Casinocruise doesn´t pay > 12K

[Tirilej]

The only way this can be avoided is by making sure that anyone who has closed an account on the same platform is automatically prevented from signing up to another casino sharing the platform, that way the player will know he isnt welcome to play there and it will save a lot of anger and frustration at a later stage.

I think it would be much better if the casinos are asking why the person wants to close their account.
To have this easy self exclusion where you just agree to something you don't read, because you maybe just want to get out of the casino, isn't so smart.
We all know that when there are laggings and errors constantly somewhere we just want to get away, never to see the place again. No good reason to get winnings confiscated.

Of course we should read the rules, but then there is that language question again. It's always in English.
I hadn't even heard the word self exclusion when I started to play. Many people are good in English but not that good. We do not understand the rules perfectly. We just trust the casinos.

Only emails and clear questions is what I would like to have.

 

[Matti]

The only way this can be avoided is by making sure that anyone who has closed an account on the same platform is automatically prevented from signing up to another casino sharing the platform, that way the player will know he isnt welcome to play there and it will save a lot of anger and frustration at a later stage.

That would meen that all players have to provide ID upon registration at a casino and wait to get them verified before being able to play. I wouldn't like that.

 

[LloydApter]

I think it would be much better if the casinos are asking why the person wants to close their account.
To have this easy self exclusion where you just agree to something you don't read, because you maybe just want to get out of the casino, isn't so smart.
We all know that when there are laggings and errors constantly somewhere we just want to get away, never to see the place again. No good reason to get winnings confiscated.

Of course we should read the rules, but then there is that language question again. It's always in English.
I hadn't even heard the word self exclusion when I started to play. Many people are good in English but not that good. We do not understand the rules perfectly. We just trust the casinos.

Only emails and clear questions is what I would like to have.

Hi Tirilej, our bonus terms are in German on the DE site and Swedish on the SV site, which I think helps. I'm checking out about the details relating the SE issue and will post about it soon. Thanks and have a good night!

 

[Tirilej]

Hi Tirilej, our bonus terms are in German on the DE site and Swedish on the SV site, which I think helps. I'm checking out about the details relating the SE issue and will post about it soon. Thanks and have a good night!

Yes you have that and that's good, but everyone doesn't have other languages.

Sorry Lloyd, this have gone above the OP's issue and now the discussion is more about Every Matrix and self exclusion.
I'm sure you can solve that too for us

 

[cncas123]

That would meen that all players have to provide ID upon registration at a casino and wait to get them verified before being able to play. I wouldn't like that.

I dont think that would necessarily be the case. If an exclusion exists, surely EM can have a database of user information for excluded users, and when a new account is opened at a casino on their platform the database can run a quick check? I dont think players who are experiencing these problems are trying to con the casinos or get round any exclusions, I think there is a genuine need to differentiate between closing an account and self excluding for responsible gambling reasons.

 

[Mouche12]

Take it a little easy Mouche12.
You wrote this so maybe people think that the rep for Cruise hasn't responded to the OP for 8-9 days, but that was another player.
About this issue the rep maybe don't know it exists yet. He haven't read the thread and it started yesterday.

When he does he needs more information, and if it will be a PAB then we won't get any information until it's finished.

I will give this thread to the rep for Every Matrix too though. They are the ones responsible for what is happening to some players, and something needs to be done to make it all more clear.

Maybe the only way is to stop letting people close their accounts by themselves. If they are forced to send an email, then the casinos should ask the player why he want his account closed if it's unclear from the first email.
That way both the player and the casino would know for sure, and they could give information about other Every Matrix casinos at the same time...If it's a case of self excluding for gambling problems of course.
Otherwise it doesn't matter.

I know, I was referring to the other player sending a PM to the rep and his non-responsiveness for more than a week.

I'd now like to know if the player indeed exceeded the max bet size. If he really did, nothing can be done about it, really sucks.

