US political crisis

[Kroffe]

It looked to me they were afraid of the potential consequences, this would have been one of the biggest and most complex cases ever, I can understand why they didn't want to touch it though.

Complex?
You do know Trumps lawyers were not even arguing that any fraud had taken place (when in court that is, on twitter is another story)
The cases did not get thrown out of the lower courts because they were complex, they were thrown out because they didnt have a leg to stand on.
Why do you think that suddenly would change if the supreme court looked at the cases?
Would the lawyers suddenly start arguing that fraud had taken place? Would they suddenly have evidence to show?

That they were too afraid to look at the cases is a weird interpretation that goes against all the facts surrounding the cases.

 

[Kroffe]

How do you know they didn't? I didn't watch much of it but each side gets 16 hours to present their case.

I didnt watch a second of it.
But if they had shown a video with just the "highlights" of trump inciting the crowd, im guessing that would be the video Bill would be complaining over and not grasping at straws with the video hes now talking about.

 

[mack341]

Complex?
You do know Trumps lawyers were not even arguing that any fraud had taken place (when in court that is, on twitter is another story)
The cases did not get thrown out of the lower courts because they were complex, they were thrown out because they didnt have a leg to stand on.
Why do you think that suddenly would change if the supreme court looked at the cases?
Would the lawyers suddenly start arguing that fraud had taken place? Would they suddenly have evidence to show?

That they were too afraid to look at the cases is a weird interpretation that goes against all the facts surrounding the cases.

I think you would need full proper audits to search for voter fraud, trump's lawyers were making 'paper' accusations and the judge was saying 'not proven, so hard luck.' There were lots of signed affidavits from witnesses etc..but no appetite from the courts [or perhaps legal precedent] to start delving into stuff...let's face it he had no chance, the system, rightly or wrongly, hates his guts or believes he's a con man or something, no way were they going to lift a finger to help prolong his stay in the oval office.

 

[sufferinsilence]

I think you would need full proper audits to search for voter fraud, trump's lawyers were making 'paper' accusations and the judge was saying 'not proven, so hard luck.' There were lots of signed affidavits from witnesses etc..but no appetite from the courts [or perhaps legal precedent] to start delving into stuff...let's face it he had no chance, the system, rightly or wrongly, hates his guts or believes he's a con man or something.

He's been a con man all his life, what changed?

 

[mack341]

It's so nice to be back in familiar surroundings!

 

[Kroffe]

I think you would need full proper audits to search for voter fraud, trump's lawyers were making 'paper' accusations and the judge was saying 'not proven, so hard luck.' There were lots of signed affidavits from witnesses etc..but no appetite from the courts [or perhaps legal precedent] to start delving into stuff...let's face it he had no chance, the system, rightly or wrongly, hates his guts or believes he's a con man or something, no way were they going to lift a finger to help prolong his stay in the oval office.

Well its hard to argue against "its all a conspiracy, he never had a chance because everyone hates him"

Imo its clear as day he tried and failed to steal the election.
Hell, Bernie even did a play-by-play on exactly what they were afraid Trump would do, and he still went ahead with it.
He spent months telling his supporters not to vote by mail, and then pretended to be surprised when the mail in votes were surprise surprise,, massively in favor of Biden.
Must be fraud.



The definiton of a con man is "a man who cheats or tricks someone by gaining their trust and persuading them to believe something that is not true."
But no, Trump with his Qanon conspiracies, election conspiracies etc is not a con man....

 

[mack341]

The definiton of a con man is "a man who cheats or tricks someone by gaining their trust and persuading them to believe something that is not true."

Biden has done a little bit himself over the years:

 

[Kroffe]

Biden has done a little bit himself over the years:

Is that why you think its ok for Trump?
I never got that way of thinking.
Two people doing wrong is worse than one person doing wrong, not better.

 

[mack341]

Is that why you think its ok for Trump?
I never got that way of thinking.
Two people doing wrong is worse than one person doing wrong, not better.

I was just about to log out but if we're talking about trump lying in bringing his election fraud cases, in every civil case a judge has to decide who is telling the truth out of the parties, and also where the truth lays; I think trump truly believes biden's win was fraud assisted or unfair in some way, so I don't think he has been wilfully and knowingly lying about the election situation. It may not be true however, and biden did win fairly.

Two politicians doing wrong, but only one gets called out for it, is even worse for a democracy and voters.

 

[sufferinsilence]

Biden's EO were just reversing Trump's EO's.

 

[Kroffe]

I was just about to log out but if we're talking about trump lying in bringing his election fraud cases, in every civil case a judge has to decide who is telling the truth out of the parties, and also where the truth lays; I think trump truly believes biden's win was fraud assisted or unfair in some way, so I don't think he has been wilfully and knowingly lying about the election situation. It may not be true however, and biden did win fairly.

Two politicians doing wrong, but only one gets called out for it, is even worse for a democracy and voters.

Agree to disagree i guess.
I dont think Trump is the sharpest tool in the shed, but i dont think hes dumb enough to not understand that he had lost.
He probably already knew when he went out and declared victory before the count was done (which was stupid in all sorts of ways)
If he didnt figure it out himself, surely someone among his staff must have told him that it wasnt looking very good, and that he was likely to lose.
But then again, maybe nobody did, people that didnt suck up to him were regularly fired from his administration, so maybe nobody dared tell him.

 

[slotplayer]

Is that why you think its ok for Trump?
I never got that way of thinking.
Two people doing wrong is worse than one person doing wrong, not better.

No offense, but you tend to play the morality card but its always in one direction. You don't see that about yourself.

 

[slotplayer]

I was just about to log out but if we're talking about trump lying in bringing his election fraud cases, in every civil case a judge has to decide who is telling the truth out of the parties, and also where the truth lays; I think trump truly believes biden's win was fraud assisted or unfair in some way, so I don't think he has been wilfully and knowingly lying about the election situation. It may not be true however, and biden did win fairly.

