Mr Q asking for bank statement after withdrawing winnings

[stakeyourheartout]

So I signed up to Mr Q a couple days ago after searching for casinos that offer better RTP than the several I currently play at. Deposited £30 total through instant bank transfer just to get a feel of the site and try out some slots. Ended up winning around £350 total, withdrew £300 and kept £50 to play with.

Anyway, what a surprise, just a couple hours later my account is “mysteriously” suspended. They then emailed asking me to send them a PDF of my bank account showing the deposit and withdrawals to and from Mr Q. I’ve never been asked to do this by any other site in all the years I’ve been playing and I really don’t feel comfortable sharing my bank statement. Obviously I have nothing to hide but it’s none of their business what I spend my money on and I’m not going to send such personal information to a stranger over email.

So I downloaded my statement and filtered it so that all that was there was the transactions they asked for along with my name and account details at the top.

You guessed it, not good enough. They want my entire statement even though that’s not what they originally asked for.

Anyway, I will absolutely not be sending my entire bank statement and am more than happy to just close the account, which sucks because I was highly enjoying the site and planned to continue playing there. Will I be entitled to the £50 that’s still in my account?

My guess is they’re just going to keep it which I find absolutely ridiculous. I had only played a couple hours. Just so happens I won more then I deposited so now I’m banished ✌?

 

[jasonuk]

Oh dear, here we go again... a reminder that MrQ were hit with a

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in 2023 so they're a lot more paranoid about this currently.

So the first thing to do is stop playing. While you mention they've suspended your account, don't deposit or play until this process is completed. Any winnings generated after any potential Customer Due Diligence (CDD) notification are likely restricted on successfully completing the CDD - so sites that offer this "feature" are giving themselves a freeroll against the customer, and are the arbiter of what is "enough" CDD.

They cover their customer due diligence in sections 6.15 through 6.23 - for proof of identity they ask for an official form of ID, then either a utility bill or bank statement; for source of funds they have a whole list of invasive financial information, including recent bank statements. Thus if this is a proof of identity check, absolutely send a utility bill instead.

Section 10 (AML) and Section 12 (Suspension and Termination) cover what the operator will consider doing - and naturally reserve all the rights you can think of. Somewhat understandable given the list of prohibited activities in 12.4 (which looks scary - but mostly standard stuff like fraud, chargebacks, collusion, third party activity, botting, VPNs and so on).

As long as you haven't violated the terms, they should

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, but you may be waiting a few weeks. They repeatedly use the word "reasonably" in these sections, but sadly we've seen a lot of operators (in general) not act reasonably in these situations.

Unfortunately, this is becoming a more frequent occurrence - not just for high rollers, but for small depositors too.

 

[justdoit]

you can easy print only payout and receive payment from only Mr Q, no need to print all bank statement, they ask me also looks like new UKGC rules only send deposit and withdraw made in Mr Q , I dont play there much and they still ask me for it

 

[jasonuk]

That sounds like what they sent and it was rejected.

also looks like new UKGC rules

Given how many sites make up "UKGC" rules, I'd be wary of believing that without a source. The last update to the social responsibility code I believe was in September - operators seem to be more proactive at asking for invasive information but for a variety of reasons (e.g. removing the friction when CDD is triggered, more information to target higher-value customers, identifying at-risk customers earlier).

Given the varying reasons for the requests or suggestions, that doesn't seem like it's coming from the UKGC directly - but operators trying to get ahead of something in the future. As you can guess, a lot of those reasons benefit the operators more than the customers.

 

[justdoit]

That sounds like what they sent and it was rejected.


Given how many sites make up "UKGC" rules, I'd be wary of believing that without a source. The last update to the social responsibility code I believe was in September - operators seem to be more proactive at asking for invasive information but for a variety of reasons (e.g. removing the friction when CDD is triggered, more information to target higher-value customers, identifying at-risk customers earlier).

