Confiscated winnings

[samdog21]

question they swallowed up your deposit np right but when comes time to pay all the bullshit flys like shit to a blanket. If I join a new casino thanks to all the people at meister I verified first before deposit a dime and make them send me confirmation iam fully verified.

 

[Jasminebed]

Depositing from a joint account is taboo at a lot of casinos, even without a self exclusion issue. So I find it reasonable for you to ask.

Swedish regulations are very strict, so I think it will boil down to that, and I'm no expert.

I will say that Jan is one of the most player friendly reps I've seen over my past decade here.

If he can help you without putting their license or fines at risk, I'm sure he will.

I strongly suggest going forward you deposit from an account in your name only.

 

[Sajsan12]

question they swallowed up your deposit np right but when comes time to pay all the bullshit flys like shit to a blanket. If I join a new casino thanks to all the people at meister I verified first before deposit a dime and make them send me confirmation iam fully verified.

Yeah sure thing. I wish I did that aswell. If the CS would have mentioned that It could somehow be a problem I wouldn’t used that card.

 

[Sajsan12]

Depositing from a joint account is taboo at a lot of casinos, even without a self exclusion issue. So I find it reasonable for you to ask.

Swedish regulations are very strict, so I think it will boil down to that, and I'm no expert.

I will say that Jan is one of the most player friendly reps I've seen over my past decade here.

If he can help you without putting their license or fines at risk, I'm sure he will.

I strongly suggest going forward you deposit from an account in your name only.

Yes, surely this won’t happen again. I won’t risk it again.
I really thought I was safe using that card after asking multiple times if it was okay. I even got the document for my partner to sign, as you can see in the initial post. Could never imagine this outcome when I did everything right.

 

[EkJR]

So why did the casino not do further checks at the point the OP made them aware of the situation with the debit card? Why only after he won has this suddenly become a problem? See faults on both sides but particularly with the casinos actions here. I am 99.9999% sure the casino would have said nothing had the player lost.

 

[Sajsan12]

So why did the casino not do further checks at the point the OP made them aware of the situation with the debit card? Why only after he won has this suddenly become a problem? See faults on both sides but particularly with the casinos actions here. I am 99.9999% sure the casino would have said nothing had the player lost.

The casino haven’t mentioned the deposits I made with the same card on the other casinos under this license. So yes, I guess you’re right.

 

[thr0b]

@colinsunderland you misunderstood me. We only have one card to our shared account and it happens to be in her name.

We do have our personal accounts and cards aswell, but we only use this card for online purchases and other “fun” things. I made sure beforehand, as I mentioned before, that it wouldn’t be a problem using this card. So don’t blame me for that. I did everything i possibly could.

then it’s not a shared account, but her account surely? In which case, you’re buggered.

 

[Harry_BKK]

then it’s not a shared account, but her account surely? In which case, you’re buggered.

@colinsunderland you misunderstood me. We only have one card to our shared account and it happens to be in her name.

We do have our personal accounts and cards aswell, but we only use this card for online purchases and other “fun” things. I made sure beforehand, as I mentioned before, that it wouldn’t be a problem using this card. So don’t blame me for that. I did everything i possibly could.

This is becoming more bizarre and entangled with every post.

So you have a shared account, but it is only in your partner's name? As Dan said, that is not a shared account. How is a casino to believe that? For all they know, you could be using the card without her knowledge. Signatures on a form are easy to forge.

As I said, I will wait for Jan to come back with his info because it starts to sound really strange.

And in your last post, you mentioned that you have more accounts within this group. Which casinos? Did you use the same registration details and the "shared card"? Did you submit the form to them too? Did you make any successful withdrawals from the other siteS?

 

[Sajsan12]

then it’s not a shared account, but her account surely? In which case, you’re buggered.

You’re wrong. The account is shared. We both have our SSNs on the bank statement. We just happen to have only one card linked to it. But you’re missing the point... The casino already cleared me using the card. It’s about my partners SE.

quoting slotter999

“I never seen a single line in any regulation which states funds from a shared bank account where one person is self excluded means all bets must be void. Is this even stated anywhere in their own terms and conditions?”

 

[Sajsan12]

This is becoming more bizarre and entangled with every post.

So you have a shared account, but it is only in your partner's name? As Dan said, that is not a shared account. How is a casino to believe that? For all they know, you could be using the card without her knowledge. Signatures on a form are easy to forge.

As I said, I will wait for Jan to come back with his info because it starts sounding really strange.

Then you don’t read what I say properly. The account is shared. We only have one card linked to the account. The card is issued in her name.

