Corona virus - Covid 19 discussion

[Mr_Slot5]

That makes it much worse for me, no one with covid has had to have the top of their skull removed in a desperate attempt to relieve massive clots

Maybe, maybe not. But we have seen many, many people suffocate to death because the virus has attacked their lungs.

The fact of the matter (which is undeniable by the way) is that pre vaccines, more people were dying of COVID than are now dying because of the vaccine.

 

[bamberfishcake]

The fact of the matter (which is undeniable by the way)

Suspicion over deaths being recorded as covid when there were huge drops in other similar categories from the year before the pandemic makes that statement questionable for me.

I don't think anybody can point to much evidence to support either side of the argument, to be honest.

p.s. where is the evidence to support less people are dying because of vaccines? I thought even the pharmaceuticals had declared the vaccines were pretty useless to the new strains?

 

[goatwack]

As if we didn't know already

So when you have Bungles the Clown in charge, pessimistic SAGE soothsayers, Big Pharma & a reinvigorated Media all combining to make the perfect storm, you have 'this'.

But remember, three weeks to flatten the curve, Hands, Face, Space and of course 'Save Granny'

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[bamberfishcake]

 

[mack341]

Maybe, maybe not. But we have seen many, many people suffocate to death because the virus has attacked their lungs.

The fact of the matter (which is undeniable by the way) is that pre vaccines, more people were dying of COVID than are now dying because of the vaccine.

Nowhere have I said it wasn't the case.

Not everyone is going to think the same way on subjects, on things like GM foods, fluoridated water, pesticides and mercury dental fillings, I distrust the 'it's perfectly safe' govt advice and conclusions, I prefer if possible to go the more natural route.

That's not always going to be possible or advisable, I'll use antibiotics and painkillers, for me at the moment, personally with covid, I'm prepared to take the risks of not having a vaccine. That may change in the future, it's not fixed in stone.

 

[bamberfishcake]

Took the words right out of my mouth Mack - I'm not anti-vaccine either.

Show me some evidence and unquestionable proof and I will be first in line.

The problem is that natural immunity cannot be bottled and sold, so big pharma doesn't want it explored.

 

[ladyhawke]

Maybe, maybe not. But we have seen many, many people suffocate to death because the virus has attacked their lungs.

The fact of the matter (which is undeniable by the way) is that pre vaccines, more people were dying of COVID than are now dying because of the vaccine.

Suspicion over deaths being recorded as covid when there were huge drops in other similar categories from the year before the pandemic makes that statement questionable for me.

I don't think anybody can point to much evidence to support either side of the argument, to be honest.

p.s. where is the evidence to support less people are dying because of vaccines? I thought even the pharmaceuticals had declared the vaccines were pretty useless to the new strains?

@bamberfishcake: like yourself, I question whether or not all COVID recorded deaths are from COVID at all.

Back in 2017, the CDC provided the following information: "... between 291,000 and 646,000 people worldwide die from seasonal influenza-related respiratory illnesses each year..."

So Flu has always been a killer, but it appears to have completely disappeared from the radar during this pandemic.


@Mr_Slot5, @bamberfishcake: Figures released by PHE (Tech Briefing 17) support the assertion that vaccines do actually lower the possibility of catching , or being hospitalised by, COVID, including the DELTA variant, although the vaccine appears to be most effective in preventing hospitalisation. I am not sure though if the following figures - in either case - show the vaccine as being effective against long-term effects of catching the virus, as the PHE report did not include any figures relating to this.

Vaccine effectiveness (%) against symptomatic disease:
Alpha Delta
Dose 1 49 (46 to 52) 35 (32 to 38)
Dose 2 89 (87 to 90) 79 (78 to 80)

Vaccine effectiveness (%) against hospitalisation:
Alpha Delta
Dose 1 78 (64 to 87) 80 (69 to 88)
Dose 2 93 (80 to 97) 96 (91 to 98

However, where ever you look, there are contradictory figures right, left and centre, so it is proving impossible to know what the hell is going on.

