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Guts blocked my account & holding my withdraw

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by Quickwin, Jun 5, 2015.

    Jun 5, 2015
  1. Quickwin

    Quickwin Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    Media
    Location:
    Norway
    Hello, i feel like i must write here to be heard since Guts blocked my account. Please be aware that i have no hard feeling towards guts and they have always seems 100% in all they do and always paid my winnings in time, but for first time i am faced a problem that i need help to fix.

    Story goes :

    I bought Ukash vouchers online from one merchant, then for 2 days ago i deposited to guts, i lost pretty large sums (like 1 bonus in 800spins for 5x) and i asked for 3500euro withdraw, next day i received my withdraw and tried to chase my losesses, i ended up depositing €21K worth of deposit, then i won 3000euro plus 500euro good will bonus that made me go up to 5000euro, i withdrew this and waited few hours and suddenly my account was blocked.

    The rep saying my Ukash was in Norwegian kroner and the their payment system had error, my account at guts is EURO and always had been euro ad my ukash is EURO so it dosent make sense to me that they blocked my acount for this reason. The rep saying if Ukash saying this is EURO they will release my withdraw but they see this as Norwegian Ukash, i then told them that if they block my withdraw and deposit after sending them all they need, they can refund my orginal deposit of €21K and im happy with it.

    I have sent the actual voucher and my transaction of my bank that showing my receipt of the Ukash.

    Now i read in other thred that they having issue with Ukash and have removed the Ukash, but my problem is not handled...


    I either want my account re opened and my €5000 withdraw prossesed asap or refund of my deposit and keep my account blocked if they wish so.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Jun 5, 2015
  3. me_and_ed

    me_and_ed Ueber Meister CAG MM

    Occupation:
    Selling out
    Location:
    Vancouver
    If you know there is a Ukash issue why bring this up here, why not PM either Tony or Ben and work though it that way, they are always around, I am sure you will get a pretty quick answer.
     
    1 person likes this.
  4. Jun 5, 2015
  5. Quickwin

    Quickwin Experienced Member

    Occupation:
    Media
    Location:
    Norway

    Ok i could wait more but bare with me that this is pretty large sums, if this was over 1-3K i would not freak out, but FYI i have been in touch with Tony, but my problem is not handled, my last email was not responded either so yes i have tried. I wish i didnt even think of playing few days ago so i would not stress with this.
     
  6. Jun 5, 2015
  7. me_and_ed

    me_and_ed Ueber Meister CAG MM

    Occupation:
    Selling out
    Location:
    Vancouver
    I get that, if everything is on the up and up you are in good hands with Guts......... deep breaths :)
     
  8. Jun 5, 2015
  9. suzecat

    suzecat Dormant account CAG MM webmeister

    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    California

    No one wants you to stress. Here is the Ukash thead I think me and ed was refering to. Just some light reading while your issue gets sorted.

    http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/showthread.php?t=67518

    Best of luck!
     
    1 person likes this.
  10. Jun 5, 2015
  11. spintee

    spintee Meister Member webby mm2

    Occupation:
    gambler :)
    Location:
    Northants
    Guts is one of the top casino out there,

    They updated there site only a few days ago, This could be a reason your acounts blocked, As long as you have played by the books you are in good hands,
     
  12. Jun 5, 2015
  13. paul7388

    paul7388 Meister Member MM

    Occupation:
    not a lot
    Location:
    glasgow scotland
    I do not see a reason to panic. If indeed its all true and the UKASH you used was EURO like you stated then I am sure you will get paid . If you think you have been wrongly treated and the Rep does not help then you can file a PAB and Max will get to the bottom of it.

    I see you brought up the other thread about Guts having problems with UKASH like to show others are having problems. I would be more inclined to say that reason GUTS pulled UKASH for a while was to do with you as its a lot of money involved. Its looking more like for some reason their system has accepted UKASH vouchers in EUROS that were purchased in a different currency meaning players are getting more money than they should.

    But as GUTS is about the best there is I look forward to seeing the outcome of this. Every casino would lock a players account if they thought something was up but they would unlock it and pay out if all is above board. So either they are still investigating or their investigations show something is wrong.

