Casino Software coding ideas

[jstrike]

But that isn't actually why I'm here.

I'm here 'cause in the last 3 years I've spent a huge, frankly ridiculous amount of time writing a piece of casino software. Some guys like to build cars, some guys like to skydive, some guys get to be David Duchovny; what can I say. I wanted to do it. Hopeless and impossible? Yes. Never stopped me before.

At first I thought I could sell it to Vegas somehow. That didn't so much pan. I kept working at it. I sweated on it day and night, every scrap of free time I had. I'm a freelance coder, so I have plenty of time off. Meanwhile, I left my home in the States for good and became sort of an international recluse.

So what started as a basement project, turned into a beta site with a hundred players and a bunch of freerolls a couple times a week. I kept improving it and fixed hundreds of bugs. All the guys knew each other somehow, friends of friends. It was a little private club and it was grand. Since no one was allowed to deposit, everbody won.

I ran it like that for a year, kept adding new games until I got it up to 20, and ended the testing. I ran out of money but found some lawyers to work on it for a piece of the future rake.

I'm a programmer, designer and jack of all trades, and I'm of the old school when it comes to anything vice related. I drink bourbon and I smoke like it's going out of style. I don't care for drugs or anything I can't see through in a glass. Grew up visiting my grandparents at the old Vegas Towers off Flamingo and spent a lot of time in my early years standing in the darker corners of the Hilton floor and watching my ma and grandma throw away their silver dollars. By the time I was five or six I knew when my mom was throwing out a card she should have held.

I'm not great with numbers; I failed pre-calculus, dropped out of school, quit my web job, and spent a few years waiting tables in New York and driving a taxi in LA. But somehow programs make sense to me, and what started as a hobby became an obsession. I always loved to gamble, but luckily I had the self-control to stop eventually. My dad always said I was a "born loser" -- said he'd never seen anyone as bad a gambler as me. But when my two hobbies, or obsessions, collided ...well, this project was born. And in two months, I'm gonna set it loose on the world.

It's not going to be like anything else out there. I'm not trying to be a billionaire; hell, I'd be happy to have it pay my rent. I don't want a million users, affiliates, or spammers. I want a small, tight club, word of mouth, not a ton of fish, just friends of friends. I might only open it on Thursdays. Who knows. Eventually it might be something.

Anyway, that's why I'm here. Because I've been reading the Meister for awhile and I've taken all his advice to heart, especially where it concerns doing right by the player and doing things in a way that are honorable and transparent. Trust is the biggest failure of most online casinos, and it's one place I'm really going to set myself apart. It's a point of honor for me. If I hit 1000 players and can't handle it myself, and can't hire anybody, I'm going to cap the signups.

I don't have the cash to license in Gibraltar, I'm going for Costa Rica and no license. I'm not going to accept any players from the US. I don't care if I make $10 a day, 'cause my own work is free and I'll run the phones until I've got enough to make more. I'm not going to give extravagant bonuses and then run some sleazy deal on them. I don't like slot machines, I only have one, and it's more of a brain teaser than a drool-box. What's more, I've got some games I'm starting that are mathematically very weird, and I've got no doubt some smart guy's going to come along and figure 'em and beat 'em, and I'm glad to pay him for his trouble. Maybe I'll bring him in on the project if he does. And I've got a lot of new ideas about how things should be run, because by and large, it's been my observation that online casinos couldn't care less about their players.

Anyway. I'm not posting a link to my site here and I'm not going to send it if you ask, 'til it's open, anyway. I'm doing this because as this project finally gets its legs I'm starting to have some ideas I just need to run by the experts, see what you guys like and what you don't. If you just want to laugh at my project, do me a favor and do what your ma told you, if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say nothin'. If you have some ideas, like, you always wanted to see something but no one ever took your opinion about it, 'cause you're just some grumpy dude who thinks internet casinos suck, then by all means lay 'em on me. So far I've done 9/10ths of things my players have asked for, but I'm looking for fresh ideas.