And for the last time - the casino already told me it was fine to use this card. Check the intitial post!

 

[L&L-Jan]

Morning !

We have received an official complaint from topic starter so we will handle it from there. After the complaint is resolved, we can discuss what can be shared to in order to help the community here.

I've also received a PM and informed Sajsan that we will proceed with the submitted complaint first.

Kr. Jan

 

[Harry_BKK]

Then you don’t read what I say properly. The account is shared. We only have one card linked to the account. The card is issued in her name.

And for the last time - the casino already told me it was fine to use this card. Check the intitial post!

At no point did you tell the casino that your partner is SE-ed.

You only told them that it is a card in your partner's name which belongs to a shared account.

Once you handed in the signed form, they cross-checked and found the SE at which point, legally and from an RG point, the deposit was made by a SE-ed player (as the card is in her name). Even when she agreed that you can use the card. At that point, they acted according to the Swedish regulations and voided the winnings. I don't know how a deposited amount is handled under the Swedish licence (in the UK they return the deposit to the payment method used)

I don't know what to think but I sure hope you find a solution as I tend to side with a player. It just doesn't sound 100% kosher, to be honest.

 

[Sajsan12]

At no point did you tell the casino that your partner is SE-ed.

You only told them that it is a card in your partner's name which belongs to a shared account.

Once you handed in the signed form, they cross-checked and found the SE at which point, legally and from an RG point, the deposit was made by a SE-ed player (as the card is in her name). Even when she agreed that you can use the card. At that point, they acted according to the Swedish regulations and voided the winnings. I don't know how a deposited amount is handled under the Swedish licence (in the UK they return the deposit to the payment method used)

I don't know what to think but I sure hope you find a solution as I tend to side with a player. It just doesn't sound 100% kosher, to be honest.

I didn’t know that my girlfriend had a self exclusion! And she’s not self excluded due to any gambling related problems AT ALL.

I understand what you are saying. But no, the deposit wasn’t made of a self excluded player. I was the one making the deposit. Using my own, earned money, from my own account.

It’s not fair to state anything different than that.

Nowhere in the Swedish gambling law it says that the winnings will be voided in a case like this.

what would be the upside for me to use a card that is shared with someone whos self excluded!? Absolutely none. So please, don’t make it sound like I try to cheat the system. I’m not stupid.

 

[sueyh]

I'm looking forwards to hearing the outcome from Jan.

This is very strange story for sure.
The OP have a quite experience with online gambling for sure, judging from he contacted the live chat before he used the card that is not under his name, which means he knows it is risky if he uses the card that in under somebody's name.

I'm just wondering why he didn't bother to contact the bank to get another card on his name, it would been really easy process since the account is shared one. It would been much easier than he contacts the live chat every time he opens an account on an online casino.

Two cards with two different persons are not allowed in Sweden even though it is joint account?

 

[DoubleTree1962]

I think the casino voiding play is the right call.

 

[muziq]

I didn’t know that my girlfriend had a self exclusion! And she’s not self excluded due to any gambling related problems AT ALL.

I understand what you are saying. But no, the deposit wasn’t made of a self excluded player. I was the one making the deposit. Using my own, earned money, from my own account.

It’s not fair to state anything different than that.

Nowhere in the Swedish gambling law it says that the winnings will be voided in a case like this.

what would be the upside for me to use a card that is shared with someone whos self excluded!? Absolutely none. So please, don’t make it sound like I try to cheat the system. I’m not stupid.

if you filed a complaint via forum (PAB) then your not supposed to post any more till the issue is resolved
So please refrain yourself from replying till its solved

All the best for PAB

 

[Sajsan12]

I'm looking forwards to hearing the outcome from Jan.

This is very strange story for sure.
The OP have a quite experience with online gambling for sure, judging from he contacted the live chat before he used the card that is not under his name, which means he knows it is risky if he uses the card that in under somebody's name.

I'm just wondering why he didn't bother to contact the bank to get another card on his name, it would been really easy process since the account is shared one. It would been much easier than he contacts the live chat every time he opens an account on an online casino.

Two cards with two different persons are not allowed in Sweden even though it is joint account?

Me having another card or not is irrelevant in this case. Yes, that would have been better. But I didn’t and I, again, made sure to check it was okay to use the card beforehand.

 

[EkJR]

I think for the sake of the OP and Casino this thread should be locked for now @dunover @maxd

 

[maxd]

I think for the sake of the OP and Casino this thread should be locked for now @dunover @maxd

Sorry -- and please keep in mind that I haven't had time to read the thread yet -- but why would we do that?

