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Royal Plaza - Beware

Discussion in 'Casino Complaints - Non-Bonus Issues' started by ketzzz, Sep 28, 2006.

    Sep 28, 2006
  1. ketzzz

    ketzzz Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Surfer
    Location:
    AU
    Hello,

    I signed up to Royal Plaza about a month ago. I did NOT claim a promotion. I am also from Australia.

    I deposited a total amount of 2000 EUR (this was from several smaller deposits) thinking that it was okay because I have read on forums that this grp was pretty reputable.

    I got my balance up to ~5800 EUR and cashed out.

    I tried to login to my account a few days later and it was locked. I emailed support many times and I did not really get any type of response except that they were looking into it.

    I finally got a response today, basically saying because I signed up in Euro I my account was locked and all my winnings were confiscated. Here is their email:

    "The Royal Plaza Casino Registration Terms and Conditions clearly state:

    - only residents of the European Union will be able to open an account
    in Euros.

    - All accounts opened not according to our Account Currency Policy (i.e.
    Euro accounts opened from a non-EU country) will be locked: should you
    have made a deposit before the account is locked, the Casino cannot be
    held responsible for any action taken afterwards.

    In accordance with these terms and conditions, the Royal Plaza Casino
    regretfully informs you that it has closed your casino account and
    confiscated any winnings due to you.

    Regards, Royal Plaza Casino"

    I guess it is my fault for not reading these rules, but I had no intention of claiming a bonus. I generally never use bonuses.

    I wanted to give a heads up to everyone, I am going to every board I can find and am writing this experience there, because this is thievery plain and simple. I would possibly be able to understand had I claimed a promotion, but I claimed nothing whatsoever. I played with my own money, it should be my choice which currency I want to use.

    I will also Pitch a Bitch. I hope this thread helps other people to not get ripped off by these thieves.
     
  2. Sep 29, 2006
  3. Nifty29

    Nifty29 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    PAID CASINO SHILL
    Location:
    Turn right, then right. then right again
    Yep - you should have read the Terms. Pure and simple.

    Most online Casinos have rules of this kind these days.

    Why not just deposit in USD? You could have saved yourself a world of hurt - and you may have been several $k dollars better off courtesy of Royal Plaza Casino.

    Put it down to a learning experience and move on - and think seriously about using USD exclusively.

    Cheers
     
  4. Sep 29, 2006
  5. happygobrokey

    happygobrokey Dormant account

    Occupation:
    student of life
    Location:
    canada
    but then, take a country like bulgaria that is not in the eu but probably has a lot of their economic traffic in euros. why can't they use euros as that is the closest/most natural currency to them? for that matter, why are USD the default when online gambling is illegal in the states? they should start by prohibiting the casinos from dealing in american dollars.

    yes definitely it makes no difference what currency you play in if you're not getting any leverage on a promotion. it's all chips anyway. you assume essentially the same risk playing GBP5 per hand with a 50-unit stack as USD10 a hand with 100-unit stack. perhaps they should create a standard (site-by-site or universal) value of a chip, where one chip equals x.xx USD, x.xx GBP... eliminates separate currency issues with wagering requirements or residency, use your own currency to buy chips of a set value, and then they just convert it back in-house when they pay out or at neteller.
     
    Last edited: Sep 29, 2006
    1 person likes this.
  6. Sep 29, 2006
  7. GrandMaster

    GrandMaster Ueber Meister CAG

    Occupation:
    Mathematician by day, online gambler by night.
    Location:
    UK
    The T&C say "only residents of the European Union will be able to open an account in Euros". Despite this, the casino allowed him to open a euro account and accepted his deposits while knowing full well that he was Australia. The casino's actions indicate that it has waived the currency restriction for this player and therefore should pay the player in full. As the player did not take any bonus, so the only difference to the casino is it can expect to win about 30% more from the player than if had played in US$.

    I recommend filing a complaint with You must register/login in order to see the link. and you should also fill in You must register/login in order to see the link. to tell them what you think of them.
     
    1 person likes this.
  8. Sep 29, 2006
  9. Nifty29

    Nifty29 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    PAID CASINO SHILL
    Location:
    Turn right, then right. then right again
    Yes, I agree that he was allowed to play - but the way I understand it is that he made several deposits totalling EUR2000 in one session immediately after opening an account. I would assume that this information may only have been detected by the Casino during a daily audit ( assuming they dont employ someone full time to monitor the full details of every single deposit). Would the casino have closed the account and returned the deposits if the player had not cashed out?....we'll never know so there is no point speculating.

    I'm not saying that this doesnt suck for the player, but the terms are clear. Personally, I'm from Australia and I know not to use EUR or Pounds at online casinos - as I said, it is very widely known to avoid doing this.

