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You still haven't said in which post you told us they had refunded your deposits.
Confiscated winnings
- Thread starter Sajsan12
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I just said they haven’t returned all my deposits, last we talked about that I hadn’t got any back.
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Interesting thread and to the OP i wish you the best and cast no judgement on you as i dont know you or have not walked in your shoes.
If I have this correct, you volunteered a chat from another casino in the hope if getting through verification a little quicker? smoother? maybe give a sense of security to whoever was looking at the hope of skipping through the system? These are my thoughts as to why you would do that.
Why would you volunteer a previous chat at a different casino. Sounds a bit fishy to me. Like your going over the top. Especially from somebody who claims to know nothing about gambling yet you knew Hyper were part of the same group as Yeti. If you did it to make things go smoother that would imply to me that you are familiar with online casino processes.
Just my thoughts. My gut feeling says something is up.
I actually wanted to post about the ethics of somebody having deposits returned. Arguably, if it could be proven they did try and fiddle the system regardless of their addiction/sickness I dont see how giving them the deposit back is helping or even ethical. Addicts will continue as long as they have the resources, sometimes rock bottom is whats required for change.
If I have this correct, you volunteered a chat from another casino in the hope if getting through verification a little quicker? smoother? maybe give a sense of security to whoever was looking at the hope of skipping through the system? These are my thoughts as to why you would do that.
Why would you volunteer a previous chat at a different casino. Sounds a bit fishy to me. Like your going over the top. Especially from somebody who claims to know nothing about gambling yet you knew Hyper were part of the same group as Yeti. If you did it to make things go smoother that would imply to me that you are familiar with online casino processes.
Just my thoughts. My gut feeling says something is up.
I actually wanted to post about the ethics of somebody having deposits returned. Arguably, if it could be proven they did try and fiddle the system regardless of their addiction/sickness I dont see how giving them the deposit back is helping or even ethical. Addicts will continue as long as they have the resources, sometimes rock bottom is whats required for change.
No. I was asking many casinos beforehand if it was okay to use a third party card, from a joint account, because this was and is the only payment method I could use.
At that point, if I remember correctly, not 100% sure about the timeline, I gambled on another casino, then I was unlucky, lost and opened first a account at no bonus casino? And then yeti.
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But why would you send a transcript from Hyper to Yeti? May be the same license but still different casino's. Did you play at Hyper after asking those questions, and if so how much did you deposit?
The Swedish SGA (
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) have all licenses and what casinos and domains they use. That has nothing to do with what I know or don’t know about gambling. Maybe I haven’t gambled for long, but I’m not retarded.I never gambled at hyper.
They are on SGAs site listed under the same license.
I talked about it this in the chat with yeti aswell before making a withdrawal request, where they say after I was asking that
“then it shouldn’t be a problem, of course we understand that partners sometimes have a joint account”
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Curios...... you asked all the questions about depositing, about the SE and yet you didnt play, and 2 weeks later you sign up at a sister site and play. That looks like a complete set-up to me, laying the groundwork at Hyper and then trying it out at Yeti.
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Yeah this has been a scam from start to finish, I think you are lucky to have had your deposits returned, as it comes across as fraud to me.
Have you used the Swedish ADR yet? If not, why not?
Have you used the Swedish ADR yet? If not, why not?
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So, what happens now? Are you going to take this case to court? If you believe you are in your right and want this money asap, that's what I would do, not making endless posts in a gambling forum.
Okay. I asked that only because I was unable to log on at hyper.
Jan can probably confirm this.
I was gambling at I think it was no bonus casino first, lost my deposits and tried my luck at yeti and won.
(If it would have been as you all seem to claim, why wouldn’t I ask no bonus casino for a refund???!)
But sure, you are free to believe whatever you like.
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Why didnt you ask the same questions at No Bonus and Yeti? Is the 9000 they are returning your deposits from No Bonus?
because they are the same company, same license?
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But you are, you are complaining you didn't get deposits refunded, but you have had your yeti (and nobonus it seems) deposits refunded?
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Same company, same license, different casino's. Strange you asked all the questions at the casino you couldnt log in to, get the answers you wanted then didnt ask them why you couldnt log in to the account and play???
