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Abhorrent treatment (guts, rizk and every single casino in there licence)

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by Playford7, May 26, 2017.

    May 26, 2017
  1. Playford7

    Playford7 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    Offshore worker
    Location:
    North east England
    So last year as some of you are aware I had to perform a chargeback with thrills, now before anyone jumps on me saying no sympathy, this was before I was active here and knew a better way of doing things.
    That said however, the service provided by thrills was nothing short of disgusting.
    Anyways to my point. I asked guts months ago if this chargeback would affect me playing with them, I waited over 2 weeks for a reply to be not given a straight answer, then i pm yitz who gave me no straight answer and told me I'm not the kind of player he wants at guts and closed my account no explanation given.
    I then go on to pm captain rizk and ask the same question by pm he assures me the chargeback won't affect my account with rizk or any withdrawal etc...
    After researching this matter I'm unconvinced, so I speak with thrills on live chat who then tell me my account with them is self excluded (it isn't) I've never self excluded anywhere in my life.
    What the agent at thrills then does is close my account on every single casino platform they use, and put a status of self exclusion on them.
    So guts, dunder, rizk, ikibu, cashmio, chance hill, casinoland etc... have all had there accounts immediately closed and a self exclusion tag put on them.
    Now bearing in mind I never once have mentioned a gambling issue, nor have I ever in my life self excluded anywhere.
    So I contact the captain via pm and he apologises and credits me a goodwill gesture on rizk and re opens that account.
    He tells me He can't do anything about the other accounts the thrills agent closed and I'll have to contact every single casino myself and explain the situation.
    So I do this and my accounts are all open again now, or so I thought.....
    Last night I attempt to sign up to one of there sister sites (casino calzone) only to be told due to a self exclusion I'm not allowed...
    Seriously!... I explain to the agent all I've just mentioned to you guys above and he's looking into it and I'm awaiting a email from security still.
    I feel beyond unfairly treated by this group, i never asked for deposits back once, I am not self excluded so why tag me as if Iam???
    Why acccuse me of a gambling problem when I've never had one???..
    And why will nobody give me a straight answer in regards with ' i performed a chargeback last year with thrills, will that affect my accounts elsewhere in your licence?'
    Sorry for the long post, just feel these casinos and there practices are beyond deplorable.
     
  2. May 26, 2017
  3. RichyJ75

    RichyJ75 Silly Member PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    Dogsbody and personal servant to my kids
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Unfortunately that is one problem you will get if playing at a casino within a group - namely all sharing the same licence number. I had a similar instance last year or the year before and still has repercussions now.

    I had a problem with one of my accounts and the agent mistakenly closed the account via using the SE option - something not requested and not wanted. As you mention, this then applies the SE label to all accounts in that group. I contacted the Captain and Yits who were more than happy to help and found what the problem was and tried to rectify it. Unfortunately with too many casino sites in the group, it proved difficult to completely remove the SE label so some accounts were open and others were closed. I contacted the sites where the account was closed, only to be told they can't reopen it due to a SE still being active at a sister casino. This worried me about the open accounts and whether this would pose problems with any future withdrawal, so I closed them to be sure.

    I hope to reopen them once the 6 month period has lapsed (any day now I believe) to be sure there are no problems remaining. Either all accounts are open or they all remain closed. I think if one account is still closed due to SE issues, then it is only asking for trouble with the open ones.

    I can't criticise individual sites as the reps are helpful, but I feel it is a problem where they all share the same licence number and the issues which revolve around that.
     
  4. May 26, 2017
  5. Playford7

    Playford7 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    Offshore worker
    Location:
    North east England
    Thanks for the swift response.
    The thing is though, I didn't once request a self exclusion, and I certainly never cited a gambling problem.
    The agent just took it upon himself to add this 'tag' on all my accounts.
    I only asked one simple question honestly.
    'I charged back at thrills last year, will this affect my accounts in your group'
     
  6. May 26, 2017
  7. Betreels Casino

    Betreels Casino Online Gaming Affiliate Manager

    Occupation:
    Operations Manager Betreels.com
    Location:
    UK and Gibraltar Licensed
    What was the reason for the chargeback? Casinos do not take kindly to chargebacks because there are usually investigations and/or fines associated with it. Not too mention the costs to the casino of processing the transaction, any cashouts from it and affiliate commissions. Usually, when a player charges back in a group of casinos, the details are flagged and future play is not allowed.

    You can ask the casinos to allow you to use Neteller and Skrill only where chargebacks aren't possible. Problem here is that most casinos don't allow bonuses with these deposit mechanisms.
     
  8. May 26, 2017
  9. Playford7

    Playford7 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    Offshore worker
    Location:
    North east England
    Well since the chargeback last year every casino in the group has allowed me to deposit no problem at all.
    The only time they had a issue is when I asked if the chargeback would effect withdrawals on my accounts, that's when the problem started.
    The reason for the chargeback was not receiving goods advertised, and thrills kept opening and closing my account, then they stopped responding to dialogue with me.
    Silly charging back I know, but as previously stated it was before I was active here and in hindsight it's a move that I regret as this place could of sorted my issue. Lesson learnt.
     