Nice to make your acquaintance, and good luck to all.

JS.

 

[SlotMonster]

Wow, that's the best introduction I ever read at Casinomeister
Welcome to the forum, JS!
We will be more than happy to help you with new ideas, testing anf GAMBLING!

 

[LaurieJim]

Great intro JS, look forward to reading more of your posts, welcome to the forum

Laurie

 

[rockycatt]

welcome from boston even though you wont let me play

 

[vinylweatherman]

I'm going for Costa Rica and no license.

Appreciate your honesty

Many online casinos have "Licensed in Costa Rica" on their sites, and most of here (if not the "fish") know that there is no such thing as a GAMBLING license from Costa Rica. It IS cheap to operate from there, BUT because there is NO regulation, and NO means for players to raise a dispute through "the regulator", you really ARE relying 100% on building trust among players.

The MOST likely point of failure for your venture is for players to get lucky right at the start, and before you have managed to build your float. This could lead to you being unable to pay players, and this will ensure your reputation gets flushed down the toilet.

It is therefore important that you have the financial backing to deal with a "worst case scenario" soon after launch. You might want to look at insurance, rather than borrowing a large amount of "float" money. You could also bring in partners who will offer financial backing in exchange for a "piece of the action".

If you software can offer something NOT offered by the majority of the rest, you at least stand a chance.

Look at 3Dice, unique software developed by a small team, and slowly grown into a successful, and UNIQUE offering. Players can ONLY play 3Dice games at 3Dice. Your mathematical challenging "slot" would be similarly classed as "unique". The casinos $lotland and WinaDay offer unique, and sometimes "brain teasing", slot based games. Their latest at Winaday looks like it comes from the stable of 3Dice (Enzo - you have serious competition here )

Upon launch, offer a "free play" mode as well as "real" play. Don't ask for too much personal information for "free" mode. This will lower the barriers for those who are curious, but would NOT want to give out their personal information at this stage. Obviously, for "real" play, you MUST have detailed information from each player to protect yourself from fraud. Even without +EV bonuses, you can still fall victim to fraudsters registering accounts to "clean up" dirty money - in by one method, and out by another. This falls OUTSIDE your level of expertise, which you have said is programming. Your lawyer partners should be able to guide you though.

Start out allowing players from countries where there are no legal issues surrounding online gambling. You have already decided that the USA is a "no-go" for you, but there are other countries with similar problems, such as Israel, Turkey, South Africa, and even some German provinces.

The UK is one of very few countries where where online gambling has been made SPECIFICALLY legal, but because you are based in Costa Rica, you may NOT advertise in the UK through UK based media. Internet and "word of mouth" is fine, and there would be no issue for a UK player playing, as it is STILL legal for us to do so, no matter where you are based.


Remember, there are MANY failures, as well as success stories. Even GOOD software has failed because it has not been able to generate enough income, or has been let down by poor operators.

Hype - good software, let down by poor operators, who all went bust.
Wizard Gaming - just couldn't make money from the product, so are now selling it at a fraction of the development costs.

Rival - good software, shocking business model + poorly backed operators.

Top Game - overall crap. Mundane software and poor operators.

ALL offer the "standard" set of casino games, but if you are developing your own, and have "failed pre-calculus", you could be setting yourself up for failure. This will happen if you release a game that, with a perfect strategy, has an RTP of over 100%. Advantage players will be "all over it", and you will be "taken to the cleaners". You could also be hit hard and fast if the "exploit" ends up on one of the bigger advantage player forums, leaving you no time to react by pulling the game, or recalculating the pay tables.

It is best to get it "right first time", because changing games AFTER release makes players suspicious of your intentions.

 

[jstrike]

Wow. Well thank you guys for the positive response, and Mr. Weatherman that's an incredible rundown that addresses almost all of the serious issues I'm grappling with since I stopped coding and started actually...being a businessman. It's pretty late (I'm in Europe now) and I'm not going to be able to answer all of these things tonight. But I will say this:

*I'm not kidding anybody about licensing, and have no desire to take my players for fools by claiming something that isn't absolutely true. They'll have to take it on its merits, and I understand that means never letting a player down.