Given the varying reasons for the requests or suggestions, that doesn't seem like it's coming from the UKGC directly - but operators trying to get ahead of something in the future. As you can guess, a lot of those reasons benefit the operators more than the customers.

casinos are scared from UKGC they ask some stupid things just to shut up UKGC, and many casino they over do it, last week one casino ask me for proof of address I send only bank details my name and address they refuse, they want full bank statement, I refuse to send, they cant ask full bank statement for proof off address , end of the day they lose money I save money, I am still the winner ?

 

[dealer wins]

My partner had a similar experience with MrQ. Asking for so much she did told them FO and close my account.

Their loss she now uses Lottomart, which also has half decent RTPs.

Shame as she liked MrQ, and they would have liked her spending im sure!

Our deeply personal financial information is PRIVATE, when will casinos start respecting this!!

 

[L&L-Jan]

@stakeyourheartout they offer an open banking link no? Really convenient, just login, they get whats required for verification purpose and we move on.

 

[paul7388]

@stakeyourheartout they offer an open banking link no? Really convenient, just login, they get whats required for verification purpose and we move on.

Might be convenient but why should you have to show any casino your whole private banking.

Take a payday for me. I deposit in a casino. If they ask for bank statement I would be screwed as I would then have to answer why I am making deposits from money put into my account by others.

As my payday is about same as my partners and kids. On payday boys transfer some money from there wages for their keep money. Not a lot as basically don't take much off them. I pay all the bills like rent etc. And partner transfers money to my account for her share.

So every month people transfer money to.my account at same time I am maybe making deposits. And the if casino saw that I'd have to answer all the questions as to why when it's sod all to do with them. No thanks.

 

[stakeyourheartout]

Thank you all for your replies. Still no further forward but I’m gonna keep at them. It’s “only” £50 but it’s not the point. They’re now saying they have an issue because the deposit came from a joint account, in which all my money goes in to? Feels like they’re just clutching for excuses. It’s not like I’m withdrawing 50k ?

 

[stakeyourheartout]

you can easy print only payout and receive payment from only Mr Q, no need to print all bank statement, they ask me also looks like new UKGC rules only send deposit and withdraw made in Mr Q , I dont play there much and they still ask me for it

This is what I sent them but it wasn’t good enough. They want my entire statement. Never gonna happen

 

[L&L-Jan]

Might be convenient but why should you have to show any casino your whole private banking.

We need to be able to establish your financial situation. It's a mixture of Responsible Gaming and AML procedures, and the result from regulatory requirements.

It is not limited to UK at all. We get assessed by the FIAU here for our .com players. And for that same reason I need to provide Stars and Entain yearly with my financial situation: 2 to 3 months of bank statement and a pay slip / tax return. Given I want to gamble and have nothing to hide, I provide this information. Obviously also given the condition that I know they deal with the data provided accordingly. Like we do, otherwise we wouldn't be ISO27001 certified.

 

[jasonuk]

We need to be able to establish your financial situation. It's a mixture of Responsible Gaming and AML procedures, and the result from regulatory requirements.

At larger amounts most people would agree - even if reluctantly - that to be the case.

The problem is we see an ever increasing number of scenarios where the amounts in question are small enough that it's difficult to justify RG or AML procedures - and it seems much more likely than an operator is applying the procedure incorrectly - either to apply leverage against a customer, or because they are paranoid (e.g. after a substantial regulatory fine) and applying it to most / all customers.

 

[L&L-Jan]

At larger amounts most people would agree - even if reluctantly - that to be the case.

The problem is we see an ever increasing number of scenarios where the amounts in question are small enough that it's difficult to justify RG or AML procedures

Operators change procedures as a result of an assesment. We barely haven't, we actually removed thresholds. Also there might be situations of lifetime thresholds on deposit levels that players are hitting. I cant give a precise answer as each operator sets own thresholds, writes procedures, procedures are submitted to the authority. Upon an assesment, if you dont execute them, you get fined. If you do, you are fine.