    But if indeed everything you posted is true then I am sure Guts will sort your problem out soon enough and will apologize to you for the inconvenience. It all comes down to what UKASH says and I know Guts were in contact with them. If UKASH has verified the vouchers were not in EURO then GUTS is right.

    Puzzles me why you think they would refund 21k of deposits to you tho if they wont process your withdrawal and keep your account blocked. If it shows up the vouchers were wrong currency then that would basically be fraud so why would the casino return anything.
     
  14. Jun 5, 2015
  15. ugaboga

    ugaboga Casino Addict

    Occupation:
    Information Technology, Day Trader
    Location:
    Australia
    How is it fraud? It's either them or Ukash made an error, how is the player responsible? The Ukash payment system is automated and authorizes with the Ukash servers. I don't see how the player can be at fault here.

    There is no way to create fake Ukash vouchers, lol.
     
    1 person likes this.
  16. Jun 5, 2015
  17. paul7388

    paul7388 Meister Member MM

    Occupation:
    not a lot
    Location:
    glasgow scotland
    Not saying it was fraud. But if someone had say a 500 UKASH voucher in a certain currency and deposited it in a casino and the casinos system was wrong and it accepted the voucher in a different currency then that would be a mistake. But if a player knew that had happened then made several more deposits using a voucher from one currency knowing it would credit them as a different currency then that would be fraud as the player would have made several deposits like that.

    The player has probably done nothing wrong and it will get sorted and he will get paid. But if it does transpire that a player made several deposits with a different currency knowing it was getting added incorrectly then what ever way you look at it it would be fraud.
     
    2 people like this.
  18. Jun 5, 2015
  19. citizenx

    citizenx Meister Member MM

    Occupation:
    Stuff
    Location:
    UK
    OK used to be a fraud analyst so system exploits are always a risk. Don't know anything about UKASH and just general comment here, not referring to this case.

    Buy some kind of voucher using GBP in Euros and the current exchange rate used by the voucher provided will generate a voucher in equivalent Euros.


    Discover that a service accepts these vouchers in one currency as that of another currency then there may be an issue.

    Example one "business as usual"

    Exchange rates are entirely made up for ease.

    £100 -> €150 voucher -> €150 purchase from provider voucher is used at.


    Example 2 "exploit"

    £100 voucher to other currency which works out as 5,000 units of that currency.

    However, tell the provider its euro and limited or failed validation from voucher issuer may result in purchase provided thinking they've been paid €5000 Euro rather than €150.

    That may only become apparent later.

    Fraudsters are clever. Often as clever if not more so than people running companies.

    Perpetual game of cat and mouse.
     
  20. Jun 5, 2015
  21. Matti

    Matti Senior Member MM

    Occupation:
    Business Development Tech
    Location:
    Sweden
    If you feel that this is a lot of money (as it is for most people) don't deposit them at a casino, and never ever go chasing losses like you stated in your OP. If you do you're on a road towards gamblers hell.

    Guts as a great casino will of course sort this out regading the UKASH issue.
     
  22. Jun 5, 2015
  23. TonyGuts

    TonyGuts Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Head of Customer Operations
    Location:
    Malta
    Hi all,

    Just wanted to give an update here also and let everyone know that we are investigating this at the moment. Its never our attention to block accounts for no valid reason.

    It is true that this is the reason why Ukash was disabled last evening for a short time was because Ukash vouchers that was passed to us in NOK got credited as EUR to players account if the player currency was set as EUR.

    As an example, if a 100 NOK voucher was used on a EUR account, the deposit that got credited to the players account was 100 EUR.

    Ukash confirmed the value of the vouchers used and they were in NOK, while Quickspin has provided me with a screenshot of his bank statement and a Ukash voucher example that he used on our site which shows EUR. These got passed on to Ukash for investigation.

    I will of course update Quickspin once I have more information from Ukash about this incident.

    Kind regards,
    Tony
     
    4 people like this.
  24. Jun 5, 2015
  25. citizenx

    citizenx Meister Member MM

    Occupation:
    Stuff
    Location:
    UK

    Good spot Guts.

    Whilst I make no statement about the intent of the OP, it seems to me there.is a 10:1 ratio of NOK to Euro. I think I would always k ow of I'd spent £20 or £200.
     
