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Irish Luck, treated like a dog

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by Josh66, Nov 20, 2008.

    Nov 20, 2008
  1. Josh66

    Josh66 Dormant account PABnoaccred

    Occupation:
    Self Employed
    Location:
    Uk
    Hi all

    the way I gamble is to bet quite intensively and then have a break for a while. I ask to be blocked for a few months. Then I have another go. It works for me: the way I choose to play.

    Anyway, this time round, I am having a go with the Rivals, rather than MG or Playtech. They have been pretty good with the bonuses and I have deposited several hundred GB pounds with Absolute Slots. I will get round to Simon Says but they want me to scan in docs and my scanner is bust so they will need to wait!

    Anyway, I couldn't log on to Irish luck and the guy in chat tells me they will let me in and I can deposit but they will NOT be giving me any bonuses. You know, a measly few quid bonus goes a long way for someone who spent 40 grand online last year (pounds not dollars) so I will play elsewhere. What's worse, I can't find online what group they are in.

    Can anyone throw any light on this?

    Also, I checked the affiliate link on their site and it says this:-

    "Excellent Retention
    We keep them playing longer so you make more money."

    How bad is that?

    This "them" is hoping to play for short periods elsewhere!

    Also, it would be nice to get some replies. I have been here for a while now and I get emails asking me to post but when I do, they generally don't get a response!

    Cheers

    J
     
  2. Nov 20, 2008
  3. chuchu59

    chuchu59 gambling addict CAG PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    EXECUTIVE
    Location:
    SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
    I doubt whether this is Irish Luck that is treating you so badly but rather the Rival software. It flags players after they have claimed a certain amount/number of bonuses and flags them as bonus abusers. The information is shared among most Rival casinos and some will automatically bar you from getting any bonuses.

    I dont have any qualms about this but the system is not designed to remove you from that list if you continue to deposit without bonuses although individual casinos have the discretion to re-instate them. From my experience, Slotocash is probably the only Rival casino that does not share the 'bonus abuser' system though you must clarify the terms and conditions of each bonus with them to avoid misunderstandings.

    I would suggest you pm the casino rep of Irish Luck and explain your case. Maybe he might be able to help. As for a more detailed and accurate version of this 'bonus abuse system' regarding Rival you should ask Robrival.

    PS I am actually bonus-banned from Absolute Slots, This is Vegas, Cocoa, Pantasia and Da Vinci and I have never deposited at the latter 2.
     
    2 people like this.
  4. Nov 20, 2008
  5. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    This Rival system looks more and more like a computer running amok. What is worse, when this "flag" is on your account, it seems to give CS the authority to treat you like something the cat dragged in - gone are all the polite platitudes, and they may as well drop the pretence and just say it out plain - F*&^ off :mad:

    Even the Rival reps have not the slightest clue as to what is going on, the computer can spew out crap, and they treat it like the word of a prophet is treated by a religious order.

    If you spend 40K per annum, you are a pretty high roller, probably more than most online casinos ever see, yet they still value this so little they can treat you so inconsiderately.
    The bonus ban is not the issue really, it is the totally illogical way it is done, the lack of any explanation, even woolly, and unwavering slavery to the mighty bonus computer shown by nearly all Rival casinos.

    There are a HUGE number of online casinos that will offer you dream holidays for that kind of action, let alone regular bonuses. They just have different software.

    Maybe ditch them, don't give them the time of day, no point moaning, and try SlotOcash, as they seem to have come to their senses, ditched the computer, and use their intelligence when it comes to who needs a bonus ban, and who is just a loyal player.

    I have noticed that a HUGE number of Rival casinos have opened recently, but nearly all are white labels of the one, Bonne Chance. It is Bonne Chance that run this computerised bonus database, but they are trying to confuse the issue by opening so many "independent" casinos to lure in players.

    I have started to notice a pattern though, and this might have some bearing. Nearly ALL those who complain about being hit by this computer bonus ban have accounts at MORE THAN ONE of the Rival casinos that fall under the ownership of Bonne Chance.