*The software is very unique -- yeah, maybe to a fault. e.g. no one knows what'll happen with more than 100 players online at the same time, or how many one server can really hold. So starting slow is part of the plan.

*I'm never putting it into the hands of operators. I don't trust other people not to ruin it. I've read a lot about how a founder shouldn't be a structural part of the organization in startups, but I don't buy it.

*My starting overhead is about $600/mo., which I can afford out of my earnings and a loan I took out. Every game on the site works in play or real mode, exactly the same. Because I'm bootstrapping this, the limits are very low. I'm starting it with $5 being the highest bet on any table game, until I build a fund. At that rate, I think I can catch a serious problem in time and afford to take care of it.

*While I did fail pre-calc, I'm pretty fair at writing simulations. There are definitely a couple games on the site which could work out to be +EV for players if they teamed up and played perfectly. I'm going to watch those carefully. I'm totally opposed to banning bots (actually, I wrote a few to get the poker tables started -- labeled as such, and based on the personalities of my beta guys), but if someone totally kicks my ass at one of the new games, bot or no, the game might be pulled, but he'll be paid. As long as there was no cheating or collusion, which I wrote some serious analytics to look for. But if he fairly kicks my ass for a million dollars on a $5 table, I pretty much deserve to be strung up; he can take over the business, and I'll go back to driving a cab.

*I'm also blocking Costa Rica, Israel, France, Italy, China, every country of the former USSR, and every country with a Muslim majority, since the religion prohibits it and you don't want to get on the wrong side of those people.

*I'm not going to verify players when they withdraw. I'm going to make them verify by video-chatting with a casino host up front, before they make their first deposit. This is just one area I think needs to be improved upon. I'm planning to use the whole Israeli El-Al method of figuring out if someone's legit, you know, eyeball to eyeball. I'll have them hold up two pieces of photo ID to the camera, and snapshot them for the records. Since I'm not licensed and the only reason to do this really is to protect myself from fraud, I figure I have a better chance if I can look someone in the eye and ask a few questions. Once they pass the interview, they can deposit and play for real, and withdraw any way they want to without having to go through some crazy process. Better to do it up front.

*Insurance -- Good idea, and I'm going to look into it. I have no idea who offers that kind of thing. Doubt I could interest Lloyds.

 

[Mouche12]

Sounds good JS, I am from the Netherlands and I'd love to give your casino a try...

 

[secret2]

Well...

..you had me at ,'Hello'.

You remind me of a Private Eye, in the smoky triangle of tobacco smoke in a lounge bar, playing Poker...or in a backroom of a lounge. LOL!

I wish you well. It's always a breath of fresh air to read such honesty and integrity.



Gosh, for some reason I want to turn on the telly and watch a 'Black and white' oldie. :notworthy


But that's just me.

I will give it a try, too!

 

[jod5413]

Wow, JR! Welcome!

Quite a task you have set for yourself. It is interesting to read your thoughts on how you will run this casino of yours. The only problem I see is you not respecting slots players.

I don't like slot machines, I only have one, and it's more of a brain teaser than a "drool-box".

Slots players are the bread and butter that keep a casino going, IMO. A lot of them like table games and video poker, too. We do love our slots. But, to each his own.

Good Luck to you!

 

[Nifty29]

If you want to run a successful online casino, you have to provide a good selection of high quality slots.

As you said, there may be the odd pro who can beat your table/unique games, but everyone will lose on slots in the medium to long term and you would be throwing away a huge potential revenue stream. Nobody can beat the slots...anybody that says they can is playing with themselves.

I agree with Vinyl (and I'm going to do it in less than 759 words ) in regards to having a generous float when starting up. The ability to pay winners quickly and without fuss is what all new operators are judged on, along with game selection and quality.

