North Korea and US politics

[mack341]

Edit: this was meant as a reply to Mr Kroffe above

But why do they have to keep adding more vaccines???
Are you 100% sure there isn't some overkill and profiteering going on?

 

[Kelly Jo]

Even if vaccines did in some way have a link to autism (they dont)
Why would 99% of all studies done on the subject lie about the results?
Some evil conspiracy to give children autism?

They do.
99%? Says who?
Weird, huh?

 

[sufferinsilence]

I think our overall attitudes about life saving Vaccines have become distorted.
I'm not going to to be forced into a dead end view on this subject simply because
I buck the narrative. There is a remedy to all of this!
Vaccines could be made safe.
Why have we so easily set aside common sense for snark?

60% of male children in America have learning disabilities.
There is proof that links this to vaccines.
Our children are being targeted.
This must end.

Calling autism "lobotomy by vaccination" is just wrong.

 

[sufferinsilence]

Edit: this was meant as a reply to Mr Kroffe above

But why do they have to keep adding more vaccines???
Are you 100% sure there isn't some overkill and profiteering going on?

View attachment 122988

Pretty smart to put 18 influenza shots in there just to make it look "worse". Atleast over here getting vaccinated for influenza is completely voluntary.

Anyway, carry on. Natural selection will do its work.

 

[mack341]

Something is going on, whether it be chemicals used in food production or something else:

 

[sufferinsilence]

Or might it just be that today we are much better in actually diagnosing autism?

 

[mack341]

Pretty smart to put 18 influenza shots in there just to make it look "worse". Atleast over here getting vaccinated for influenza is completely voluntary.

Anyway, carry on. Natural selection will do its work.

So if you remove the influenza shots [this chart is based out of the USA] does it still not look a bit like overkill?

 

[sufferinsilence]

So if you remove the influenza shots [this chart is based out of the USA] does it still not look a bit like overkill?

I have to admit I don't really know most of those abbreviations but it doesn't seem like the worst idea to be vaccinated for hepatitis imo. Perhaps there might be some overkill but I'd have to read up on all the diseases the US is vaccinating for. On the other hand why would we want to re-introduce old illnesses in our society when we have more than enough issues as is with current new ones like nCov-2019?

 

[mack341]

Or might it just be that today we are much better in actually diagnosing autism?

If other illnesses and conditions rates have similarly rised due to better diagnosing, then that could be the answer. I'm sure doctors in 1975 weren't that bad at running children through various tests though.

 

[sufferinsilence]

If other illnesses and conditions rates have similarly rised due to better diagnosing, then that could be the answer. I'm sure doctors in 1975 weren't that bad at running children through various tests though.

You'd be surprised when it comes to psychiatric illnesses.

 

[Kelly Jo]

Calling autism "lobotomy by vaccination" is just wrong.

Reality is harsh.
A lobotomy targets specific functions of the brain.
How is that different than altered Autism genome?

In the US, Fetal tissue (cell lines/stem cells) has been used in the manufacture of viruses since the mid to late 1930s.
Autism was first diagnosed in 1943. Prior to this victims were diagnosed as schizophrenic.

Expand your thinking. When you step back to take in the larger view, the truth begins to emerge.

 

[Kroffe]

They do.
99%? Says who?
Weird, huh?

Yes, WHO says vaccines are a good thing.
And its not weird.

What is weird is people thinking they are smarter than the majority of medical professionals around the world.
Bringing back diseases once seen as eradicated and killing their own children because of ignorance.
That is weird.
Letting your child die because of a vaccine-preventable disease should really be considered the same as murder.

Wont bother with this topic anymore.
People advocating death over vaccines cant be reasoned with.

 

[mack341]

Yes, WHO says vaccines are a good thing.
And its not weird.

What is weird is people thinking they are smarter than the majority of medical professionals around the world.
Bringing back diseases once seen as eradicated and killing their own children because of ignorance.
That is weird.
Letting your child die because of a vaccine-preventable disease should really be considered the same as murder.