    You say this:-

    This is no accident, they want players to think this is a brand like Microgaming, where if you have, say, 20 accounts with MG software, you could be playing at a dozen COMPLETELY INDEPENDENT casinos.
    It may be that the computer uses the number of Rival accounts as part of the bonus banning formula, so you could still spend several K over all the Rivals, thinking each offer is independent, but the computer looks at your gaming as though it were all in the same account. They may even take, say, 3000 withdrawn from one Rival, and a similar amount deposited in a DIFFERENT Rival (or set of Rivals), and taking another bonus, as "bonus abuse" akin to claiming a bonus on a reversed withdrawal.

    Playing intensively could easily trigger this, since you are probably withdrawing and depositing again as soon as you get paid, thinking that these are unconnected if the deposits are in a different casino.

    I could withdraw, say, 10K from All Jackpots, get it flushed, and then put most of it into All Slots, with a 10% loyalty bonus. I doubt this would be seen as "getting a bonus on a reversed cashin", or a form of "bonus abuse", provided I played the deposit, perhaps entering one of the promotions.

    I am beginning to suspect that there is a hell of a lot more "sharing" going on between these managed (by Bonne Chance) Rivals than they have cared to admit. They have admitted to the forum that the sharing is very limited, and is only done in order to prevent "bonus abuse". It seems it goes far deeper than that, since it is NOT stopping players from doing the SUB at all Rivals, but rather kicks in once they have become established loyal players. One player reported being loyal for THREE YEARS, and then getting "the treatment" from their computer.

    This issue is the worst possible publicity, as it might do nothing to deter the SUB hunters, but it DOES deter me from thinking I can become a long term LOYAL player, and expect an increasing level of priviliges as the months (or years) pass.
     
    5 people like this.
  6. Nov 20, 2008
  7. actech

    actech Dormant account

    Occupation:
    freelancer
    Location:
    d
    Have acounts in all Rival. Sloto is not conected, and think one of the new ones. Got bonus ban in all after withdraw 2k at Superior. Upon asking what is goin on the answer was same
    here from Cocoa

    info: All operators are currently assisting others. Thanks for your patience. You are currently placed in queue number 1. The average wait is 19seconds. An operator will be with you shortly.
    info: You are now chatting with 'Liz'
    Liz: Welcome to Cocoa Casino's Live Support. How may I assist you?
    you: Hi i have promotions that i'm denied to use. Why?
    Liz: One moment please.
    Liz: I'm sorry your account is not eligible for promotions. The decision was made by management.
    you: Really? Is there a problem? i can see 10$ free that i got, noticed in mail?
    Liz: I'm sorry the reason you can not claim the promotion is due to not being eligible for bonuses.
    you: i got mail for10$ nd free chip and 100% bonus. And i can see it in cashier. Why now not?
    you: i made deposits so i was gettin free chip
    Liz: I'm sorry
    Liz: The decision was made today by management
    you: guess i'm not welcomed here anymore
    you: And it was based on? why i was not informed about that decision?
    Liz: I am sorry to inform you but the casino reserves the right to deny promotions to anyone, without disclosing the reason why.

    here from SiS

    nfo: All operators are currently assisting others. Thanks for your patience. You are currently placed in queue number 1. The average wait is 33seconds. An operator will be with you shortly.
    info: You are now chatting with 'Albert'
    Albert: Welcome to Simon Says Casino Live Support. How may I assist you?
    you: Hello! why i'm not welcomed here anymore?
    you: i can't claimed deposit bonuses?
    you: **************
    Albert: One moment please.
    Albert: I'm sorry, but the account was set to not eligible by Management, we're unable to see the reason. We would need to check with management for you, is it ok if we email you back as soon as we know more.
    you: In which rival casinos i'm also got this ban? what is your sister casinos? Same hapaned in Cocoa casinos.
    you: Ok please mail me reasons of this ban
    Albert: One moment please.
    Albert: Your referred account also was set to not eligible.
    Albert: Please note that we have forwarded your inquiry to our Management for further consideration. You will be contacted in regard to this matter as soon as possible at your registered E-mail Address.
    Albert: Is there anything else I can help you with?
    you: thx