One post here about being screwed around with payments and it's all downhill from there, as many ex-operators can attest to.

Learn from the mistakes of others - that is the key.

 

[jstrike]

I didn't mean to come off like I was defaming slot players. I come from a long line of them. One of my uncles was even a slots manager at Caesar's back in the 70s. Although he used to say the only guys who ever win at the casino are the guys who walk in, put it all down on one blackjack hand, and walk out.

I just don't get slots these days. To me, the new ones are too complicated. You look at it and read the instructions and you just can't tell what the odds are...I have a hard time with most of them even figuring out what a winning combination is going to be or how it's gonna pay, and what triggers the bonuses. I feel like a lot of them are all flash to dazzle you, and if they're rigged you'd have a hard time even figuring out how let alone proving it. Part of my design is to make it easy for the player to determine the odds and for anyone to prove clearly that the slots are fair. That's the approach I'm taking to everything with this project. That's also why I made all the tables multiplayer, even roulette and craps.

I do plan on adding more slots, eventually... I made a code template that'll let me do just about any combination of things you could want. I'd like to hear more about what slot players are looking for these days in a new machine. The one I do have, it's pretty simple on the surface. Just three reels with fruits, and three paylines across, paid only on combinations that run right to left, just like the old nickel bandits. The trick to it is, though, that you can change the number of fruits (2-10), the number of reels (3-8), the weight of each fruit on each reel separately, and the contrast on the pay table between every spin if you want to. The best combinations pay out close to 98%. You can weight it for big long-shot wins, (big being like $100 on a 5¢ slot), or lots of small hits, or for the best overall EV. Or just play the classic version at around 95%. I figure the uniqueness of that is enough to get me started.

Now, I could take any of those combinations and make a six-reel slot with dozens of paylines, wilds, bonuses rounds, coin flips and unicorns running around...I mean anything, really...but I don't know what people want in that regard 'cause this originally started more as a poker and tables project than anything else. So if there's someone out there with a great idea for a machine they'd like to see in action, give me a holler. I'm open.

As far as limits and a float, I'd be curious to hear if people would be turned off by a new casino only having 25¢ to $5 blackjack and $.05/$.25 slots at the beginning. I think that's what it's going to have to start at, until the float is bigger. I'll freely admit I'm starting this with about $5,000 in house funds, and some of that's going to go to freerolls and guarantees and things...and whatever happens the policy is always going to remain that I'll hold 150% of cash in the system for instant payouts at all times, even if that means I have to take out another loan, and I'll only start figuring gross gaming revenue after that. A man can't buy his honor, and I'd rather spend the rest of my life broke and in debt than not be able to pay a player. But I'm hoping it doesn't come to that. So I'm putting the emphasis on poker to start with, and I might even have to turn off the other games at the beginning if it starts looking too risky. But I'm wondering if there's a market for low-stakes stuff like that.

Anyway, thanks again for the positive comments and suggestions. I can't wait to hear more.

 

[Jasminebed]

I appreciate your upfrontness too, but I agree with jod about slots being bread and butter. Table games might pay back higher percentage wise, which is why a slot stable is a wise investment.

I think you might want to rethink your licencing as well. Kahnawake has made great strides in its respectability, and fees are much lower than the EEU jurisdictions. It is not necessary to run your support out of the same location.

If you want to take a good look at a small independent casino that has made a loyal following, starting small and remaining smallish, 3Dice is a great model.

And remember, free advice is worth what you paid for it, but never refuse it. I have a motto that if three people you trust give you the same advice, you should seriously consider it.

Welcome to CM.

 

[davey]

How long before you're up and running?

Hi Mate
How long do you recon before you're up and running? Will you have roulette and if so what will the min bet be? If it's one cent and you allow Australians, you've won me for sure.
Good luck mate
Davey

 

[jstrike]

Davey,

I'm tentatively planning on launching it in early January, but I'm still dealing with lawyers, banks, weeding out legitimate e-wallets from bad ones, credit card processing...all the headaches I never thought about when I started this trip. We'll happily accept players from the land of Oz.

