Casino Plex not paying my big win out

[Nate]

Interesting Nate.

At what point does "fattening ones pockets over minor issues" become a legitimate enforcement of a mutually agreed contract? 5 mins late? 10 mins late? A hour? A day?

Do you see my point? Once you start bending rules for one, you have to do it for all, and you may as well not have rules. The rule at casinoplex is crap and rogue, and I wouldn't play there based on that one fact alone, but the player agreed to it....they didn't have to, and chances are very good that if they READ the terms first they would not have taken a bonus at all.

I don't understand why myself and others are copping flak when we are actually in agreement on most points. The only difference is that we are saying that the player placed themselves in a position where they could be ripped off by a predatory term. Nobody forced him to take a bonus. It wasn't awarded without specific agreement and acceptabce from the player.....in fact, as I outlined, there were actually FOUR safeguards/opportunities provided by casinoplex to PREVENT this situation occurring, and there seems to be a general ignorance of the fact that the player refused to take advantage of ANY of them.

The whole situation was created by BOTH parties in one form or another. One is having the book thrown at them by (mostly) the usual "casinos are evil" suspects, whilst the other is absolved of any and all responsibility and made out to be an innocent victim.....geez even the OP admits he's mostly to blame.

Some can bang on about a couple of words (e.g. lynch mob) or head off down Irrelevant Street (e.g. the finsoft issue ), but NOBODY has shown ANY example of the casino breaching ANY of its own terms, nor making up any in retrospect and enforcing them retrospectively. In THIS case, the casino has done NOTHING wrong.....in THIS case.

In the case of the existence of the actual TERM, they most certainly have done something wrong. Its a huge red flag and anyone playing there would have to be nuts......but one would have to be even more nuts to just accept a bonus without having the first clue what terms were attached.

Is the term rogue? Yes.
Should the casino be the subject of a CM warning etc? Quite possibly.
Is the term designed to fleece players? Probably.
Should the casino return his balance for further wagering as a goodwill gesture? IMO, yes.

Did the player read the terms before playing? No.
Did the player wait for support to assist? No.
Did the player check his wagering amount before withdrawing? No.
Did the player admit fault? Yes.


Bryan has said it many times, and it especially applies to this issue:

"If you don't like the terms of a bonus then don't take it"

I also believe he has stated to the effect that if you don't read the terms and accept it anyway, you're responsible for the consequences.

The main problem I see that is causing conflict is that there are actually TWO seperate issues at play in this thread, and many are only addressing one, and some don't even believe the other even exists.

Of course, this is all coming from someone like me who is a known "rogue defender"

I see your point Nifty and I do not dispute the finer details - Re: the OP's negligence.

I was just pointing out that An Accredited lender would go into dialogue or even negotiation over an issue like this.

It is the rogue lenders who charge the 50% and take advantage of the situation - 'Sorry you are a minute late - You OWE me' - It's in their terms, but does it make it right? - Yes I have agreed to them, I was stupid, but does it give them a the right to steal from me?

This is why the rogue lender stays on the black market and is unable to gain accreditation - His business practices are unethical and bordering on thievery...

In an Ideal World, we would expect the Casino show some integrity and give the OP the opportunity to complete the WR OR pay him his money. It's obvious from the reps perspective, he does not want to engage in ANY form of negotiation. The attitude and actions themselves are typical of rogues. Sorry you broke the T&C's and your money is confiscated - Tough Luck.

Matt brought up an interesting quote about bonuses being credited - Lets see where that takes us. I would be interested to see the response now...

Nate

 

[chuchu59]

Nate, The example you are listing is different because of one essential element that is required for the enforcement of any contract - consideration. A bank lends money to a person and that is consideration. In the OP's case, the so-called terms are there but what is the consideration with regard to stating that the submission of a withdrawal forfeits all bonuses. The MG casino, for some casinos, will state specifically when you attempt a w/d before meeting wrs that you have not met wrs and the portion of uncleared bonuses will not be reinstated once you embark on this course of action(withdrawing). The term the casino is using for confiscation of the winnings bears no relevance whatsoever to the play at the casino and imo those who insist that the player has not adhered to the terms are condoning the rogue action of the casino. In other words, no one can cry foul in future when there are rogue terms and casinos use them to deny or confiscate winnings. I can only shake my head in disbelief.