In the Netherlands we have a saying: "Zeggen wat je doet, en doen wat je zegt" - "Say what you do, and do as you say" - which is basically what the authority audits an operator on.

And I've raised that earlier, often you only see the complaints/mentions of those with a pending withdrawal. The previous deposit most likely triggered the threshold. The withdrawal has nothing to do with it. I gave an example of a random day where we had 7% of the players who hit their threshold, who had a pending withdrawal. Thats very low.

 

[bamberfishcake]

I could be wrong but I thought it was standard to see documents in full? Used to be the case in banking anyway, and I can't see why the AML rules would change from industry to industry.

IIRC the whole document must be seen. Hence why photos have to show all four corners. Furthermore, how can you assess SOW without looking at the whole picture?

On a lighter side, are we really moaning about a SOW request post-withdrawal? I thought most gripes were with the cynical requests that stall them. ?

Again, I am not up to date with today's regs, but I can't see anything wrong with what MrQ have done, except perhaps not communicate their request as well as they could have.

 

[justdoit]

I could be wrong but I thought it was standard to see documents in full? Used to be the case in banking anyway, and I can't see why the AML rules would change from industry to industry.

IIRC the whole document must be seen. Hence why photos have to show all four corners. Furthermore, how can you assess SOW without looking at the whole picture?

On a lighter side, are we really moaning about a SOW request post-withdrawal? I thought most gripes were with the cynical requests that stall them. ?

Again, I am not up to date with today's regs, but I can't see anything wrong with what MrQ have done, except perhaps not communicate their request as well as they could have.

If casino they ask just to see transaction from your bank and casino (Mr.Q) they don't need to see other transaction, end of the day that what they ask for, is not their business what we do with are money or where we spend,

 

[Guntis]

Here is an example of how some UK high-street bookies work compared to other casinos. Last year i lost at Ladbrokes 10k in a few days which was an annual limit.

Now, a year later they set a 2.5k monthly deposit limit and 500 loss with a notice that if i want to increase these limits i would need to provide some income-related information.

For most players, including me, these limits are perfectly fine.



They never seen my bank statements or anything like that, and payouts here were always in 2-3 hours, no questions asked.

Do they know my financial information from some 3rd parties? If they've acquired Experian, Nationwide, or HSBC, then possibly yes.... lol.

 

[jasonuk]

I could be wrong but I thought it was standard to see documents in full? Used to be the case in banking anyway, and I can't see why the AML rules would change from industry to industry.

IIRC the whole document must be seen. Hence why photos have to show all four corners. Furthermore, how can you assess SOW without looking at the whole picture?

I guess the exact wording comes into play - for paper documents as you say it's fairly standard what is required (and similarly applies here). However for digital documents it can be a bit more vague - do they want a PDF copy, what do the images have to show and so on.

Now, a year later they set a 2.5k monthly deposit limit and 500 loss with a notice that if i want to increase these limits i would need to provide some income-related information.

For most players, including me, these limits are perfectly fine.

It looks like that is a gross deposit limit, so it makes sense. I was going to say if that was a net deposit limit that would be silly - and yet some sites do exactly that and risk funds being trapped to the next month (can't wager because loss limit, potentially can't withdraw because ML regulations).

And yes, after much wrangling with the information regulator (who rightly threw out the "single customer view" stuff which was a gross invasion of privacy), the UKGC has the green light for operators to do credit searches - so it's now part of the T&Cs and you'll see soft searches popping up in your history.

 

[thr0b]

On this one, it at least seems that MrQ are doing it properly; allowing a withdrawal and then asking for documents before they'll let you do anything more.

On the issue of deposit limits - not a fan of sites switching to Net Deposit Limits without checking that's what the customer wants; kind of defeats the object of a deposit limit if you can deposit £100, withdraw £100 and be able to deposit £100 again. Not that I'd deposit that much anyway, but some would, and allowing more deposits regardless of whether you've withdrawn or not is a scummy trick.