Edit: Sorry everyone, can't get the charts to line up properly. Grrrrr.

 

[ladyhawke]

The problem is that natural immunity cannot be bottled and sold, so big pharma doesn't want it explored.

When people mention natural immunity, I am unsure what they mean.

The definition of natural immunity is that it is "the antibody protection your body creates against a germ once you’ve been infected with it..."

However, there are some diseases that once you have been infected, the most likely outcome is death, e.g. smallpox which was very contagious before it was eradicated - by vaccines.

Natural immunity is not always a failsafe against getting out of gaol, but it certainly seems to have become a miracle belief to many that trumps medical science.

 

[bamberfishcake]

When people mention natural immunity, I am unsure what they mean.

The definition of natural immunity is that it is "the antibody protection your body creates against a germ once you’ve been infected with it..."

However, there are some diseases that once you have been infected, the most likely outcome is death, e.g. smallpox which was very contagious before it was eradicated - by vaccines.

Natural immunity is not always a failsafe against getting out of gaol, but it certainly seems to have become a miracle belief to many that trumps medical science.

Correct me if I'm wrong but eradicated diseases such as smallpox required one vaccine, not a series of boosters in less than a year. For sure, some diseases have been on a course to kill millions and vaccines have saved lives.

I am in no way against progress or medical science, but I firmly believe, from mental health to cancer, eradication is off the menu for modern medicine. There is no profit in cure and modern medicine is money-driven, not driven by good-natured scientists looking for recognition.

I think the good-natured scientists and doctors are stifled in their approach by corporations and governments.

As for if the human race would have survived without vaccines, we can only guess. Would the strongest have survived and the human race, on the whole, be much stronger? Would there be a worry about overpopulation? When considering natural immunity, I think the human race and 'mother nature' has been proven to win over throughout the course of history. Look at the Incas, wiped out because they had no natural immunity built up against the diseases the Spanish were naturally immune to and had built up a natural resistance to.

 

[dealer wins]

Proof beyond any doubt covid is a global takeover and not about a virus.

Thats it, no more proof needed.

What a choice, get the vaccine, die within 5 years, dont get the vaccine, will need to fight for your life. I choose to fight, I will die before they put that shit in my arm.

 

[sufferinsilence]

Proof beyond any doubt covid is a global takeover and not about a virus.

Thats it, no more proof needed.

What a choice, get the vaccine, die within 5 years, dont get the vaccine, will need to fight for your life. I choose to fight, I will die before they put that shit in my arm.

Video has absolutely 0 to do with covid.

 

[Kroffe]

Video has absolutely 0 to do with covid.

And is also just a small part of the video, taken out of context.

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(full video, might need to use incognito mode to read)

 

[Steviedoo]

Correct me if I'm wrong but eradicated diseases such as smallpox required one vaccine, not a series of boosters in less than a year. For sure, some diseases have been on a course to kill millions and vaccines have saved lives.

I am in no way against progress or medical science, but I firmly believe, from mental health to cancer, eradication is off the menu for modern medicine. There is no profit in cure and modern medicine is money-driven, not driven by good-natured scientists looking for recognition.

I think the good-natured scientists and doctors are stifled in their approach by corporations and governments.

As for if the human race would have survived without vaccines, we can only guess. Would the strongest have survived and the human race, on the whole, be much stronger? Would there be a worry about overpopulation? When considering natural immunity, I think the human race and 'mother nature' has been proven to win over throughout the course of history. Look at the Incas, wiped out because they had no natural immunity built up against the diseases the Spanish were naturally immune to and had built up a natural resistance to.

Small pox was eradicated by a collaborative global vaccination programme led by the World Health Organization.


Historically, the small pox vaccine has been effective in preventing smallpox infection in 95% of those vaccinated. In addition, the vaccine was proven to prevent or substantially lessen infection when given within a few days after a person was exposed to the variola virus.