  26. Jun 5, 2015
  27. spintee

    spintee Meister Member webby mm2

    Occupation:
    gambler :)
    Location:
    Northants

    You need to take a good look at deposits where this has happened, If there has been a few deposits in a short period than ban them,

    Obvious there will be deposits and the error might of happend but if people took advantage than bad for them,
     
  28. Jun 5, 2015
  29. vinylweatherman

    vinylweatherman You type well loads CAG MM

    Occupation:
    STILL At Leisure
    Location:
    United Kingdom
    It's not the players' fault though. It's a software glitch that made a dangerous assumption that the player's account currency setting should be used to determine the currency of a UKash voucher, rather than the currency of the UKash voucher itself.

    In my experience, when playing in a casino that uses a different currency than the UK pound, the currency exchange was taken care of for me either by my bank or by the casino. This used to be a common experience when I started as many softwares didn't have multi-currency support, and as the US was around 90% of the market, everything was in the US Dollar. It's not such a problem now as multi-currency support is common, however the UK has not adopted the Euro, and it's becoming increasingly common to see Euro only casinos springing up for the European market. This means that the problems of old are coming back to haunt players from non Eurozone countries. This error could have the opposite effect for UK players as they would find a £100 UKash voucher turning into €100.

    Suspending accounts that have suffered the error is a good thing, but it seems communication with affected players has been lacking, and in this case has made a player feel that the casino is trying to shaft them by accepting all the losing deposits, but then refusing to pay the withdrawal when the player has only won SOME of that money back. It's probably natural given the circumstances for the player to demand that ALL the play is void, not just the final winning session.

    The fairest solution may be to recalculate the wagers and outcomes in NOK where they were derived from UKash deposits that were subject to this error.

    It seems that UKash is prone to a fair few problems, the most notable of which is dodgy voucher reselling, and this may be why it's being killed off in favour of Paysafecard.
     
  30. Jun 5, 2015
  31. ProbabilityZero

    ProbabilityZero Senior Member

    Occupation:
    Carer of Dementia sufferers
    Location:
    Onmybutt
    It's not a player's fault for a system error. However, as others have stated, you would be aware if your balance 10x what it should have been and surely most players would be honest in these circumstances. Regardless of whether it's technically fraud playing on with that knowledge would show a lack of morality.

    This is a general observation and not a slander to the OP without knowing his own personal situation and experience in this matter. :)
     
  32. Jun 5, 2015
  33. refre

    refre Senior lurker PABnonaccred PABnoaccred

    Occupation:
    Professional slot player
    Location:
    .
    Currency exchange is getting very expensive. You can easily lose 10% going in and out through E-wallets...

    My goal is to only transact in my own currency - and I'm saving a fortune. There are no fees on vouchers and I don't lose out on the exchange rate if my account is the same currency. I did look into getting them online, I quickly passed though. The 're-sellers' were dodgy at best and fees were very high.

    I've settled with bying them at the supermarket (+ convenience stores and gas stations). I even get cash back when using the right card :D Also there's the added benefit of not being able to spend more than the value of your voucher...

    Freddy
     
  34. Jun 5, 2015
  35. keiller

    keiller Quit the forum

    Occupation:
    dog walker
    Location:
    london
    In my opinion crap casino saying takes up to 3 days to verify me:eek:
    every other casino verified within an hour or two!
     
  36. Jun 5, 2015
  37. The Viking

    The Viking Ueber Meister MM

    Occupation:
    chef
    Location:
    Faroe Islands
    You gotta come up with more then that :) did you mail back asking whats taking so long?
    did they mail you back with a reason? are they missing some docs from you ? have you PM the reps in here about it ?
     
  38. Jun 5, 2015
  39. CasinoBen

    CasinoBen Accredited Casino Representative

    Occupation:
    Managing Director
    Location:
    Marbella
    Hi,

    As I responded in my PM to you the 1 - 3 days was a worst case scenario that my support agent gave you. We had only requested documents from you a few hours ago so please give us a chance as 99% of the time our verification is done well within 24 hours. Verification can take up to 3 days if we are not supplied the correct documents or need to check the authenticity of the documents that were received which is the reason for that estimate.

    Regards,

    Ben
     
    3 people like this.

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