Two politicians doing wrong, but only one gets called out for it, is even worse for a democracy and voters.

My friend brought up the point that maybe Trump was privy to election shananigans we were not. Its possible I suppose.
Hillary Clinton and Stacy Abrams both continue to claim their elections were fraudulent as well.

The difference is Trump became obsessed with the loss when all options in his right where exhausted. Its actually too bad because he could have went out on a high note as he finally did get some respect for his operation warp speed program from the left media he desperately longed for, even CNN called him "the president" for a while.

But I would not get back in to debating the election if I were you, the mail-in ballots are blank when the voters receive them and its up to each candidate to convince the voters they're the better choice. Ultimately, Trump did it to himself.

 

[Kroffe]

No offense, but you tend to play the morality card but its always in one direction. You don't see that about yourself.

Could you give me an example?

 

[pinnit2014]

Could you give me an example?

Close enough - Sounds like the most boring game ever.

Not a patch on Hungry Hippos

 

[slotplayer]

Could you give me an example?

I had list of three a couple of weeks ago fresh in my mind, but can't remember 2 of them right now as I just woke up but I remember the Trump election email one. If I remember the other two I'll let you know.

 

[Kroffe]

I had list of three a couple of weeks ago fresh in my mind, but can't remember 2 of them right now as I just woke up but I remember the Trump election email one. If I remember the other two I'll let you know.

Trump election email?
Im not sure i know what you are referring to.

 

[Kroffe]

Close enough - Sounds like the most boring game ever.

Not a patch on Hungry Hippos

View attachment 150480

Great game, but not everyone plays fair.

 

[slotplayer]

Trump election email?
Im not sure i know what you are referring to.

I can't remember what thread it was but it had something to do with the first $8k going to the Trump super pac.

 

[Kroffe]

I can't remember what thread it was but it had something to do with the first $8k going to the Trump super pac.

I still feel the same about that
Dick move to collect money to "stop the steal" when almost none of the donations actually went to that.
And the agressive emails that were sent out begging for those donations (without mentioning where the money actually went) were no better.

Not sure how thinking that was a crap thing to do was playing the morality card only one way tho.
Its not like i praised anyone else for doing the same, right?

 

[mack341]

My friend brought up the point that maybe Trump was privy to election shananigans we were not. Its possible I suppose.
Hillary Clinton and Stacy Abrams both continue to claim their elections were fraudulent as well.

The difference is Trump became obsessed with the loss when all options in his right where exhausted. Its actually too bad because he could have went out on a high note as he finally did get some respect for his operation warp speed program from the left media he desperately longed for, even CNN called him "the president" for a while.

But I would not get back in to debating the election if I were you, the mail-in ballots are blank when the voters receive them and its up to each candidate to convince the voters they're the better choice. Ultimately, Trump did it to himself.

No I won't get back into it in a big way, I was just starting to accept the biden/kamala reality and then this impeachment stuff and brouhaha over the capitol hill protest received saturation coverage, the dems and media are so smug it's unbelievable...and if some shenanigans did happen in that election, it makes it even worse as then the capitol protest and impeachment would never have occurred.

After what happened in 2016, the authorities bugging and spying on his campaign, I'm not convinced anything was off the table to prevent him securing a 2nd term, it must be highly unusual for a president to win millions more votes than last time and still lose, but just goes to show how divided people were I guess, polarised.

 

[vorcirion]

No I won't get back into it in a big way, I was just starting to accept the biden/kamala reality and then this impeachment stuff and brouhaha over the capitol hill protest received saturation coverage, the dems and media are so smug it's unbelievable...and if some shenanigans did happen in that election, it makes it even worse as then the capitol protest and impeachment would never have occurred.

After what happened in 2016, the authorities bugging and spying on his campaign, I'm not convinced anything was off the table to prevent him securing a 2nd term, it must be highly unusual for a president to win millions more votes than last time and still lose, but just goes to show how divided people were I guess, polarised.

Yeah it's not really fun when someone tries to murder you. Might make people cranky a bit. But sure you can call that as "a protest".
Law and order-president huh? Killing some cops and then saying to these cop killers: "we love you".
Trump had the power to stop this murderous mob but he never tried. He actually liked the scene and you still keep defending him.

 

[slotplayer]

I still feel the same about that
Dick move to collect money to "stop the steal" when almost none of the donations actually went to that.
And the agressive emails that were sent out begging for those donations (without mentioning where the money actually went) were no better.

Not sure how thinking that was a crap thing to do was playing the morality card tho.
It would be hard to argue it was a nice thing to do.

Well we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.

 

[slotplayer]

No I won't get back into it in a big way, I was just starting to accept the biden/kamala reality and then this impeachment stuff and brouhaha over the capitol hill protest received saturation coverage, the dems and media are so smug it's unbelievable...and if some shenanigans did happen in that election, it makes it even worse as then the capitol protest and impeachment would never have occurred.

After what happened in 2016, the authorities bugging and spying on his campaign, I'm not convinced anything was off the table to prevent him securing a 2nd term, it must be highly unusual for a president to win millions more votes than last time and still lose, but just goes to show how divided people were I guess, polarised.

Right after I posted not to rehash the election I saw this video on U Tube.

 

[mack341]

Yeah it's not really fun when someone tries to murder you. Might make people cranky a bit. But sure you can call that as "a protest".
Law and order-president huh? Killing some cops and then saying to these cop killers: "we love you".
Trump had the power to stop this murderous mob but he never tried. He actually liked the scene and you still keep defending him.

I'll file this in the 'not worth replying to' pile, along with your other gaslighting/ strawman/ ad hominem replies to me.