We're opening with American roulette. At your request, I'm going to make 5¢ - $5 tables available that will take a 1¢ bet on numbers. All the tables are multiplayer (4 spots per roulette wheel) so the action is automatic when there's more than one player, giving everybody time to place their bets. It's therefore not as rapid as a lot of online roulette. It gets only about half again as many spins per hour as a wheel in a real casino. On the plus side, you can sit at six tables at once, if you've got a big enough screen.

Nice to hear you'd like to give it a shot!

 

[aceking123]

We're opening with American roulette. At your request, I'm going to make 5¢ - $5 tables available that will take a 1¢ bet on numbers. All the tables are multiplayer (4 spots per roulette wheel) so the action is automatic when there's more than one player, giving everybody time to place their bets. It's therefore not as rapid as a lot of online roulette. It gets only about half again as many spins per hour as a wheel in a real casino. On the plus side, you can sit at six tables at once, if you've got a big enough screen.

hi strike . would it not be far better to use european roulette than usa ? im thinking most players do prefer european roulette as the odds are better . also when you say max dollar bet of $5 am i right in thinking this is the max straight up single bet you can do on a single number meaning $5 = $175 payout stake remains ? or is the max over the whole table ?

 

[jstrike]

hi strike . would it not be far better to use european roulette than usa ? im thinking most players do prefer european roulette as the odds are better . also when you say max dollar bet of $5 am i right in thinking this is the max straight up single bet you can do on a single number meaning $5 = $175 payout stake remains ? or is the max over the whole table ?

Hi Mr. Jones. I'm definitely going to build a European roulette version after we launch, but animating the Roulette wheel and board was one of the most time-intensive parts of any game on the site. It's done in 3d. And I have to put all my energy into improving the existing games so close to launch... it'll have to wait 'til we're making a little money and I can afford to hire some other programmers. Hope that won't put too many players off.

About the bets, I'm figuring it out right now, but it seems to me that a 1¢ table would have a (100x) $1 maximum on inside bets, and outside bets would be between 5¢ and $5. We have no 5¢ chip, so the base price of an outside bet would be 10¢ in that case. That's a wider range than I'd give to most other tables...I'm open to extending the minimum by 10x on that one. Usually a $1-$50 table would have a $10 maximum on inside bets and a $5 minimum on outside bets. But this is all still being worked out, we haven't launched yet, so any of what I'm telling you here could change for better or worse.

There are definitely no whole table maximums on any of the games, and there won't be any.

 

[Gabriel_LCP]

Hey great intro! I am the affiliate manager for Live Casino Partners and we are based here in Costa Rica! Anything you need just let us know!

 

[aceking123]

hi again , just another point for when you get time or chance maybe on your 3 d roulette how about tier bets etc etc neighbours bets ????

 

[jstrike]

Mr. Jones, I'm glad to say we've all neighbor bets, 3, 4, 5 and 6 spot bets, at the same minimum. Also, you can see the other players bets at the table in realtime. There's not an automatic way to place a tier or snake bet, but before the wheel spins, chips can be dragged around on the table, put on top of other bets and combined, removed, etc. in a very easy manner, and shift-clicking an existing bet allows you to drag the value up or down by an increment of whatever chip you have selected in the chip palette. So it's quick and easy to place any combination you like. The software doesn't currently offer automatic re-placement or letting bets ride, but I'm looking at adding those features to all the games possibly before launch.

The software can't allow bets called while the wheel is spinning, because the RNG decides the number at the start of the visual spin sequence for the player, and delivers it to the player then, so that the actual spin the player sees just tries to get the physics to look right based on the predetermined random number. If you have a slow computer, the wheel can be jumpy because of the 3d involved, but the ball knows where it's going to end up. Since the user's software receives the number at the time the spin starts, we can't accept any more bets after that, or hackers could just read the number and bet it

 

[davey]

Not yankee roulette please mate!