 

[mrmark21]

I've been getting countless spam from this casino. I was tempted to play one of the bonus offers but this casino isn't accredited. Suffice it to say after reading this thread I won't be taking a chance on this one.

 

[Mouche12]

I think my emails to Casino Plex have not done any harm in this case, but I will nevertheless take greater care in the future. Also, it appeared that Nifty was corresponding with Tropica in the non-payment of $ 7K - and that is quite alright then?

Confused by the rep's comments now - he refers to a € 1000 bonus on the second deposit - I thought it was only € 100?? In any case, I am also eagerly awaiting their response about breaking their own rule re issuing 2nd deposit bonuses when there is still a balance in the player's account resulting from a previous deposit + bonus.

Anyway, I learned that the OP will try other resources to get his winnings reinstated and sincerely hope that he will be successful!

 

[wobble33]

Martin, in your own terms it states

The Second deposit bonus and Daily Bonus is given only if you have no funds in your account from a previous deposit and deposit bonus (account balance plus bonuses is less than €1) and have not requested a withdrawal.

So how was this player able to even claim that second deposit bonus. (this is assuming that it was a 1st and 2nd deposit bonus). If it was not the welcome bonus is there a different set of t&c for the bonuses the op took because the one above is from your general bonus t&c.

i have played a lot on playtech casinos, etc jackpot 24/7 and corals only to mention a few, and no way can you recieve a bonus if you already have a bonus outstanding on your account. it just does not go through the bonus code or even when its automatic. so how this man got this bonus in the first place i have no idea.

 

[Nifty29]

I think my emails to Casino Plex have not done any harm in this case, but I will nevertheless take greater care in the future. Also, it appeared that Nifty was corresponding with Tropica in the non-payment of $ 7K - and that is quite alright then?

Confused by the rep's comments now - he refers to a € 1000 bonus on the second deposit - I thought it was only € 100?? In any case, I am also eagerly awaiting their response about breaking their own rule re issuing 2nd deposit bonuses when there is still a balance in the player's account resulting from a previous deposit + bonus.

Anyway, I learned that the OP will try other resources to get his winnings reinstated and sincerely hope that he will be successful!

I wish some people would READ properly.

I was NOT corresponding with ANYONE regarding the $7k Tropica case.

The former rep sent Bryan and I an email...not the other way around. End of story.

I did NOT, and never HAVE, contacted a casino to interfere/intrude upon another player's case. IMO, it usually does more harm than good as it can make the casino feel "pressured" or "threatened" and that doesn't usually end well for the player....which is why I don't DO it. If a player asked me to contact someone on their behalf, then I would consider it, but I leave that kind of things to affiliates like KK etc, to whom I have directed such requests that have come to me originally.

Another good example of people only hearing what they want to hear.

 

[vinylweatherman]

i have played a lot on playtech casinos, etc jackpot 24/7 and corals only to mention a few, and no way can you recieve a bonus if you already have a bonus outstanding on your account. it just does not go through the bonus code or even when its automatic. so how this man got this bonus in the first place i have no idea.

It would only happen if the software saw no outstanding WR from an earlier bonus. This opens the possibility that we are being told a few porkies by the rep about the cause being left over WR from the earlier bonus.

The second bonus would have been claimed when the balance stood at €1.30, so would surely fail UNLESS at the point of claiming the WR had already been removed due to it being a small amount. The same with the third bonus, which was the €100 on a €500 deposit. This got credited, so the system at that point cannot have found any prior unmet WR. This leaves us with the WR that would have come with the final €100 bonus. The question here is whether that WR had been completed.

