Pharaohs Casino - new software, stupid terms

[lojo]

I am more impressed than amazed, but I am pleasantly surprised.

Please keep in mind it is not discrimination to offer one set of people one offer and another demographic, another.

It is their money you are playing with if you accept a bonus offer and they can offer it to whomever or nobody if they please.

Now if a casino declined real wagers from a player, well, that is their absolute business right as well.


Excellent result Mario, don't let bonus users beat you down.

 

[lojo]

Indeed the written contract should reflect the terms clarified here so far, and KK's question should be clarified as well.

Again, I am impressed. And have no fear of depositing and being paid.

Would ya all just quit with the bonuses? Gamble or go home.

Regards.

 

[chuchu59]

Indeed the written contract should reflect the terms clarified here so far, and KK's question should be clarified as well.

Again, I am impressed. And have no fear of depositing and being paid.

Would ya all just quit with the bonuses? Gamble or go home.

Regards.

Lojo,

The bonus issue is quite complex. Both players and casinos want to retain this for different reasons. Some players abuse bonuses by betting big initially on table/card games and grind out WRs with minimal bets thus ensuring profits in the long run. Some believe this will give them a slight advantage when providing them with entertainment and there will always be some newbies who are afraid of what is happening at the other side but wish to play nevertheless. The bonus gives them a sense of security in that they feel their bankroll wont be eroded that quickly.

Some casinos, especially the rogued ones use bonuses to entice people to play but will also use them as an excuse not to pay. The better ones use them to retain customers and make sure that their market share is not eroded by customers deflecting to other casinos with 100%, 200% etc. match bonuses. Until such time as most players are educated with the knowledge that bonuses are not what they seem especially with the high WRs, it is here to stay. IMO it would be much better if the comp system could be improved. Most of them work at $1000 wagering to $1 comp which is much too measly. If bonuses are removed, I think this should be worked out to $1000 to $15 given the lower costs of operation for the casino and their payout percentages.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Yep, that's the perverse thing about trying to goose an sticky (sorry, phantom) type bonus, an even riskier strategy would probably go unnoticed by the casino operator. Hell, just do a couple of $50 spins on a slot machine.

Try Munchkins

 

[vinylweatherman]

I am more impressed than amazed, but I am pleasantly surprised.

Please keep in mind it is not discrimination to offer one set of people one offer and another demographic, another.
It is their money you are playing with if you accept a bonus offer and they can offer it to whomever or nobody if they please.

Now if a casino declined real wagers from a player, well, that is their absolute business right as well.


Excellent result Mario, don't let bonus users beat you down.

It is in the EU. iTunes lost a case based on this very thing, they offered UK members tracks at 99p, and other EU states at 99 Eurocents. Casinos could fall foul of this were they to advertise for UK players, assuming Kawanake make it onto the whitelist.
In terms of mere demographics, it is generally OK, as people can move from one demographic to another, such as earnings. However, to discriminate against an entire country allows no such movement. Once you are British, always British, no matter how much you progress up the salary scale, and whatever your educational achievements.
Irish groups have successfully challenged discrimination on the grounds of being Irish, and this is no different to being discriminated against for being British.
It comes under race laws, in particular statements that no ethnic group should experience blanket discrimination from goods and services based purely on their origin. Discriminating against individuals based on their past conduct though is OK.
If players are abusing offers, the offers should be changed such that abuse is impossible in the future, even if this ends up preventing casinos from preying on the less well educated members of humanity by putting them off.

 

[chuchu59]

Mario, thanks for your very comprehensive reply!

However:-


a) I don't see how you can single out UK players (or any other individual country) - 'bonus abusers' in any location will play bonuses in the best possible way to try to maximise their winnings.

b) Do you not agree that it would be FAR more sensible for the casinos to get the software set up so that it is impossible for players to make 'undesirable' bets? Or if that's not practical, spell out in the T&C's exactly what is not allowed?

e.g. You could say: "In meeting the Wagering Requirements for any bonus, players are not permitted to wager more than 25% of their total bankroll on a single bet, except when their total bank is less than 50 credits (when no restrictions shall apply)."

Fortune Lounge have already included a similar type of term.

I really would appreciate a response to point 'b' at least.

