21grand :( :(

[silcnlayc]

Pinababy69:Not everyone has a driver's licence, or a passport...I don't know why people have such a hard time believing that.

Well, Pinababy69, I guess the answer to this is because , we in the USA get carded (ID w/photo) checked when we do a lot of things and it has become the norm for us to expect everyone to behave as the USA does...such as carry a minimum of one photo ID's in case you are stopped, walking, riding a bike, driving or whatever by a policeman...When someone says they have no photo ID, here in the USA you get fingerprinted and locked up until you can prove who you are and it is a completely foreign idea to us just because we have to carry so much ID to prove who we are.

Being a naturalized citizen, I used to carry a permenant green card (visa with photo) and when I got my citizenship, I was told I must get a passport with photo (even tho I never traveled out of the country either) to exchange my greencard when I became a citizen. So ID's in every shape and form is required here ...and when I say REQUIRED, it is almost the law in some cases..

Even high school students must carry some form of ID w/photo in many of our schools anymore..and if they are under a certain age, they must be photographed sidways to show they are underage unlike anyone over 18, they get a full frontal..

So, saying you have no form of photo ID is so incomprehendable to many of us in the USA , it is like saying..you have no identity because you cannot prove who you are..does this make sense??

I guess the question is, what and how can you prove if ever need be on who you actually are if you were ever arrested, picked up, lost something etc....I guess that is the thoughts many of us are thinking....

.

.

 

[Nifty29]

On the subject of 21Grand - they just dont respond to emails

Ive sent a dozen emails from different addys over the past 3 weeks and ONE of them was answered 5 days later and the rest were IGNORED.

Even when I contacted the rep here is took days for a reply, and he told me there was 'no record of me ever contacted the casino'......yet 2 days later I received a reply from an email sent several days before I contacted the rep so they most certainly DID receive at least one of them.

Sorry, but there is no way emails from 3 seperate addys could all not make it through. Someone isnt on the ball and if there is one thing I hate its being ignored.

The main query I had was when I took a bonus for "200% +$25" I got the 150% bonus and lost it, but no $25 afterwards......I also took the "150% +10" and didnt get that one either. To date, NONE of the emails regarding this subject have been answered.

Something isnt right here, and I would advise caution.

 

[all4greed]

I guess the question is, what and how can you prove if ever need be on who you actually are if you were ever arrested, picked up, lost something etc....I guess that is the thoughts many of us are thinking....

Well there are more like:

How do you:

Rent a motel/hotel room, cash a check or withdrawal money from a bank, pay with a credit card at a store (some require ID), get a cell phone, etc. Just boggles my mind.

No need to answer. Just thinking aloud...

 

[sparkz]

Well there are more like:

How do you:

Rent a motel/hotel room, cash a check or withdrawal money from a bank, pay with a credit card at a store (some require ID), get a cell phone, etc. Just boggles my mind.

No need to answer. Just thinking aloud...

Although you say no need to answer I would like to give some honest idea of things to do with ID. Wheras the US think of ID as granted and essential. the UK thinks the complete opposite.

Just to give an idea of what its like in the UK. Part of my job is working in a toy retail store (as well as running a toy import busness). Never do we require any customers to have identification whatever method they choose to with. I cashed in a cheque the other week to my bank, only needed account number. My phone contract upgrade happened a few months back. They simply do a credit check and make sure my details match up... within days the phone was sent and contract upgraded. For hotel booking. I booked a hotel a year ago through laterooms. They only required that I made a deposit on my card to reserve the room, if I cancelled in a certain timeframe I lose my deposit. I did go though and paid the rest of the money on arrival.


If for example I had lost my card but had bank account details and wanted cash out of the bank. I would have to confirm some digits of my security code I chose when I opened the bank account. Also I would have to sign a peice of paper. This would be matched to my signature on opening the account. If all matched and was correct they would issue me with my money.


Even when I got a loan there was no ID requirement. They wanted a copy of my tax form and then checked the rest on a credit check database to see all was in good order.

The closest thing here you can get to a "government issued ID" is a birth certificate. Which is why I believe all casinos should accept birth certificates for UK players. It shows more information than a passport or driving licence.

 

[sparkz]

oops typo... too late to edit it as well that should of said:

Never do we require any customers to have identification whatever method they choose to PAY with

 

[GrandMaster]

FWIW Pina in Europe people are issued photo ID/national identity cards pretty early in life. I'm not sure when they start carrying them but I know school kids in their teens already have them.

Europe is not a single country with one set of laws. Until recently there were no ID cards in the UK, and even now only a select group can get them, there are no ID cards in Ireland or Denmark, in several European countries, for example, Franca, ID cards are not compulsory.

