Leovegas - reduced RTP% on PlaynGo and Pragmatic Play

[Krogilasi]

With all the silence about the change of their RTP, Leovegas has also fallen to use lower RTP version on Play n go and pragmatic play. Of course there is no mention about this change to players, and let the players lose more money.. Ka-Ching! Why would they inform players to weaken their player experience. Woah, who cares.. I just found this out today. If someone says that its not so remarkable change, well it indeed is, even in the short run you are expected to lose more your hard earned money.

Nice..

Well.. Not.

 

[sapit222]

Thanks for letting us know.

I checked and both Book of Dead and Legacy of Dead are on the lower 94% now (maybe all of Play n go?).

Seems like i have to maybe skip LeoVegas also..

Shame on you bad casinos!

 

[bamberfishcake]

The most shocking thing is that they have not informed any of their players.

Its one of the best examples of daylight robbery in modern times.

Flick a switch, make hundreds of thousands, if not millions and nobody needs to be told or will be any the wiser!

Its absolutely ludicrous.

 

[bamberfishcake]

UKGC? Anywhere?

Another epic fail by the UK government.

Somebody take me and the kids in? Ive had it with this country. Will work for food and lodgings.

 

[colinsunderland]

This has been discussed on here on another thread, they didn't even announce it on their own site (CG) so they aren't going to do so on this forum that they clearly don't give a shit about any more.

 

[bamberfishcake]

The more threads the merrier.

Lets document their blatant rip off of their unsuspecting customer base during a pandemic, which has seen growth, during a pandemic

 

[Krogilasi]

This has been discussed on here on another thread, they didn't even announce it on their own site (CG) so they aren't going to do so on this forum that they clearly don't give a shit about any more.

Yeah ok, i still believe all of these low-rtp casinos actually deserve more visibility. At least if they are doing this silently to not inform their players because it is a big change.

There seems to be too many people who either dont give a damn about lower RTP version (if anyone is one of those, shame on you) of the game they play, or they just simply believe they got the max RTP version Slot in their hands that they are playing. All i can say to suggest all of you to stop funding these places as they are joking with their customers like this.

 

[Gaz237]

The more threads the merrier.

Lets document their blatant rip off of their unsuspecting customer base during a pandemic, which has seen growth, during a pandemic

Start as many threads as you like, but i doubt it would reach 0.01% of the bigger Casinos player base.

Add in the fact that 90%+ of players know sweet FA about RTP anyway.

 

[Kyocer777]

With all the silence about the change of their RTP, Leovegas has also fallen to use lower RTP version on Play n go and pragmatic play. Of course there is no mention about this change to players, and let the players lose more money.. Ka-Ching! Why would they inform players to weaken their player experience. Woah, who cares.. I just found this out today. If someone says that its not so remarkable change, well it indeed is, even in the short run you are expected to lose more your hard earned money.

Nice..

Well.. Not.

How did you find about Pragmatic Play RTPs? In help file?

 

[bamberfishcake]

Start as many threads as you like, but i doubt it would reach 0.01% of the bigger Casinos player base.

Add in the fact that 90%+ of players know sweet FA about RTP anyway.

I agree and would dare to say maybe 99% of players.

Still worth it if just one person learns that LeoVegas PlaynGo is now a lower payout than what it was before. Even though it looks like the same slot.

Wouldnt it be nice if everyone banded together and boycott certain providers or casinos on certain nights. Power is always with the people.

 

[Gaz237]

I agree and would dare to say maybe 99% of players.

Still worth it if just one person learns that LeoVegas PlaynGo is now a lower payout than what it was before. Even though it looks like the same slot.

Wouldnt it be nice if everyone banded together and boycott certain providers or casinos on certain nights. Power is always with the people.

They are only reacting to lost revenue by the slower spins and no feature buys.

Everyone else will follow suit eventually and it will be rare to find one on max %.

If the UKGC impose a bet limit, i would expect a further drop, to the 92% mark, providers will have to start bringing games out with the lower RTP,s or the casinos won't host them.

 

[CasinoNinja]

They are only reacting to lost revenue by the slower spins and no feature buys.

Everyone else will follow suit eventually and it will be rare to find one on max %.

If the UKGC impose a bet limit, i would expect a further drop, to the 92% mark, providers will have to start bringing games out with the lower RTP,s or the casinos won't host them.

Casinos have gotten greedy or they are trying to coup back their losses from their responsible gambling fines so they all can get their yearly bonus.

They managed fine before which before bonus buys, even when people was just playing videopoker at 99% RTP.

Greed is all

 

[colinsunderland]

They are only reacting to lost revenue by the slower spins and no feature buys.

Everyone else will follow suit eventually and it will be rare to find one on max %.

If the UKGC impose a bet limit, i would expect a further drop, to the 92% mark, providers will have to start bringing games out with the lower RTP,s or the casinos won't host them.

So they haven't cut them outside the UK?

 

[bamberfishcake]

They are only reacting to lost revenue by the slower spins and no feature buys.