Wont bother with this topic anymore.
People advocating death over vaccines cant be reasoned with.

I must admit I don't know a lot about this issue compared to yourself. I find it hard to understand why intelligent people in the US and elsewhere campaign and have worries and concerns if everything is so plainly win-win re vaccines.

Out of the vaccines in the chart I posted how many relate to illnesses that are known to kill ?

It's not necessarily believing oneself to be smarter than the medical professionals, but a combination of factors, big pharma have been caught out hiding research data with some medicines that they are developing, govt often lie about big issues, as do the media, therefore I don't think it is unreasonable to ask questions from time to time.

 

[mack341]

This documentary could be interesting, Dr Wakefield was struck off but he doesn't strike me as a loon and he has been relentlessly smeared and attacked by the media.

"At the time of his MMR research study, Wakefield was senior lecturer and honorary

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in experimental

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at the Royal Free Hospital School of Medicine " wikipedia

san franciso chronicle review of the documentary:

The vast majority of people who see this film will not have the scientific knowledge to assess the film's veracity. But it's fair to say that the documentary, though characterized as antivaccination, isn't quite that. The point of view is more nuanced. It's against the vaccination of children ages 2 and younger. And it's particularly against the MMR — that is, the giving of three vaccines at once ... it's a passionate advocate for its viewpoint, and that makes for compelling viewing. ... Of course, it's possible that the children would have developed autism anyway, and that one event didn't cause the other. But the parents presented here are convinced otherwise

 

[Kroffe]

I must admit I don't know a lot about this issue compared to yourself. I find it hard to understand why intelligent people in the US and elsewhere campaign and have worries and concerns if everything is so plainly win-win re vaccines.

Out of the vaccines in the chart I posted how many relate to illnesses that are known to kill ?

It's not necessarily believing oneself to be smarter than the medical professionals, but a combination of factors, big pharma have been caught out hiding research data with some medicines that they are developing, govt often lie about big issues, as do the media, therefore I don't think it is unreasonable to ask questions from time to time.

Not everything is a conspiracy.
What possible gain could there be for all legitimate health oraganisations & professionals around the world to lie about this? Why do they want to give children learning disabilities?


Look what i found online.
There are people believing this.
Almost everyone would probably say its wrong, but i know better than all of them.
This means he is a time-traveler, and i will not be convinced otherwise.
And i will keep believing that even if it means bringing back eradicated diseases and killing children.

That makes as much sense as anti-vaccination does.
Do you think people should be asking questions about Keanu being a time-traveler?
After all, it would be a classic government move to hide such a thing from us.


In 2010, the GMC found that Wakefield had been dishonest in his research, had acted against his patients' best interests and mistreated developmentally delayed children,

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and had "failed in his duties as a responsible consultant".

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The Lancet fully retracted Wakefield's 1998 publication on the basis of the GMC's findings, noting that elements of the manuscript had been falsified and that the journal had been "deceived" by Wakefield

Sounds like a top guy. Lets trust him, and disregard that all his findings have been debunked.
Oh snap, Keanus here.
We are gonna go back in time and make sure Hitler gets in to art-school, possibly preventing WW2.
Wish us luck!

 

[Kroffe]

That was quick.
We prevented it.

Dont listen to anyone saying it happened. They are lying.
Now back to sanity.

 

[Harry_BKK]

I must admit I don't know a lot about this issue compared to yourself. I find it hard to understand why intelligent people in the US and elsewhere campaign and have worries and concerns if everything is so plainly win-win re vaccines.

Out of the vaccines in the chart I posted how many relate to illnesses that are known to kill ?

It's not necessarily believing oneself to be smarter than the medical professionals, but a combination of factors, big pharma have been caught out hiding research data with some medicines that they are developing, govt often lie about big issues, as do the media, therefore I don't think it is unreasonable to ask questions from time to time.