Court no. I will send it to ARN. If I’m wrong I’m wrong. I thought I did everything I could to avoid anything like this to happen.
Like I said before, I have used this deposit method before and lost maybe 50k SEK. I say it again. I NEVER EVER asked for a refund. I lost MY money, from MY account. The only thing is my partners name is on the card. And clearly she has a SE. What I didn’t know shit about.
Not complaining. Really don’t give a shit about 9000.
Jan said they returned my deposits, I answered that they didn’t.
The deposits returned is 10200SEK from yeti.
I did ask them that. If I remember correctly they just told me to try again.
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But doesnt one of your posts say you asked at Hyper if you had an exclusion, so obviously you are aware the implications of having an exclusion.
I have to agree with @harrybkk and @colinsunderland that it looks like a scam from start to finish.
Where is the additional 9000 that they are going to refund coming from?
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And obviously you didnt want to try again??? You just decided to wait a few weeks and go on to Yeti.....
Hm, who said I didn’t try again???
Again, if I remember things right, it still didn’t work to log on to hyper for some reason.
AGAIN. Because I wasn’t able to log on to HYPER.
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If I can't log in to a site I ask the question why, especially when i go to the trouble of asking if they accept a card in someone elses name and if there is an exclusion in place. And if they say try again and it doesnt work i ask them why again, until i find out why i cant log in.
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So there's 9000SEK stuck on Hyper where you can't login anymore? Honestly, this is very confusing.
Okay? And I didn’t.
Like I said.
Everyone of you are free to believe whatever you like. I know myself, I know what I did and didn’t do.
The only thing I did was gamble with my own money, lost my own money. Gambled again, and won.
It’s fine that you part with the casino, I can understand your point of view.
The thing is that you forget that’s a human on the other side.
especially you @Harry_BKK, think I never got that hurt from someone I don’t know, let alone some random dude online.
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If you haven't been gambling long, firstly why would you have excluded anywhere, secondly, surely you would remember if you had, and thirdly, why are you opening new accounts if you have a gambling problem?
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I honestly think most of us are trying to understand what's going on here rather than siding with you or the casino. Perhaps it would be best if you, like Jan did earlier today, would bundle everything in 1 clear post without leaving stuff out. After all today we've learned a couple of new things in your case vs Yeti Casino.
No. I never gambled on hyper because I was unable to log on.
Before I gambled at Yeti I gambled on nobonus casino where I made deposits and lost them. I never asked for ANY deposits back. The casino told me they would refund them, but they haven’t. I really don’t care about those 9000. I lost them.
Even if @Harry_BKK says something else, I have a very good income and no money related problems at all.
I will provide Harry with a copy of my income if he’s interested.
1 and 2. That was a question only because I was unable to log in.
3. I don’t have any gambling related problems at all.
This hurts me more than you can imagine, being accused for all kinds of crap.
Can we please just await Jan’s reply that I didn’t lie about the returns of the deposits and then please close this thread.
This was never my intention, I never thought I would get in this much trouble for gambling. Again with my own money, on my own personal casino account. With a card I asked if it was okay to use.
I know today that I didn’t have all the information about my partner or the card, and yes, I still kinda believe that the verification with BankID is enough proof to validate that it was actually me gambling. I know that because no one else have access to it. And yes, I still have that as a argument because it’s regulated in the Swedish law. SGA also confirmed that BankID is the most established and safe way to prove someone’s identity.
That’s all I can say.
Edit: Yes, I been writing a lot in this thread, repeating myself. All out of frustration. Because this havent been and still isnt a pleasant thing to handle.
The money is one thing, it’s a lot, but not life changing in a way.
Yes, I made big deposits and gambled with high stakes because I can afford it. So take in consideration that I made deposits of ~20k. Then the actual win isn’t that big.
Can we please just await Jan’s reply that I didn’t lie about the returns of the deposits and then please close this thread.
This was never my intention, I never thought I would get in this much trouble for gambling. Again with my own money, on my own personal casino account. With a card I asked if it was okay to use.
I know today that I didn’t have all the information about my partner or the card, and yes, I still kinda believe that the verification with BankID is enough proof to validate that it was actually me gambling. I know that because no one else have access to it. And yes, I still have that as a argument because it’s regulated in the Swedish law. SGA also confirmed that BankID is the most established and safe way to prove someone’s identity.