 

[sparkz]

Its a stalemate now. I will keep people updated on how its going. If good things happen i'll say... likewise with the bad

but it hasnt been good,

Support say the same thing so iv given up contacting them and as for the rep here... pfft

was told if theres no response to get in touch with them and they will be back this morning... well obviously the problem can not be sorted out with normal support staff and i said that. As to no suprise I havent had a reply this morning and still havent now.

11 days gone now and still my withdrawl is "processing"... not good even by rival standards


edit: oh and did I meantion theres NO live support staff around at the moment... dont know how long thats been

 

[just play]

It's really easy Sparkz....(you don't have to answer these here, just in your head)

How much is your withdrawal?

How much will it cost to get whatever they want?

Is it worth it?



I didn't notice...can Max or CM help with this?

 

[sparkz]

Well my answer to thoese would be too obvious,

and it wouldnt be about the cost to get the things I needed moreso asbout the legality of it,

afterall a passport is for going abroad and a driving licence is what you are driving. I somehow dont think the government would be happy to issue me with thoese to send to casinos (I will phone up customs and the DVLA's helplines on monday morning and report back but I know already what they will say)

As I think it was KK who says, He has a passport but got 1 through choice... No way is anyone or anything going to make me go out of my way getting a passport soley for the use at casinos when Im expecting Customs to be very skeptical about the whole thing

 

[kakata]

you cannot(nowaday) have the full bottle and a drunk wife

 

[sparkz]

ehhh??

 

[breakstone]

While I agree that casinos should ask for ID from players who deposit by credit card, it is not necessary for players who solely deposit by Neteller or Moneybookers. Neteller and Moneybokers have their own stringent ID verification for players who open accounts with them, including phone calls from them and bank statement verification, drivers licence Id and utility bill ID, which is checked from year to year. There is absolutely no reason for casinos to use this as an excuse to delay payments to players depositing by these 2 options. We have already been verified.

 

[RedAndi]

Am I the only one who would feel uneasy about passing a birth certificate along to people in an office in a far away country?
Probably a US thing, as Birth Certificates are so important for obtaining other important documents (passports, social security) and such here.

Also, in reading about sparkz and his ease with doing so many things in the UK without a pic ID, It got me to thinking being a identity thief in the UK would be one sweet gig ....
Just nab someones paperwork and walk in with detail and you are all set!

 

[just play]

Im expecting Customs to be very skeptical about the whole thing

I am totally lost!!!!!

Customs being skeptical because you are getting a passport??? You can't just say you are thinking of going to another country???

You are making this much harder than it should be, you are making it seem like you are doing something wrong.

My daughter got a passport with no problem whatsoever, I'm lost on why you assume this is a big deal?

 

[sparkz]

agreed, even though as mentioned "credit card" with casinos is simply a term for card payments. Under this option "debit cards" work but they are completely different.

Wheras credit cards are borrowing money from a company only to pay it back at the end of the month a debit card is linked to money which is actually yours in your bank. In fact everytime you pay via a "debit card" you verify the transaction using your verified visa password (I do anyway) where you authorise the transaction and verify you are the account owner. I only have a debit card, no credit card which I can fully prove.

Rival is just starting to tick me off now and still im in the same situation that I was in days ago.

The rep has still not responded. I still havent been paid and the last email from support was still faxback forms which I forgot to mention also ask for bank statement/utility bill... I had already sent my latest bank statement so it shows how they dont even bother to check.

I would like to have the chance to turn around and say "fair enough, They appologised and I got paid" but as it stands its still a negative situation. End of the day its my cash and weather it was $10 or $10,000 its mine and theres no reason to not let me have it.

 

[jas2587]

agreed, even though as mentioned "credit card" with casinos is simply a term for card payments. Under this option "debit cards" work but they are completely different.

Wheras credit cards are borrowing money from a company only to pay it back at the end of the month a debit card is linked to money which is actually yours in your bank. In fact everytime you pay via a "debit card" you verify the transaction using your verified visa password (I do anyway) where you authorise the transaction and verify you are the account owner. I only have a debit card, no credit card which I can fully prove.

Rival is just starting to tick me off now and still im in the same situation that I was in days ago.

The rep has still not responded. I still havent been paid and the last email from support was still faxback forms which I forgot to mention also ask for bank statement/utility bill... I had already sent my latest bank statement so it shows how they dont even bother to check.

