Can a casino set its own RTP on a game or is it down to the manufacturer ?

[nikantw]

Keep in mind that a bad month is not proof of lower RTP settings. If I can have 100% after 34,000 spins on a 89% game, 80% or 70% over 100,000 spins on a 96% one is much easier.



I just wish more accredited casinos had a tool like this.

 

[PaaskeDenmark]

Keep in mind that a bad month is not proof of lower RTP settings. If I can have 100% after 34,000 spins on a 89% game, 80% or 70% over 100,000 spins on a 96% one is much easier.

View attachment 94872

I just wish more accredited casinos had a tool like this.

Does this rtp stats actually work at videoslots?? mine seems all over the places no matter what slot i look at. And searching does not show anything correctly...

Examples are like Vikings go Wild my rtp is 1970.00%

and in Divine Fortune its 3.71% overall I know these figures in no way is correct. Reason i am asking also when we play freerolls surely that will mess up those figures unless only real play counts.

 

[nikantw]

Does this rtp stats actually work at videoslots?? mine seems all over the places no matter what slot i look at. And searching does not show anything correctly...

Examples are like Vikings go Wild my rtp is 1970.00%

and in Divine Fortune its 3.71% overall I know these figures in no way is correct. Reason i am asking also when we play freerolls surely that will mess up those figures unless only real play counts.

There are some problems, like results not loading or fs with wrong RTP. But most times it works fine.
Besides you can track each spin with this and do the calculations by yourself to check it out.
Go to "view", set period of time and look the seasons below.

 

[ESCJAMIE]

Exactly my RTP on videoslots seems to be VERY out

 

[nikantw]

Exactly my RTP on videoslots seems to be VERY out

For real? I mean did you calculate your seasons RTP from your wagering and total payouts and then saw what "my rtp" is saying for that season and it was very different?
You can also calculate the RTP using your wagering and your loss.

The reason I ask for this is that 2% lower RTP means half playtime, so it is impossible to caculate RTP based on a "feeling".
And if we go to VS and say "I feel it is way off" they will think we are just problem gamblers (that is how all CS agents are advised to respond to claims of low RTP) and do nothing.
But if we have evidence that it is indeed way off, then there is a chance they will fix whatever the problem is.

 

[ESCJAMIE]

Yeah for example I play Bonanaza alot and get good wins from it on base and bonus but somehow it says

Bonanza 36.47% RTP

I mean thats seems very low.

 

[nikantw]

Yeah for example I play Bonanaza alot and get good wins from it on base and bonus but somehow it says

Bonanza 36.47% RTP

I mean thats seems very low.

Ok, can you post a pic? This is mine



You can adjust the dates and see how the numbers change and if it makes sense.
Then you can scroll down and press "view" to your latest season to see how it was. You can calculate RTP simply by asking support about your wagering, as long as you have starting / end balance.

 

[trancemonkey]

The one major gripe i have with this is:
How many People do actually check the Paytable to see if the RTP is the same as on other sites? I would guess that quite a few people if not even the majority of players do not know that some providers even offer different RTP options. They see Book of Dead on two sites and -- rightfully so -- expect it to be the same Game. Only one might be running on a lowered RTP which might make them not wanna play the Game.

#sarcasm_on

Just like when you see two Audi A4's next to each other - you expect them to be the same car right? You certainly don't expect that one might have a better a better engine than the other - i mean Audi should only supply one engine size for an A4 right? And god help if they have different things inside... i mean, all cars should come with exactly the same spec right?

#sarcasm_off

 

[dunover]

they look the same,

#sarcasm_on

Just like when you see two Audi A4's next to each other - you expect them to be the same car right? You certainly don't expect that one might have a better a better engine than the other - i mean Audi should only supply one engine size for an A4 right? And god help if they have different things inside... i mean, all cars should come with exactly the same spec right?

#sarcasm_off

Yes, take Bonanza - I get the supercharged twin-turbo 2.0i version with leather upholstery and 196 brake whereas Jono gets the 2.0d with nylon seat covers and 150 brake.

Actually it's not a great analogy as to buy my model you'd have to pay more than Jono's and you can immediately see they're different, whereas in slots they look the same, people pay the same a spin and expect the same product.