One of the first methods for controlling smallpox was variolation, a process named after the virus that causes smallpox (variola virus). During variolation, people who had never had smallpox were exposed to material from smallpox sores (pustules) by scratching the material into their arm or inhaling it through the nose. After variolation, people usually developed the symptoms associated with smallpox, such as fever and a rash. However, fewer people died from variolation than if they had acquired smallpox naturally.

The basis for vaccination began in 1796 when the English doctor Edward Jenner noticed that milkmaids who had gotten cowpox were protected from smallpox. Jenner also knew about variolation and guessed that exposure to cowpox could be used to protect against smallpox. To test his theory, Dr. Jenner took material from a cowpox sore on milkmaid Sarah Nelmes’ hand and inoculated it into the arm of James Phipps, the 9-year-old son of Jenner’s gardener. Months later, Jenner exposed Phipps several times to variola virus, but Phipps never developed smallpox. More experiments followed, and, in 1801, Jenner published his treatise “On the Origin of the Vaccine Inoculation.” In this work, he summarized his discoveries and expressed hope that “the annihilation of the smallpox, the most dreadful scourge of the human species, must be the final result of this practice.”

Vaccination became widely accepted and gradually replaced the practice of variolation. At some point in the 1800s, the virus used to make the smallpox vaccine changed from cowpox to vaccinia virus.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

Video has absolutely 0 to do with covid.

At this point we can only conclude he’s either delusional or trolling the thread for reaction.

I genuinely wouldn’t bet against him being triple vaxxed in reality.

 

[mack341]

One of the first methods for controlling smallpox was variolation, a process named after the virus that causes smallpox (variola virus). During variolation, people who had never had smallpox were exposed to material from smallpox sores (pustules) by scratching the material into their arm or inhaling it through the nose. After variolation, people usually developed the symptoms associated with smallpox, such as fever and a rash. However, fewer people died from variolation than if they had acquired smallpox naturally.

The basis for vaccination began in 1796 when the English doctor Edward Jenner noticed that milkmaids who had gotten cowpox were protected from smallpox. Jenner also knew about variolation and guessed that exposure to cowpox could be used to protect against smallpox. To test his theory, Dr. Jenner took material from a cowpox sore on milkmaid Sarah Nelmes’ hand and inoculated it into the arm of James Phipps, the 9-year-old son of Jenner’s gardener. Months later, Jenner exposed Phipps several times to variola virus, but Phipps never developed smallpox. More experiments followed, and, in 1801, Jenner published his treatise “On the Origin of the Vaccine Inoculation.” In this work, he summarized his discoveries and expressed hope that “the annihilation of the smallpox, the most dreadful scourge of the human species, must be the final result of this practice.”

Vaccination became widely accepted and gradually replaced the practice of variolation. At some point in the 1800s, the virus used to make the smallpox vaccine changed from cowpox to vaccinia virus.

Historically, the small pox vaccine has been effective in preventing smallpox infection in 95% of those vaccinated. In addition, the vaccine was proven to prevent or substantially lessen infection when given within a few days after a person was exposed to the variola virus.

Small pox was eradicated by a collaborative global vaccination programme led by the World Health Organization.

See i could go with all of that, the old methods they used, it feels 'organic' to me, their rudimentary methods worked and it was a medical discovery. Now we're using nanoparticles and pieces of genetic code, is it more complex than it needs to be, what's wrong with the method used to make the traditional flu jab, just switch the viral part to coronavirus, it's a tried and tested formula so there should be no bell's palsy, clots and heart inflammation etc...

 

[sufferinsilence]

See i could go with all of that, the old methods they used, it feels 'organic' to me, their rudimentary methods worked and it was a medical discovery. Now we're using nanoparticles and pieces of genetic code, is it more complex than it needs to be, what's wrong with the method used to make the traditional flu jab, just switch the viral part to coronavirus, it's a tried and tested formula so there should be no bell's palsy, clots and heart inflammation etc...

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You mean these? I guess the Valneva one might be easiest to get ahold of once it's approved

 

[mack341]

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You mean these? I guess the Valneva one might be easiest to get ahold of once it's approved

Yes something like that, but sadly "In September 2021, Valneva announced that the UK government had cancelled the vaccine order."