 

[Harry_BKK]

I didn’t know that my girlfriend had a self exclusion! And she’s not self excluded due to any gambling related problems AT ALL.

I understand what you are saying. But no, the deposit wasn’t made of a self excluded player. I was the one making the deposit. Using my own, earned money, from my own account.

It’s not fair to state anything different than that.

Nowhere in the Swedish gambling law it says that the winnings will be voided in a case like this.

what would be the upside for me to use a card that is shared with someone whos self excluded!? Absolutely none. So please, don’t make it sound like I try to cheat the system. I’m not stupid.

So how does that work in Sweden?

Do they have Self-Exclusion just for fun and then a separate one for gambling-related problems?

Does the casino have the option to execute different SE's? Is Spelpaus offering that? I would be very surprised if that is the case.

And I don't make anything sound in any way. You said you didn't know she was SE-ed, so the card was good to go in your view.

I guess your partner filled out the form for allowing you to use the card. Latest at this point, any SE-ed player would have mentioned the SE because everyone knows that as a SE-ed player you can't deposit. OR if the deposit goes through that there is a high probability that winnings will not be paid.

Sorry, but your case just does not sound as innocent as you want it to come across.

 

[Sajsan12]

So how does that work in Sweden?

Do they have Self-Exclusion just for fun and then a separate one for gambling-related problems?

Does the casino have the option to execute different SE's? Is Spelpaus offering that? I would be very surprised if that is the case.

And I don't make anything sound in any way. You said you didn't know she was SE-ed, so the card was good to go in your view.

I guess your partner filled out the form for allowing you to use the card. Latest at this point, any SE-ed player would have mentioned the SE because everyone knows that as a SE-ed player you can't deposit. OR if the deposit goes through that there is a high probability that winnings will not be paid.

Sorry, but your case just does not sound as innocent as you want it to come across.

I won’t reply much more on this now. I contacted spelinspektionen (Swedish regulator) and they told me my girlfriends SE has nothing to do with this. They shouldnt even have checked that. The information i got is that the casino only should control the person playing, no one else. I logged in to my account using my personal ID, therefore the only one the casino should control is self excluded or not is me.

Their conclusion is that the casino did wrong who even checked my partners SE-status because I was the one gambling.
Keep in mind that this is the information i got from spelinspektionen, its not me saying it.

And yes, I gave spelinspektionen all the information. Didn’t leave anything out.

 

[Sajsan12]

Will post spelinspektionens answer here after the matter is solved. But first off I Will forward it to the casino.

 

[EkJR]

Sorry -- and please keep in mind that I haven't had time to read the thread yet -- but why would we do that?

Because it's now a complaint between the player and casino and, particularly the player, is likely to continue arguing the case.

 

[colinsunderland]

Threads don't usually get closed when a PAB or complaint is made.

 

[EkJR]

Threads don't usually get closed when a PAB or complaint is made.

Tbf, just trying to protect the player from himself!!

 

[Sajsan12]

Threads don't usually get closed when a PAB or complaint is made.

Tbf, just trying to protect the player from himself!!

If you read my latest post I have contacted the Swedish regulation, and from them got an answer I’m pleased with. Therefore I won’t argue or complain anymore regarding this because I no longer have a reason to do so. Will first off forward the answer to the casino.

I will update the thread with spelinspektionens answer when the matter is solved.

 

[colinsunderland]

Don't think theres much more to say tbh, he's made his position clear, and pretty much prevented Jan getting involved informally on here now he has made a proper complaint

 

[Gaz237]

Will post spelinspektionens answer here after the matter is solved. But first off I Will forward it to the casino.

I don't think you will like their answer, regardless of what you believe they have said.

Not a chance in hell of you getting paid winnings. Deposits back at best.

Makes no odds why your partner SE, the simple fact is she had, and you then used a card in her name to deposit (joint account or not) It was HER card, not YOURS, And she was SE'd, game over.

When the Casino said it was ok to use the card, obviously the SE never got flagged (or you sent the ID in later)

Would make a complete mockery of the SE system if the SE'd players card/details could just be used on a different account.

Utter madness.

 

[Sajsan12]

I don't think you will like their answer, regardless of what you believe they have said.

Not a chance in hell of you getting paid winnings. Deposits back at best.

Makes no odds why your partner SE, the simple fact is she had, and you then used a card in her name to deposit (joint account or not) It was HER card, not YOURS, And she was SE'd, game over.

When the Casino said it was ok to use the card, obviously the SE never got flagged (or you sent the ID in later)

Would make a complete mockery of the SE system if the SE'd players card/details could just be used on a different account.

Utter madness.

