Online gambling has become a disgrace for UK players

[SlotGrinder]

I remember having a discussion here on CM many years ago with Nifty, about RTP %'s.

As I recall, he seemed to be arguing that a couple percentages would not make a significant difference in player experience, so that it shouldn't matter to players whether the RTP is 99% or 93%. I would get so frustrated with his obstinance, but yeah, it makes a BIG difference in player experience.

It definitely does
It;s not a "couple of percent" because it is relative, for example a 96% rtp means you lose 4% of your wager per spin on average whereas a 94% rtp means you lose 6% of your wager - that is a 50% increase!
If you went to into your local shop and everything had suddenly increased by 50% in price then you would walk straight out again!

99% to 93% will make you lose your money 8x as quickly! that guy is talking crap lol
Depending on where specifically the rtp is lost in the game will make a difference to how the experience is but I don't see how they could possibly work out so "it wouldn't make a significant difference to player experience". Either the small wins are less common and smalleror the big wins are smaller and the bonuses less frequent. Either way it becomes quickly noticeable

There was an experiment where players had to choose from 2 supposedly normal decks of cards, a red deck and a blue deck. One deck was ever so slightly weighted towards containing better cards but only very slightly. Pretty quickly players would favour the "better" deck even though they couldn't pinpoint why. They could just "feel it". So I don't think it is an illusion when you hear so many people saying the slots feel worse now, since they really ARE! and by a significant amount too

 

[L&L-Jan]

More to come:

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Besides earlier affordability checks that will start affecting way more players, were also looking at 5 second spins from 17 jan 2025.

 

[Mr Wild]

More to come:

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Besides earlier affordability checks that will start affecting way more players, were also looking at 5 second spins from 17 jan 2025.

5s spins is not for slot games, but roulette and others.

 

[jasonuk]

Have spun this out to a separate thread given it's importance.

5s spins is not for slot games, but roulette and others.

Agreed, given the pre-text "It will extend requirements that already apply to slots to other online products" it's relating to non-slot products.

 

[Provoxv]

The difference in RTP might seem small at first glance, but as you've pointed out, it adds up significantly over time. Losing 4% vs. 6% per spin can really change the whole gaming experience. Personally, I've noticed that the overall feel of the games has changed. It's not just the RTP, but the frequency and size of wins that make a huge difference. I've been playing

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, and the transparency there is refreshing. It feels more like a real casino experience and less like I'm being cheated by algorithms. I had a positive experience with an online casino recently where they offered great bonuses and a variety of games. The live dealer games were particularly engaging and gave me a sense of fairness. Unlike some slot games, I could see the action unfold in real time, which added to my confidence in the platform.

 

[dunover]

The difference in RTP might seem small at first glance, but as you've pointed out, it adds up significantly over time. Losing 4% vs. 6% per spin can really change the whole gaming experience. Personally, I've noticed that the overall feel of the games has changed. It's not just the RTP, but the frequency and size of wins that make a huge difference. I've been playing

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

, and the transparency there is refreshing. It feels more like a real casino experience and less like I'm being cheated by algorithms. I had a positive experience with an online casino recently where they offered great bonuses and a variety of games. The live dealer games were particularly engaging and gave me a sense of fairness. Unlike some slot games, I could see the action unfold in real time, which added to my confidence in the platform.

Alas we won't be 'particularly engaging' here with spammers.

Do one, your AI bot writer needs a higher IQ.

 

[snorky510238]

I am that cynical that I don’t even believe the live dealers are actually “live”. There is no proof that they are. Online gambling is full of skullduggery and cheating. I’ve been there got the T-shirt and had it spun dry whst I was still wearing the bastard!

I know I keep banging the same drum but it’s only in the hope that one day, the lid gets blown off completely and I can say, I tried to tell you. It’s corrupt, dirty, cheating filth and the more providers are forced to gimp rtp’s the more obvious it becomes.

 

[kou187]

I am that cynical that I don’t even believe the live dealers are actually “live”. There is no proof that they are. Online gambling is full of skullduggery and cheating. I’ve been there got the T-shirt and had spun dry while I was still wearing it.