I'd love a journalist to ask whitty why the flu vaccine method can't be used, it would seem the simplest option to reduce 'hesitancy' and safety concerns, be interesting to hear his answer.

 

[ladyhawke]

Small pox was eradicated by a collaborative global vaccination programme led by the World Health Organization.


Historically, the small pox vaccine has been effective in preventing smallpox infection in 95% of those vaccinated. In addition, the vaccine was proven to prevent or substantially lessen infection when given within a few days after a person was exposed to the variola virus.

One of the first methods for controlling smallpox was variolation, a process named after the virus that causes smallpox (variola virus). During variolation, people who had never had smallpox were exposed to material from smallpox sores (pustules) by scratching the material into their arm or inhaling it through the nose. After variolation, people usually developed the symptoms associated with smallpox, such as fever and a rash. However, fewer people died from variolation than if they had acquired smallpox naturally.

The basis for vaccination began in 1796 when the English doctor Edward Jenner noticed that milkmaids who had gotten cowpox were protected from smallpox. Jenner also knew about variolation and guessed that exposure to cowpox could be used to protect against smallpox. To test his theory, Dr. Jenner took material from a cowpox sore on milkmaid Sarah Nelmes’ hand and inoculated it into the arm of James Phipps, the 9-year-old son of Jenner’s gardener. Months later, Jenner exposed Phipps several times to variola virus, but Phipps never developed smallpox. More experiments followed, and, in 1801, Jenner published his treatise “On the Origin of the Vaccine Inoculation.” In this work, he summarized his discoveries and expressed hope that “the annihilation of the smallpox, the most dreadful scourge of the human species, must be the final result of this practice.”

Vaccination became widely accepted and gradually replaced the practice of variolation. At some point in the 1800s, the virus used to make the smallpox vaccine changed from cowpox to vaccinia virus.

What an astonishingly informed post.

I salute you.

 

[bamberfishcake]

Small pox was eradicated by a collaborative global vaccination programme led by the World Health Organization.


Historically, the small pox vaccine has been effective in preventing smallpox infection in 95% of those vaccinated. In addition, the vaccine was proven to prevent or substantially lessen infection when given within a few days after a person was exposed to the variola virus.

One of the first methods for controlling smallpox was variolation, a process named after the virus that causes smallpox (variola virus). During variolation, people who had never had smallpox were exposed to material from smallpox sores (pustules) by scratching the material into their arm or inhaling it through the nose. After variolation, people usually developed the symptoms associated with smallpox, such as fever and a rash. However, fewer people died from variolation than if they had acquired smallpox naturally.

The basis for vaccination began in 1796 when the English doctor Edward Jenner noticed that milkmaids who had gotten cowpox were protected from smallpox. Jenner also knew about variolation and guessed that exposure to cowpox could be used to protect against smallpox. To test his theory, Dr. Jenner took material from a cowpox sore on milkmaid Sarah Nelmes’ hand and inoculated it into the arm of James Phipps, the 9-year-old son of Jenner’s gardener. Months later, Jenner exposed Phipps several times to variola virus, but Phipps never developed smallpox. More experiments followed, and, in 1801, Jenner published his treatise “On the Origin of the Vaccine Inoculation.” In this work, he summarized his discoveries and expressed hope that “the annihilation of the smallpox, the most dreadful scourge of the human species, must be the final result of this practice.”

Vaccination became widely accepted and gradually replaced the practice of variolation. At some point in the 1800s, the virus used to make the smallpox vaccine changed from cowpox to vaccinia virus.

Was talking to my neighbour about this the other day.

Apparently, that's how English ladies became known to have beautiful skin.

Fascinating story, another interesting one is about John Snow (not the character from GOT) who realised the Cholera outbreak was coming from an unsanitary water pump on Broad St in London after noticing that none of the workers in the nearby Broad Street brewery contracted cholera because of their daily allowance of beer - something to do with the brewing process that boiled out the disease.