Thanks.
KK

On point 'b' the T&C list will never be exhaustive as both casinos and players will face some new situations brought about by the market. Nevertheless, trying to be more precise results in a lot less squabbles.

As for the 'discrimination' issue, allalong players from various countries had different WRs imposed on them and I do believe that casinos can decide on whatever they wish as long as they dont spell out such rules after deposit and play. Maybe, for Mario adding the word 'some' before "UK players" in KK's highlighted phrase would be acceptable.

 

[Mario]

a) I don't see how you can single out UK players (or any other individual country) - 'bonus abusers' in any location will play bonuses in the best possible way to try to maximise their winnings.

b) Do you not agree that it would be FAR more sensible for the casinos to get the software set up so that it is impossible for players to make 'undesirable' bets? Or if that's not practical, spell out in the T&C's exactly what is not allowed?

KK

Hi there KasinoKing,

Hope you are well,

I totally agree that there will always be players, does not matter from where they are who will bend and find new ways of maximizing their game play to quickly complete the WR.

In regards to your second question yes we are in the process of implementing a rule in the system which will assist in this matter and that will be that you are not able to make an all in bet. It will just be implemented on the acquisition offer and not all other offers.

How it will work is as follow:

We are able to set a maximum bet amount on the games which will avoid or stop players from making an all in bet.

So that will surely assist in this matter.

Best regards
Mario
PlayShare Group Representative

 

[vinylweatherman]

Hi there KasinoKing,

Hope you are well,

I totally agree that there will always be players, does not matter from where they are who will bend and find new ways of maximizing their game play to quickly complete the WR.

In regards to your second question yes we are in the process of implementing a rule in the system which will assist in this matter and that will be that you are not able to make an all in bet. It will just be implemented on the acquisition offer and not all other offers.

How it will work is as follow:

We are able to set a maximum bet amount on the games which will avoid or stop players from making an all in bet.
So that will surely assist in this matter.

Best regards
Mario
PlayShare Group Representative

How long has this been possible for with MG then. I think the answer is 2005.
It seems odd that so many MG casinos have preferred instead to confiscate winnings rather than read the operators manual and set low limits at the offending games to prevent this strategy from the outset.

Casino Action used this to prevent the one big bet of $500 in their old bonus accounts. They set it to $100 at Blackjack in those bonus accounts, but left it at $500 in the real accounts. If they could do this in 2005, then all those MG casinos that have whined about being unable to deal with this withiut using an "F U clause" have been lying for 2 years to the player community. Casino Rewards are STILL whining and confiscating winnings rather than using this tool - I suspect some casinos prefer it this way, software implementation of rules would make it impossible to justify confiscation of winnings, and would deny them the chance to make extra by baiting for "bonus abusers" and then screwing them when they bite with a confiscation of winnings, but no refund for the 50% or so of losing attempts.

 

[lojo]

Some very good points and arguments all... much for me to ponder...

 

[AussieDave]

Hi all,

(btw remove the x's)

Looking at the bonus t&C's page:
xxxhttp://www.pharaohscasino.com/Deposit_Bonus_TC.aspx

It states "To be eligible to receive the welcome bonus a player must have NOT received a Welcome Bonus from and casino operated by Naden which are on the following list:
xxxhttp://list.playsharepartners.com/

When did (playshare) or have they always owned Pharaohs Casino?

Now I'm confused.

 

[Mario]

Hi all,

(btw remove the x's)

Looking at the bonus t&C's page:
xxxhttp://www.pharaohscasino.com/Deposit_Bonus_TC.aspx

It states "To be eligible to receive the welcome bonus a player must have NOT received a Welcome Bonus from and casino operated by Naden which are on the following list:
xxxhttp://list.playsharepartners.com/

When did (playshare) or have they always owned Pharaohs Casino?

Now I'm confused.

Hi Trezz,

Rather hear it from the horses mouth as I'm sure that allot of posters on this forum will gladly enlighten you about the whole white label scheme.

Pharaohs are part of PlayShares White Label program and they came onboard about just bit more than a month ago.

Pharaohs was part of the Boss operators and opted to rather be part of our White Label program which gives them a much better and more trust worthy systems and games.

Hope this helps.

Best regards,

Mario

PlayShare Group Representative