I know I keep banging the same drum but it’s only in the hope that one day, the lid gets blown off completely and I can say, I tried to tell you. It’s corrupt, dirty, cheating filth and the more providers are forced to gimp rtp’s the more obvious it becomes.

Although i may not agree that the Live dealers are not Live, I do believe one day the industry will be exposed for not being as clean and as RANDOM as it claims to be. But hey, By then they will have already robbed billions of gamblers. I just hope one day it does get exposed but i doubt it will.

We need a documentary called (RNG Exposed) Ross Kemp could go to Malta to check if its all up to code and truly random like they claim.

"And today I'm here in Malta. To find out if RANDOM is really random" Ross Kemp.

I would love to watch that!

 

[jasonuk]

I am that cynical that I don’t even believe the live dealers are actually “live”. There is no proof that they are. Online gambling is full of skullduggery and cheating. I’ve been there got the T-shirt and had spun dry while I was still wearing it.

I know I keep banging the same drum but it’s only in the hope that one day, the lid gets blown off completely and I can say, I tried to tell you. It’s corrupt, dirty, cheating filth and the more providers are forced to gimp rtp’s the more obvious it becomes.

Where there is an actual live host, there are lots of things that can be done to verify if it is live (and in the early days, baccarat tables would have things like a news channel in the background to verify that it was actually live) - although some of the smaller providers or automated tables, there is no such guarantee even to this day.

I suspect that cynicism will increase when Evolution start doing augumented reality tables (avatar-based hosts), because you start to wonder what else they can fake. There are certain categories of games, and certain providers, that I already wouldn't trust as far as I can throw them - some of them are clearly defying the laws of physics.

Although if it was pre-recorded, some mug playing Prag live is going to get dealt from two shoes in the near future I'm still astounded that happened...

 

[kidgloves]

Surely casino's are making more money these days with the profiles of slots? The leaning towards high variance is only a good thing as a minority of players hit big and a majority of players feed the casino coffers with their 1 or 2 bonuses for naff all over a decent number of spins.
I can't quite believe that I can play Big Bass Bonanza in my local AGC for a similar RTP to some of the lower settings online.

 

[slot_zombie]

Surely casino's are making more money these days with the profiles of slots? The leaning towards high variance is only a good thing as a minority of players hit big and a majority of players feed the casino coffers with their 1 or 2 bonuses for naff all over a decent number of spins.
I can't quite believe that I can play Big Bass Bonanza in my local AGC for a similar RTP to some of the lower settings online.

In a way the casinos are probably also gambling a little bit, for example ripping a new ringpiece for players on Tombstone RIP month in, month out and hoping they are not the one in which that rare 300000x lands.

But I agree they are certainly making more money overall, the profiles of most modern games are disgusting.

 

[Kroffe]

In a way the casinos are probably also gambling a little bit, for example ripping a new ringpiece for players on Tombstone RIP month in, month out and hoping they are not the one in which that rare 300000x lands.

But I agree they are certainly making more money overall, the profiles of most modern games are disgusting.

Do NLC slots also have a low-ish cap on the betsize similar to how some casinos do with Doa2?
Casinos can pretty much decide the risk by limiting how much people can bet on the super high volatile slots.
Maybe its not necessary with NLC slots considering they go so hard on the bonus buy angle, and its not exactly cheap to buy bonuses on NLC slots assuming you go for the super bonus.

 

[satchnz]

Do NLC slots also have a low-ish cap on the betsize similar to how some casinos do with Doa2?
Casinos can pretty much decide the risk by limiting how much people can bet on the super high volatile slots.
Maybe its not necessary with NLC slots considering they go so hard on the bonus buy angle, and its not exactly cheap to buy bonuses on NLC slots assuming you go for the super bonus.

Your post got me interested in what the max bet was for Tombstone RIP at two UK casinos I still frequent on occasion. Both carry NLC slots but neither have Tombstone RIP…

 

[Kroffe]

Your post got me interested in what the max bet was for Tombstone RIP at two UK casinos I still frequent on occasion. Both carry NLC slots but neither have Tombstone RIP…

Just checked on Videoslots, Tombstone rip has max bet of 6sek for me, for comparison Vera&John has max bet set to 8sek.
Guessing it would be 60p and 80p for a UK customer.
Videoslots Doa2 the max bet is 18sek and on Vera&John its 90sek.