 

[cncas123]

I have never understood why people keep self excluding from casinos. But each to their own. Anyway before a player self excludes it should be their responsibility to check with the casino exactly what it means and how it affects them at other casinos.

If I close an account, it will be because I dont want to be sent endless emails from that casino to entice me back, and I try and explain that to chat, but I have found recently that some accounts that I have closed in the past are now self excluded rather than closed, even though I never self excluded. There is a huge difference between closing an account and self excluding, but casinos dont seem to differentiate between the two.

 

[Senfpott]

Hi there,

there´s some news and I want to inform you what´s going on in my case here.

LlodApter managed to get me the logs of my bets placed during playing with the bonus. Thanks for that! But I´m not happy that this is a simple and unprotected excel-sheet. So I and everbody else could simply do some modifications on that. But that should´t be the case here....
In this sheet there are about 75 bets higher than the maxbet of 5 EUR. Correct. But all other bets were excluded and not listed, means that I am not able to check if I did the needed wagering amount before placing these bets....

I really don´t want to blame casinocruise or any other casino. But after confiscating 12K EUR I really wish to have some real proove of breaking the Bonusrules.

Anyway, at this moment I´m deeply disappointed as you can imagine. I don´t see good chances to get the winning amount or even a part of it. If I really did break the rules, it´s me who´s responsible for that. I know that.... Even it was only 1 EUR I was eventually overbetting....

I will now contact cruise again to get the deposits back at least. That should be no problem.

I´m not sure if it´s a useful way to do a PAB now?!?! I´m still thinking that I didn´t break the rules but I have really no idea how to proof....

@LloydApter: Thanks for your work here! Do you personally think, that there´s a chance to get even a compensation or something for getting more than 12K confiscated? I mean loosing 12K for overbetting 1 EUR - if this is really correct - is pretty hard

Selfexclusion-Problem:
@Everyone: Feel free to discuss this problem in this threat, but maybe it´s a better way to open some new threat for discussing the problem cause it may have an affect on many, many players. So everyone should know about that.

Senfpott

 

[KasinoKing]

I´m not sure if it´s a useful way to do a PAB now?!?! I´m still thinking that I didn´t break the rules but I have really no idea how to proof....(

100% definitely YES - do a PAB.

Not just for yourself, but for all other players who may fall foul of the "self exclusion" issue in the future.
If casinos are going to confiscate anything for this reason, it MUST be written into the T&Cs, with a list (or link to a list) of ALL the other casinos within the group. Anything less is totally unfair as it puts the casinos in a win-win situation.

A PAB should also greatly encourage Cruise to supply your FULL play history. I'm sure they would like to get Accredited here; withholding this information is NOT going to help their cause in that direction.

KK

 

[Senfpott]

100% definitely YES - do a PAB.

Not just for yourself, but for all other players who may fall foul of the "self exclusion" issue in the future.
If casinos are going to confiscate anything for this reason, it MUST be written into the T&Cs, with a list (or link to a list) of ALL the other casinos within the group. Anything less is totally unfair as it puts the casinos in a win-win situation.

A PAB should also greatly encourage Cruise to supply your FULL play history. I'm sure they would like to get Accredited here; withholding this information is NOT going to help their cause in that direction.

KK

I fully agree and did the PAB right away. I hope I did fill everything in the correct way and that u´ll be able to understand my bad english ;-)

 

[Harry_BKK]

LlodApter managed to get me the logs of my bets placed during playing with the bonus. Thanks for that! But I´m not happy that this is a simple and unprotected excel-sheet. So I and everbody else could simply do some modifications on that. But that should´t be the case here....
In this sheet there are about 75 bets higher than the maxbet of 5 EUR. Correct. But all other bets were excluded and not listed, means that I am not able to check if I did the needed wagering amount before placing these bets....(

That is just plain cheeky of them, to put it politely. Sending only a part of the log with the bets above the 5$ mark

They certainly try everything to convince you that you are in the wrong. Don't give up, the PAB will help you. Just have to be patient.