    and Superior

    info: All operators are currently assisting others. Thanks for your patience. You are currently placed in queue number 1. The average wait is 17seconds. An operator will be with you shortly.
    info: You are now chatting with 'Liz'
    Liz: Welcome to Superior Casino Live Support. How may I assist you?
    you: Hello! I made flush withdrawal on 17.10. and money still is not on my acount. Can you check what is caousing delay?
    Liz: One moment please.
    Liz: Withdrawals at the moment take 2 to 5 business days to process.
    you: ussually is quick in my Moneybookers acount
    you: So it's not superior casino as it claims
    Liz: As you requested the withdrawal on Friday it will start processing tomorrow on Monday
    you: And i'm banned for promotion in all sister casinos and here
    Liz: One moment please.
    you: And may bet per spin had been lowered at only 5cent coin size
    you: guess if you win a litlle you get a ban
    Liz: Your patience is appreciated. I will be with you shortly.
    Liz: Yes you have been banned for promotions at all casino's except Sloto cash
    you: Why is that? because of winning? guess you will take we don't need to tell you that
    Liz: The decision was made by management.
    you: that you got right to ban player for no reason told.
    Liz: I can not see the reason why, as it's management's decision.
    you: Guess they have rights not to tell why..
    Liz: Yes they have the right.
    you: not a nice way to find that you are not welcomed anymore.......
    Liz: I'm sorry
    you: bye

    And first casino that reinstaled my status few hours after ban was Superior, casino that trigered ban.( i'm still bannned in cocoa, davincis and mayan, others reinstated my status )

    Here is the news:
     
    1 person likes this.
  8. Nov 20, 2008
  9. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    Why do it then:confused::confused::confused:

    This bit of research seems to make things pretty damn clear. It was the $2000 win that triggered the ban, plain and simple. The ban was automated and simultaneous. It seems that a big win at ANY ONE Rival casino triggers the automated ban, and then it is up to individual managers to apologise and pretend it was all a mistake.

    FAR FAR more sinister is the reaction of slashing the max bet for such players, ON SLOTS:eek:
    This action is more or less an accusation of wrongdoing, whatever "spin" casino management put on it.

    Are their games REALLY Random:what: They seem to run scared of any player winning big, or even MEDIUM sized, on their slots, it this "not supposed to happen", implying that players who DO win when "the game is not supposed to pay that much" get not only a blanket ban from bonuses, but a reduction in bet size on top.

    There seems considerable RETROSPECTIVE action involved here, with promotions already "won" from participation BEFORE the ban being retrospectively confiscated.

    Does Rival want to end up in the rogue pit:confused:

    How about some HONESTY and OPENNESS by the Rival reps. WTF is REALLY going on here? The computer is managing this, but SOMEBODY PROGRAMMED IT, so don't take us for idiots by pretending no-one knows what is going on.
     
    4 people like this.
  10. Nov 20, 2008
  11. chuchu59

    chuchu59 gambling addict CAG PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    EXECUTIVE
    Location:
    SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
    What a stupid system Rival has. It uses certain criteria to label players as 'bonus abusers' and this triggers an automatic ban across nearly all Rivals. However, even if you play at various Rivals without taking bonuses, the ban is not automatically lifted and you have to make your case to each casino individually.

    While I believe that they have a right to use a system to bar certain players from claiming bonuses across the board the opposite should also apply and once a player has deposited a certain amount without bonuses the system should recognise this and automatically lift the ban.
     
  12. Nov 20, 2008
  13. IrishLuckCasino

    IrishLuckCasino Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Casino Manager
    Location:
    Australia
    Hi Josh.

    I will allow bonuses on your account using the username / email address you sent me yesterday in PM. I will also put some notes on your account for any support staff to talk to.

    It is possible (actually highly likely) that your account is also being banned/suspended because you've chosen to self-exclude yourself from other Rival casinos.
    If this is the case, that part of the system is designed protect people from playing at another property and avoiding a self imposed ban somewhere else.

    It is a difficult situation for me, because I prefer to be cautious with regards to responsible gambling.

    If anybody else has this problem, please PM me, or email This email is not visible to you. , and we will look at your account and help you.

    For the record, Irish Luck is an independent casino, and not part of any existing group. We will be adding more casinos in the future though.

    RE: Banning / Bonus-banning winning players.
    This is NOT Irish Luck Policy. We will never ban you because you win!