    It may be to the Casinos detriment, but that is immaterial. It is every players' responsibility to read the terms before they deposit funds and anyone who isnt prepared to accept this reponsibility should not be playing online.

    The player is at fault here (by their own admission) and he should leave it at that and let ECOGRA deal with legitimate cases where people really have been ripped off by rogue or incompetent casinos.

    Its nothing personal, its just a point of view.
     
  10. Sep 29, 2006
  11. BBKPoker

    BBKPoker halfway to busto PABrogue3

    Occupation:
    None
    Location:
    Edinburgh, Seattle, Vancouver BC, Auckland
    I agree as well. Pretty much the entire reason of banning players from playing in a currency other than their own countries is the abuse of playing bonuses in pounds to make more money. Assuming this player did not request or claim any bonus (which you have to do manually and accept the terms on Royal Plaza) there is no particular reason why the casino should have an issue with him playing in a differing currency. It was a big mistake to not follow the rules and deposit in the right currency but this is one of the very few situations in which a player breaks the rules where I think they should be paid regardless (and play further with the knowledge they will be banned from bonuses or given the option to open a new account in the correct currenct).

    I've made the mistake once each of opening accounts in Euros or Pounds before (misclicking) and I've been invited to open a new account in the correct currency and have my balance convereted and transferred there. Once I had claimed a bonus and once I had not. There doesn't seem to be a legitimate reason why the casino should take issue with doing this assuming the player's account of what happened is factual.
     
    1 person likes this.
  12. Sep 29, 2006
  13. Nifty29

    Nifty29 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    PAID CASINO SHILL
    Location:
    Turn right, then right. then right again
    The solution of having the balance converted to a USD account and being restricted from future bonuses would be a good outcome.

    Great suggestion BBK :)
     
  14. Sep 29, 2006
  15. just play

    just play closed account

    Occupation:
    Director of Home Operations
    Location:
    USA


    Since when?

    It's not illegal in the states.

    :confused:
     
  16. Sep 29, 2006
  17. ketzzz

    ketzzz Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Surfer
    Location:
    AU
    I will email them with that suggestion, but I do not think it will happen. They have not been very helpful whatsoever in this situation.

    Their Rep Pm'd me and I gave him my details. He said he may be able to help me, so we will see.

    I also have not received my deposits back as of yet, and I deposited on the 4th of Sep.

    Nifty, I find your position on this situation strange. Basically you are saying because I signed up in Euro (without claiming any bonuses) that the casino has a right to steal my money. This makes no sense, they should have offered me to change my currency or they should not have allowed it in the first place. My neteller account is also in Euros, the euro is much more stable than US dollars and thats the currency I feel most comfortable with. I have played at quite a few casinos and I have NEVER had a problem before.

    Anyway, Ill update if I hear anything.
     
  18. Sep 29, 2006
  19. GrandMaster

    GrandMaster Ueber Meister CAG

    Occupation:
    Mathematician by day, online gambler by night.
    Location:
    UK
    There is no need for daily audit. If the casino is so concerned about players playing in the wrong currency, then it should not offer the disallowed currencies as a choice. As I recall, the choice of currencies is one of the last things when signing up, it certainly comes after the address, it should be easy to do with a minimal amount of programming. Confiscating players' money for playing in a disallowed currency is the sort of thing that a court might strike down as an unfair and unforceable contractual term.

    If the casino is consistent then it should apply the T&C to losing players, too. I am yet to hear from anybody who deposited in the wrong currency, lost and was refunded his deposit.
     
  20. Sep 29, 2006
  21. BBKPoker

    BBKPoker halfway to busto PABrogue3

    Occupation:
    None
    Location:
    Edinburgh, Seattle, Vancouver BC, Auckland
    If this is the case, this is a pretty legitimate reason to have signed up in Euros. As someone who lives in the U.S. I definitely agree that the dollar has been pretty volatile as of late.

    I would strongly suggest that you take a screenshot of you being logged into Neteller showing that your account is registered for Euros and explain that this is the reason you signed up in Euros and explain that you didn't want to pay the currency conversion fees. That is a legitimate reason, and additionally, you never claimed a bonus so they don't really have an avenue to claim bonus or promotional abuse which is what that entire rule is pretty much designed to avoid.
     
  22. Sep 29, 2006
  23. Nifty29

    Nifty29 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    PAID CASINO SHILL
    Location:
    Turn right, then right. then right again
    Well, yes, the fact that your Neteller is in EUR does change things somewhat - I guess I assumed you used a credit card.

    Grandmaster - I agree that the casino shouldnt allow the option. There must be a way to prevent this via the micro signup as they seem to be able to do it when it comes to country of residence and DOB etc.