 

[Guntis]

I guess the exact wording comes into play - for paper documents as you say it's fairly standard what is required (and similarly applies here). However for digital documents it can be a bit more vague - do they want a PDF copy, what do the images have to show and so on.


It looks like that is a gross deposit limit, so it makes sense. I was going to say if that was a net deposit limit that would be silly - and yet some sites do exactly that and risk funds being trapped to the next month (can't wager because loss limit, potentially can't withdraw because ML regulations).

And yes, after much wrangling with the information regulator (who rightly threw out the "single customer view" stuff which was a gross invasion of privacy), the UKGC has the green light for operators to do credit searches - so it's now part of the T&Cs and you'll see soft searches popping up in your history.

With this limit, i can deposit £2.5k now in one go or make deposits throughout the month up to this limit. But, i can't lose more than £500. In this case, they'll likely stop my deposits until the next month.

I'm not sure if they count any wins, because i recently won £900, and the deposit limit is still the same.

Last year, these limits were different. There was a £10k limit (which they somehow decided to set; docs were not needed), and i could play it all in a minute or over the year, no matter what.

 

[dealer wins]

@stakeyourheartout they offer an open banking link no? Really convenient, just login, they get whats required for verification purpose and we move on.

You would have to be INSANE to let a casino access your bank accounts.

 

[MahoneyKnows]

Operators change procedures as a result of an assesment. We barely haven't, we actually removed thresholds. Also there might be situations of lifetime thresholds on deposit levels that players are hitting. I cant give a precise answer as each operator sets own thresholds, writes procedures, procedures are submitted to the authority. Upon an assesment, if you dont execute them, you get fined. If you do, you are fine.

In the Netherlands we have a saying: "Zeggen wat je doet, en doen wat je zegt" - "Say what you do, and do as you say" - which is basically what the authority audits an operator on.

And I've raised that earlier, often you only see the complaints/mentions of those with a pending withdrawal. The previous deposit most likely triggered the threshold. The withdrawal has nothing to do with it. I gave an example of a random day where we had 7% of the players who hit their threshold, who had a pending withdrawal. Thats very low.

My Dad has a similar saying “Do as I say - not as I do” and “I’m teaching you what not to do” typically after he’s done something stupid ? he’s a hilarious miserable old guy with a very different sense of humour that has rubbed off on me 10 fold.

 

[pekka55]

We need to be able to establish your financial situation. It's a mixture of Responsible Gaming and AML procedures, and the result from regulatory requirements.

It is not limited to UK at all. We get assessed by the FIAU here for our .com players. And for that same reason I need to provide Stars and Entain yearly with my financial situation: 2 to 3 months of bank statement and a pay slip / tax return. Given I want to gamble and have nothing to hide, I provide this information. Obviously also given the condition that I know they deal with the data provided accordingly. Like we do, otherwise we wouldn't be ISO27001 certified.

You don't need to establish anything for a 30£ deposit. Jesus Christ, this is getting ridiculous.

No wonder crypto casinos are on the rise. I have no interest in crypto and even I'm now considering it because of answers like this.

 

[thr0b]

You don't need to establish anything for a 30£ deposit. Jesus Christ, this is getting ridiculous.

No wonder crypto casinos are on the rise. I have no interest in crypto and even I'm now considering it because of answers like this.

He's not saying they want to. They need to; they have to.

You're both right.

 

[pekka55]

He's not saying they want to. They need to; they have to.

You're both right.

Show me where it says they have to do it for any tiny deposit.

The casino industry screwed themselves by not giving a shit for decades and now they're running scared of fines and for some weird reason seem to interpret the rules completely wrong.

 

[L&L-Jan]

now they're running scared of fines and for some weird reason seem to interpret the rules completely wrong.

Looking forward to receive an updated procedure with the correct rules applied!