Don't know much about vaccines but I just need to look at the average life expectancy around 1900 and 2019. The former is the time where medicine sort of became more advanced. Penicillin was still not around until 1928.

1900 - 49 years
2019 - 78 years
(approximate overall averages for male and female)

Vaccines are surely not the only reason but certainly part of it.

 

[ternur]

This documentary could be interesting, Dr Wakefield was struck off but he doesn't strike me as a loon and he has been relentlessly smeared and attacked by the media.

"At the time of his MMR research study, Wakefield was senior lecturer and honorary

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in experimental

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at the Royal Free Hospital School of Medicine " wikipedia

san franciso chronicle review of the documentary:

The vast majority of people who see this film will not have the scientific knowledge to assess the film's veracity. But it's fair to say that the documentary, though characterized as antivaccination, isn't quite that. The point of view is more nuanced. It's against the vaccination of children ages 2 and younger. And it's particularly against the MMR — that is, the giving of three vaccines at once ... it's a passionate advocate for its viewpoint, and that makes for compelling viewing. ... Of course, it's possible that the children would have developed autism anyway, and that one event didn't cause the other. But the parents presented here are convinced otherwise

Wakefield has been discredited across the board. His research (and the documentary) are prime examples of pseudo science and motivations other than credible scientific research.

Edit: Kroffe already made the same point.

 

[Kroffe]

Ah a little nature-documentary was what i needed to calm down.

@mack341 Im all for a good conspiracy.
But vaccines causing autism&learning disabilites has nothing going for it, and everything going against it.
Saying that every legitimate health organisation in the world is involved in a conspiracy to give children learning disabilites is just crazy.

If there are any studies done by a legitimate health organisation from anywhere in the world that confirms a link between the two, id of course read it. But i dont think there is.
All i have been able to find is reports&studies that were impossible to replicate the results of, and the people producing&spreading them have been stripped of their license and fired. (alot of them not having a medical license in the first place)

Its hard to stay calm when people are serious about using oils&crystals and other bs like that instead of decades of medicinal research. How smug does one have to be to assume they know better than people has worked and studied these things their entire life.
And the worst part is that its not themselves they are putting in danger.
The children has done nothing to deserve dying from a preventable disease just because their idiot mother or father saw a picture on facebook saying vaccines cause autism.

Its just insanity.
Unless a study from a credible source saying learning disabilites and vaccines are linked shows up this will be my last post on the topic.
Third times the charm.

 

[sufferinsilence]

Not everything is a conspiracy.
What possible gain could there be for all legitimate health oraganisations & professionals around the world to lie about this? Why do they want to give children learning disabilities?


<snip weird Keanu Reeves stuff>

Do you want the long story or short? I'll give you the short one: because the liberal globalist elites want to keep the people under control and to keep them under control it means to keep them dumb.

I heard this guy George Soros is the mastermind behind all that.

And if you don't believe this I'll go and find some other conspiracy theory!

 

[Kroffe]

Do you want the long story or short? I'll give you the short one: because the liberal globalist elites want to keep the people under control and to keep them under control it means to keep them dumb.

I heard this guy George Soros is the mastermind behind all that.

And if you don't believe this I'll go and find some other conspiracy theory!

 

[mack341]

Wakefield has been discredited across the board. His research (and the documentary) are prime examples of pseudo science and motivations other than credible scientific research.

Edit: Kroffe already made the same point.

Wakefield, as I understand, believed giving the vaccinations one at at time was safer than all at once [mmr], he was not anti vaccine per se.

Just on a common sense level, thinking of a baby and it's immune system, it makes sense to me to be cautious. Merck the patent holder for this new combined way of giving the vaccines, must have made a pretty penny over the years

And Japan apparently banned mmr in 1993, I always thought they were a highly intelligent people:

MMR vaccination was mandatory when it was introduced in Japan in 1989; parents who did not comply could be fined. But within three months, doctors started warning of side- effects. Before long, the number of children with problems related to the vaccine was 2,000 times higher than expected, with meningitis among the adverse reactions.

