Casinocruise doesn´t pay > 12K
- Thread starter Senfpott
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- Apr 18, 2009
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I have asked the rep several times. They are stand alones so they do not follow Every Matrix rules when it comes to self exclusions.
I asked as late as yesterday so I guess it's still the same today.
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It is confusing to know who are stand alones and not but I know that Next/Luck have their own licence, and so does Thrills/SuperLenny.
Guts/Betspin also.
But those 2+2+2 are sister casinos so are you self excluded at one of them you can't play at the other one.
But which casinos that Every Matrix lists, apart from those above, I don't know if we ever will find out.
Please Lloyd if you have a list then give it to us so we know which are connected to your casino
They may have separate Maltese licenses, I don't know
But according to the UKGC website, They ALL share one UK licence. If you click on the 'gambling commission' logo on any of those sites, you'll be taken to the same license, which ultimately belongs to jetbull.com
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That could depend on if you're a UK resident,
Although I don't know, since the OP was from Germany
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I'm just telling what I have been told. Go ask yourself.
Maybe a new thread would be great too. Everyone doesn't read this.
Maybe a new thread would be great too. Everyone doesn't read this.
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Unless of course, it's an option with EM, and Casino Cruise have decided to use the option to void the OP's winnings, where as casinoLuck and next, don't use that option
But according to UKGC website, they have their own UKGC licenses also.
Guts/Betspin
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My guess is that someone from EveryMatrix messed up filling some official form and because of that it lists Jetbull as the trading name instead of EveryMatrix being the trading name and Jetbull being just another whitelabel, and because of badly filled form, it also lists at least 3 sites that have their own UKGC licenses as EM whitelabel sites. Or maybe they originally planned to use Everymatrix UKCG, but then decided to get their own licenses, and that form is just outdated.
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Bah, sometimes those links seem to be just to take some expiring search results. So I copied the original content, and used spoiler tags to make the post shorter. You can safely click those "Show Spoiler!" buttons, no plot revelations about your favorite tv show, movies or books or anything like that.
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Of course, although you can colour me up surprised. I'll have to have a read of that thread. If they did, all credit to them.
Our OP here is owed 12K.
Remind me which bit seems fair?
The casino was one you had not signed up at before. You had not self-excluded at this casino but at a sister operation about which you were apparently given no notification. By any reasonable standard of expectation, you signed up at a casino where you were "clean".
Let's add on to that that they then threw out the "illegal betsizes" thing - which you knew was false. And that when asked to supply evidence they provided only the apparently "illegal" bets, rather conveniently it seems to me, avoiding addressing the issue of when the bigger bets occurred. And why was this even relevant, if they already had you by the short n' curlies on the self-exclusion issue?
To rephrase your comment I quoted: I do not understand that. And it's disappointing to me that it seems fair to you. Because it doesn't seem fair to me. It seems to me that you've accepted an unfair result extremely readily. But in the light of the fact that your 12K (yes, that's your 12K Senfpott; you won it fair & square and in good faith) is certainly gone, maybe you're simply being rationally philosophical. I can understand that, although I struggle to empathise with it.
I hope at least you've taken away the relevant lessons: >>>don't self exclude<<<, and when you're done with a bonus or whatever, >>>just cash out<<<. Don't start betting big on the basis that "the bonus rules are satisfied". Make a clean break, then start in a-swingin' with the big bets on a fresh deposits.
Of course, although you can colour me up surprised. I'll have to have a read of that thread.
Remind me which bit seems fair?
The casino was one you had not signed up at before. You had not self-excluded at this casino but at a sister operation about which you were apparently given no notification. By any reasonable standard of expectation, you signed up at a casino where you were "clean".
Let's add on to that that they then threw out the "illegal betsizes" thing - which you knew was false. And that when asked to supply evidence they provided only the apparently "illegal" bets, rather conveniently it seems to me, avoiding addressing the issue of when the bigger bets occurred. And why was this even relevant, if they already had you by the short n' curlies on the self-exclusion issue?