I would like to have the chance to turn around and say "fair enough, They appologised and I got paid" but as it stands its still a negative situation. End of the day its my cash and weather it was $10 or $10,000 its mine and theres no reason to not let me have it.

mine as in you have to prove who you are its simple as that
like another poster I believe just play stated you are making it much harder then it is
an maybe that is why they are making it just as hard
who knows why the Rep isnt responding not good on their part but we only have your facts to go by

I do wish you all the luck in the world on getting your cashout but I honestly feel that you are your worse enemy here on this cashout

i send in bank statement current utility bill state of Florifa ID an I have a Ewallet click to pay an a Usemywallet account an only deposit that way an still have to send the proof

Cindy

 

[sparkz]

mine as in you have to prove who you are its simple as that

proven, back to the point at the beginning, if a legal governent issued birth certificate showing DOB, Address, full name (all details that are in my casino account) is now not being accepted then no way should a passport be accepted because getting anything like a passport requires a birth certificate to begin with.


cant see how im shooting myself in the foot with it all. Plain and simple I work hard all month, pay taxes and get a nice wage out of it, it infuriates me with the fact im not bigtime a gambler, I dont spend every day gambling, I know exactly I am not trying to commit fruad or do anything illegal, fair enough they dont know that but at least some initiative could be used.

and for "you are making it much harder then it is
an maybe that is why they are making it just as hard". it hardly brings good publicity to any casino when problems arise so i tend to think they like to sort out problems as quick as they can.



and as for just play.... The thing is why would I want a passport? I am never going to go overseas in my entire life, thus if I got 1 it would only be to send in to casinos. With all the secutiry breaches that have happened concerning customs I really cant see them being happy about the thought of me sending copys of a passport all over the net... and no... im not going to tell them im going overseas.. why should I? After all i would be the one "forced" into getting it for purposes it isnt intended for.

"My daughter got a passport with no problem whatsoever" - just to add as well, regarding that comment. Maybe its no problem in the states getting 1 but here its a lot more complex. 1 of the things you have to do is go for an interview at 1 of their offices, the problem being there is no offices locally so that would mean further travel to 1 of their premises out of my own pocket.

next and as to quote the government passport website:

"You need to sign the form yourself and should also get it countersigned at section 10.

The person you ask to countersign should be someone who has known you for at least two years. They must:

* be over 18
* hold a current British or Irish passport
* be willing to write their passport number on the form

They should work in a recognised profession or otherwise have good standing in the community. You can find a list of suitable professions by following the link below to 'Who can countersign your application?'"


That rule has only come into place recently. There is nobody I know of that criteria, family members do not count (many of my family members have expired passports over 10 years old anyway that wouldnt count)

so just try telling me its easy and im making a big deal of it for no reason... i think if you were in my situation you would be peeved, im not dumb, I have gone through everything possible I could do

 

[jas2587]

21Grand is online right now reading this thread maybe they will have something to say
remaining silent isnt helping them at all IMO

GoWildcindy

 

[21grandcasino]

Hi Guys,
After reading this I want you all to know that I have been speaking with sparkz and having not been in the office for a couple of days I wanted to speak to him while here.
I would also like to point that on the website under withdrawals it states

21GrandCasino aims to process your withdrawals within 24 hours, during business working hours providing all requested documentation has been provided and approved

I am wanting to have a look at the chat history as of course staff have changed and i want to see what exactly was said about the birth cert as I have spoken to everyone here and everyone here knows that this would not be enough so I want to see what was said!

I am in fact myself from the UK, I know there is no ID cards and yes ID Theft is massive..

With regards to the emails there was a global rival problem with emails and if you would have emailed here I would have responded like we have done with everyone that has contacted us on here at least with in 48 hours.

So there will be an up date once i get hold of sparkz in the live chat and once spoken to the accounts department.

enjoy the rest of the weekend...
C

 

[21grandcasino]

jas I was in fact replying to you email which you sent in my inbox, please give me at least 5 minutes to respond!!..
Thank you

 

[21grandcasino]

This is the email from Rival regarding lost emails!!

Dear Operators,

Earlier this week there was a bug with our mail servers. After the fix,
there was a delay in sending all of the older mailings and they did not
get to begin sending until yesterday. As of yesterday, all of the older
mailings began the queue, then newer ones to follow. This affected all
operators, and so your mailers may take a while longer to send than
usual. This may be why your players are receiving their Wednesday
mailers and such today, and so on.

We do apologize for the inconvenience.