That’s all I can say.
Edit: Yes, I been writing a lot in this thread, repeating myself. All out of frustration. Because this havent been and still isnt a pleasant thing to handle.
The money is one thing, it’s a lot, but not life changing in a way.
Yes, I made big deposits and gambled with high stakes because I can afford it. So take in consideration that I made deposits of ~20k. Then the actual win isn’t that big.
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If I were you, I would be less concerned about other peoples' comments than the 300,000 SEK not being paid because you used someone else's card. Okay, you're taking steps, but explaining over and over what happened or not won't get you your winnings.
You now seem to downplay your winnings, as they're not so big compared to the deposits you made. This confuses me. Do you really think it's more important to convince others than getting your winnings?
You now seem to downplay your winnings, as they're not so big compared to the deposits you made. This confuses me. Do you really think it's more important to convince others than getting your winnings?
No, I think I just tried to make people understand me in some way. Tried to justify everything. Tried to be more clear and show somehow that I didn’t try to scam the casino in any way.
Anyone who been accused for lying when they’re not knows it’s the most terrible and most frustrating feeling in the world. Especially when everything you say is turned against you.
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Actually, as long as I would get my winnings, I wouldn't care if people believe me or not. I'd go to court to get what I believe is rightfully mine - in this scenario that would be the only thing that matters imo.
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@Sajsan12 You forgot or oversaw my repeated part "I would be happily proven wrong".
First, you haven't answered anything from my post, except for the convenient part regarding "cards" and "card".
Second, Jan checked your gameplay and it was similar to the "partner" that self-excluded. That gives it all away I'm afraid. You would be surprised what kind of things the operators can analyze. It goes as far that they could tell if you use an auto-clicker.
Third, you said your partner has not excluded for gambling reasons. According to the excerpt from the chat your partner had with L&L, she had very serious gambling problems.
Fourth, taking note of the above, I am flabbergasted that your "partner" knew she/he is excluded at L&L and simply lets you use the card in her name. And that at multiple casinos from the group. Which raises the next red flag as this was IMO part of your "insurance". Deposit & lose - ask for deposits back, deposit&win - get paid, if casino refuses, you have a trail of "positive" evidence that L&L allowed you to use the card. I can tell you, this trick is very old and has been used countless times.
That you have not asked for refunds so far is because the plan was to sign up and play at all casinos in the group before hitting them with the "refund request". Play at more, more "risk-free" chances to gamble.
Fifth, a good income and credit score is no proof that you don't have a gambling problem. I was making 100s of thousands a year in my high time around the year 2000. My credit rating was so good that Lufthansa gave me a Senator Visa Card with a EUR40,000 credit limit, that was my sixth credit card at the time. Yet I was still gambling like there is no tomorrow and doing stuff I shouldn't. When my credit score eventually started tanking, I employed a specialized consultant company to repair it. Worked a treat. Hence, you showing income and credit score is no indication of your addiction status.
Sixth, you were offered on multiple occasions to open a PAB in which case this would have been discussed in private on your behalf (without us posting our opinions which apparently are hurting you) and all evidence would have been presented. You chose to ignore it and not only omitted important parts of your story but keep repeating: "my account, my BankID etc" . Especially you repeating over and over that BankID as being so safe is for me another red flag.
IMO, it is one of the main parts of the "insurance plan". And I venture as far as saying that you and "your partner" are in this together.
Seventh, the POGG, who is known just as CM to be an advocate for players, looked at your case and decided in favour of the casino.
I have not read your PM yet and I am not sure that I want to be drawn in any deeper into your case. Will think about it and maybe read it later. But as of now, I have not seen anything new that changes my opinion
First, you haven't answered anything from my post, except for the convenient part regarding "cards" and "card".
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Second, Jan checked your gameplay and it was similar to the "partner" that self-excluded. That gives it all away I'm afraid. You would be surprised what kind of things the operators can analyze. It goes as far that they could tell if you use an auto-clicker.
Third, you said your partner has not excluded for gambling reasons. According to the excerpt from the chat your partner had with L&L, she had very serious gambling problems.