It seems the rep is telling one story, but the software is telling another. It's a shame the OP didn't take a screenshot of this "clear warning" they got (according to the rep), as it would show what the software detected about WR at the time.

If it turns out the casino DID bend the rules to allow the bonus to be claimed when they had the prospect of €1000 coming in, they can jolly well take circumstances into account and bend them when the money is set to flow the other way.

The reps stance that the rules as written are an absolute, no exceptions can be made, does not fit with the bonuses getting credited when the terms are an absolute "no they can't" if there is still an outstanding WR.

 

[Slotster!]

The fact the casino are corresponding in this way, discussing the case with other people etc is another indication towards the professionalism of this outfit.

It's the good old 'make it up as you go along' level of customer service...

At least this thread is here to serve as a warning to anyone thinking about chucking some hard earned cash @ Casinoplex -- I guarantee this debacle will cost them way more than the 17k they decided to keep.

 

[vinylweatherman]

The fact the casino are corresponding in this way, discussing the case with other people etc is another indication towards the professionalism of this outfit.

It's the good old 'make it up as you go along' level of customer service...

At least this thread is here to serve as a warning to anyone thinking about chucking some hard earned cash @ Casinoplex -- I guarantee this debacle will cost them way more than the 17k they decided to keep.

It will if the OP goes via Gambling Grumbles, as everything is done in the public gaze, and the casino may now be in damage limitation mode, and are likely to pay if their story falls apart.

 

[Slotster!]

It will if the OP goes via Gambling Grumbles, as everything is done in the public gaze, and the casino may now be in damage limitation mode, and are likely to pay if their story falls apart.

I don't know what Gambling Grumbles is, but this OP should make as much noise and create as much exposure as possible.

I would.

If I was 17k down - I'd want every single last penny of it diverted away from these sort of outfits and sunk into somewhere that at least would treat you as a person as opposed to a mug punter ATM they can rip off at will - pointing at the rules board and saying "ha ha ha unlucky!" - get f****d.

What's so frustrating is that casinos have a house edge, run well they are profitable and extremely viable businesses. Jesus Christ - people walk in and throw money at you for nothing - it's the best business model on earth. The ones that play dirty and then try to stitch up the winners are the scum of the earth.

 

[just play]

I've been following this thread since day one. I posted on page 2 that the OP broke a term, that was that. Then the rep joined in and had his side of the story. Usually when the rep joins in, we find out the whole story and the player is usually wrong. In this case, I think the casino is wrong. The rep posted this...

Originally Posted by CasinoPlex

Hi Mario

I have just checked your account with regards to the loss of your bonuses and winnings.
On the 26th of March at 14:41 you made a deposit of €500 where you received a bonus of €1000 which had had a wagering of 50 times = 50.000. After playing different games your end balance was €1.30 meaning that this bonus and its wagering were still active.
On the same day the 26th of March you made another deposit of €500 and received a bonus of €1000 which had a wagering of 50 times = 50.000. Your new balance was now €1,501.30.
Now since you didn’t finish the first bonus the wagering is still active and you have to clear the bonus wagering for the first bonus.

Then Mattsgame posted this...

Martin, in your own terms it states

The Second deposit bonus and Daily Bonus is given only if you have no funds in your account from a previous deposit and deposit bonus (account balance plus bonuses is less than €1) and have not requested a withdrawal.

So how was this player able to even claim that second deposit bonus. (this is assuming that it was a 1st and 2nd deposit bonus). If it was not the welcome bonus is there a different set of t&c for the bonuses the op took because the one above is from your general bonus t&c.

In this case, I think the casino is wrong and should in fact give back the player his money and finish the LAST wagering requirement, because it says in the terms you can't even claim another bonus unless there are no funds in your account. But for some reason he was able to claim 3 bonuses with money in his account. Something is wrong here.

If however like Mattsgame said, this wasn't a 1st and 2nd deposit bonus...what are the terms for regular deposit bonuses?

