Non-Bonus Complaint William Hill Casino club demands comprehensive private financial information about me

[mathsboy1975]

This might be a bit off topic but that old saying; I have nothing to hide (so cooperate with unreasonable searches etc.) is not correct I think.
Because being searched as if you were a common criminal is degrading.

Totally agree with you. However it may well be the quickest way of getting hold of your £20K

 

[Mousey]

@ Mousey It's the I-Gaming Industry rep found here: https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/23717/
I don't know if an I-Gaming rep counts as a genuine rep.

Any rep listed here should respond to a Private Message query from members in a timely fashion. If they do not, Bryan and/or Maxd need to be made aware. The OP has also stated that the Rep did not respond. Please report reps that do not respond within a reasonable length of time -- say or two or three days at most (not including weekends).

Sorry Mousey, I am new here and not familiar with the local humor. What is file of pitch a bitch? I wrote to the William Hill casino representative and he did not answer.

The PAB or Pitch a Bitch is a mediation service offered here at the forum - free of charge. Fill out a form, Maxd contacts casino and it goes from there. More info HERE. Or just go to top of forum and look for PAB FAQ.

 

[matita]

The main reason getting a lawyer involved is that they could send a letter to WH on your behalf, and this might make them see sense and water down their demands so that they are compliant with UK data protection laws, as they will know damn well that they might be able to fool a player, but they won't fool their lawyer. This should not cost more than £200, for a consultation and a legal letter to WH.

I would definitely go down this route as well. Sometimes a letter from a solicitor works wonders. If they were honestly concerned about money laundering or fraud they would have involved the police, and I am not entirely convinced that casinos really mind where their clients' money come from as long as they keep spending.

 

[Beravek7]

That's an interesting story. First the guy deposits and loses about 30.000 pounds at the casino. No one cares about the source of the money. One year later the guy starts to win some of the lost money back. And , off course, now it is a time to become concerned about where this money comes from. And let's imagine (only imagine) that the source of the money is illegal. And the OP will never be able to prove that the money is from any kind legal activities. What will WH do? Give the money to police? To charity? Keep it all to themselves?

 

[petro]

I heard recently that there may be new laws in American B&M casinos.
You have to prove where you got the money from.
e.g. you go and spend 5k in a casino. The casino will ask what is the source of that $.

I have also reported to Max that the WH rep has left the building.

 

[vinylweatherman]

That's an interesting story. First the guy deposits and loses about 30.000 pounds at the casino. No one cares about the source of the money. One year later the guy starts to win some of the lost money back. And , off course, now it is a time to become concerned about where this money comes from. And let's imagine (only imagine) that the source of the money is illegal. And the OP will never be able to prove that the money is from any kind legal activities. What will WH do? Give the money to police? To charity? Keep it all to themselves?

They should hand it over to the authorities in order that it may be claimed by the legitimate owner. If no claim is made, the money passes to the government and goes into the general pot, although the rightful owner can get it back if they can provide proof it's theirs.

The casino would not feel that the player is a victim as it was never their money to start with.

 

[K2014]

Thank you all for your comments. I have yet things to say about one or two of the views expressed in this thread, especially when it comes to the value of privacy, but I will have to wait because I have just submitted a PAB.

 

[aceking123]

Thank you all for your comments. I have yet things to say about one or two of the views expressed in this thread, especially when it comes to the value of privacy, but I will have to wait because I have just submitted a PAB.

well done for going via PAB service make sure you do read the rules & remain with no comments concerning the matter you have with them on here,

 

[petro]

Has there been any updates on this topic yet?

WH have owed me money now for about 4 years and I'm looking for leads.

 

[Simmo!]

Has there been any updates on this topic yet?

WH have owed me money now for about 4 years and I'm looking for leads.

Until the results of the PAB are available the OP cannot discuss this further petro. Sorry - you probably know that but I am sure this thread will get updated when it is resolved.

 

[maxd]

Hello everyone, just wanted to say a few words about this case so it's clear where things are at and why.

As some of you already know I am busy doing the monthly PAB reports for 2014. As it happens the PAB reports are unusually time-consuming this time around -- I had what you might call a record-keeping melt-down in the early part of the year -- and that has definately slowed things down with new and ongoing PABs.

To make a long story short I am just now getting to this PAB in earnest. Apologies to all for this one dragging on but we should see some action here in the coming days.

 

[Balthazar]

Even though I don't think that a PAB can do much for OP here (the casino appears to stay within the limits of their own T&C), I find this case highly interesting and I can't wait to hear more

I can see why the casino would believe that OP might be laundering money (large deposits a few years ago followed by no play and then a large cashout) HOWEVER, I don't believe for a second in the "if you have nothing to hide" mentality so I'm a bit on the fence here.