Fourth, taking note of the above, I am flabbergasted that your "partner" knew she/he is excluded at L&L and simply lets you use the card in her name. And that at multiple casinos from the group. Which raises the next red flag as this was IMO part of your "insurance". Deposit & lose - ask for deposits back, deposit&win - get paid, if casino refuses, you have a trail of "positive" evidence that L&L allowed you to use the card. I can tell you, this trick is very old and has been used countless times.
That you have not asked for refunds so far is because the plan was to sign up and play at all casinos in the group before hitting them with the "refund request". Play at more, more "risk-free" chances to gamble.
Fifth, a good income and credit score is no proof that you don't have a gambling problem. I was making 100s of thousands a year in my high time around the year 2000. My credit rating was so good that Lufthansa gave me a Senator Visa Card with a EUR40,000 credit limit, that was my sixth credit card at the time. Yet I was still gambling like there is no tomorrow and doing stuff I shouldn't. When my credit score eventually started tanking, I employed a specialized consultant company to repair it. Worked a treat. Hence, you showing income and credit score is no indication of your addiction status.
Sixth, you were offered on multiple occasions to open a PAB in which case this would have been discussed in private on your behalf (without us posting our opinions which apparently are hurting you) and all evidence would have been presented. You chose to ignore it and not only omitted important parts of your story but keep repeating: "my account, my BankID etc" . Especially you repeating over and over that BankID as being so safe is for me another red flag.
IMO, it is one of the main parts of the "insurance plan". And I venture as far as saying that you and "your partner" are in this together.
Seventh, the POGG, who is known just as CM to be an advocate for players, looked at your case and decided in favour of the casino.
I have not read your PM yet and I am not sure that I want to be drawn in any deeper into your case. Will think about it and maybe read it later. But as of now, I have not seen anything new that changes my opinion
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Whenever I've used my debit card at a casino for the first time I'm pretty sure I have to enter the name written on the front of the card, does the casino's system [not just L & L's] automatically pick this name up and check it against the excluded player database?
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Nope, AFAIK the current payment systems compare primarily number, expiry date and CVV number. A casino would not see the name on the card until you submit a copy for verification.
You can check your receipts when you pay with your card in a shop. It does not print your name on the receipt.
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Just opened Youtube and got this on my random feed. What are the odds? 
EDIT: I might add, the name is a Discord nick, an app that is very popular among gamers because it virtually guarantees anonymity. You can create private chat rooms, dedicated groups etc.
I remember using something similar in my "syndicate" days to exchange info and read up on the latest "glitches to exploit" and "scam ideas". Not saying the OP is doing that or that the account even belongs to him, it is just that such apps are used exactly by that kind of groups. The pic for his avatar might be just a generic one from the web.
EDIT: I might add, the name is a Discord nick, an app that is very popular among gamers because it virtually guarantees anonymity. You can create private chat rooms, dedicated groups etc.
I remember using something similar in my "syndicate" days to exchange info and read up on the latest "glitches to exploit" and "scam ideas". Not saying the OP is doing that or that the account even belongs to him, it is just that such apps are used exactly by that kind of groups. The pic for his avatar might be just a generic one from the web.
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That seems a shame, so in this case the op enters his name when opening the account but when registering the card which has a different name, the system cannot automatically pick that up.
I think Jan said they've now blocked the use of joint cards from sweden but maybe this rule ought to be applied everywhere [not just for sweden] by all casinos.
Otherwise it's bound to cause problems down the line for casinos and people in relationships where one is a gambler; or an SE gambler if the automated system can't pick this up and it only get's picked up later in a manual, deeper check after the gambling has taken place, losses or wins.
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@Harry_BKK
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Whatever the situation was the OP got his deposits back and that's fair enough. I personally think it's just as unethical as the situation you portrayed. It doesnt matter if you won 10 sek or a million .. you could never guessed the outcome with playing and therefore the casino didn't do anything wrong to you. You should've checked it better yourself.
Your actually sketching a bad example of players who truly were SE and made a genuine mistake.
By returning your deposits there's no harm done and it seems to me that the case is closed.