Good Luck

 

[Senfpott]

That is just plain cheeky of them, to put it politely. Sending only a part of the log with the bets above the 5$ mark

They certainly try everything to convince you that you are in the wrong. Don't give up, the PAB will help you. Just have to be patient.

Good Luck

Thanks!

I´m not quiet sure, what I´m allowed to post here after doing the PAB. So I´ll better say nothing more here in this case till everything is clear or I´m told otherwise....

Thanks to the great support here in this forum!!! :notworthy

 

[Harry_BKK]

Thanks!

I´m not quiet sure, what I´m allowed to post here after doing the PAB. So I´ll better say nothing more here in this case till everything is clear or I´m told otherwise....

Thanks to the great support here in this forum!!! :notworthy

ZIP!!!...nothing, you would only jeopardize your PAB by posting further comments.

Gruesse aus Bangkok
Harry

 

[LloydApter]

I was just updated that Senfpott has been sent a full and detailed report and explanation of the breach.

Regarding the EM SE issue - our solution for now is to refund all players who play at our casino their deposits while at the same time they are SE at another casino using the same EM platform regardless if they win of lose.

 

[kavaman]

That may be a solution, for you but its not ideal by any means. I mean most people don't even know what everymatrix is. It should be clearly listed in your t&c that if another player has a casino at another everymatrix site (including a list of which sites are em), that if your SE you guys are not paying out winnings.

Or, create something together with EM so that the accounts get locked upon creation.

Or just lose this rule. Its not for the players, i mean some players just self exclude themselves purely because they don't want to play with that particular casino anymore, not because of gambling problems. Yeah maybe 50% exclude because of gambling problems, but unless they are admitting they have gambling problem, then they are just moving on to another casino, which may or may not be EM, so they shouldn't be punished.

Do you think its ideal that player does not know he is playing another EM casino, and win's only to find out he is not going to be paid his win. This just makes angry complaining players and alot of bad publicity for the casino.

 

[LloydApter]

If a player that SEed deposits and loses they can go to the regulator and get their deposit back. All EM SE are only considered gambling issue SE.

Yes, we are working on a better solution. For now 1) check the EM site for casino partners 2) don't SE rather ask the casino to stop sending you emails or to close your account

And of course if you SE because you have a gambling problem then you should not be gambling anyway

 

[Tirilej]

If a player that SEed deposits and loses they can go to the regulator and get their deposit back. All EM SE are only considered gambling issue SE.

Yes, we are working on a better solution. For now 1) check the EM site for casino partners 2) don't SE rather ask the casino to stop sending you emails or to close your account

And of course if you SE because you have a gambling problem then you should not be gambling anyway

That's the thing. We can't check EM's site for casino partners.

It says they have 64 clients, but only 32 are told. Who are the rest?

Of those 64 several have their own licence, and don't need to follow EM on this. Who are they? Most players don't know this.

It's time this get its own thread so people will find out. I'll do that later if I have the time, or please someone who's interested. Go ahead

 

[kavaman]

Yeah i wasn't talking about myself, i never SE . I was just talking about new guys who might SE, and tirilej is right on this, EM site does not list all their partners ;(. I kinda agree , we are filling this thread with SE issues rather then the actual problem , so maybe it would deserve its own thread.

I don't have any issue with casinocruise in particular, i mean i think you guys are a quality site like all em sites.

 

[Nammy]

It's an odd way to manage a problem gambler exclusion issue.

Problem gamblers - and I've seen many in normal casinos - are people who suffer financial hardship as a consequence of gambling. The act of gambling is immaterial, it's the financial consequences that count. So here, when the problem gambler actually wins, ie. the actual financial consequences are the reverse of the usual ones and the outcome is not, happily, problematic, the casino responds by changing the win to a non-win, thus returning the problem gambler to his usual losing state. In other words, a problem gambler who almost always loses but may occasionally catch a break and win, is now condemned to forever lose, because a win will never be paid because...he's a problem gambler.