Hi again JStrike
I was getting so excited I fed my chooks twice yesterday but you've lost me now, or at least until you get the Eurpean roulette going. As we all know two zeros actually doubles the house advantage and us punters need all the help we can get.
Perhaps you could try what Bet Voyager do with their American Roulette. They have 38 numbers but they pay 37/1 on any straight up win. They operate with no house edge on any form of roulette and I love it.
You could perhaps pay 36/1 which would be better than the normal 35/1.
I desperately need a backup in case the even money betting send Bet Vogager broke.
Cheers
Davey

 

[jstrike]

Y'know Davey, that's a good idea. 36:1 on straight up bets, 18:1 on neighbors, 9:1 on corners. I'm gonna do it. Can't really offer 37:1 as I am going into business to make a profit. But if that's what it takes to make us competitive with the sites that have European tables, then I think we've gotta go for it.

 

[davey]

No worries mate

Yea that will definitely get you more business as you could advertise the bonus pay. I'm amost certain there are only Bet Voyager and Bet Fair who actually have the 'no zero' roulette, otherwise you would be on par with the all the other casino's European Roulette and well ahead as far as their American roulette is concerned. Incidently Bet Fair don't accept Aussies or Americans so they're no good to me.
I have a million other ideas on roulette as setting up a casino was and idea of mine also but I figure at 58 I have left my run a bit late.
Cheers
Davo

 

[jstrike]

Whoooops. Sorry, Davey. This is a case of me being comically bad at math. I woke up this morning and smacked myself on the head.

What would have to be offered would be 36 to 1 on spots, 17.49 to 1 on neighbors, and 8.24 to 1 on corners, to keep the overall house edge at between 1.75% and 2.63% on inside bets. So denominations would come into play. If you bet 1¢ on a straight spot you'd get 37¢ back on a win. But if you bet 1¢ on a neighbor you'd get back 17¢. You'd have to bet 2¢ to get 37¢ back on a neighbor bet. Likewise on a corner, you'd only get 9 back on 1¢ or 18 back on 2¢, but you'd get 28 back on 3¢ and 37¢ back on 4¢.

Actually, a 3¢ corner bet would be the best bet on the table.

It's got to be this way, because the way I wrote it originally I realized gives the player up to a 5.26% edge over the house in some cases.

Also. I didn't realize Betfair doesn't take Australian players. I know lots of online casinos still do... I'm obviously going to have to have the lawyers check all this out. Australia was not on our blacklist, and hopefully it won't have to be.

 

[SlotMonster]

Just noticed you are not accepting players from ex-USSR countries

Why?

 

[jstrike]

Just noticed you are not accepting players from ex-USSR countries

Why?

I should have cleared that up. We won't allow players from Russia because of the ban there, and also all of the -stans are out. The EU countries, Latvia, Lithuania and Estonia will probably be allowed, but I don't know how much traffic we can get there because we don't have anything in those languages. Eventually, I would like to allow the Ukraine, Belarus, Armenia and Georgia, but we may not open there at first. Because of the language barrier, it might be very difficult for us to do business there as a small casino. We're also worried that it's a very high risk area for sophisticated payment scams, chargebacks, hackers, etc., which could drive us out of business before we get off the ground. I'm also worried that those areas are already "taken" and I don't want any problems. Just the cost of protecting ourselves there is more than we will probably make in the first year in the rest of the world.

It's unfortunate. Two of my grandparents are from Belarus and the Ukraine, although I don't speak the language, they spoke fluent Russian and White Russian. They left in 1917. I know a lot of Russians, Ukrainians and Armenians in Los Angeles who are good people and love to gamble. But I also drove a taxi in that city, and know enough of the modern dark side to make me very careful -- especially about stepping into anyone's territory.

I hope that explains it. Maybe if / when we have enough cash to protect ourselves, we can open up to the region.