I do not like the fact just because someone withdrawals money, but still has a playthrough left they get all their money confiscated? This isn't right. I know at RTGs, (if it's not in the cashier) they will email you and tell you that you still have x amount of dollars to playthrough, this seems to be the only fair and honest way.

 

[Bladefury]

Hey guys

i have in fact told the story to askgamblers.com, i am not sure what will come of it, but as i said even if i get the 17 000 back just to finish WR with it I'll even be happy, even that seems like an impossible task.

 

[Nifty29]

I've been following this thread since day one. I posted on page 2 that the OP broke a term, that was that. Then the rep joined in and had his side of the story. Usually when the rep joins in, we find out the whole story and the player is usually wrong. In this case, I think the casino is wrong. The rep posted this...





Then Mattsgame posted this...




In this case, I think the casino is wrong and should in fact give back the player his money and finish the LAST wagering requirement, because it says in the terms you can't even claim another bonus unless there are no funds in your account. But for some reason he was able to claim 3 bonuses with money in his account. Something is wrong here.

If however like Mattsgame said, this wasn't a 1st and 2nd deposit bonus...what are the terms for regular deposit bonuses?

I do not like the fact just because someone withdrawals money, but still has a playthrough left they get all their money confiscated? This isn't right. I know at RTGs, (if it's not in the cashier) they will email you and tell you that you still have x amount of dollars to playthrough, this seems to be the only fair and honest way.

To be fair, the rep hasn't responded yet as to exactly what bonuses were being used, as those terms seem to apply only to first and second welcome bonuses.

If it turns out the software screwed up and allowed a bonus when it shouldn't have, then it most certainly strengthens the players case and would be sufficient grounds imo to void that carry over WR term and have the players balance reinstated to finish his wagering. After all, if the bonus wasn't allowed, he wouldn't have been in this situation. I also think the player, if this happens, should consider himself extremely lucky given his complete ignorance of just about everything to do with his acceptance of said bonus.

Still, VWM has called the rep a liar, so he's obviously been able to hack in to casinoplexs systems, so we can totally rely on everything he says now. I'm sure the rep appreciates being labeled a liar, as I'm equally sure it will help the OPs case....NOT.

 

[just play]

To be fair, the rep hasn't responded yet as to exactly what bonuses were being used, as those terms seem to apply only to first and second welcome bonuses.

If it turns out the software screwed up and allowed a bonus when it shouldn't have, then it most certainly strengthens the players case and would be sufficient grounds imo to void that carry over WR term and have the players balance reinstated to finish his wagering. After all, if the bonus wasn't allowed, he wouldn't have been in this situation. I also think the player, if this happens, should consider himself extremely lucky given his complete ignorance of just about everything to do with his acceptance of said bonus.

Ya, that's what I was trying to get at. You worded it better than me. Which bonuses where they? I can't believe it would take this long to find out? A few clicks and the rep would know correct? Or why not the player...Bladefury...were these bonuses first and second welcome bonuses?

Strengthens the players case? I would say, I MAKES the players case no?

I'm confused on your last sentence...why should he consider himself lucky, and why would he be ignorant? If it comes to light it's the casino that messed up?

 

[Bladefury]

Ya, that's what I was trying to get at. You worded it better than me. Which bonuses where they? I can't believe it would take this long to find out? A few clicks and the rep would know correct? Or why not the player...Bladefury...were these bonuses first and second welcome bonuses?

Strengthens the players case? I would say, I MAKES the players case no?

I'm confused on your last sentence...why should he consider himself lucky, and why would he be ignorant? If it comes to light it's the casino that messed up?

I had already received a welcome bonus the week before and lost it all.

These two bonuses were just part of the Wednesday.

 

[Mouche12]

@ Bladefury - I am happy to hear you went ahead and submitted your case to AskGamblers. I keep my fingers crossed for you!