To rephrase your comment I quoted: I do not understand that. And it's disappointing to me that it seems fair to you. Because it doesn't seem fair to me. It seems to me that you've accepted an unfair result extremely readily. But in the light of the fact that your 12K (yes, that's your 12K Senfpott; you won it fair & square and in good faith) is certainly gone, maybe you're simply being rationally philosophical. I can understand that, although I struggle to empathise with it.
I hope at least you've taken away the relevant lessons: >>>don't self exclude<<<, and when you're done with a bonus or whatever, just cash out.
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- Apr 18, 2009
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What is the matter with you?
You don't know that it was false in any way. You didn't play, and you didn't suffer the loss. Still you're the one who's most disappointed
Are you a relative to the OP in any way because I can't figure out what you're doing in here besides trying to discredit Casino Cruise?
And you say you don't play online
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Sorry to barge in so late. The thread has been started for over a week but as usual my old eyes cant take me to reading all posts in this 12-page thread. For what they are worth here are my comments:
The OP says he self excluded himself from some casinos to prevent hackers abusing the account. Wouldnt it be simpler to just close the account?
The casino denied winnings because Everymatrix caught info that the OP had self-excluded himself at other casinos using Everymatrix. Surely, if they had taken the gambling issue seriously the OP would not have been able to register at Casino Cruise. My apologies if these points had been mentioned by other posters already.
Obviously gameplay and personal background checks are not done by the same casino employee, they have different employees and departments for those. These checks are done in parallel lines. When the player does withdrawal, the department responsible for background checks starts to do those, and the department responsible for gameplay checks starts to do those. It isn't done in series, the department responsible for gameplay checks doesn't wait until background check is done or vice versa. Because gameplay and background checks are concluded in parallel by different personnel and departments, if there is something wrong in both, being informed of these violations at different times isn't surprising, rather it is something you would expect to happen.
The level of computer skills varies a lot. Based on other threads, some people in addition to not bothering to read terms and conditions properly don't even know what Ctrl+F does, nor do they know how to use that to find max bet limits and surpass them due to this. Someone could get confused by full logs, but they might remember the time when they completed the wagering, and for them list of bets passing the limit with the time stamps is better. Some other people have better computer skills and they might be better off with full logs. I guess it would be best if casino sent both at same time.
You don't know that it was false in any way. You didn't play, and you didn't suffer the loss. Still you're the one who's most disappointed
The OP has been provided with the logs now, and he did not suggest in his last post there were any such errors on his part. The only issue was the self-exclusion. It's safe to say there were no such infringements. However, it would be helpful if he could state the fact categorically.
And yes, I am frankly flabbergasted that the OP takes this all in such good part, and I am certainly more annoyed than he is. But to be even just a tiny bit annoyed would make me comparably more annoyed. He's batted away £12,000 winnings with no more than "it's disappointing but fair". Fool or saint? Either way, he's a wonderful customer.
That's just mud-slinging. The casino is discrediting itself. It needs no help from me:
The player signed up with no indication he shouldn't be playing. There was no auto-block on players who had self-excluded from sister casinos. That is the casino's fault, not the player's. On the fact alone they should pay him, and acknowledge the mea culpa. That would be the fair outcome. We have no way of knowing that self-excluded players who lose get their deposits back. I'll refrain from expressing my opinion on the likelihood of that, but until self-excluders are automatically blocked, the only possible fair resolution is to pay them their winnings. This player should be paid.
Of course; that is patently self-evident.
What is the matter with you?
You don't know that it was false in any way. You didn't play, and you didn't suffer the loss. Still you're the one who's most disappointed
Are you a relative to the OP in any way because I can't figure out what you're doing in here besides trying to discredit Casino Cruise?
And you say you don't play online
Why are you always on the casino sides, people make mistakes
and i know CasinoCruise and Lloyd as well, i would say he is a fair fine lad
but still, everytime i read, you bashing out players who come up with any problems, there is no reason to protect them you are not Batman, and the casinos are not Gotham City and the Players are not the Penguin or the Joker ... just chill a bit
does any of the reps come forward and told us whats the matter if u are self excluded by one of them , you cant play at any of them ?
Does this only applies for UK customers ?
this is a big joke .. they put a date out and say everyone before that is not entitled to get a refund
what about Thrills/Superlenny ? RoyalPanda ? ect.