  10. May 26, 2017
  11. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    Lesson learned: don't charge back.

    You say you charged back for "not receiving goods"? Did they give you potato chips instead of casino chips? :p

    Seriously. Do you think they are going out of their way to assist you? I would take it on the chin and move on to a casino group that has no records of you charging back, but since you have admitted this is a public forum - good luck with that.
     
  12. May 26, 2017
  13. Playford7

    Playford7 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    Offshore worker
    Location:
    North east England
    Excuse me a moment. I was well within my rights to do that, if you buy something in a shop and it isn't what you paid for, do you just 'take it on the chin' and forget about it and the money you spent and move on?.. really...
    No wonder most casinos act the way they do with a outlook like that.
    As also previously stated many times now, I regret going Down that route, had I known more about a different way of doing things and also the service available here then I'd of done that and used it.
    The fact I'm allowed to deposit happily at all there other sites at the moment is ok then?..
    The fact captain rizk himself by pm told me I'm fine to play there.
    You don't seem to grasp the issue I have, I'm not self excluded nor have I ever cited a gambling problem, which was just assumed on my behalf by a casino group.
    That's ok then I take it in your book?..
    And with all due respect 'you admitted on a public forum good look with that' comment is rather poor form don't you think?..
    One chargeback, one mistake and I'm now void of any help or assistance?..and I should never be allowed to play online again?.
    Still nobody has Answered if that chargeback
    On thrills would have effected my other accounts.
     
  14. May 26, 2017
  15. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    You said you charged back because you didn't get what you paid for. What exactly was that? :what: I could see charging back on a casino that folded and took your deposit with it, but this is Gut's, etc. What exactly did you not receive?

    And yes, if you choose to come out in public, bash a company for not treating you with respect because "you made a mistake", well that is just taking the piss.

    Like I said, there are other casinos that would be willing to deal with you. Perhaps those on the GiG platform aren't one of those.
     
  16. May 26, 2017
  17. Betreels Casino

    Betreels Casino Online Gaming Affiliate Manager

    Occupation:
    Operations Manager Betreels.com
    Location:
    UK and Gibraltar Licensed
    Hi,

    It's hard to actually figure out if you have a problem at all.

    In your OP, you said all accounts were open and only when you registered a new one, was it blocked. If you are ok at all the others, why not play there or choose a casino from the accredited list above? If the casinos are allowing you to deposit, then you will be paid, however if it was my casino, I would recover the charge back first as there is no such thing as "goods not received" when playing online. You deposit and you play = goods received.

    It is also possible that the casinos flagged you as self-excluded because they don't have a flag called: "chargeback / fraud". By applying the Self-Exclusion tag, they ensure you are blocked when registering new accounts. Agents taking your chats would not know the reason and only see: "Self-exclusion" on their system. Just a thought.

    Either way, there are 1000's of casinos on the net today. You should simply chose a few that meet your needs.
     
  18. May 26, 2017
  19. Playford7

    Playford7 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    Offshore worker
    Location:
    North east England
    As trivial as it is, it was super spins upon my first deposit. Which live chat confirmed I'd recieve.
    And I didn't.
    And no sorry, I'm not saying they are not treating me right as 'I made a mistake' so please don't attempt to twist this.
    I simply asked a question months ago, that nobody has publicly came out on here to answer as yet, yourself included.
    Does that chargeback at thrills have a effect upon my other accounts at casinos in your group, and would it affect my right of a withdrawl.
    And taking the piss?. I think you will find most certainly In mass percent, it's the players that have the piss ripped out of them by the majority of casinos.
    I mean that's why casinomeister is here right?..advocate of the player....
    Captain rizk had no issue me playing there, infact none of the other casinos in the group did.
    A guts advisor told me months ago that my thrills chargeback would affect my accounts and also withdrawals.
    This is how this started. Yet nobody will say with any conviction if this is the case.
     
  20. May 26, 2017
  21. Playford7

    Playford7 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    Offshore worker
    Location:
    North east England
    No such thing as goods received? Oh ok.
    That's great so you deposit and don't recieve the offer they themselves indeed have in there terms of that particauly deposit bonus.
    So just a shrug of the shoulders and walk away?. Forget about it.
    Fantastic, I'll do that in the future.
     
  22. May 26, 2017
  23. nutnut

    nutnut Senior Member

    Occupation:
    IP consultant
    Location:
    england
    In my opinion you seem to be looking for a issue.

    If you had been depositing fine why even mention the charge back of course they will then think twice about allowing you to play. I do not agree you have any excuse to chargeback, goods not received? So you never got a bonus they offered? Doesn't give a right to charge back imo. As has been said hundreds of casinos exist if they don't want your money go elsewhere.

    Really don't see the issue, you want to play at casinos that don't want or trust you?
     
  24. May 26, 2017
  25. Tirilej

    Tirilej Still a Lady CAG MM

    Occupation:
    Breathing
    Location:
    Sweden
    He was trying to help and advice you so no need to reply like that :)

    I understand your concern. Also you should have mentioned that Thrills wasn't a part of that group when you made the chargeback.
    I think it's the processors that are blacklisting customers that have made chargebacks, so you can find yourself in the same position with another casino in the future.
    You will never be a customer at Betit group but if Rizk and Guts tell you you're fine then stick with them and ignore the rest of the casinos under that license. At least you will have reps here to talk to if anything happens.