Japan decided to use another MMR vaccine in 1991 but the number of problems connected with the vaccine was still higher than usual. Three children died and others were left seriously handicapped, suffering from damaged hearing and blindness among other problems.

Tragic cases included a 21-month-old child who lapsed into a coma two days after being given the MMR vaccine and never recovered. There was a huge public outcry and in 1993 the Japanese government moved to a programme of single vaccinations.

Although it reconsidered using MMR in 1999, Tokyo decided it was better to continue immunising against measles, mumps and rubella separately. [the independent's website]

----------

I just don't see the need to take a risk with a child's health and the parent should have the option of single vaccines even if the risk is slight that mmr could cause more problems.

 

[Kroffe]

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They are intelligent.
Thats why we get this response when an outbreak happens.

"The group said it emphasized avoiding medicines and vaccines and eating naturally farmed foods. But after some members became infected, the group apologized and said it was changing its practices.

“Given the unexpected situation, we will follow the health care center’s advice to get vaccine shots for measles or other highly infectious diseases so that we don’t cause concern to others,” the group said in

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."

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So 140 000 died during one year vs 104 over a period of 15 years.
And 104 might be high since "VAERS is a self-reporting system. This means that anyone—doctors, patients, family—can file a report, even if the event is not verified. "

Im no good with maths, but i think 140 000 is slightly larger than 104.
And thats not a fair comparison since its one year vs 15.
So its more like 140 000 vs 7.

 

[Kelly Jo]

Not everything is a conspiracy.
What possible gain could there be for all legitimate health oraganisations & professionals around the world to lie about this? Why do they want to give children learning disabilities?


Look what i found online.
There are people believing this.
Almost everyone would probably say its wrong, but i know better than all of them.
This means he is a time-traveler, and i will not be convinced otherwise.
And i will keep believing that even if it means bringing back eradicated diseases and killing children.
View attachment 122990

That makes as much sense as anti-vaccination does.
Do you think people should be asking questions about Keanu being a time-traveler?
After all, it would be a classic government move to hide such a thing from us.


In 2010, the GMC found that Wakefield had been dishonest in his research, had acted against his patients' best interests and mistreated developmentally delayed children,

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and had "failed in his duties as a responsible consultant".

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The Lancet fully retracted Wakefield's 1998 publication on the basis of the GMC's findings, noting that elements of the manuscript had been falsified and that the journal had been "deceived" by Wakefield

Sounds like a top guy. Lets trust him, and disregard that all his findings have been debunked.
Oh snap, Keanus here.
We are gonna go back in time and make sure Hitler gets in to art-school, possibly preventing WW2.
Wish us luck!

I have a friend from high school that has 5 kids. Four of them are autistic. They were perfectly normal infants and toddlers. And then they weren't.

He. Has. Four. Autistic. Children.

He was an awesome friend. There's nothing recognizable about him any longer. He rarely smiles or speaks anymore. *shrugs

 

[Kroffe]

Woops, seems the 104 only concerns USA.
Still, no matter how one twist and turn the numbers reported worldwide, thinking that avoiding vaccines are a safer choice makes no sense at all.


And measles is not the only disease preventable by vaccines either.
There are alot of exciting&fun diseases that could make a comeback if the anti-vaccination madness does not stop.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[ternur]

Wakefield, as I understand, believed giving the vaccinations one at at time was safer than all at once [mmr], he was not anti vaccine per se.

Just on a common sense level, thinking of a baby and it's immune system, it makes sense to me to be cautious. Merck the patent holder for this new combined way of giving the vaccines, must have made a pretty penny over the years

I just don't see the need to take a risk with a child's health and the parent should have the option of single vaccines even if the risk is slight that mmr could cause more problems.