I won’t discuss this anymore. I got an answer from spelinspektionen after displaying all the facts and all the emails, correspondence with the casino.
Like I said, this is not my words. It’s what the team on the Swedish “spelinspektionen” told me.

All because I was logged in to my personal casino account using my personal BankID.

If I hadn’t logged in with BankID, that would be a totally different story.

Again, not my thoughts - only the information I got.

 

[DoubleTree1962]

A customer I know also did this. Basically his wife self excluded on gamstop. He used his wife card due to being mortgages payer. He couldn't be seen to gamble as the house was in his name.

His wife let him use her card. The man signed up to new casino. He was never contacted by casino he deposited over 30 times in the month. He made more withdrawal request after waiting for nearly a month he contacted the casino. They ask for the copy of card. He sent it and explained wife let him use it.

The customer reverse the withdrawals but the casino after verfiying closed his account for breech of terms. So what would happen to him ? Casino keep losses or void play If casino keeps loss this guy should be paid.

 

[cncas2123]

I don't think you will like their answer, regardless of what you believe they have said.

Not a chance in hell of you getting paid winnings. Deposits back at best.

Makes no odds why your partner SE, the simple fact is she had, and you then used a card in her name to deposit (joint account or not) It was HER card, not YOURS, And she was SE'd, game over.

When the Casino said it was ok to use the card, obviously the SE never got flagged (or you sent the ID in later)

Would make a complete mockery of the SE system if the SE'd players card/details could just be used on a different account.

Utter madness.

Totally agree, it would mean any SE player with a joint account just has to make an account in his/her partners name, use the joint card to deposit and if they lose claim it back as SE, and you if they win they claim the winnings. Fraudsters will love this and I can’t see any regulator allowing this loophole to exist.

 

[maxd]

Because it's now a complaint between the player and casino and, particularly the player, is likely to continue arguing the case.

Ok, thanks for the heads-up but unless I'm missing something I don't see the need for thread closure at this time.

 

[Sajsan12]

Totally agree, it would mean any SE player with a joint account just has to make an account in his/her partners name, use the joint card to deposit and if they lose claim it back as SE, and you if they win they claim the winnings. Fraudsters will love this and I can’t see any regulator allowing this loophole to exist.

You seem to miss the point that i was logged in and verified my identity with BankID. Its not just ”creating an account in your partners name” then. This is once and for all a identification method that even the government considers legit.

 

[nikantw]

I am not saying that the OP isn't genuine and honest, but this could be used from Swedish scammers:
Self exclude, use partner's acc with their card, get a refund if they lose or paid if they win.

For that reason casinos and regulators need to be very strict and very clear on the rules, even if that means some good people will get "burned". Not fun or fair, but there is a learning period for everyone in this new gambling world.

 

[DoubleTree1962]

You seem to miss the point that i was logged in and verified my identity with BankID. Its not just ”creating an account in your partners name” then. This is once and for all a identification method that even the government considers legit.

The problem is nothing to do with your verfication. The problem is you used wife's card.. That's is one problem. They may have paid the big problem is your wife is self excluded that is the reason the play is void.

 

[Sajsan12]

The problem is nothing to do with your verfication. The problem is you used wife's card.. That's is one problem. They may have paid the big problem is your wife is self excluded that is the reason the play is void.

That isn’t the problem because it wasn’t her gambling. Which is proven by me verifying my account with BankID.

 

[Sajsan12]

I am not saying that the OP isn't genuine and honest, but this could be used from Swedish scammers:
Self exclude, use partner's acc with their card, get a refund if they lose or paid if they win.

For that reason casinos and regulators need to be very strict and very clear on the rules, even if that means some good people will get "burned". Not fun or fair, but there is a learning period for everyone in this new gambling world.

That wouldnt be possible because you under the Swedish regulation needs to verify your identity before gambling.

 

[DoubleTree1962]

That isn’t the problem because it wasn’t her gambling. Which is proven by me verifying my account with BankID.

Yes but you used her card. In UK we have to send in passport . Once that is sent you are verfired. But if you use wife card the casino will ask for a photo.

 

[Sajsan12]

Yes but you used her card. In UK we have to send in passport . Once that is sent you are verfired. But if you use wife card the casino will ask for a photo.

here you need to verify your account with online ID, same as you use (like I mentioned earlier a few times) for filing your taxes, take loans, log on to your medical journal etc. that’s before you start gambling.

 

[EkJR]

I am not saying that the OP isn't genuine and honest, but this could be used from Swedish scammers:
Self exclude, use partner's acc with their card, get a refund if they lose or paid if they win.