Is there's noone who can get a list ? Bryan maybe ?
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I'm certainly not always on the casinos side. I wasn't this time either.
I look at every issue from both sides.
Sometimes it is the players fault and sometimes the casino. In this case there was wrong doings from both no doubt about that, and if you read my posts again then maybe you'll see that I said that.
While you're doing that then please read the other 4000 too. I suspect you will be finding a lot of posts against casinos. Maybe more than the opposite.
Thanks for not accusing me for working at this casino too though. I can't work everywhere you know
I'm certainly not always on the casinos side. I wasn't this time either.
I look at every issue from both sides.
Sometimes it is the players fault and sometimes the casino. In this case there was wrong doings from both no doubt about that, and if you read my posts again then maybe you'll see that I said that.
While you're doing that then please read the other 4000 too. I suspect you will be finding a lot of posts against casinos. Maybe more than the opposite.
Thanks for not accusing me for working at this casino too though. I can't work everywhere you know
LOL , no this time it wasn't that obviouse .. hahah joking
I have read it and i saw that you took the right side here , as that casinos need to protect players from signing up before and not when making a withdraw .. so i apologize to you , my Catwoman
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LOL , no this time it wasn't that obviouse .. hahah joking
I have read it and i saw that you took the right side here , as that casinos need to protect players from signing up before and not when making a withdraw .. so i apologize to you , my Catwoman
Thanks
I have also answered a few of your questions about what casinos are related and which one you can play at without getting Every Matrix involved.
Just a few posts back.
I'm also well aware that I can act like a bitch sometimes... but just like any cat I can be nice too
this means im entitled to get thousand's of euros back ? this will be starting to get funny
It is confusing to know who are stand alones and not but I know that Next/Luck have their own licence, and so does Thrills/SuperLenny.
Guts/Betspin also.
But those 2+2+2 are sister casinos so are you self excluded at one of them you can't play at the other one.
But which casinos that Every Matrix lists, apart from those above, I don't know if we ever will find out.
Please Lloyd if you have a list then give it to us so we know which are connected to your casino
thanks Tirilej
Can i confirm that PlayHippo is one of EM casinos with the same licence ?
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You have to ask them. I know nothing about Playhippo.
I think I might be in same boat, my account with them got closed after I had already deposited a few times and lost does this mean I'm entitled to a refund? It seems I was because i self excluded from another casino and after getting verified with casinocruise they closed my account. I also had $200 of cashback I was suppose to be receiving but not anymore since they closed my account.
LloydApter
Official Rep for <a href="http://www.casinomeister
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Playhippo is on the list shown -
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EM are working on sorting out the SE saga so that's why some players are just suddenly having their accounts closed. So, we can expect a bit a mess until all the historical stuff is sorted out but going forward it will be properly organized.
LloydApter
Official Rep for <a href="http://www.casinomeister
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Hi Leoantho, same but with an added twist. The case in hand includes both a bonus breach and a SE at a related casino, so the outcome will be the same.
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They are on the list yes, but that doesn't mean that they are using anything else than the games from Every Matrix.
We can never be sure who are stand alones and not until we have a complete list.
For now we have to ask each casino.
I've never self excluded from any casino, but I do feel for those who have who maybe just took the easy way to close their account without thinking about the consequences it would have.
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I have been very frustrated at a few everymatrix casinos. I paid real money for slots that lag and disconnect and when you couple that with incredible losing streaks. I found myself so angry that I wanted to close the casino in question for all time. Pleassee exclude me from this non-working casino. That doesn't mean I have a gambling problem.
I am playing at other EM casinos that work better than the other ones, but I had no idea that my winnings can be confiscated. What SE rule, where is it?? Why am I paying if I can't win?
That op should have been paid!!!!!!!
I am playing at other EM casinos that work better than the other ones, but I had no idea that my winnings can be confiscated. What SE rule, where is it?? Why am I paying if I can't win?
That op should have been paid!!!!!!!
Kiwiguy
Dormant account
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I've crossed C.Cruise in my travels them seem o'k though haven't got to the stage of a payout (story o my life rofl) gl OP .
