Casino Complaint Redbet: 'Losing' my deposit due to a technical error...

Hi Tirilej & Vinylweatherman - thanks again for the replies.

I'll make a formal complaint to the bank as you suggest.

If I make any progress - or hear anything from Redbet, which seems unlikely - I'll post here again. It's now been 12 days since the money vanished...
 
The bank have returned my money at last, so thanks again for the advice on this thread.

They told me they needed to have written confirmation from Redbet that they would not try to claim the "pending" amount, and Redbet's support provided that.

Still no word from any Redbet rep here, or any apology, though. Not great, is it?
 
The bank have returned my money at last, so thanks again for the advice on this thread.

They told me they needed to have written confirmation from Redbet that they would not try to claim the "pending" amount, and Redbet's support provided that.

Still no word from any Redbet rep here, or any apology, though. Not great, is it?

While an apology from Redbet may be a diplomatic way to end the matter I cannot honestly see how Redbet has erred here.
 
Hi - well, I've said it earlier on the thread, but in short: I made a deposit, their payment process failed, my deposit disappeared from my bank account - and they told me it was my problem to sort out. Does that explain it?
 
Hi - well, I've said it earlier on the thread, but in short: I made a deposit, their payment process failed, my deposit disappeared from my bank account - and they told me it was my problem to sort out. Does that explain it?

It is a bitter thing to happen. However i can see how it was out of Redbets hands. I am sure they were pretty sure that upon waiting period the bank would return the money, however they couldnt do anything to speed it up... so everyone had to let it run its course.
I guess where they could have handled it better is a softer approach with you, from what i gather. Perhaps reassure you that if all is as you have said, then the funds will surely appear or hand hold you into how to deal with your bank. Although i can see their point where somethings have to be dealt between you and your bank and not a third party (them).
 
It is a bitter thing to happen. However i can see how it was out of Redbets hands. I am sure they were pretty sure that upon waiting period the bank would return the money, however they couldnt do anything to speed it up... so everyone had to let it run its course.
I guess where they could have handled it better is a softer approach with you, from what i gather. Perhaps reassure you that if all is as you have said, then the funds will surely appear or hand hold you into how to deal with your bank. Although i can see their point where somethings have to be dealt between you and your bank and not a third party (them).

It turns out they could, all the bank needed was a written confirmation from the merchant that they would not try to claim this pending transaction, and as soon as the bank had it, they returned the money. Clearly, Redbet should have done this right at the start, and this would have been over in a day or two. As it stands, the money was effectively frozen because although the technical error meant the money didn't move to Redbet, the technical error also meant that the authorisation was not cancelled either, so the money was stuck in limbo till either RedBet claimed it, or cancelled the hold, which has to be done from the merchant's end, nothing to do with the player.

It may still be worth escalating the matter as technical problems and uncooperative merchants should not be the customer's problem, and the current system does not allow for an easy return of the held money when there is a technical failure after the authorisation has been given by the bank, but which makes it impossible for the merchant to ever call upon that authorisation. The bank should not have left it to the customer to do the chasing as these are technical issues with the behind the scenes systems that banks and merchants use to move money when we buy things, and so it should be someone from the bank that troubleshoots on behalf of the customer when technical failures cause money to be "stuck" in the system.

Of course, this resolution proves that all along this money had never left the bank, they were hanging on to it to cover their own arse just in case the technical issue was resolved in such a way that the money was called upon by the merchant.

If you dispute a charge, the bank are certainly not "unable to help" then, they can even pull back money that has already left and gone to the merchant, so maybe the problem here is that the request wasn't made properly, and maybe you had to enter a formal dispute for the charge on the grounds that what you were charged for "casino chips" never arrived, and the merchant was saying that they never would because the money didn't reach them.
 
It turns out they could, all the bank needed was a written confirmation from the merchant that they would not try to claim this pending transaction, and as soon as the bank had it, they returned the money. Clearly, Redbet should have done this right at the start.

Hi - thanks again for your help resolving this, really appreciate it. And yes, that's why this is so annoying - if Redbet had taken responsibility on day one, this never would have happened. They just weren't interested, implying it was my problem, not theirs.

As I said earlier in the thread, imagine this happening when making a purchase at Amazon or any other online retailer that valued its customers - if their payment process failed and locked your money, they wouldn't just shrug it off. Just because it's a casino and a virtual product, it shouldn't be any different.

(still no contact from the rep, by the way!)
 
It turns out they could, all the bank needed was a written confirmation from the merchant that they would not try to claim this pending transaction, and as soon as the bank had it, they returned the money. Clearly, Redbet should have done this right at the start, and this would have been over in a day or two. As it stands, the money was effectively frozen because although the technical error meant the money didn't move to Redbet, the technical error also meant that the authorisation was not cancelled either, so the money was stuck in limbo till either RedBet claimed it, or cancelled the hold, which has to be done from the merchant's end, nothing to do with the player.

It may still be worth escalating the matter as technical problems and uncooperative merchants should not be the customer's problem, and the current system does not allow for an easy return of the held money when there is a technical failure after the authorisation has been given by the bank, but which makes it impossible for the merchant to ever call upon that authorisation. The bank should not have left it to the customer to do the chasing as these are technical issues with the behind the scenes systems that banks and merchants use to move money when we buy things, and so it should be someone from the bank that troubleshoots on behalf of the customer when technical failures cause money to be "stuck" in the system.

Of course, this resolution proves that all along this money had never left the bank, they were hanging on to it to cover their own arse just in case the technical issue was resolved in such a way that the money was called upon by the merchant.