 

[trancemonkey]

they look the same,


Yes, take Bonanza - I get the supercharged twin-turbo 2.0i version with leather upholstery and 196 brake whereas Jono gets the 2.0d with nylon seat covers and 150 brake.

Actually it's not a great analogy as to buy my model you'd have to pay more than Jono's and you can immediately see they're different, whereas in slots they look the same, people pay the same a spin and expect the same product.

Only it IS a good analogy, because they are playing at completely different casinos.

If i go in to Waitrose, i will likely pay more for a loaf of Warburtons than if i go in to Tesco and buy it - they are identical products, but one is more expensive than the other. The consumers know this, so it's their choice. So if i go to one casino, why should the expectation be that it will "cost me" (in terms of RTP) the same as at another when this simply doesn't happen in life. It's why we have so many price comparison sites....

To say every casino should run the exact same game is just nonsensical i'm afraid and would create an unfair playing field. It should be, as it is, up to each casino to decide what RTP they run the games at. The RTP's are displayed in all UKGC licenced casinos. It's down to the player to decide whether he's happy with it.

Now you could argue that it should be easier to find this out, but that's a different conversation...

It would be great if someone could keep an active list of the RTP of every game at every site.... the ultimate casino comparison site...

 

[dunover]

Only it IS a good analogy, because they are playing at completely different casinos.

If i go in to Waitrose, i will likely pay more for a loaf of Warburtons than if i go in to Tesco and buy it - they are identical products, but one is more expensive than the other. The consumers know this, so it's their choice. So if i go to one casino, why should the expectation be that it will "cost me" (in terms of RTP) the same as at another when this simply doesn't happen in life. It's why we have so many price comparison sites....

To say every casino should run the exact same game is just nonsensical i'm afraid and would create an unfair playing field. It should be, as it is, up to each casino to decide what RTP they run the games at. The RTP's are displayed in all UKGC licenced casinos. It's down to the player to decide whether he's happy with it.

Now you could argue that it should be easier to find this out, but that's a different conversation...

It would be great if someone could keep an active list of the RTP of every game at every site.... the ultimate casino comparison site...

It isn't because the loaf of Warburtons looks exactly the same in whichever store you go in, as it's made by that manufacturer. Now if Warburton's decide to supply Waitrose with the usual 800g loaf and then Tesco with a 750g loaf in the same packaging, you'd expect it to be clearly marked on the packaging so you could evaluate the item BEFORE you decided to purchase it....

 

[trancemonkey]

It isn't because the loaf of Warburtons looks exactly the same in whichever store you go in, as it's made by that manufacturer. Now if Warburton's decide to supply Waitrose with the usual 800g loaf and then Tesco with a 750g loaf in the same packaging, you'd expect it to be clearly marked on the packaging so you could evaluate the item BEFORE you decided to purchase it....

And the RTP is shown to the player.... But admittedly on some games is hard to find.

We will have to agree to disagree on this one...

 

[orion]

if a casino (generally speaking, not in the UK) for some reason sets the TRTP to a lower value (let's say 91% instead of top-setting 96%), then who should take the responsability to update the "info file" in the game with the actual/real TRTP value ?

in other words, if a casino is offering 91% TRTP on a game, but the player can see 96% stated in the info pages, would be the casino or the game provider guilty of giving misleading information ?

 

[nikantw]

I think the best analogy of low RTP is 'Ocean's 8' and Cate Blanchett watering-down the vodka at a nightclub she owns.
The average player has no idea it is lower RTP (most don't even know what RTP is), just like the average cutomer at the club has no idea the vodka has water. In that case they are clearly 100% stealing the player/customer.

On the other hand, you can go to the club and ask vodka with ice (ice is water). No problem with that.
Just like a business can sell at whatever prize they want, also a player that knows the RTP is low at one casino can choose to play there or not.

The industry wants to focus on that side and say "we can discuss how easy to find RTP is".
But infomation is the key and as long as even one player has no idea what RTP is, it doesn't even matter if it is not hidden, lowering RTP means stealing.

The only way it can be ok is if you make 100% sure that the player knows. You can only do that with a big pop-up every time you login saying:
"Attention, this site operates games at a lower RTP. That means your playtime will be a lot smaller. Find out more here." And a link explains exactly what RTP is
and how it effects playtime.