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- May 29, 2004
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Casino Cruise isn't really the problem here: it's EveryMatrix's exclusion policy but as the casino they are expected to handle the customer-facing part of the transaction and the problems that go with it.
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- May 22, 2012
I refer you to a thread I started recently, and which many CM posters made good contributions to:
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/clarity-of-related-casino-terms.66725/
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So have all players that have deposited since the 6th April and lost, so have not been picked up by the withdrawal process, had their deposits returned to them if they are self excluded at any other EM site?
How are players supposed to know that they have to go through the regulator to get their losses returned if you don't inform them or they haven't read this thread? You should be pro-active on this and return all deposits otherwise you are in a win win situation where you keep all losing deposits and also keep all winnings if there are any. That is rogue.
As has been mentioned numerous times in this thread not all SE are for gambling problems, why don't you just ask players that are SEing if they want to be blocked from all the EM casinos with a list of which ones they are.
LloydApter
Official Rep for <a href="http://www.casinomeister
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Thanks for the additional posts and questions. Amidst our discussions with EM to solve this issue, we are looking into a variety of solutions; naturally, you understand that this is not just our decision to make, but rather we require the cooperation of EM as well. The best solution, of course, is to automatically block such customers from sister websites, and such a solution is being developed to be deployed as soon as possible. In the meantime, we suggest that if any customer has any concerns about whether his or her self exclusion will be applied to another website, to contact customer support in advance.
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But this is your decision to make, I agree that you may need the cooperation of EM to sort this but you make the decision.
They are your customers so you have the responsibility of care, if a player deposited and had no chance to win then that deposit should be returned .
dontknowtobet
Newbie member
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I was writing something but apparantely it's wrong, my apologies.
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asparkes15
Banned User - douchebag troll - threatening member
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This is rogue behaviour through and through. Anyone who thinks otherwise needs to get their head checked. To OP, if you need legal advice PM me, I have a barrister that would definitely help you through this.
dontknowtobet
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It's also unscrupulous.
I happen to have self excluded from other Every Matrix casinos.
I'm also registered to CasinoCruise and haven't won anything yet, according to their T&C I should have never been allowed to play there.
So according to their decision regarding OP's claim and consequent actions, I'm entitled to get my deposits back on CasinoCruise, no?
EDIT: I actually missed some of the earlier posts about this exact subject.
EDIT: Feedback from casinocruise support
UPDATE: CasinoCrew just replied and I have been refunded accordingly.
I'm also registered to CasinoCruise and haven't won anything yet, according to their T&C I should have never been allowed to play there.
So according to their decision regarding OP's claim and consequent actions, I'm entitled to get my deposits back on CasinoCruise, no?
EDIT: I actually missed some of the earlier posts about this exact subject.
EDIT: Feedback from casinocruise support
UPDATE: CasinoCrew just replied and I have been refunded accordingly.
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- Joined
- Dec 21, 2014
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The situation is that several casinos are operating under the same EM Maltese license so if a player SE at one of the sister casinos it is the same as SE from all of them. All deposits are refunded to such players. Moving forward - EM is looking for a better solution and we are working on our own license. In the meantime - apologies for the inconvenience and please double check yourselves re SE. Thanks for the post.
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- Jul 25, 2007
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"Apologies for the inconvenience" is a bit of an understatement given the fact that the casino confiscated 12K from the OP. Refunding deposits only serves the casino well; the OP should receive his full winnings as he was not aware that he was SE from your site as a consequence of previous SE(s) elsewhere. Your system accepted his deposit(s) regardless, so the casino should pay up.
I concur with Asparks15 and would definitely seek legal assistance if I were the OP.
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That's not the whole story. We have already concluded in this thread and with the player that he breached the bonus terms, the SE was an extra issue and there have been cases where we have refunded large amounts of deposits when players have lost. I'm not sure why this has all been re-opened again but thanks for the post. And yes, I'm also sorry for the player.