For that reason casinos and regulators need to be very strict and very clear on the rules, even if that means some good people will get "burned". Not fun or fair, but there is a learning period for everyone in this new gambling world.

The fact he has asked them outright before doing anything should make him a different case imo.

 

[DoubleTree1962]

But u still deposited with wife card so that doesn't matter.

 

[DoubleTree1962]

The fact he has asked them outright before doing anything should make him a different case imo.

That's not the problem. He never said I was going to use my wife card who is self excluded. He said can I use my partner card how would they know who his partner is and if she was self excluded .

 

[Sajsan12]

But u still deposited with wife card so that doesn't matter.

Thats not up to us to decide. The SGA says different.

 

[DoubleTree1962]

The big difference is he never just usedpartner card he used one who is self excluded

 

[Sajsan12]

Let’s not discuss this anymore. SGA will no matter what have the final saying on this matter.

I will update you with the outcome.

 

[EkJR]

That's not the problem. He never said I was going to use my wife card who is self excluded. He said can I use my partner card how would they know who his partner is and if she was self excluded .

I understand that but where is it written that after this the fact his wife had a self exclusion matters? Maybe the casino could have asked if there were any self exclusions he was aware of at that time. As far as I know his account is registered in his name, the fact the deposit method is his wifes is a mute point if there was some paperwork done to confirm this and this was not an issue until withdrawal stage.

 

[colinsunderland]

What strikes me as strange is, the OP posts on here.
Within a few hours, on a Sunday, the boss of the casino posts on here asking for the user name, saying he will look into it. Not just any rep, but the one who is probably the most helpful rep on here.
Less than 24 hours later, not even allowing a full business day to pass, the OP starts an official complaint, therefore pretty much stopping anything Jan may have been able to do for him, in it's tracks.
Why would anyone do that? I get that if a rep doesn't respond within a couple of days someone might take it further, but Jan posted here saying about the complaint literally 2-3 hours after their day would have started.
I know one thing, I would have waited a day or two at least before taking it further.

 

[Sajsan12]

What strikes me as strange is, the OP posts on here.
Within a few hours, on a Sunday, the boss of the casino posts on here asking for the user name, saying he will look into it. Not just any rep, but the one who is probably the most helpful rep on here.
Less than 24 hours later, not even allowing a full business day to pass, the OP starts an official complaint, therefore pretty much stopping anything Jan may have been able to do for him, in it's tracks.
Why would anyone do that? I get that if a rep doesn't respond within a couple of days someone might take it further, but Jan posted here saying about the complaint literally 2-3 hours after their day would have started.
I know one thing, I would have waited a day or two at least before taking it further.

Never been in a situation like this before. I’m new to the forum aswell. I sent a email to the casino before I started this thread, that email is what they consider the official complaint I guess. Didn’t know how else to do it. Didn’t know who Jan is or that there even was a rep here. Just reached out to get some help.

 

[Slottery]

I understand that but where is it written that after this the fact his wife had a self exclusion matters? Maybe the casino could have asked if there were any self exclusions he was aware of at that time. As far as I know his account is registered in his name, the fact the deposit method is his wifes is a mute point if there was some paperwork done to confirm this and this was not an issue until withdrawal stage.

There's been many incidents where casinos have ended up to refund 3rd party deposits where owner of payment method have been self-excluded through Spelpaus (national database), so no need to do any of these in future would probably be welcome for casinos who have been doing these (it's common practice to check 3rd party deposit method owners are or are not self-excluded through Spelpaus).

Finding out that self-exclusion (still not sure was it done to casino or Spelpaus as OP mentioned that his partner used to play years ago but SGA license only been existing since January 2019 so years ago done shouldn't make much difference if casino not digging old account history under MGA license) at withdrawal stage in this case was pretty understandable as casino didn't have information about of owner of the card before OP provided it in form like agreed with casino.

Don't really see that casino would start to ask that is person who name is in card problem gambler or not as that should imo be something what player should advise casino and OP stated that he was not aware about this self-exclusion (and it haven't been made due to problem gambling but other reason and still casino find it as self-exclusion).

We sill see how this is ending if it will get until SGA with all information from both sides but now we only have OP statements what happened and when, same story can be told with many different tones in voice so hope for OP that whole complaint end up to SGA to decide and casino for sure after that will honor their decision and would assume it's best for casino and OP both to get decision from them or how ever SGA usually wants complaint procedure to be handled.

 

[maxd]

... Self exclude, use partner's acc with their card, get a refund if they lose or paid if they win. ...

FWIW I've seen an unusual number of cases exactly like this recently.