    I think you have to let it go. You made a mistake and you can't take it back. That is the prise you have to pay unfortunately.
    Be wise. I know you're smart enough ;)
     
  26. May 26, 2017
  27. Playford7

    Playford7 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    Offshore worker
    Location:
    North east England
    I agree. And I never meant no offence. So apologies for that.
    Yet still nobody will clarify my original question. All I wanted to know was I safe I carry on playing at there casinos.
    This seems to be more about a silly chargeback decision than the real point I made.
    As said many many times now I'd never go that route again.
     
  28. May 26, 2017
  29. Tirilej

    Tirilej Still a Lady CAG MM

    Occupation:
    Breathing
    Location:
    Sweden
    If the reps have told you you're fine then trust them, and you'll be ok :thumbsup:

    If anything happens then at least I will back you up in here.
     
  30. May 26, 2017
  31. Jasminebed

    Jasminebed Closer to 100 than Birth

    Occupation:
    Not in workforce
    Location:
    Ontario
    Cases like this are why it needs to be mandatory that it is the player that choses to be entered into a self-exclusion data base for problem gambling that would forbid any play at any UKGC licenced casino.
     
  32. May 26, 2017
  33. Captain Rizk

    Captain Rizk Accredited Casino Representative

    Occupation:
    Bullshit battling Superhero
    Location:
    Malta
    I have no problem answering this - yes absolutely it does. If a player makes a chargeback for any reason other than a stolen card or card used without their permission or whatever it may be then we do not want to deal with that player in the future. You place a deposit, you purchase online gambling services, use them and then decide that you dont want to pay for them and so chargeback? Why would we want to deal with a player like that again? And yes, we get hundreds and thousands of stories about why it happened but which ones are true?

    I chose to make an exception in your case and guaranteed you that, unless something else happened then you would be able to play and withdraw at Rizk and I have kept my side of the bargain.

    You are also correct that your account should not have been SE'd but it should have been "blocked" at every site that you had an account, that was a mistake and one that i rectified and, by way of apology I gave you a bonus equal to 50% of your lifetime deposits.

    I am not sure what else i can say or do.
     
  34. May 26, 2017
  35. Playford7

    Playford7 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    Offshore worker
    Location:
    North east England
    I fully understand that, and I thank you for allowing me to continue to play.
    My point was somewhat lost here, so apologise.
     
  36. May 26, 2017
  37. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    The only real grounds for complaint here would be under Data processing laws. The Thrills agent seems to have added you to the SE database as an act of "revenge". This is a clear violation of Data Processing law, and you could complain about this action to the ICO.

    However, there is also a "right to refuse service", so there is nothing to say that once the wrongful SE issue is dealt with you have any "right" to force businesses to take your custom, so long as they are doing so for a legitimate reason (such as risk of chargebacks), rather than due to something like you being a member of a legally protected minority under anti discrimination laws.

    Chargeback is always the very last resort a player should use if they want to carry on playing at other sites. At the very least, the formal complaint procedures should be exhausted, which in the UK (now) would mean a complaint to the casino, and then a complaint to the ADR. Outside the UK, a decent casino will allow a trusted third party to mediate, such as eCogra or the PAB service here.


    As for Neteller, you CAN actually chargeback a casino deposit, it's a case of using a card to fund Neteller, and then charging back your Neteller deposit (this would require a few lies to the bank), who will then recover their loss from the casino after banning your Neteller account and blocking you from ever having another. Whilst Neteller don't offer a chargeback service no matter what has happened to the customer, they DO effectively charge back from a casino if they have fallen victim to a chargeback from a Neteller funding via a card.
     
  38. May 27, 2017
  39. Playford7

    Playford7 Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    Offshore worker
    Location:
    North east England
    Thanks for that informative response.
    The chargeback here seems to only be the majority's main concern.
    Yes I should of used alternative means, I'm fully aware of that, at that time I wasn't aware of the correct way of dealing with a compliant within the online casino world, and in the future I'd never do that.
    The fact I've been placed self excluded is the issue, I must have spoke to over 20 agents asking for some kind of way to get this removed as it's not true. Yet nobody seems to be doing anything, I'm awaiting emails from months ago still.
    If I'm correct rizk and betspin etc and the others only recently started sharing the same licence with thrills, super Lenny kaboo, My chargeback was before this.
    All I simply did was be totally honest and ask the casino's that now share there licence with thrills if it affected my accounts. Since then I've had accounts opened and closed at will.
    I was even told this morning that I had self excluded at super lenny....I havnt.
    All I wanted to know is I'm safe to play and I'm not classed as self excluded, as that's not a request I made to any single casino in my life.
    I appreciate captain rizk's help and time, and I must say the wording and title of my OP and possibly the writing of it could have been a lot better. If possible I'd change the title, rizk and guts and the like are a decent bunch on the whole, and they in fairness didn't deserve the title of the thread. So for that I do sincerely apologise.
     

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