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It has not been proven (yet) that the player breached the bonus terms, I thought the evidence for this was inconclusive. The extra issue was the alleged violation of the bonus terms. It started with the SE issue, and suddenly this violation of bonus terms popped up. I need conclusive evidence that this was really the case. Refunding (substantial) deposits is not enough, players should be paid their winnings in full.
I don't see what is so suspicious in this supposed time line.
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/casinocruise-doesn´t-pay-12k.66693/?t=66693
Then this was posted 7 hours later
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/casinocruise-doesn´t-pay-12k.66693/
Timeline:
- Senfpott withdraws. His background data is send for review to the department and people responsible for background check, and gameplay data is send for review to the department and people responsible for reviewing gameplay data.
- 2 hours later his account is locked by the department responsible for background checks. He contacted live chat and he was informed of the reasons for locking.
- Gameplay department completes it's review before the next live chat session. They could have completed their review even during the first live chat session.
- On the next day, he contacts live chat again, and is informed of in addition to being self excluded, of his bonus violation.
Note that it was not the gameplay department contacting him of his bonus violation, but him contacting the live chat and being informed of his bonus violation. The gameplay department could have completed their job anytime between his first and second live chat, they could have completed their job even during the first live chat session. So background department could have been just less than hour faster than gameplay department in completing their job.
Someone might argue that if both departments had completed their job at the same time, that would be even more suspicious and sign of the casino making stuff up.
But in reality, neither of those scenarios is in anyway truly suspicious.
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- Joined
- Jul 25, 2007
- Location
- Amsterdam
I responded to the casino rep's message that the SE was an extra issue. However, the way this case was presented showed that the SE issue was at the core of the OP's problem to get paid. Also, I inderstand that the OP did comply with the T&Cs until he had met WR (i.e. he started wagering in excess of the maximum bet size after having met WR). And the latter has, IMO, not been evidenced to the contrary - then again, the OP seems to have left this discussion and did not submit a PAB. Too bad.
- Joined
- Sep 8, 2007
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If the casino can't proactively police the clause of SE accounts at other casinos operating under the same license, then they shouldn't police it retroactively. Like others have stated, it's an ethical issue. If a player loses, he doesn't get his deposit refunded - yet a winning player will have his winnings voided and a refund issued. It clearly provides an enormous advantage to the casino.
- Joined
- Dec 21, 2014
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- Malta
With respect to the SE issue, this is the official statement from eCogra for EM:
The basic procedure for any account opened or accessed during a self-exclusion period is that neither the player nor the operator should benefit from play by a vulnerable person.
Therefore the player should be returned the position they were in before play commenced – i.e. refund the deposits and void any winnings.
- Joined
- Dec 21, 2014
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- Malta
This is just to confirm that the player has had for a while now the full game log.
Also, I know that the player is aware that he broke the bonus terms by wagering too much with his bonus money.
It is an unfortunate thing, because a breach of the bonus terms is a breach of the bonus terms however small or large the consequences.
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- Feb 13, 2013
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I think this thread should be closed as almost all gamblers know EM casinos and they still pull the trick of joining another em casino after SE to get deposits back in case they lose n try n get all the money if they win
I don't think you should explain any further as u have been more than co-operative as responsibility also falls on the gambler to know certain things i-e if u have a gambling problem dont gamble
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Does anyone know all 64 Every Matrix casinos, don't wont to get caught out on this one.
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when you join a casino, at the bottom of every site next to the certificates n stuff it tells u if its a everymatrix casino
from main page, clearly visible
''The website is operated and managed by EveryMatrix Ltd, a company bearing registration number C44411, and having its registered address at Suite 10, Level 4, Portomaso Business Tower, Vjal Portomaso, St.Julians, STJ 4011, Malta. EveryMatrix Ltd. is licensed and regulated by the Malta Gaming Authority (www.mga.org.mt) in virtue of a Class 1 license numbered MGA/CL1/497/2010
The Casino games, Quickfire, are provided by EveryMatrix N.V. a limited liability company incorporated under the laws of Curacao, bearing company registration number 108354 and having its registered address at Dr. Hugenholtzweg Z/N, Curacao and is licensed and regulated in virtue of license number No. 8048/JAZ granted by the Government of Curacao.''
every EM casino does n must display the above
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