I find it outstanding that Jan took time to look into your query and it acknowledged the community of online gaming were Casinomeister stands for; genuine complaints, questions and sharing gaming experiences.
I wish everyone a good weekend!
Sincerely Skephan
Your actually sketching a bad example of players who truly were SE and made a genuine mistake.
By returning your deposits there's no harm done and it seems to me that the case is closed.
I find it outstanding that Jan took time to look into your query and it acknowledged the community of online gaming were Casinomeister stands for; genuine complaints, questions and sharing gaming experiences.
I wish everyone a good weekend!
Sincerely Skephan
1. Because it’s all nonsense.
2. I don’t understand what he means with “gameplay”. Is it what slots I played? If I remember correctly I played most novomatic slots, that was the reason I chose this casino from the start. If my partner gambled and what slots she played years ago, that I cant and don’t know anything about.
3. 4. Until this day, my partner haven’t told me about any gambling related problems. So I don’t know what to believe here.
5. Maybe not, but a person with a serious gambling addiction would, as you say, probably be in serious debt, which you accused me for to have. I can easily prove both income and credit rating to you which clearly shows that none of the things mentioned above is true.
I have credit cards with no limitations (easily proven) why wouldn’t I have used this do gamble? Because I don’t gamble on credit. I used my own money.
6. Yes, things hurt me. And like I said, I don’t know much about this because I never came across trouble while gambling. I clearly don’t know which steps to take, in which order.
7. The POGGs final reply was
“We are not the ADR for this operator for Swedish players. The Swedish regulator has it's own system. You should follow the advice provided to you by the regulator.
Thanks,
ThePOGG”
Again, this is nothing that’s “part of a plan”. Again please tell me how I’ve been gambling with the same deposit method for u think at least 12 months (not been gambling a lot, but when I did I used this card) but never requested a deposit refund if the things you said would be true?
Should I have gone that far to on different casinos, different licenses, lose a lot and continue playing because “maybe I win sometime”. As I said before, the win itself isn’t that big compared to the deposit. A gambling addict would have continued playing and probably lost everything anyway?
I know my GF gambled, we talked about that now. But that she had a SE is something she says isn’t because of any addiction.
Again, this is all just assumptions from your side. That’s why I think you’re being unfair.
Just keep in mind that, whatever you like to believe, MAYBE I’m telling the truth?
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I should have checked it better myself? I did with all the information I had at that point - it’s not the first time I used this card!
I don’t understand what you guys are referring to by saying that... Because for real.... tell me one thing.
What you suggest is that I should go back to every casino where I used this card, say that my partner (who’s name is on the card I asked to use) apparently have had a gambling problem (?) years ago and demand them to return my losses?
Wtf is that even. I gambled for my own money and lost. I’m not an idiot!!!
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This is the bit I dont understand. What drove you to ask if you had exclusions in place at Hyper and whether you could deposit with a partner card? Did you have that conversation with every single casino you joined or was this just a random thought that you wanted to check out?
To me the fact that you are asking these questions, then not playing at the site, is laying the groundwork for something else.....
That was not the case. As I explained before, I asked that question to hyper because I was unable to log in. It didn’t work. And i tried again and again and still didn’t work. At that point I, if I remember correctly chose to not gamble at all that day.
The questions about the joint bankaccount and the card issued in my partners name was asked through chat or email on all the casinos (edit: I mean licenses) I gambled at.
Because the SGA site have a really good View of which casinos operate under the same license I didn’t ask all the casinos this question.
but as far as I understand when looking back - NOW (as we speak) - I asked yeti the same question, this is mentioned in the chat when we talked about it afterwards, but the casino can’t find it and asks ”did you use another email in chat?” And I answer that maybe I did (or maybe spelled email wrong, I don’t know)
Then they say again after I explained that “then it shouldn’t be a problem, we do understand that some partners have joint accounts”
Can someone please answer this:
What you suggest is that I should go back to every casino where I used this card, say that my partner (who’s name is on the card I asked to use) apparently have had a gambling problem (?) years ago and demand them to return my losses?
This, to me, when knowing what actually happened is insane.
What you suggest is that I should go back to every casino where I used this card, say that my partner (who’s name is on the card I asked to use) apparently have had a gambling problem (?) years ago and demand them to return my losses?