If you dispute a charge, the bank are certainly not "unable to help" then, they can even pull back money that has already left and gone to the merchant, so maybe the problem here is that the request wasn't made properly, and maybe you had to enter a formal dispute for the charge on the grounds that what you were charged for "casino chips" never arrived, and the merchant was saying that they never would because the money didn't reach them.

Oh. Thanks for that. If thats the case then it should be done without question since these cases and technical problems do happen. Should be added to their procedures, as with other merchants. Or at least more clear way to explain to the client with instructions.
 
I'm not quite sure what the confusion is here - this is simply poor from Redbet & they would not be seeing my deposits again with this attitude. I think they should offer some comps to reassure the player.
 
Redbet themselves didn't lose the deposit, it's more a case of "RedBet not following accepted banking procedure over technical error causes customer's money to be stuck indefinitely in a pending state." Even the resolution wasn't accepted procedure, it was EXCEPTIONAL procedure found only by weeks of customer shooting in the dark trying to hit upon a working solution.

Something also went wrong at the banks end too, because authorisations that are not subsequently claimed are supposed to drop after a few days. Petrol pumps do this all the time, they authorise £99 but take a different charge once you have filled up. Now if all those £99 authorisations didn't drop automatically there would be complaints. Authorisations have this short lifespan before dropping automatically BECAUSE of the probability that technical issues will prevent the first attempt at a transaction from going through, so the banking system needs a way to ensure that the system doesn't seize up with indefinitely pending transactions that need to be cleared manually by the customer contacting the merchant and the bank each time.

The bank also needs to explain why this authorisation was going to sit pending "forever" unless Redbet could be forced to do something, and it was forcing Redbet to produce this written declaration that they would not ever take the charge that finally cleared the pending transaction.
 
Looking around, it seems this problem is common, and just as common is the buck passing to and fro between merchant and bank with neither wanting to help the customer. ONLY if a fault is identified with how the bank dealt with the matter would a complaint about the bank be upheld. If the problem is held to be with the retailer or their acquirer, then this would be the subject of a separate complaint, possibly one of not being treated fairly.

Above all, it seems it's only a real problem when DEBIT cards are used, because any errors such as this can prevent people from accessing their own money, including paying bills. Use a CREDIT card though, and unless you are running it uncomfortably close to the limit (which you shouldn't routinely be doing), then this type of error will remove a part from the top of your credit limit, and this should not ordinarily cause inconvenience during the time it takes to resolve itself.

Here is an example of someone getting the runaroud between Mothercare and their bank in much the same way as this case, until the matter eventually resolved itself after 7 days.

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One contributor even mentioned the solution:-

Contact mothercare and ask them to fax your bank saying they wont be collecting it along with the payment details and your bank should lift the ringfence on the funds.

However, even with no action being taken, the charge should either be taken or drop after a few days, expressed as "working days", so would not include weekends and bank holidays. For debit cards, this should be around 5 working days, so a calendar week.

Ask the bank for it's policy on "authorisation holds", and for how long such holds are applied where the merchant does not collect the money before they drop automatically. Unless this period was exceeded, then it's probably not really down to the bank, it's Redbet that should have acted, specifically, they should have cancelled the authorisation hold from their end once they had decided they would not be actioning the charge. However, if the time was exceeded, then something else happened that caused the bank to stray from it's usual policy, which might be cause for complaint.

There is something rather worrying though, it seems that consumers have little protection and few rights of immediate redress when such problems occur. Often the problem is made worse by merchants asking the customer to "try again", as this can create duplication of authorisation holds, and even duplicate charges being made. I remember having a rant about MGS banking saying "please try again" when my Neteller deposits were supposedly "declined", only to find that they had been debited, and that by following this advice I had double the mess to clean up when I had TWO declines, but also TWO deposits taken from my Neteller.

I think this is a serious weakness in electronic money transfer systems, and as such, consumers should have more rights in regard to getting something done, and a clear definition of who is to do this rather than the current stalemate where the merchant and bank both blame each other.

In the mean time, it seems that using a credit card affords much more protection as it's not your money stuck in limbo, it's the bank's money (It has agreed to lend you the amount of the purchase, has set it aside, but has not yet actually lent it to you), and unless the charge is subsequently processed, you do not pay a pending charge on your credit card statement, nor is interest charged even if it sits pending "forever".

An alternative is to have a separate account purely for debit card gambling, so that if an error holds some of your gambling budget in limbo, it just prevents the casino industry making that amount from you that week, but has no impact on your non gambling bank account activity, so everything else you do should not be impacted.

If you are panicking because today is 100% bonus day, remember that there will be another coming along, and in many cases it can be predictable.
 
Issue solved

Good morning gents,

Please let me firstly apologize for the delay in the response. We can assure you that we treat every case very serious and with it's due urgency. However, my colleague Adam was in his in vacation and for some reason i just noticed the thread. Things have been a bit crazy with all our follow-ups after the affiliate conferences, that we must have missed yours. Sorry about that :).

Also I would like to say thanks very much to all amazing Casinomeister members for all the support and help showed in this matter – you guys are awesome.

Saladfingers my friend, i am glad to hear that you received the funds back and the issue is solved now. Once again apologies for the inconvenience and please PM me your username, we will ensure that will take very good care of you. Kindly note that from this point onward you should always PM me. This will ensure that all the correspondence is tracked and solved asap.

Thank you all, in anticipation.
Marius
 
Hi Marius, thanks for your reply. I will send you a private message.

Hi saladfingers, great stuff mate! I'm glad you got it sorted.If there is anything we can do to make your playing experience in our platform more joyful please do let me know.
Have a great weekend and thanks everyone!
 

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