The problem with Wakefield was (and is) that he ignored the most basic rules of scientific research. He had a result in mind and used what ever means he could to reach that result. Credible research requires ethics and reliability -- His "research" lacked both.

 

[Kroffe]

I have a friend from high school that has 5 kids. Four of them are autistic. They were perfectly normal infants and toddlers. And then they weren't.

He. Has. Four. Autistic. Children.

He was an awesome friend. There's nothing recognizable about him any longer. He rarely smiles or speaks anymore. *shrugs

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Your friend or his partner, or maybe both, probably has poor genetics causing this.
Or is there something confirming this has anything to do with vaccines?
Or confirming it is even true?
Since your claim of "60% of kids have learning disabilites" seems to be made up.
Atleast i could not find anything backing it up.

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[mack341]

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They are intelligent.
Thats why we get this response when an outbreak happens.

"The group said it emphasized avoiding medicines and vaccines and eating naturally farmed foods. But after some members became infected, the group apologized and said it was changing its practices.

“Given the unexpected situation, we will follow the health care center’s advice to get vaccine shots for measles or other highly infectious diseases so that we don’t cause concern to others,” the group said in

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."

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So 140 000 died during one year vs 104 over a period of 15 years.
And 104 might be high since "VAERS is a self-reporting system. This means that anyone—doctors, patients, family—can file a report, even if the event is not verified. "

Im no good with maths, but i think 140 000 is slightly larger than 104.
And thats not a fair comparison since its one year vs 15.
So its more like 140 000 vs 7.

Japan is densely populated so I expect measles outbreaks could affect more children quickly, but the govt still recommends vaccination against measles [it's not mandatory as I understand it] as a single not a combination like mmr.

No one so far on this thread seems to have grasped that fact that japan has banned the mmr, I would say given the japanese advanced society in areas of science and health, this is significant and hasn't been decided on a whim.

 

[mack341]

The problem with Wakefield was (and is) that he ignored the most basic rules of scientific research. He had a result in mind and used what ever means he could to reach that result. Credible research requires ethics and reliability -- His "research" lacked both.

Listening to the guy in the video below it seems the things wakefield was guilty of were technicalities, 12 other top scientists co-signed the paper, and the other distinguished dr who was struck off alongside wakefield, prof John walker-smith won his appeal at the high court against that decision. I get a strong sense there was a witch hunt against wakefield, who just does not come across as a fraudster to me.

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From the NAA website [national autism association]

While the Lancet paper did not state that the MMR vaccine caused either inflammatory bowel disease or autism in the 12 children in the case series, the authors did note that seven of the children had received the MMR vaccine and that further investigation of a possible link to autism was warranted. “From the mere suggestion that a vaccine could have a potential link with adverse outcomes, a war was waged against these distinguished physicians and researchers,” said NAA Executive Director and parent Lori McIlwain. “No one questions that adverse vaccine events do occur in susceptible individuals, yet those who investigate these events on behalf of sick children are subjected to the harshest scrutiny and punishment.”

 

[Kroffe]

Japan is densely populated so I expect measles outbreaks could affect more children quickly, but the govt still recommends vaccination against measles [it's not mandatory as I understand it] as a single not a combination like mmr.

No one so far on this thread seems to have grasped that fact that japan has banned the mmr, I would say given the japanese advanced society in areas of science and health, this is significant and hasn't been decided on a whim.

Does not really matter why they did it, since the whole argument is about vaccines causing autism&learning disabilites.
Every serious study made tells us it does not do that.
And you still have no answer to why you think all the health-institutions around the world would want give children autism and learningdisabilites.
Even as far as conspiracy theories go, you must admit this one is crazier than most.



For it to even begin to make sense, vaccines would have to kill over 3 000 000 people each year.
Then i equals the diseases that are preventable by vaccines.
But even then it would not make any sense, since the idiotic people not vaccinating their children are bringing back more diseases, so the figure 3 000 000 will be alot higher if the stupidity continues.

