Danger! High Voltage - Technical Analysis (The best symbol on Gates of Hell and other info)

trancemonkey

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Good work @The Reel Story :)

The maths for DHV is pretty much exactly as I would have expected that game to work, although the lack of Wilds on the reels is interesting so if that is the case, it must he decided on a separate chance...
 

snorky510238

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So given that every symbol is allocated a number and then the rng spits out 6 numbers (I assume) 1 for each reel with DHV and Bonanza. How is it (especially with Bonanza but also DHV) that you get the G and the O constantly landing adjacent to each other? (can happen on any reels) particularly on reels 1 and 2.

Given the distribution of scatters compared to the total symbols per reel this happens way more than the statistical average.
 

The Reel Story

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So given that every symbol is allocated a number and then the rng spits out 6 numbers (I assume) 1 for each reel with DHV and Bonanza. How is it (especially with Bonanza but also DHV) that you get the G and the O constantly landing adjacent to each other? (can happen on any reels) particularly on reels 1 and 2.

Given the distribution of scatters compared to the total symbols per reel this happens way more than the statistical average.

The word 'constantly' there is probably a bit strong :) However you have to remember that, yes, the RNG is producing 1 number per reel (the reel stop) but each reel stop produces 4 visible symbols. So for a reel with 3 scatters there are 12 possible reel stops out of 177 that will produce a scatter. Likewise with reels that have 4 scatters, you get 16 possible stops that will produce a scatter.

As the scatter frequency is 3,4,3,3,4,3 on the reels, it means that you have a 4 sandwiched between two 3's, so while the most common should be seeing scatters on reels 2 and 5, two adjacent scatters isn't ridiculously rare. My statistical maths isn't good enough to tell you exactly what the probability of that is though :)

As for Bonanza, I don't really know as I've not looked into it in any detail, but I'd imagine a similar thing, esp when you take into account Megaways increasing the number of visible symbols.
 

snorky510238

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The word 'constantly' there is probably a bit strong :) However you have to remember that, yes, the RNG is producing 1 number per reel (the reel stop) but each reel stop produces 4 visible symbols. So for a reel with 3 scatters there are 12 possible reel stops out of 177 that will produce a scatter. Likewise with reels that have 4 scatters, you get 16 possible stops that will produce a scatter.

As the scatter frequency is 3,4,3,3,4,3 on the reels, it means that you have a 4 sandwiched between two 3's, so while the most common should be seeing scatters on reels 2 and 5, two adjacent scatters isn't ridiculously rare. My statistical maths isn't good enough to tell you exactly what the probability of that is though :)

As for Bonanza, I don't really know as I've not looked into it in any detail, but I'd imagine a similar thing, esp when you take into account Megaways increasing the number of visible symbols.
Ok yeah DHV isn’t as bad as Bonanza or millionaire actually. If you played it for a while you would definitely see what I mean.

It’s way past statistical probability. I am of the opinion it’s one of those psychology things purposely put in there to create excitement because hearing the bang,bang crashing sounds the scatters make when they land gives you that adrenaline rush. This is heightened when 2 land on adjacent reels because their reels spin and stop very quickly.

It’s the sound the brain recognises and responds to as it’s obviously the first step of the feature hit we all crave. Very clever but I just wondered how they do it as it’s way to abundant to be random.
 

Reelsoffun

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The word 'constantly' there is probably a bit strong :) However you have to remember that, yes, the RNG is producing 1 number per reel (the reel stop) but each reel stop produces 4 visible symbols. So for a reel with 3 scatters there are 12 possible reel stops out of 177 that will produce a scatter. Likewise with reels that have 4 scatters, you get 16 possible stops that will produce a scatter.

As the scatter frequency is 3,4,3,3,4,3 on the reels, it means that you have a 4 sandwiched between two 3's, so while the most common should be seeing scatters on reels 2 and 5, two adjacent scatters isn't ridiculously rare. My statistical maths isn't good enough to tell you exactly what the probability of that is though :)

As for Bonanza, I don't really know as I've not looked into it in any detail, but I'd imagine a similar thing, esp when you take into account Megaways increasing the number of visible symbols.


Couldnt be bothered to work out chances for near miss etc but If I did it right ( didnt check my calculations ) i get this

6 Scat 1 in 5792615
5 Scat 1 in 77106
4 Scat 1 in 2473
3 Scat 1 in 149

TOTAL 1 in 141 Overall

141 seems low to me so i might have made some errors
 

trancemonkey

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Ok yeah DHV isn’t as bad as Bonanza or millionaire actually. If you played it for a while you would definitely see what I mean.

It’s way past statistical probability. I am of the opinion it’s one of those psychology things purposely put in there to create excitement because hearing the bang,bang crashing sounds the scatters make when they land gives you that adrenaline rush. This is heightened when 2 land on adjacent reels because their reels spin and stop very quickly.

It’s the sound the brain recognises and responds to as it’s obviously the first step of the feature hit we all crave. Very clever but I just wondered how they do it as it’s way to abundant to be random.

You're assuming every single stop position has the same weight...
 

Reelsoffun

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You're assuming every single stop position has the same weight...

Yes correct, that was based on even weighting as generally with that many stops per reel they often are evenly weighted but not guaranteed of course.
 

trancemonkey

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I've never seen, or done, a game where every reel stop is evenly weighted. Maybe a long time ago.