Somewhat relevant is that Vera&John also uses the highest rtp models for all providers, not only can you bet more but you probably have a higher chance of actually hitting the max win.
Not that you will be seeing me doing 90sek spins anytime soon.

 

[jasonuk]

Despite all the attempted changes in the terminology (*cough* max win *cough*), liability still rules the roost - so 300000x on a £250k liability would be 83p per spin.

I think Stars was doing a million at one point, not sure if that's still the case today.

 

[SlotsGuy]

These decisions which are effecting not just the enjoyment of online gambling but anything enjoyable at all is coming much higher than independent Governments, call me a conspiracy theorist (I don't care) but there's enough evidence to know the entire earth is ruled by a very evil One World Government and presidents/prime minsters are nothing more than puppets following orders.

Every aspect of life from smoking, drinking, meat, travelling, driving, gambling, nightclubs, music, sugar drinks, raves/concerts and our general freedoms is being destroyed by these satanic powers.

If you think online gambling is getting bad, towards the end of this year they're making massive radical changes to high-street arcades and bingo halls also. We then have the dreaded cashless society getting implemented as we speak and digital ID soon to be launched and once that happens say goodbye to your freedoms.

Life is changing massively, we're firmly in George Orwell's 1984. Agenda 2030 / The Great Reset.

The best thing is simply DO NOT COMPLY - If an online casino persists with asking for financial documents/wage slips/tax documents/savings etc simply say no and close the account.

 

[slot_zombie]

What are they doing to the arcades? The latest I saw is that they were getting better treatment and being allowed more £500 machines.

 

[Jono777]

What are they doing to the arcades? The latest I saw is that they were getting better treatment and being allowed more £500 machines.

Hoovering the carpets, reintroducing overflowing ash trays, bringing in more Bar-X for the over 80's and allowing you 5 minutes now when you lose all your dosh instead of ejecting you instantly.

 

[SlotsGuy]

What are they doing to the arcades? The latest I saw is that they were getting better treatment and being allowed more £500 machines.

Arcades will be restricted further and need to reduce how many £500 machines they can have, by the start of next year at least half of the £500 machines will be removed and replaced by £100 jackpot machines. I'm hearing Gamstop will expand it's reach and you'll need to be checked when entering any casino/arcade/bookies before you can place a bet.

Machines will become cashless and therefore you'll need to use a debit card (until CBDC is introduced) to play and each player will have a daily limit, winnings will be refunded at the machine back to your card. Players will only be allowed to gamble for a certain amount of time, opening hours will no longer be 24 hours.

There's a dark agenda happening to destroy all night-time leisure/shopping activities, it goes very deep which I won't go into but look carefully at pub opening times, raves (now moving to daytime raves), supermarkets no longer 24/7, local councils promoting pubs to close at 9pm such as London. To cut it short the Government want to control you and make sure you're nicely tucked up in bed by 10pm and of course to cut down with police resources/anti-social behaviour. They want a population of miserable, depressed little slaves with nothing to look forward to with a daily dose of big pharma anti-depressants & chemical laden foods.

 

[slot_zombie]

Gotta say that's a pretty bleak picture.

It's also contrary to the recently published guidance issued by the Govt. which states they are moving to a 2:1 B3 to Cat C ratio of machines. ie a more liberal regime.

Can't find any sources at all to back up the expansion of gamstop or time limits.

 

[SlotsGuy]

Gotta say that's a pretty bleak picture.

It's also contrary to the recently published guidance issued by the Govt. which states they are moving to a 2:1 B3 to Cat C ratio of machines. ie a more liberal regime.

Can't find any sources at all to back up the expansion of gamstop or time limits.

I'm hoping you are able to see where things are going generally in life, although this information has not been made fully public just yet... it's going to happen, step by step... they don't tend to make huge changes within a short time, they don't want to awaken the masses to the dark agenda they have planned.