    RE: Rival system banning players.
    The system can be too aggressive in many cases with banning players from taking bonuses. Like slotocash, we are moving towards a manual review, rather than relying on the software to determine who to ban.

    RE: Our VIP program.
    As others have pointed out, many casinos treat their VIP players like gold. Irish luck is no exception. Our VIP manager will treat you like royalty.
    Moreover, you will get the same level of attention if you spend $20, or $20,000 with us.


    I will respond to the other issues raised in this thread separately.

    Please bear with me while I sort the original issue out ASAP.
     
    5 people like this.
  14. Nov 20, 2008
  15. chuchu59

    chuchu59 gambling addict CAG PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    EXECUTIVE
    Location:
    SOMEWHERE IN ASIA
    Agree with the above post on everything except that I personally believe that a player who spends $20000 at your casino should attract more attention and special treatment from you than those who spend $20.
     
    2 people like this.
  16. Nov 20, 2008
  17. hippo925

    hippo925 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    medical field
    Location:
    so cal
    This was definitely the issue that caused me to close all my rival accounts 7 months ago. Every casino, of course, has a right to decide their own policy on who gets what bonuses, but to make it so blatantly obvious that anyone who wins once in a while (ie cashes out) is to be treated like crap is just simply showing contempt for their customers.

    I've signed up at some of the new rivals and it is indeed an accomplishment to meet the wr on these bonuses since it is very rare. In fact, these bonuses are only really good for extending your play time. Yet, if you are able to do it once or twice... you don't deserve them anymore?

    Ahhh... we are only valued players and customers if we lose.. right? You can deposit a bunch, play a bunch, and be very loyal.... but if you cash out, none of that matters?

    Even slotocash, where i have been very loyal to (and doing ok in terms of luck), has limited my bonuses and added cashout restrictions that were never there before, even on the 15% bonus. i deposit without bonuses now, but how long do you play somewhere when you feel like a second class customer?

    The problem for rival is that many players will resent being "treated" like this and those players who do get good bonuses will wonder: "Hmmm, i get these bonuses now because i lose and they want me to keep losing, but if i get lucky, they are gonna treat me like crap too!"

    This will certainly raise a brow for anyone when they see a rival casino talk about player appreciation.

    For the record, i still believe slotocash to have the best cs and cashout times for the rivals. if irish luck does follow in the same footsteps, i will be sure to try them out again.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2008
  18. Nov 20, 2008
  19. hippo925

    hippo925 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    medical field
    Location:
    so cal
    You're talking about nash, aren't you?:p
     
  20. Nov 20, 2008
  21. Josh66

    Josh66 Dormant account PABnoaccred

    Occupation:
    Self Employed
    Location:
    Uk
    Hi all

    Thank you very much for the detailed replies, this has been very helpful....and interesting for me to read.

    Interesting also that some of you refer to Rival payouts, randomness etc. I queried this recently because I thought that I had noticed a pattern. Why is it when you low roll, you often get huge hits and when you high roll you NEVER get any? Well I don'. It seems like something kicks in and it's always a loosing streak.

    I queried one of the Rivals about this and got this response:-

    We would like to inform you that we have reviewed your play and have found no issues.

    Please be advised that all our games are completely random and are controlled by a random number generator. This generator has been tested by independent parties outside of the casino and has shown to be completely random. Rival has received RNG certification by CertainKey based on Fortuna-based algorithm for highly prized "cryptographically secure" classification, assuring 100% fair gaming.

    It is a hardware-based source of randomness for RNG seeding, a far superior alternative to software-based sources. This is all to ensure a complete random game always for all our players.

    Because of this at times people can have incredible amounts of luck while at other times it seems all they do is loose. Most people of course only remember when they loose, but forget those couple of winning spins in a row. And off course it is gambling, sometimes you win, sometimes you loose.

    I wrote back to them and thanked them for taking the time to respond (it was Absolute) but told them that my problem was that "sometimes you win, sometimes you loose" was not true for me - it was "I always loose, I never win" lol.

    Anyway, thanks again for the responses, very much appreciated

    Cheers

    Josh

    PS Tristan, further to you telling me that you couldn't assist me in my PM to you, you have publicly said that my account at Irish Luck is open and that I am eligible for bonuses. Thanks, it is open but no bonuses for me it seems.
     