That said, in Australia reel weights are not allowed.
 

snorky510238

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I thought reel weighting was done by having more lower paying symbols than high paying etc. By the way I have read those replies it sounds like you are now telling me that say a reel had 100 positions that not all stop positions have an equal chance of landing in view. Have I understood that correctly.
 

Reelsoffun

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I've never seen, or done, a game where every reel stop is evenly weighted. Maybe a long time ago.

That said, in Australia reel weights are not allowed.


I always thought it was more for slots using physical reels where you cant have more than 24 ish on a reel before they get tiny.

You shouldnt need to weight reels of a virtual strip TBH as you can do that with adding more of a symbol to do that.
 

Reelsoffun

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I thought reel weighting was done by having more lower paying symbols than high paying etc. By the way I have read those replies it sounds like you are now telling me that say a reel had 100 positions that not all stop positions have an equal chance of landing in view. Have I understood that correctly.


It is generally, but can be also done the way TM says.


Yes that exactly what TM is saying that even if the reel has 100 it could be weighted to say 256 but like i said in his reply that's a more complicated way of doing it for effectively the same thing, dont see the point myself and in some places not allowed.


I mean why have a reel with 100, weight it to 170 when you can just make a reel 170 in the first place.
 

snorky510238

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It is generally, but can be also done the way TM says.


Yes that exactly what TM is saying that even if the reel has 100 it could be weighted to say 256 but like i said in his reply that's a more complicated way of doing it for effectively the same thing, dont see the point myself and in some places not allowed.


I mean why have a reel with 100, weight it to 170 when you can just make a reel 170 in the first place.
That’s where I am getting confused cheers for that. Just out of interest what’s your analysis of the adjacent scatters being so frequent on Btg games.It definitely happens especially on Bonanza there’s no getting away from it. A lot of the time they are laterally in line as well.
 

brianmon

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It is generally, but can be also done the way TM says.


Yes that exactly what TM is saying that even if the reel has 100 it could be weighted to say 256 but like i said in his reply that's a more complicated way of doing it for effectively the same thing, dont see the point myself and in some places not allowed.


I mean why have a reel with 100, weight it to 170 when you can just make a reel 170 in the first place.
Because the player only sees the reel with 100.
They don't get to see how the 170 reels have been padded out with duplicate, adjacent, low paying symbols, which all 'map' to single reel stops on the 100 reel
 

brianmon

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That’s where I am getting confused cheers for that. Just out of interest what’s your analysis of the adjacent scatters being so frequent on Btg games.It definitely happens especially on Bonanza there’s no getting away from it. A lot of the time they are laterally in line as well.
Are you talking about, how you sometimes get 2 scatters, seemingly close together on the same reel.
Like you get a scatter, then a reaction, and another scatter drops in above the first, with only 1 symbol between them. Yet the reels never stop with 2 scatters showing on the reel, with 1 symbol between them.
 

trancemonkey

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I always thought it was more for slots using physical reels where you cant have more than 24 ish on a reel before they get tiny.

You shouldnt need to weight reels of a virtual strip TBH as you can do that with adding more of a symbol to do that.

Yes, you can... but it's an extremely inefficient way of doing it, as it is far easier to use weights. In fact, most of the games I've done would be (almost) impossible without weights.
 

trancemonkey

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It is generally, but can be also done the way TM says.


Yes that exactly what TM is saying that even if the reel has 100 it could be weighted to say 256 but like i said in his reply that's a more complicated way of doing it for effectively the same thing, dont see the point myself and in some places not allowed.


I mean why have a reel with 100, weight it to 170 when you can just make a reel 170 in the first place.

I think you are underestimating or misunderstanding how and why reel weighting works. It really isnt always as simple as weighting a reel band with 100 symbols to behave as if it has 170.
 
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trancemonkey

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Because the player only sees the reel with 100.
They don't get to see how the 170 reels have been padded out with duplicate, adjacent, low paying symbols, which all 'map' to single reel stops on the 100 reel

Exactly...
 

The Reel Story

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Yeh, no way to tell if weightings are in play unfortunately.

There is something very interesting going on in Bonanza, but i don't know what it is yet. It has reel sets defined but it also has another set of variables called RSC which im assuming is 'reelscatter'. But the base reel set does appear to have scatter symbols present on the reels.

I'll try to work it out at some point but it's very possible its done in such a way as to build excitement, as you say.
 

snorky510238

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Are you talking about, how you sometimes get 2 scatters, seemingly close together on the same reel.
Like you get a scatter, then a reaction, and another scatter drops in above the first, with only 1 symbol between them. Yet the reels never stop with 2 scatters showing on the reel, with 1 symbol between them.
No although I know what your saying. This tells me the scatters don’t have fixed positions. I am talking about the times G and O land on say reels 1,2 or 2,3 or 3,4 in other words adjacent reels. It happens to often to be random. To create the excitement of a possible feature.
 

Reelsoffun

When it comes to gambling, timing is everything.
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Because the player only sees the reel with 100.
They don't get to see how the 170 reels have been padded out with duplicate, adjacent, low paying symbols, which all 'map' to single reel stops on the 100 reel


I understand that, just meant its not always necessary, however its always needed to be done on physical reel games and would depend on the game for online games.
 
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