I thought the slower spins and feature buy bans came in after a lot of lowering, though my memory plays cruel tricks sometimes.

If the industry was more, struggling to find the right word, but maybe transparent. I wouldnt have so much of an issue.

Fact is, I still go into new games and have to hunt to find the RTP. Some providers are worse than others but putting it in help files or under tabs with strange symbols is no help. It should be displayed in the loading page or with the paytable.

Credit where its due and Pragmatic place it where it would naturally be found i think. Anywhere else is just cynical and sneaky and i dont like that in business or as a customer.

It also does not sit right with me and never will how two slots with the same name, same reels, same provider etc etc can have a different payback %/ return/ or RTP.

Just for those reasons and particularly the last. Leo Vegas and similar casinos by actively reducing what their slots pay back, without telling customers, are literally conning them out of money and i dont think its born out of necessity. They are not skint.

Thinking on also that maybe Nikantw had a point when he said it would create problem gamblers. In some cases I believe it will cause problems. Punters are probably scratching their heads right now or maybe in a months time wondering why their slot time has gone down and they've not had as much fun.

 

[Gaz237]

So they haven't cut them outside the UK?

I never meant that they have had to cut RTP to survive, it's purely profit driven.

And i would be surprised if the likes of Leo have not lowered them everywhere.

 

[Gaz237]

I thought the slower spins and feature buy bans came in after a lot of lowering, though my memory plays cruel tricks sometimes.

If the industry was more, struggling to find the right word, but maybe transparent. I wouldnt have so much of an issue.

Fact is, I still go into new games and have to hunt to find the RTP. Some providers are worse than others but putting it in help files or under tabs with strange symbols is no help. It should be displayed in the loading page or with the paytable.

Credit where its due and Pragmatic place it where it would naturally be found i think. Anywhere else is just cynical and sneaky and i dont like that in business or as a customer.

It also does not sit right with me and never will how two slots with the same name, same reels, same provider etc etc can have a different payback %/ return/ or RTP.

Just for those reasons and particularly the last. Leo Vegas and similar casinos by actively reducing what their slots pay back, without telling customers, are literally conning them out of money and i dont think its born out of necessity. They are not skint.

Thinking on also that maybe Nikantw had a point when he said it would create problem gamblers. In some cases I believe it will cause problems. Punters are probably scratching their heads right now or maybe in a months time wondering why their slot time has gone down and they've not had as much fun.

They have not been lowered out of necessity. The bosses sit round a table once a month and come up with ideas to increase profit.

They only care about the bottom line.

And as a business it would make no sense to explain to all your customers, that they are going to lose their money quicker.

 

[gonzo fonso]

well they must think we are just mugs for playing at these casinos,i reckon the law of averages are on 10 seperate deposits over 10 days you will probably win twice and loose the other 8 times

 

[pinnit2014]

I'll be surprised if you still have anywhere offering 96%'s next year, possibly sooner: maybe one two but even they'll struggle to justify that (for want of a better expression) to their owners given any attraction/retaining of customers won't outweigh the 2% difference etc.

Make a prediction that Unibet are one of the last men standing

Probably just testing the waters before they eye up the 92%'s - would be quite interesting to see what analysis they've done, if any, to determine at what point any drop/switch/decrease in play leads to a financially worse off position. Unfortunately that figure's probably in the 80's

 

[bamberfishcake]

And as con artists it would make no sense to explain to all your customers, that they are going to lose their money quicker.

Just corrected your spelling mistake.

No need to thank

 

[JGslots]

Will we all be playing slots on 70% payout 5 years from now?

 

[sufferinsilence]

Will we all be playing slots on 70% payout 5 years from now?

I think I'm switching to Euromillions if that happens.

 

[bamberfishcake]

We still have:

Unibet Casino Review, trusted & updated info - Casinomeister
Novibet Casino Now Accredited- Casinomeister
21Casino Review: Accredited - Casinomeister® Online Casino Authority

for the UK.

And i think all the other WHG sites are currently max,

Any more anybody knows of?

 

[pinnit2014]

Pretty sure Casumo have PNG highest but others on lower.

But wouldn't play there, so kinda moot.

 

[Kroffe]

Is the betsson group in the uk? (betsson,nordicbet,betsafe etc)

They have some oddities, like they run Fruit shop:MW at 95% instead of 96% for example but other than that they run everything at full rtp.

 

[colinsunderland]

Pretty sure Casumo have PNG highest but others on lower.

But wouldn't play there, so kinda moot.

Yeah Casumo do but they make their extra profit by ripping customers off by withholding winnings while they ask for a bank statement from your great great great third removed cousin from 1694

 

[orion]

I'll be surprised if you still have anywhere offering 96%'s next year, possibly sooner: maybe one two but even they'll struggle to justify that (for want of a better expression) to their owners given any attraction/retaining of customers won't outweigh the 2% difference etc.