    Again, its not personal. Ive just been around long enough to know that if the terms are there in black and white then the casino will most likely invoke them and not pay. A player must accept SOME responsibility to be familiar with casino T&C's.

    Im very disappointed they didnt return your deposits immediately - this is definitely something you should pursue as, according to the casino, the bets were not allowed and therefor not made and therefor you should receive a refund.

    I really hope you get your deposits back (and maybe even your winnings as a goodwill gesture)

    Royal Plaza has a big chance to get some good PR here by making an exception in this case - lets see if they come to the party.
     
  24. Sep 30, 2006
  25. AussieDave

    AussieDave Dodgy whacko backstabber

    Occupation:
    Gaming SEO Specialist & Casino Webmaster
    Location:
    Australia
    :thumbsup:

    I can only speak from an Australians point of view, but when you signup at any MG casino and you enter Australia as your country a drop down box appears with all the States in them.

    Obviously the software's been programmed to identify Country zones. There for I'm surprised (in the instance) that it's not programmed to their currency choices too. Especially at a casino that does not accept certain currencies from certain Countries.

    Without sounding like an A hole, this is another prime example of why you must read the Terms & Conditions for every casino you sign up at.

    We all know that most casino's tend to throw curve balls into their T&C & so on.


    :lolup:
     
  26. Oct 1, 2006
  27. tombomb

    tombomb Dormant account

    Location:
    right here
     
  28. Oct 2, 2006
  29. thelawnet

    thelawnet Dormant account

    Occupation:
    programmer
    Location:
    UK


    Wow, that's pretty harsh. The player didn't actually do anything wrong, or try to exploit the casino or anything.

    One would hope that a reputable casino would not steal winnings from a player who acts in good faith.

    Clearly they are deeply disreputable and are using the small print to steal from a player who won fair and square.
     
  30. Oct 2, 2006
  31. ketzzz

    ketzzz Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Surfer
    Location:
    AU
    I think this might be worse than I thought. I have written them 3 emails now asking where my deposits are and I never really got a reply that meant anything. This was the latest email that I received. I want to know if you guys decipher this the way I have.

    "Thank you for contacting our Casino.

    As already stated in our previous email, we write to inform you that
    your account has been discontinued .

    Please note that the currency you have chosen does not comply with our
    Terms and Conditions.
    Please check our Web site under "About Us", "Terms and Conditions",
    "Registration", as follows:

    You must register/login in order to see the link.

    All accounts opened not according to our Account Currency Policy (i.e.
    Euro accounts opened from a non-EU country) will be locked: should you
    have made a deposit before the account is locked, the Casino cannot be
    held responsible for any action taken afterwards."


    Does this mean that they will not give me back my deposits? Ive emailed them again for clarification. I will also wait to hear what their Rep says tomorrow. I am also right now going to file a complaint with Ecogra. Its one thing to take my winnings (legit winnings with no bonus play) but its another to take my deposits. Can they really do that?
     
  32. Oct 3, 2006
  33. ketzzz

    ketzzz Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Surfer
    Location:
    AU
    Its official...

    They are stealing my deposits as well... Here is the email from them when I asked why they have not yet paid my deposits.

    Dear Craig,

    Thank you for your answer.

    Once again we are sorry to inform that, when opening an account in our
    casino, our softwares asks you to confirm that you have read the Terms
    and Conditions; by ticking the box, you confirmed you did and agreed
    with it .

    We apologise for the inconvenice this may cause but this decision
    remains final.


    This is a new low.... I have never heard of a casino stealing deposits. I have filed a complaint with Ecogra so we will see if anything comes of that.
     
  34. Oct 4, 2006
  35. Nifty29

    Nifty29 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    PAID CASINO SHILL
    Location:
    Turn right, then right. then right again
    This is downright disgusting.

    Yes you violated the terms, BUT the way I see it is that if all the bets you made were void then you never actually played any of your deposit which means that all of the funds you deposited should be returned to your casino account which means that you should be able to withdraw them immediately.

    Its one thing to refuse to pay WINNINGS based on casino rules, but it is completely unacceptable to keep the DEPOSITS if the player had no chance of winning.

    If this casino doesnt give this player his money back they should be seriously considered for rogue status IMO.
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2006
  36. Oct 6, 2006
  37. thelawnet

    thelawnet Dormant account

    Occupation:
    programmer
    Location:
    UK


    Wow.....

    Crooked as hell.

    This is really taking the piss, it's amazing that these people are accredited here. Just unbelievable.
     
  38. Oct 6, 2006
  39. Flizzin

    Flizzin Wants your jackpot

    Occupation:
    Workstation Services Technical Support
    Location:
    Canada
    OMG, these people are Accredited ? :icon_evil

    That is pretty shady if you ask me...
     

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