any problems before either. We have done exactly the same thing; called eachother to talk about casinos and stuffs like that. No casino has ever got suspicious because of our similiar names or same broadband provider.

If Cirrus was a reputable casino, they probably would have called us both and given us the chance to prove that we actually ARE different persons.
Christine claims she has called Daniel Nilsson but that the phone number he had submitted was false. Now, I have to check this with my friend, but I dont think he would use a false phone nr.
Never have they tried to call me. In fact, I have tried to call them several times but their number only takes me to a fax machine.

Is is unusual that a computer crashes?
I know a little bit more about computers than my friend do so that's why I'm gonna help him.
Please... do you think THAT would have helped? to send the documents from my IP and everything... Jesus. That would only make it worse.
He will post here tomorrow from his computer and we will post our IPs and everything. This "hell" has only been on for 1-2 days. Its not that easy to prove all these accuses in that short of time.

Christine has come with so many stupid claims. She tells me about someone who's 18 and named the same as Daniel N. She think they're the same person.
All her claims are nothing but lies.

Because I have proofs - Cirrus has not.
You can also put it the other way; why would you believe Cirrus?

I don't know, there are so many things that time, why should we believe you in all of these issues?

 

[caruso]

The minimum age business is bizarre. I understand you may have been encouraged to deposit by the casino, and if that could be proved I think they might find themselves in hot water with RTG, but the legality / morality of that aspect aside, why would you do this when a rule clearly states you must be at least 21? You're inviting them to screw you.

Your pugnacious attitude in all this is also completely the wrong way to go about it. I know how frustrating it is, but threatening to get on a plane to Costa Rica to go and beat them up (implicit if not stated) is counter-productive to say the least. You give them absolutely no reason to cooperate. True, if you're in the right (the possibility of which isn't helped by the minimum age issue) you don't technically need to be cooperative, but there is such a thing as diplomacy and tact - which you don't have a whole lot of (speaking as a fellow tactless non-diplomat). You're shooting yourself in the foot. Chill out and let Bryan help if he can.

 

[Jurgent]

Well, they claim I have submitted false identity and I still have the email with security documents that I sended them. I also have a sign up confirmation and personal emails from Christine with rules of a bonus offer, but I dont know what they would prove. The strongest evidence for the age rule, is probably the fact that they approved my withdrawal request, wich I have screenshots off. Without security documents they wouldnt have approved it. But then of course, they can probably show a false ID or something just to screw me some more. God knows what they are able to.

I'm now much more calm then I was before. I will no longer even contact them because they make me sick. Although Andr seems to be the only normal person there.
All this has now gone to level/stage nr 2.

It's not a threat to go down to their office or something like that. It would have been a threat if I told I would bet'em up or something, but I have never said such thing. Just because I may say something like: "you will pay for this in one or another way", it doesnt have to mean in a violence or illegal way.


But thanks for your advices.

 

[dickens1298]

Wow.. just finished reading this thread. One misses a lot in the span of a week!

So the original poster admittedly lied about his age, in blatant violation of the casino's rules. The casino has decided to withhold the winnings and bonus, yet return the deposit.

So..the original poster is made whole as if this entire business never took place, right?

So why does he feel that he has the right to complain?

It seems a salient point is that "Christine" gave him "permission" to play despite being underage. Try applying this logic to a brick-and-mortar casino. If you enter the Venetian, ask a supervisor if it would be okay to play the slots even though you're 20, and are given the "ok" and proceed to win the jackpot....I seriously doubt that the casino would allow you to keep the money. Most likely result would be: (1) a refund of the funds wagered and (2) the prompt firing of said supervisor. In the Cirrus case, (1) but not (2) was effected. Seems rather equitable to me.

And his virtual "stomping" of the feet and threatening to fly to Costa Rica would be simply preposterous, if it wasn't rather amusing.

 

[jetset]

Far be it from me to defend a dump like Cirrus, but I have an uncomfortable feeling about this case, and like other experienced posters here I feel there is something fishy going on. I suspect that goes beyond the age thing, which on its own is grounds for disquiet.

Among the several other red flags that have been identified here is this statement by the complainant: "Christine claims she has called Daniel Nilsson but that the phone number he had submitted was false. Now, I have to check this with my friend, but I dont think he would use a false phone nr."

It's just another worrying aspect that might indicate we are all being taken for a little ride by some obviously young and not very moral students who have known all along that they were pushing their luck.

Just as a postscript - the content of the complaint aside, I agree that (assuming Daniel's posts are "unedited") the casino's responses have been way less than professional.