There appear to be a few indiscrepancies (a $100 bonus according to the OP vs a $1000 bonus according to the casino rep; the 2nd bonus should not have been issued in the first place) and more things may come to the surface. I am sure AskGamblers will get to the bottom of this.

Best of luck Bladefury!

 

[Bladefury]

@ Bladefury - I am happy to hear you went ahead and submitted your case to AskGamblers. I keep my fingers crossed for you!

There appear to be a few indiscrepancies (a $100 bonus according to the OP vs a $1000 bonus according to the casino rep; the 2nd bonus should not have been issued in the first place) and more things may come to the surface. I am sure AskGamblers will get to the bottom of this.

Best of luck Bladefury!

The first bonus was 1000 bonus on my 500 deposit.
the second bonus was also 1000 bonus on another 500 deposit. I had lost all this and had 1.30 left.

A few days later i deposited another 500, and received 100 on that.

 

[Slotster!]

The first bonus was 1000 bonus on my 500 deposit.
the second bonus was also 1000 bonus on another 500 deposit. I had lost all this and had 1.30 left.

A few days later i deposited another 500, and received 100 on that.

Please let us know how you get on. If this casino want to claw back any shred of integrity - the VERY LEAST they'll do is give you another crack at meeting WR...

I won't hold my breath.

 

[Nifty29]

Ya, that's what I was trying to get at. You worded it better than me. Which bonuses where they? I can't believe it would take this long to find out? A few clicks and the rep would know correct? Or why not the player...Bladefury...were these bonuses first and second welcome bonuses?

Strengthens the players case? I would say, I MAKES the players case no?

I'm confused on your last sentence...why should he consider himself lucky, and why would he be ignorant? If it comes to light it's the casino that messed up?

I was referring to the fact that he didn't have a clue about what the bonus terms were....there could have been a 20% max bet term for instance, in which case he would have been totally screwed. Its "lucky" (depending on what happens now) that the term he breached COULD turn out to be a system bug of sorts that "forced" him into a situation that the terms state he shouldn't have been allowed to be in.

However, it now appears that the bonuses concerned were NOT welcome bonuses at all and that the rules Matt found may not apply. It also shows that the OP was not a "newb" at this casino, and may well have KNOWN that his balance needed to be under $1 to claim another bonus, else he wouldn't have been able to claim the second part of the welcome bonus (which he says he did). It also means he actually had MORE opportunities to check out terms and ask questions etc.

As I said earlier though, VWM has full access to the casinos systems, which is how he was able to accuse the rep of deliberately misleading the membership by posting untruths, so we should wait for him check the players history before calling it IMO.

Its interesting to note that intercasino (accredited) and some other casinos a while back had the same policy regarding carry over WR, but it didn't stop them being accredited and caused only a few "grrrr" posts in the forum, as it was in the terms and players knew what the score was as a result. It seems now that its suddenly absolutely rogue and scandalous, purely because it cost a careless player $17k. If it was $17 or $170 the thread would be a tenth of its size, which makes no sense at all to me. The view seems to be that they're rogue fraudsters if they confiscate large amounts, but its OK if its a small amount.....there's no logic in that at all. Maybe its because intercasinos bonus terms were so good otherwise with low WR?

 

[Bladefury]

I was referring to the fact that he didn't have a clue about what the bonus terms were....there could have been a 20% max bet term for instance, in which case he would have been totally screwed. Its "lucky" (depending on what happens now) that the term he breached COULD turn out to be a system bug of sorts that "forced" him into a situation that the terms state he shouldn't have been allowed to be in.

However, it now appears that the bonuses concerned were NOT welcome bonuses at all and that the rules Matt found may not apply. It also shows that the OP was not a "newb" at this casino, and may well have KNOWN that his balance needed to be under $1 to claim another bonus, else he wouldn't have been able to claim the second part of the welcome bonus (which he says he did). It also means he actually had MORE opportunities to check out terms and ask questions etc.

As I said earlier though, VWM has full access to the casinos systems, which is how he was able to accuse the rep of deliberately misleading the membership by posting untruths, so we should wait for him check the players history before calling it IMO.