I really dont think people not vaccinating their children are fit to be parents.
If they gambled with their own life i would still think it was idiotic, but hey go for it.
But gambling with their childrens lives, putting them in danger of dying from 100% preventable diseases is just so stupid there are no words.
Im not even sure stupid is a good choice of word here, Evil probably fits better.
People letting their children die of vaccine-preventable diseases should be put in jail, and its insane they are allowed to keep murdering their children.

If someone can give a reason to not use vaccines that makes sense maybe there is a point to continue this topic. And quoting research done by fraudsters is not a reason that makes sense, even if the dont come across as fraudsters to you. They do to all medical professionals conducting their research with ethics and morals.

Til then, back to things that makes sense.
Like neat videos of nature.

 

[Kelly Jo]

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Your friend or his partner, or maybe both, probably has poor genetics causing this.
Or is there something confirming this has anything to do with vaccines?
Or confirming it is even true?
Since your claim of "60% of kids have learning disabilites" seems to be made up.
Atleast i could not find anything backing it up.

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To be clear, I said male children in the US.

Developmental Disabilities Affect 1 In 7 U.S. Kids

Male to female ratio of American children is aprox -------------> 106 to 100
Boys are twice as likely to have learning disability -------------> 1 to 2

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#MathsIsHard

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Seriously though... ANY PERCENTAGE OVER .05% IS TOO MUCH, so what's the point?

 

[mack341]

Does not really matter why they did it, since the whole argument is about vaccines causing autism&learning disabilites.
Every serious study made tells us it does not do that.
And you still have no answer to why you think all the health-institutions around the world would want give children autism and learningdisabilites.
Even as far as conspiracy theories go, you must admit this one is crazier than most.



For it to even begin to make sense, vaccines would have to kill over 3 000 000 people each year.
Then i equals the diseases that are preventable by vaccines.
But even then it would not make any sense, since the idiotic people not vaccinating their children are bringing back more diseases, so the figure 3 000 000 will be alot higher if the stupidity continues.

I really dont think people not vaccinating their children are fit to be parents.
If they gambled with their own life i would still think it was idiotic, but hey go for it.
But gambling with their childrens lives, putting them in danger of dying from 100% preventable diseases is just so stupid there are no words.
Im not even sure stupid is a good choice of word here, Evil probably fits better.
People letting their children die of vaccine-preventable diseases should be put in jail, and its insane they are allowed to keep murdering their children.

If someone can give a reason to not use vaccines that makes sense maybe there is a point to continue this topic. And quoting research done by fraudsters is not a reason that makes sense, even if the dont come across as fraudsters to you. They do to all medical professionals conducting their research with ethics and morals.

Til then, back to things that makes sense.
Like neat videos of nature.

I think we're at cross purposes here, japan does vaccinate children against measles as a single, the issue for me is are some children vulnerable to the combination mmr vaccine, on top of that I do get a sense children are being over vaccinated compared to my generation [1970s] but if it is to save lives then I'm not against it, that's why I asked earlier how many of the illnesses vaccinated against are killers?

 

[Kelly Jo]

Listening to the guy in the video below it seems the things wakefield was guilty of were technicalities, 12 other top scientists co-signed the paper, and the other distinguished dr who was struck off alongside wakefield, prof John walker-smith won his appeal at the high court against that decision. I get a strong sense there was a witch hunt against wakefield, who just does not come across as a fraudster to me.

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From the NAA website [national autism association]

While the Lancet paper did not state that the MMR vaccine caused either inflammatory bowel disease or autism in the 12 children in the case series, the authors did note that seven of the children had received the MMR vaccine and that further investigation of a possible link to autism was warranted. “From the mere suggestion that a vaccine could have a potential link with adverse outcomes, a war was waged against these distinguished physicians and researchers,” said NAA Executive Director and parent Lori McIlwain. “No one questions that adverse vaccine events do occur in susceptible individuals, yet those who investigate these events on behalf of sick children are subjected to the harshest scrutiny and punishment.”