Wikipedia explains it much better than I ever could:

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Those were the days when people worked for recognition and is a good example of why medicine does not work when monetary gain is the focus, like nowadays.

 

[mack341]

Dr John Campbell off youtube is convinced the medical staff giving the vaccine should aspirate the injection, to make sure they haven't hit a blood vessel, and then inject. He strongly believes it's contributing to the side effects rate, esp heart inflammation.

 

[bamberfishcake]

Dr John Campbell off youtube is convinced the medical staff giving the vaccine should aspirate the injection, to make sure they haven't hit a blood vessel, and then inject. He strongly believes it's contributing to the side effects rate, esp heart inflammation.

I also watched this. I don't understand why they stopped doing it.

Its been standard medical practice for years and still is in most parts of the world with minuscule risk.

 

[geordiecolin]

As if we didn't know already

View attachment 162301

So when you have Bungles the Clown in charge, pessimistic SAGE soothsayers, Big Pharma & a reinvigorated Media all combining to make the perfect storm, you have 'this'.

But remember, three weeks to flatten the curve, Hands, Face, Space and of course 'Save Granny'

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And who funds the LSHTH?

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.

 

[geordiecolin]

You have got to trust in a guy who's eyebrows stretch all of the way to his ears

 

[mack341]

You have got to trust in a guy who's eyebrows stretch all of the way to his ears

I've fallen in love with Geert No, he's a good guy I think. Two interesting things though, if omicron is milder/less dangerous then his doom theories could be wrong, and he never mentions the virus origins, or gain of function, which may play a big part in how it mutates/evolves.

 

[geordiecolin]

I've fallen in love with Geert No, he's a good guy I think. Two interesting things though, if omicron is milder/less dangerous then his doom theories could be wrong, and he never mentions the virus origins, or gain of function, which may play a big part in how it mutates/evolves.

I don't fully get the gobbledegook. I can't concentrate on what Geert is saying due to checking out his extended eyebrows

 

[mack341]

From yesterday's news:

Professor Ravi Gupta tells Sky News that studies have suggested the virus has "kind of altered the way it infects cells"

 

[dionysus]

remember people, delta and omicron make......media control.
but..also, cilantro mode; sure as sh!t a big global ploy by the spice industry to keep you home cooking

 

[geordiecolin]

From yesterday's news:

Professor Ravi Gupta tells Sky News that studies have suggested the virus has "kind of altered the way it infects cells"

I think I have found the next Mrs Geordie.
Trump is really splitting the MAGA vote with his "Legacy"

 

[mack341]

I think I have found the next Mrs Geordie.

I challenge you to a duel

 

[geordiecolin]

I challenge you to a duel

Maybe she would like a duel

 

[bamberfishcake]

I've fallen in love with Geert No, he's a good guy I think. Two interesting things though, if omicron is milder/less dangerous then his doom theories could be wrong, and he never mentions the virus origins, or gain of function, which may play a big part in how it mutates/evolves.

I've not read up on gain of function immunisation and have a limited understanding but he mentions it about 10 minutes in.

He says we are helping it gain function by being vaccinated?

 

[bamberfishcake]

eyebrows stretch all of the way to his ears

Damn you Geordie, I also cant concentrate on what he is saying now

 

[Kroffe]

Data from Sweden on hospitalisations due to Covid per 100k unvaccinated & vaccinated (2 jabs)

 

[geordiecolin]

Damn you Geordie, I also cant concentrate on what he is saying now

Was my intention

 

[geordiecolin]

Data from Sweden on hospitalisations due to Covid per 100k unvaccinated & vaccinated (2 jabs)


View attachment 162407

Anal covid Patienter sounds like a thing some will pay good money for around my way

 

[geordiecolin]

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[geordiecolin]

I hope that there is no travel lockdown after boxing day as my daughters are due to come stay



I understand that smokers are less likely to contract smoking. I started inhaling Cigars as a preventative!