Best regards,

--

*Rival Support **| **Rival Gaming**


Please be assured that I am here to help with any problems and try to give a good customer service and try to make 21 GC better, if you send an email and don't here back from us please please contact me here... and i will do my up most to reply ASAP.. (but I don't keep CM logged i all day every day, give me chance please) and deal with the problem and fingers crossed resolve it to..
C

 

[sparkz]

Hi Guys,
After reading this I want you all to know that I have been speaking with sparkz and having not been in the office for a couple of days I wanted to speak to him while here.
I would also like to point that on the website under withdrawals it states

21GrandCasino aims to process your withdrawals within 24 hours, during business working hours providing all requested documentation has been provided and approved

I am wanting to have a look at the chat history as of course staff have changed and i want to see what exactly was said about the birth cert as I have spoken to everyone here and everyone here knows that this would not be enough so I want to see what was said!

I am in fact myself from the UK, I know there is no ID cards and yes ID Theft is massive..

With regards to the emails there was a global rival problem with emails and if you would have emailed here I would have responded like we have done with everyone that has contacted us on here at least with in 48 hours.

So there will be an up date once i get hold of sparkz in the live chat and once spoken to the accounts department.

enjoy the rest of the weekend...
C

Just for me to add my update to the thread,

Understandably the rep has replied and although no payment (yet) there is only positives to put back.

I can appreciate the way in which my situation has been understood and it has kept me thinking postive about the matter.

The only thing i can say was "I have spoken to everyone here and everyone here knows that this would not be enough"

with regards to another rival situation. That goes to show with VRC (i mentioned about in another thread) that if staff already know a birth certificate is not enough then the support staff at that casino simply had no rights in saying he didnt know. If he knew full well it wouldnt be accepted and told me "I dont know" then it could be seen as misleading.

anyways, back to the situation in hand. It now seems to be being dealt with well, and im feeling a lot more positive

 

[LaurieJim]

I know this is a stupid ?

Being from the US i just took it for granted that everyone has some form of picture ID, whether it be a State ID, Bank ID ,Passport ect.

My question is as im wanting to better understand the Doc's needed for players who do not have the above items.

(1) How does one go about cashing a check at a bank in your respected country, will just a Birth Certificate work?

(2) Your pulled over for speeding, do you just whip out your ole Birth Certificate from the the glove box or purse/ wallet?

(3) When you go to vote, what form of ID do you use, we have a voters reg. card here, no picture, but does work for ID needed places.

(4) In many European nations they have free medical, so are you not issued a medical card, how do they know its you and would that work as a form of ID?

(5) I can understand any Casinos concern for wanting some form of ID as ID theft is a big problem not just here but everywhere.

(6) What proof can you provide that the Bith certificate is yours indeed and not stolen.

Im sorry for all the questions as i just want to know, i carry my DL. in my purse along with my S.S card, voters Reg card and several other forms of ID including a check cashing card, my Auto Insurance is in my glove box along with the vehicle reg.

Its just hard for me to understand as my Birth Certificate and other items are in a lock box and in 47 years on this earth my addy and name have changed several times.

So as an American it seems strange to me not to have some sort of proof as to who you are besides a BC. and i cant blame the casinos for wanting some other form of ID.


Laurie


Edit: I do hope the casino works something out with you and you get paid.

 

[Jasminebed]

If I'd never lost my health card, it would not have a picture on it. Doesn't have my address either. Old UK driver's licences don't have pictures either.

Casinos do business with multiple countries, and should realize that different countries issue different IDs. I can't get a ID card like the non-driving licences issued in some states.

If there was a large sum at stake, I could obtain a passport. Since Canadians now require a passport to visit the US, they made things a little easier, but not any cheaper. And unless I travelled to another city and paid expedited fees, it would take 5 or six weeks.

Casinos need to realize that in countries that do not routinely issue required photo ID that players may not have any, and be willing to make other suitable arrangements for withdrawals if you deposited.

Since the UK requires an in person interview and a reason for issuing a passport, I don't think that "a casino wants a copy" would be a valid reason. To simply say you need it for identifiction purposes doesn't make sense in a country that does not require such ID within its borders.

 

[LaurieJim]

ID theft is a big concern for everyone and not just the casinos, if a player opens up an account and uses a stolen credit card and funds that account and wins a massive amount, how easily would it be to make a copy of a Birth certificate given all the new age gagets we now have, not hard at all, so thats why i can see a casino wanting different items to back up that the card is indeed yours and not stolen.

How many cases of ID theft are used to fund money to casinos, where they are caught by a casino demanding proof, it is fair to the casino and to all honest players to produce reasonable items as requested, i dont think its a stalling tactic but a wise business practice for all to follow.

One pic Id, two bills in your name showing your addy and back and front of method of funding, unless qt, is not being unreasonable imho.


Laurie