Debunking =Damage control utilizing confirmation bias and virtue signaling. It's fairly effective.
But not on you. A++

 

[Kroffe]

To be clear, I said male children in the US.

Developmental Disabilities Affect 1 In 7 U.S. Kids

Male to female ratio of American children is aprox -------------> 106 to 100
Boys are twice as likely to have learning disability -------------> 1 to 2

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#MathsIsHard

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Seriously though... ANY PERCENTAGE OVER .05% IS TOO MUCH, so what's the point?

Without anything linking this to vaccines, i dont see how this is in any way relevant.

 

[Kroffe]

I think we're at cross purposes here, japan does vaccinate children against measles as a single, the issue for me is are some children vulnerable to the combination mmr vaccine, on top of that I do get a sense children are being over vaccinated compared to my generation [1970s] but if it is to save lives then I'm not against it, that's why I asked earlier how many of the illnesses vaccinated against are killers?

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I dont know if the 27 listed are all "killers".
I know the diseases being brought back by anti-vaccination nuts are killing people.

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There is no credible data or research showing in any way or form that not vaccinating your children is a logic choice.

 

[mack341]

I think in the USA it could also be linked to pesticides on food and gmo foods, not certain but feel when you add this into the mix as it were, there could be a link.

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"Conclusion Findings suggest that an offspring’s risk of autism spectrum disorder increases following prenatal exposure to ambient pesticides within 2000 m of their mother’s residence during pregnancy, compared with offspring of women from the same agricultural region without such exposure. Infant exposure could further increase risks for autism spectrum disorder with comorbid intellectual disability."

 

[paul7388]

Interesting debate you are all having.

But i have more serious things to think about.

In heaven at the moment as found sizzling steak wotsits. They are bloody amazing and i can say i am addicted already. Better not just be a limited trial.

Anyway thought i would share my amazing discovery. Will leave you all to your less important discussion now.

 

[Kroffe]

Good, then we can leave vaccines out of this.
Unless @Kelly Jo wants to post "Studies unquestionably connect vaccines that contain relatively large amounts of human fetal contaminants to Autism."
I consider this topic done and over wth.

Yeeey vaccines, booo people willing to gamble with their childrens lives.
Lets get out their and save some kids!

 

[mack341]

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I dont know if the 27 listed are all "killers".
I know the diseases being brought back by anti-vaccination nuts are killing people.

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There is no credible data or research showing in any way or form that not vaccinating your children is a logic choice.

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And "Sweden, Norway, Denmark and Germany have banned or restricted use of the fillings. The European commission may soon call for their phasing out"

yet for years the medical world has pooh-poohed any link or concerns to problems from mercury fillings, there maybe logic in not having all the vaccines done if some are for non fatal illnesses, it very much depends on the child, I don't think the science is there to predict when a bad reaction will occur that's a problem.

 

[paul7388]

Good, then we can leave vaccines out of this.
Unless @Kelly Jo wants to post "Studies unquestionably connect vaccines that contain relatively large amounts of human fetal contaminants to Autism."
I consider this topic done and over wth.

Yeeey vaccines, booo people willing to gamble with their childrens lives.
Lets get out their and save some kids!

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Must admit never saw you so passionate about a subject before.

And i agree with what you are saying.

Measles is occuring more in UK now mainly because a lot of the migrant's coming into the country do not believe in vaccination . Many other diseases are making comebacks. Like you say the benefits outweigh any possible side effects and parents should be doing all they can to protect their kids.

 

[mack341]

"Serum levels of blood mercury were significantly higher in autistic children than healthy controls; increased levels of blood mercury were found in 48% of autistic patients, and 72% of autistic children had anti-MBP auto-antibodies. "

 

[dionysus]

Must admit never saw you so passionate about a subject before.