  22. Nov 20, 2008
  23. RobWin

    RobWin closed account

    Occupation:
    Who knows?
    Location:
    A Vault!
    Well if that is truly the case then what is the point of spending/depositing what we do in order to be VIP Customers ?? That does not even make any sense and goes against all the grain of the way land based casinos operate toward their VIP clientele...:rolleyes:
     
  24. Nov 20, 2008
  25. Casinomeister

    Casinomeister Forum Cheermeister Staff Member

    Occupation:
    Homemaker
    Location:
    Bierland
    I think we need to remind ourselves (and especially for any newbies reading this) that bonuses are not obligatory/mandatory. You can have many positive casino experiences without using them. Some of you act as though your life depended on bonuses and that the casinos owe these to you.

    Just an observation from the sidelines :p
     
    2 people like this.
  26. Nov 20, 2008
  27. Zoozie

    Zoozie Ueber Meister CAG PABnonaccred

    Occupation:
    Software Developer
    Location:
    Denmark
    I wish Rival casinos would not email bonus offers to players that are banned.
    I got tired of receiving emails with bonus-offers just to log into the cashier to see that there no bonuses whatsoever there. (I am also bonus-banned in Rival DB). So stop sending offers to customers that are bonus banned please!

    The only Rival casino I play at is SlotOCash now and I am pretty happy with them so far. But I am up to 11 cycles in VP (JoB/Dueces wild) with no royal flush amoung all Rivals! I have never hit a RF at a Rival casino. Last year I posted I was 6-7 cycles behind (which was confirmed by Rival-BoB), but luck has not changed here. It is possible damn unlucky. I was up to 5-6 cycles before I hit I hit a RF at WagerWorks, but then them started rolling in all over the place and I am actually ahead now here.

    Can anyone could post a SS of a Rival Royal Flush?
     
  28. Nov 20, 2008
  29. solarrocker

    solarrocker Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Customer Support Manager
    Location:
    Netherlands Antilles
    1 person likes this.
  30. Nov 20, 2008
  31. KasinoKing

    KasinoKing WebMeister & Slotaholic.. CAG MM PABnonaccred webmeister

    Occupation:
    House-Husband and Casino Advisor
    Location:
    Bexhill on sea, England
    I don't believe it! :eek2:
    This is correspondence from what is supposed to be a professionally run casino and they can't even spell 'lose' properly!

    What is the world coming to?
    :what:
     
    1 person likes this.
  32. Nov 20, 2008
  33. SteveCut

    SteveCut Senior Member

    Occupation:
    None
    Location:
    EU
    Yeh, what a bunch of loosers! :)
     
  34. Nov 20, 2008
  35. Josh66

    Josh66 Dormant account PABnoaccred

    Occupation:
    Self Employed
    Location:
    Uk
    lol - I need to brush up my spelling too !
     
  36. Nov 20, 2008
  37. Jasminebed

    Jasminebed Closer to 100 than Birth

    Occupation:
    Not in workforce
    Location:
    Ontario
    Zoozie, could you please explain for me what you mean by "cycles"?
     
  38. Nov 20, 2008
  39. silcnlayc

    silcnlayc Just one more spin pleez! CAG MM PABnonaccred PABaccred

    Occupation:
    IT Director of Operations
    Location:
    Left Hungary
    I signed up at the 2 new Rivals (after reading up on them here) and was told to claim my welcome sign up bonus and I was denied both..go figure..I think I have used maybe 4 bonuses (these were free ND chips) from 6 Rivals in the past 2 years! But yet I was banned from claiming these new ones (I didn't ask for them, it was OFFERED!) until I emailed them and said, whats up with that?

    They manually overode it and give me my whopping 10 bucks! Guess what, I removed them instantly and never deposited in them because of this. I will stick with the 4 I have that have had the decency in throwing a few bucks my way (freebies which I do use). Other than that , I do not use bonuses for any real money deposits if I can help it.. (I forget to email cs at some casinos to tell them not to give me them when they are automatic and I truly HATE that)

    So I guess we are on some kind of "system" for being flagged...interesting!
     

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