Either way CBDC when introduced (a cashless society) the Government will have full control over your finances and how you spend the money. Every digital pound will need to be approved by the Government, alongside your human social credit score (like China) and digital identity/15 minute cities. Under the European Central Bank (ECB) have proposed the Digital Euro and will have the following features:

* Users be allowed to spend no more than 50 Euro per transaction
* Users have a maximum monthly spending limited of 1,000 euros
* Users have a limit of 50 transactions per month
* Users have a limit of digital euro holdings max 3,000 euros
* Be programmable, so the Governments or central banks can impose spending restrictions
* Can only be spent at government-approved merchants
* Be programmed to expire within a certain amount of time
* Not have anonymity as a viable option

They are testing this now and will roll out fully by 2026.

For now boycott cashless businesses and use cash as much as you can.

You have more power than you think...don't obey.

 

[paul7388]

I'm hoping you are able to see where things are going generally in life, although this information has not been made fully public just yet... it's going to happen, step by step... they don't tend to make huge changes within a short time, they don't want to awaken the masses to the dark agenda they have planned.

Either way CBDC when introduced (a cashless society) the Government will have full control over your finances and how you spend the money. Every digital pound will need to be approved by the Government, alongside your human social credit score (like China) and digital identity/15 minute cities. Under the European Central Bank (ECB) have proposed the Digital Euro and will have the following features:

* Users be allowed to spend no more than 50 Euro per transaction
* Users have a maximum monthly spending limited of 1,000 euros
* Users have a limit of 50 transactions per month
* Users have a limit of digital euro holdings max 3,000 euros
* Be programmable, so the Governments or central banks can impose spending restrictions
* Can only be spent at government-approved merchants
* Be programmed to expire within a certain amount of time
* Not have anonymity as a viable option

They are testing this now and will roll out fully by 2026.

For now boycott cashless businesses and use cash as much as you can.

You have more power than you think...don't obey.

I am seriously hoping you are just at the wind up and you truly do not believe everything you have posted today.

 

[SlotsGuy]

I am seriously hoping you are just at the wind up and you truly do not believe everything you have posted today.

Paul, I don't want you to believe anything I'm saying. I want you to have an open minded and do your own independent research away from the mainstream news, 1st page of Google etc.

 

[paul7388]

Paul, I don't want you to believe anything I'm saying. I want you to have an open minded and do your own independent research away from the mainstream news, 1st page of Google etc.

No offence but i do not need to.

You seriously saying you believe in 2 years time throughout Europe no one can spend more than 50 euros at a time and no more than a 1000 a month.

So by that means no one could buy a car, a house ,a phone ,a TV , or Virtually anything.

No going to a restaurant for a fancy meal or going a Holiday.

So guessing there would be no need to control spending as every business would be bankrupt and closed so nothing to spend on anyway.

And you truly believe that will happen in 2 years lol.

 

[dealer wins]

These decisions which are effecting not just the enjoyment of online gambling but anything enjoyable at all is coming much higher than independent Governments, call me a conspiracy theorist (I don't care) but there's enough evidence to know the entire earth is ruled by a very evil One World Government and presidents/prime minsters are nothing more than puppets following orders.

Every aspect of life from smoking, drinking, meat, travelling, driving, gambling, nightclubs, music, sugar drinks, raves/concerts and our general freedoms is being destroyed by these satanic powers.

If you think online gambling is getting bad, towards the end of this year they're making massive radical changes to high-street arcades and bingo halls also. We then have the dreaded cashless society getting implemented as we speak and digital ID soon to be launched and once that happens say goodbye to your freedoms.

Life is changing massively, we're firmly in George Orwell's 1984. Agenda 2030 / The Great Reset.

The best thing is simply DO NOT COMPLY - If an online casino persists with asking for financial documents/wage slips/tax documents/savings etc simply say no and close the account.

Amen brother 100% the world is getting butt fucked by the WEF, UN WHO who are cobtrolling our governments.

Apart from all the above, they are actively trying to poison and kill us off!

And the bastards wont remove the max bet button right next to the spin button either!