And i agree with what you are saying.

Measles is occuring more in UK now mainly because a lot of the migrant's coming into the country do not believe in vaccination . Many other diseases are making comebacks. Like you say the benefits outweigh any possible side effects and parents should be doing all they can to protect their kids.

Just point out, there's a lot of home-grown stupidity as well.
I forever see online ridiculous retorts such as 'well, if YOUR kid is vaccinated, it shouldn't matter to you if mine isnt'

 

[Kroffe]

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And "Sweden, Norway, Denmark and Germany have banned or restricted use of the fillings. The European commission may soon call for their phasing out"

yet for years the medical world has pooh-poohed any link or concerns to problems from mercury fillings, there maybe logic in not having all the vaccines done if some are for non fatal illnesses, it very much depends on the child, I don't think the science is there to predict when a bad reaction will occur that's a problem.

Worth noting i think is that the reason we stopped using amalgam fillings had nothing to do with any research saying it was in any way dangerous.
"
The Swedish Government has announced the introduction of a blanket ban on mercury in the country that will be effective from 1 June 2009.
"

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[mack341]

Some countries – Sweden last year, and Norway, Denmark and Germany, have banned or restricted the use of mercury fillings. But not France or the UK. The European commission is due to publish the findings of its review on dental amalgam fillings in March.

In a preliminary report, published online in July, the company tasked with the study, Bio Intelligence Service, recommended phasing out mercury in dental care in Europe. "Having heavy metals in your mouth is a source of toxic substances, which for some genetically predisposed patients may increase the risk of diseases such as disseminated sclerosis," says neurologist Bernard Aranda, who is "on the whole in favour of a ban".

Afssaps recommends that mothers expecting a baby or breast-feeding, and anyone with kidney problems should avoid mercury fillings.

 

[sufferinsilence]

Just point out, there's a lot of home-grown stupidity as well.
I forever see online ridiculous retorts such as 'well, if YOUR kid is vaccinated, it shouldn't matter to you if mine isnt'

The most stupid thing I've heard of is people having "measle-parties"... I mean, why would you do that?

 

[paul7388]

Just point out, there's a lot of home-grown stupidity as well.
I forever see online ridiculous retorts such as 'well, if YOUR kid is vaccinated, it shouldn't matter to you if mine isnt'

Yeah very true.

Just too make it clear tho i was not taking a dig at migrant's my opinions on that will remain mine. But i was saying it as it is true.

Had been watching one of the medical programmes that were showing the rise in diseases and the areas it was happening. And the health visitors and doctors explained how a great proportion of migrant's refused to gat their kids done and how they were trying to educate them.

 

[Kelly Jo]

The most stupid thing I've heard of is people having "measle-parties"... I mean, why would you do that?

Is that for real? Gesus h...

 

[dionysus]

The most stupid thing I've heard of is people having "measle-parties"... I mean, why would you do that?

chicken pox parties were a thing here too (and seems to have a resurgence)

 

[Borgie]

Interesting debate you are all having.

But i have more serious things to think about.

In heaven at the moment as found sizzling steak wotsits. They are bloody amazing and i can say i am addicted already. Better not just be a limited trial.

Anyway thought i would share my amazing discovery. Will leave you all to your less important discussion now.

Post me some please they sound yummy.

 

[Kroffe]

The most stupid thing I've heard of is people having "measle-parties"... I mean, why would you do that?

To immunize.
People not caring much for the safety of their children prefer this method over vaccines.

A pox party (also flu party etc.) is a social activity where children are deliberately exposed to an

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. Such parties were done before vaccines were available to, "get it over with," or because it was believed childhood disease would be less severe than disease as an adult.

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For example,

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is more dangerous to adults than to children over 5 years old.

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Nowadays pox parties are typically organized by

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who mistakenly think that vaccination is more dangerous than contracting the disease.