Make a prediction that Unibet are one of the last men standing

Probably just testing the waters before they eye up the 92%'s - would be quite interesting to see what analysis they've done, if any, to determine at what point any drop/switch/decrease in play leads to a financially worse off position. Unfortunately that figure's probably in the 80's

bad news for you.
71-84% and people still play.

ofc is not that simple, lowering the rtp (and the variance) that much the casino loses the "clever" players who are able to manage themselves, but keeps the addicted ones, and it seems this is ok for the final balance of the casino.

the question is how long.

 

[pinnit2014]

Bambi’s currently having an irregular heartbeat at the thought of a 70 online

 

[chuchu59]

With reduced RTP players may have to opt for higher variance slots especially when it comes to clearing wagering requirements. Casinos might wish to lower bonus wagering requirements to offset the reduced RTP especially in the short term.

 

[dunover]

Will we all be playing slots on 70% payout 5 years from now?

You can simply play Bonanza to get an idea of what that will feel like....

 

[Nate]

You can simply play Bonanza to get an idea of what that will feel like....

Now just imagine playing the progressive version on min stake. With its reduced RTP to compensate for jackpot provisions it will surely dish out some horrible sessions.

In any event, seeing the 117k ways in the Free Spins indicates its a modified version.

Nate

 

[Mouse75]

Leovegas.... who closed my account for "bonus abuse".... I had had a 100% match £200 plus £200 on thier sister site Royal Pands and was half way through wagering, playing min stakes when balance dropped to £5, so i played five £1 spins on bonanza - hit 800x, and went back to min betting across at least 50 games to hit wagering. Account closed!!
Scum casino - scu
m operations team - and clearly not interested in giving players a fair crack of the whip.
Now they went even more profit at the cost of players - I hope you all avoid them like the plague

 

[Skephan]

The strange part is when mentioning lower RTP or not honouring SE requests or RG-Limits they always make you feel like it's your fault for depositing and losing and your responsibility. My opinion is that casino's and providers have a responsibility too to care about their clients. In this matter they should've have informed their clients, but they don't have to cause ''hey you accepted their T&C'' and made a deposit. Leovegas is not obliged to accept responsibility for your actions anyways you know when enrolling: '' the house always wins'' .

If this kind of attitude continues and players re-accepted eventhough they admitted problemgambling (mutiple groups are guilty of allowing this to happen) this will indurstry will eventually bleed to death. We're risky, spontaneous, but not stupid and would like to have some entertainment back for our made deposits.

 

[sapit222]

Ive sent a question to Svenska Spelinspektionen (Swedish Gambling Authority) about the lowered RTP and am waiting for a reply.

 

[Kyocer777]

If casino is regulated by Malta, they cannot have lower RTP than 96%.

Anybody knows about minimum RTP of other regulatory bodies?

 

[colinsunderland]

If casino is regulated by Malta, they cannot have lower RTP than 96%.

Anybody knows about minimum RTP of other regulatory bodies?

I'm not massively up to date on MGA rules, but I'm pretty sure thats wrong?

 

[Kroffe]

I'm not massively up to date on MGA rules, but I'm pretty sure thats wrong?

Yeah, i think there is a lower limit, i think ive seen 91 or 92% be mentioned for some license, dont remember if it was mga tho.
I mean, there are alot of slots that does not have a 96%+ version, like all novomatics for example.

 

[Halvor]

I'm not massively up to date on MGA rules, but I'm pretty sure thats wrong?

You are correct, its 92%.

 

[kidgloves]

Will we all be playing slots on 70% payout 5 years from now?

Not me for one! I'm annoyed as it is with a few % drop already. Trouble is, the market if there as already stated with all the clueless punters.

 

[Kyocer777]

For example San Quentin - I think Curacao casinos don't need to put anything in their help files:

San Quentin xWays is a video slot with five reels, three rows and 243 ways as default. The various features included in the gameplay will increase the number of ways with no real set upper limit. Theoretically, a staggering 13,189,257,216 ways are possible. Wins are awarded for three to five matching symbols landing on adjacent reels from left to right only. You can join the inmates for a reel session on desktop, tablet or mobile from 0.20 to 32 credits per spin. The game has extreme volatility (10/10) with a default RTP of 96.03% and a hit rate of roughly 1:3 spins. Some operators will offer it in the DX version with 94.11%, always check the help files to find out which version you will be playing. Using the Bonus Buy feature will increase the default RTP to 96.26 – 96.95% based on which option is purchased.

 

[flyerskyangle]

bad news for you.
71-84% and people still play.

ofc is not that simple, lowering the rtp (and the variance) that much the casino loses the "clever" players who are able to manage themselves, but keeps the addicted ones, and it seems this is ok for the final balance of the casino.

the question is how long.

I think that’s not the problem of “clever” or not.
The sh”t problem is the promoters showing their big win with these slots.
For example,almost all streamers show their impossible hits on their YouTube channels, they bet 5$,10$,even 100$ Stake at pragmatic play games, and win huge? Isn’t it kidding new players?