Just thought i would slip a comment on the thread.
Maybe Brexit has not worked out the way planned. Tho Coronavirus has also done a good job in destroying the economy short term and maybe long term.
5 years from now we might be better off or we might be totally screwed.
You might turn out to be correct in your views that it was worst thing ever Chopley time will tell.
But here is the main point. All this people did not get what they voted for maybe correct for a few. But in truth out of all the voters the vast majority have no clue about any of it. They just voted Brexit for various reasons. Most have no clue whether things are better for them or not. They will not be sitting thinking we got lied to as they will not even know if country is better or not and won't even know a thing about companies moving abroad or going bust.
Truth of matter is most people that voted would not even sit thinking how will country be in 10 years. They voted as they got caught up in the hysteria of it all and thought why should we be run by europe and if i vote i can stop my street getting full of immigrants . Sad but true.
It is just the same in Scotland. Anyone with a bit of sense can see that if we go independent the country is screwed and financially we will be fucked and we would need a border with the main country England that nearly all trade goes through.
But most people have no clue about any consequences. They just go we will be Independent and not answer to England. God there are many thousands that even vote independence because they hate the Royal Family. Fact of matter is i would say that in all these votes the majority and i mean actual majority have not got a clue what they are voting for.
So yes lies on both sides. Yes Fishermen etc. might be getting a rough deal. Businesses might be struggling. But then again the country still remained Locked down when more businesses have went bust than Brexit will cause. But to keep saying the people did not get what they voted for is not exactly correct. Some did not get what they voted for but most did not have a clue what they voted for and still have no clue whats happened.
Again Paul, there's a lot in there I agree with, and I've said as much myself earlier in this thread.
The fact is an awful lot of people had no bloody idea what they voting for, and I include Remainers in that as equally as Leavers.
I'm still of the opinion it should have never gone to a referendum, the issues are simply far too complex and nuanced for the average person to be expected to have any understanding of without doing a huge amount of research first, I don't care if someone is a Remainer or a Leaver, the vast majority of them had no clue that, for example, the situation with NI would end up being so precarious.
(For clarity, I'm not saying voters on either side were too stupid to understand the issues, just that they'd never had any cause to try to.)
This is literally what we elect politicians and governments for, so they can deal with all this complex shit,
as their actual jobs (which they are paid very well for), whilst we get on with all the stuff we have to deal with in our own lives, IMO the referendum was just an abrogation of responsibility by a political class that was too cowardly to have the courage of its convictions.
The EU wasn't even remotely on the radar of most people as a cause for concern prior to the referendum, we all know Cameron only promised one in the first place as he was worried about UKIP nibbling at Tory heels in a few too many marginal constituencies.
One thing I will say is that when it comes to the business impact, many businesses who managed just fine last year during Covid, are now struggling horrendously with Brexit. Companies that managed to carry on running and keep exports/imports to and from the EU flowing smoothly all through 2020 have been knocked for six by the imposition of customs checks, extra costs, mountains of paperwork, delivery chains becoming impenetrable nightmares etc. UK businesses will go under, UK jobs will be lost, and the EU is ready and waiting to welcome both.
So yes, I agree with the broad thrust of what you're saying there Paul, but given that reality, I honestly think you can logically conclude from that position that the referendum itself was a bad idea, why hand over responsibility for a decision with such huge potential consequences to a load of people who literally have no real idea what those consequences might be, don't really care about them afterwards, and don't even know whether or not things have got better or worse as a result.
And for the record, I include Remainers and Leavers equally in that analysis, and indeed myself. I've only clued myself up in the years since the referendum result came through, prior to it actually being held I, like an awful lot of people, never gave it much thought if I'm honest. I'd have ticked the 'Remain' box, but I couldn't have given much in the way of good reasons for doing so.