It's an ironic way to treat problem gamblers.

Of course, it turns out that bonus terms may have been broken. But the casino hasn't supplied the requested evidence to show whether or not the terms actually were broken, only selective material which shows nothing, and which the casino must have known did not supply the required information when they supplied it.

This is also odd.

To the player: get your full logs. And why in the world did you create this unnecessary problem? Why not either cash out after you were done with the bonus, or carry on playing but without going into rule-breaking territory, which you did simply because "the bonus terms had been satisfied"? You pointlessly created a potential issue where no issue needed to be created.

 

[Tirilej]

Since we (the players) have a hard time figuring out what casinos are related and what rules they are following, then maybe there should be some special rules for at least the accredited ones to follow.

Dunover started a thread about that: https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/clarity-of-related-casino-terms.66725/?t=66725

Please jump in with comments there

 

[Mouche12]

Quote:
To the player: get your full logs. And why in the world did you create this unnecessary problem? Why not either cash out after you were done with the bonus, or carry on playing but without going into rule-breaking territory, which you did simply because "the bonus terms had been satisfied"? You pointlessly created a potential issue where no issue needed to be created.Unquote

My understanding is that players can start wagering any bet size they please AFTER the WR (i.e. according to the bonus terms) have been met, so I don't see why this could create a potential issue.

The OP has now received a detailed report and hopefully further info will be released once this matter has been settled.

 

[Nammy]

To the player: get your full logs. And why in the world did you create this unnecessary problem? Why not either cash out after you were done with the bonus, or carry on playing but without going into rule-breaking territory, which you did simply because "the bonus terms had been satisfied"? You pointlessly created a potential issue where no issue needed to be created.

My understanding is that players can start wagering any bet size they please AFTER the WR (i.e. according to the bonus terms) have been met, so I don't see why this could create a potential issue.

It's already created an issue, so that much should be self-evident.

Example: wagering is $1000; maximum bet is $1; player plays $1 slots; player wagers $1000.

On his 1001st spin, he changes to $5, on the basis that "the wagering is complete so I can play as I like".

Sensible or misguided?

 

[Tirilej]

It's already created an issue, so that much should be self-evident.

Example: wagering is $1000; maximum bet is $1; player plays $1 slots; player wagers $1000.

On his 1001st spin, he changes to $5, on the basis that "the wagering is complete so I can play as I like".

Sensible or misguided?

So what? You can't accuse someone for what he's doing after he made the wagering.
Besides, it's none of our business. Many are doing that and I'm sure they don't expect that to be the issue.

Why are you trying to punish the player even more? Isn't it enough that he (probably) will get his winnings confiscated?

 

[gokkie]

This thread caught my eye because of the self exclusion thing.
I had the same happen to me only days back (after april 6)with two every matrix connected casino's. Both accredited here.

A few days back started playing again with a casino where I had played before but a long time ago about 7 months.
I could login fine, so I played and won 1300€. I cashed out this amount as well.

I had to send in docs because my total lifetime winnings with the casino were above 2300€.
No problem, did that.

Then I got an e-mail stating my account was self-excluded and therefore blocked and doc. verification was cancelled
So I tried logging in and my account was blocked.

I was sure I was not self-excluded at this casino. Also I was unsure what would happen to my winnings.
I got an e-mail that I was self-excluded at another sister casino, so therefore they also blocked my account at this one.
However the only thing that triggered this is because I won and they had to verify my account. Then they probably found I was self excluded at their sister casino.

So now I was getting very concerned about being paid. I checked the terms and conditions of the casino I was playing at and nowhere I found any relation to the other casino.
The reason I knew they were connected is because the casino's are both accredited here and there I saw they are connected.

However I got an e-mail they were paying me my winnings anyway and two days later I received the total of 1300€
So reading this thread I feel lucky at the end it ended well for me.
I would have been sick if for this reason I would have been denied my winnings.

 

[SpinUk]

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