OP is in the UK and so is WH, right? That might be the problem here. Is there a possibility that WH is required by law to audit their suspicious players in the UK? Otherwise I don't see why an online casino would give a rats' ass if someone properly paid taxes to their government (which is what money laundering is).

 

[jshort]

William Hill have enough information about me by now, because as I wrote above I eventually sent them proofs of substantial winnings at other casinos and in fact I regret doing so. They did not answer saying that the information I sent was not credible. Instead, they are ignoring me and not paying.

I'm guessing there is also a clause in their T&Cs about "professional-gamblers will have their winnings confiscated" otherwise I'm guessing the OP would've used this excuse.

I think any action they take short of giving the player his winnings is wrong. He lives in the UK. If he is a pro-gambler, he should be paid/banned. If the OP is un-employed, not-really a pro and has gambled his way via much credit card debt, he should still be given his winnings if it were determined he had some kind of gambing problem (WH could/should ban him, but he still needs to be paid).

 

[vinylweatherman]

I'm guessing there is also a clause in their T&Cs about "professional-gamblers will have their winnings confiscated" otherwise I'm guessing the OP would've used this excuse.

I think any action they take short of giving the player his winnings is wrong. He lives in the UK. If he is a pro-gambler, he should be paid/banned. If the OP is un-employed, not-really a pro and has gambled his way via much credit card debt, he should still be given his winnings if it were determined he had some kind of gambing problem (WH could/should ban him, but he still needs to be paid).

It's not illegal, and since they took the bets, they have to pay up. It's more usual for bookies to ban those whom they feel are "too good" at predicting winners or playing games of chance. It seems likely that this was a money laundering issue, and WH were trying to verify the legitimacy of the funds deposited. The problem is that they may have gone too far in law, leaving them open to legal action from the player, and a rap on the knuckles from the personal data regulator as they are requiring the player to give them personal data relating to third parties.

However, the OP seems to have vanished, so we don't really know what the eventual outcome was, or if it's still ongoing.

 

[K2014]

However, the OP seems to have vanished, so we don't really know what the eventual outcome was, or if it's still ongoing.

I did not vanish. Since my PAB is still ongoing I can not post anything in spite of having a lot to say.

 

[jshort]

I did not vanish. Since my PAB is still ongoing I can not post anything in spite of having a lot to say.

I'd PM Max again. I noticed that the PAB image in your avatar has turned from color green to grey. I believe that's an indication that ones PAB has been put in the "unresolved/incomplete" section.

 

[vinylweatherman]

I did not vanish. Since my PAB is still ongoing I can not post anything in spite of having a lot to say.

OK Fair enough. I am just surprised at how long this one has taken, prompted by the resurrection of this long standing thread.

You are doing the right thing by staying quiet whilst the PAB is ongoing.

 

[kavaman]

I think its outrageous from WilliamHill to ask source of income. If they were really worried on why the player is spending so much money at their site, they should have asked this information when the player was losing money, not after when he had won some of it back.

First when i started gambling online the casino's asked for ID (maybe). Then it became id and utilitybill. Then it became id and 1-2 utilitybills. Then i started seeing that some casinos even asked for notarized id, which i thought was a bit too much, but ok in some cases. But asking anything beyond these, and possible phone verification is just too much. Casino's should not have the right to ask anything more that they currently are asking , its just too much sensitive information to be given to a gambling site if you have to supply your whole financial history, they are not the IRS for heaven's sake.

 

[maxd]

I'd PM Max again. I noticed that the PAB image in your avatar has turned from color green to grey. I believe that's an indication that ones PAB has been put in the "unresolved/incomplete" section.

The info on the colours is here: PAB listings in user profiles

Green means it's an Accred casino issue. Grey overrides all other clours and simply means "ongoing/work-in-progress".

 

[Casinomeister]

More about PABs here
Link Outdated / Removed

 

[Mousey]

More about PABs here
Link Outdated / Removed

Please, also note concerns that the WH forum rep has been reported as totally unresponsive.

 

[Casinomeister]

Please, also note concerns that the WH forum rep has been reported as totally unresponsive.

Yep, I know that. I popped him an email some time ago, and I think he was AWOL then too. Bummer.

 

[maxd]

I've emailed the guy twice, still waiting to hear back. They've never been particularly enthusiastic when it comes to dealing with PAB issues but things lately are looking even worse than usual. :/

 

[psmith2020]

but how do things stand with william hill acreddited status as i am about depositing but looking at this i dont wont to give them my life story and my accounts if i win

 

[maphesto]

but how do things stand with william hill acreddited status as i am about depositing but looking at this i dont wont to give them my life story and my accounts if i win

William Hill and their sister brands are not accredited. I don't think they ever was.

Also, IIRC, their sister casinos are on the rogue list because of their terms when it comes to progressive slots.