This, to me, when knowing what actually happened is insane.
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1. If all inconvenient questions are "nonsense" then that is your prerogative. I only analyze your posts which leads to those questions.
2. Gameplay = what slots, what bet sizes, what risks you take by gambling wins autoplay/manual spin, how much and how often you deposit and about another million criteria all go into player profiling. There are simply no two players the same. It is a pure analysis which is very, very rarely wrong.
3. That is a miracle. She spoke to L&L just over a year ago. Go back and read the date Jan posted. I would say that is not years ago, it is rather recent .
5. I didn't accuse you of having debt. It is a general thing for heavy addicts to be in debt. However, as I said, income and credit score are not the sole indicators on how addicted a person is.
6. Following our advice at the beginning would have spared you all the hurt. You decided not to.
7. @ThePOGG in his first reply
You might be indeed a "newbie" who got into this mess but I (can't say for others) have yet to see a case like yours which turned out to be a"honest" mistake.
So you talked to your GF. Did you ask her why she told L&L support that she has a "very bad gambling addiction"?
Of course my posts are my opionions or assumptions as you say. I can only look at your posts and don't have access to the L&L information. My answers are written based on my gambling experience over 20 years, not that I am particularly proud of it.
And again, I stated in virtually every post that I'll happily be proven wrong but reading your last few posts did not show anything new.
This is my side of the story, summarized for those who asked:
I can’t use the card issued in my name for casino transactions (work related reason).
After that I got an email saying they confiscated my winnings because they would violate the Swedish gambling law if they paid me.
I contacted SGA asking about this and they told me there is no such paragraph in the law.
Then they told me it was because they can’t prove that it was me playing.
Therefore my argumentation about BankID. That BankID is regulated by law.
Had a long phone call with SGA about the matter where they confirmed that the casino wouldn’t violate any law if paying my winnings and that BankID is the most established and safe method to prove someone’s identity.
That’s it. And here we are.
I can’t use the card issued in my name for casino transactions (work related reason).
- I have a joint account with my girlfriend that we use for online transactions.
- I asked the casino (in this case yeti (clearly with another or misspelled email) and hyper) if it was okay to use this card. (At this point I didn’t know anything about a SE)
- I got the answer that it was.
- I opened an account with that in mind using BankID.
- I gambled, and lost at no bonus casino.
- I gambled, lost my first deposits, made some more and won on yeti.
- I was asked to send in KYC-documents and at that point again talked to the casino about the joint account m and card (account can be issued in two names, cards not, and because we only use it for online transactions there’s been no need to pay for a extra card) and because I didn’t saved the previous chats from yeti I provided them with the chat from hyper.
- Got again the information that “then it shouldn’t be a problem, we understand that partners sometimes have joint accounts”
- I sent them my partners ID, a copy of the card and a bank statement showing both our names. And the authorization form.
- So far, nothing’s wrong.
- Then they ask for a copy to show my partners address and if I have a bankaccount in my name only where they can pay my win.
After that I got an email saying they confiscated my winnings because they would violate the Swedish gambling law if they paid me.
I contacted SGA asking about this and they told me there is no such paragraph in the law.
Then they told me it was because they can’t prove that it was me playing.
Therefore my argumentation about BankID. That BankID is regulated by law.
Had a long phone call with SGA about the matter where they confirmed that the casino wouldn’t violate any law if paying my winnings and that BankID is the most established and safe method to prove someone’s identity.
That’s it. And here we are.
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It might not violate a law to pay you. It would violate responsible gaming regulations. They’re going to err on the side of caution to protect themselves as the fines for not doing so are massive.
Chalk this down to experience. Don’t use someone else’s card to play. Whether it’s a shared account or not.
If you can’t use your own account for gaming for work reasons, open another bank account solely in your name for gaming.
Chalk this down to experience. Don’t use someone else’s card to play. Whether it’s a shared account or not.
If you can’t use your own account for gaming for work reasons, open another bank account solely in your name for gaming.
Point is that we are discussing an individual case here, but the events of registering with BankID from a person not on the national self exclusion system / not SE'ed within our casinos and after use a card of a person who is. Due to the increase of these events we have stopped allowing it.
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