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[geordiecolin]

I've not read up on gain of function immunisation and have a limited understanding but he mentions it about 10 minutes in.

He says we are helping it gain function by being vaccinated?

Is it wrong to pretend your fully vaxed on a scientists dating website hoping for a good gain of friction outcome?

 

[mack341]

I've not read up on gain of function immunisation and have a limited understanding but he mentions it about 10 minutes in.

He says we are helping it gain function by being vaccinated?

Gain of function is where scientists manipulate a virus in a lab, it was banned and then obama lifted the ban just before he left office. Geert vanden bossche has never referred to the origin of covid 19 afaik

 

[dealer wins]

Omicon, the NWO's worst nightmare. A delta infected person who also had a cold has produced a mutation that has made it significantly less lethal.

The odds must be in the tens of trillions for that single mutated virus particle being coughed out, and finding its way to another human, infecting them, and spreading it further and now becoming the dominant strain worldwide.

This is why the Johnson regime is trying their hardest to bring in lockdowns, vaccine passports now, because they know, due to a freak of nature, omicon will end this pandemic in the UK within weeks, and worldwide within months. Thank you mother nature.

I hope I am right and feel I am.

We are still in the shit though, the economy is damaged beyond repair and will crash soon, and the vaccinated will start dying and getting cancers, autoimmune diseases, brain diseases and a multitude of other fatal conditions in their millions over the coming months and years, which will overwhelm the NHS even if we still manage to afford it.

Very grim times are coming.

Merry Christmas all

 

[Kroffe]

And as usual, no response to replies to the last troll post.
Just make a new troll post, baiting responses.

Getting old, Dealer.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

And as usual, no response to replies to the last troll post.
Just make a new troll post, baiting responses.

Getting old, Dealer.

I can only think that some people have far too much time on their hands and/or lead very boring lives.

 

[dealer wins]

And as usual, no response to replies to the last troll post.
Just make a new troll post, baiting responses.

Getting old, Dealer.

So is being threatened, incentivised, lied to, demonised, discriminated against, segregated, punished etc for making an informed decision not to get a clot shot mate. Be careful what you comply with mate, because this is akin to Nazi Germany, but this time its not the Jews being poisoned!!

 

[Kroffe]

So is being threatened, incentivised, lied to, demonised, discriminated against, segregated, punished etc for making an informed decision not to get a clot shot mate. Be careful what you comply with mate, because this is akin to Nazi Germany, but this time its not the Jews being poisoned!!

Looking at what you deem to be 'proof beyond any doubt' im not sure i would call it an 'informed decision'

And you are literally saying you hope you are right about billions of people dying within 5 years.
If you are not trolling you should seek some help, its not normal to think like that.

 

[bamberfishcake]

Times like this I miss @colinsunderland

He was a helpful and considerate member of the CM community.

@dealer wins please be more mindful of your comments when posting. I am guilty of impulse posting but you take the biscuit with that one. Did you even pause for thought when writing that? Maybe you don't have two brain cells to rub together to muster one.

The vaccines, or virus, do not consider race, colour or sexual preference like Hitler and his cronies did and even if you were found to be half right, I don't think gloating like that will win any friends. Did you have a bad day on the slots or something?

 

[sufferinsilence]

Interesting thread from Prof. Balloux

 

[justdoit]

wtf

 

[Webzcas]

According to this article

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those that received two vaccine injections and who have also been infected with Covid, now have 'Super Immunity' against Omicron!

But people who've had it AND been jabbed have incredible 'super immunity

I am now from this point onwards wearing red pants over my blue trousers and I also tend to wear a red cape now when out and about

 

[bamberfishcake]

We can only hope that some do have super immunity. Good luck to all.

 

[goatwack]

Wearing pants on the outside is nothing new, been doing that for years. Sure, the pants aren't quite like Superman's and a bit skiddy, but it's perfect for when you want to follow those social distance guidelines ?

Also doubles up as a face covering, where the only thing I'll be breathing in is a week's groin-waft. Omicron's scared of me, the bitch

Merry Christmas everybody