Its interesting to note that intercasino (accredited) and some other casinos a while back had the same policy regarding carry over WR, but it didn't stop them being accredited and caused only a few "grrrr" posts in the forum, as it was in the terms and players knew what the score was as a result. It seems now that its suddenly absolutely rogue and scandalous, purely because it cost a careless player $17k. If it was $17 or $170 the thread would be a tenth of its size, which makes no sense at all to me. The view seems to be that they're rogue fraudsters if they confiscate large amounts, but its OK if its a small amount.....there's no logic in that at all. Maybe its because intercasinos bonus terms were so good otherwise with low WR?

There's no Logic in 17 000 Euros disappearing with a click of a button, rules, no rules, terms and conditions, or no terms and conditions. For example silver sands casino doesn't allow any withdrawing with the amount that you still need to WR on, it just leaves it there for you to finish. You keep calling me careless, ignorant and few other names I've seen you post here. But that's ok, i am not worried about it, i just don't want to see this happen to others, and believe me it will. All they need to do is make a change that allows players to keep their wagering amount, is that to much to ask for? You defending them like this just makes them carry on with these ridiculous rules and so called regulations of theirs, which in no way benefits us as players one single bit.

Even after nearly one week i have not even received my so called 1500 that was suppose to be put in my account, due to them having "problems" with their system.

 

[vinylweatherman]

I was referring to the fact that he didn't have a clue about what the bonus terms were....there could have been a 20% max bet term for instance, in which case he would have been totally screwed. Its "lucky" (depending on what happens now) that the term he breached COULD turn out to be a system bug of sorts that "forced" him into a situation that the terms state he shouldn't have been allowed to be in.

However, it now appears that the bonuses concerned were NOT welcome bonuses at all and that the rules Matt found may not apply. It also shows that the OP was not a "newb" at this casino, and may well have KNOWN that his balance needed to be under $1 to claim another bonus, else he wouldn't have been able to claim the second part of the welcome bonus (which he says he did). It also means he actually had MORE opportunities to check out terms and ask questions etc.

As I said earlier though, VWM has full access to the casinos systems, which is how he was able to accuse the rep of deliberately misleading the membership by posting untruths, so we should wait for him check the players history before calling it IMO.

Its interesting to note that intercasino (accredited) and some other casinos a while back had the same policy regarding carry over WR, but it didn't stop them being accredited and caused only a few "grrrr" posts in the forum, as it was in the terms and players knew what the score was as a result. It seems now that its suddenly absolutely rogue and scandalous, purely because it cost a careless player $17k. If it was $17 or $170 the thread would be a tenth of its size, which makes no sense at all to me. The view seems to be that they're rogue fraudsters if they confiscate large amounts, but its OK if its a small amount.....there's no logic in that at all. Maybe its because intercasinos bonus terms were so good otherwise with low WR?

The difference is that with Intercasino, the cashier protected the PLAYER. It simply wasn't possible to submit a withdrawal for any amount that was still quarantined under a WR. This is how it should be handled with this casino, but of course, that meant Intercasino could never void 17K because a player withdrew a quarantined sum, whereas the casino plex cashier lets the mistake through, and then leaps on the cash and takes it away.

The rep's fairly detailed account contradicts other information, and the no bonus with pending WR also applies to "daily bonuses", not just the first and second deposit bonuses.

Even if the two big 200% bonuses were somehow allowed with pending WR, the daily bonus that lead to this incident should not have been credited as the rep said that the WR from the first of the two 200% bonuses was still active. Either the rep is wrong, or the terms are, as both contradict each other.

Nothing said now will help or hinder the OPs case as the rep has made it clear that they are not going to budge under any circumstance, even though the negative PR must already be costing them more than the 17K they grabbed, and is set to intensify as the OP is taking the issue up at another mediation site.

If 17K is that important to them, they must be strapped for cash as a bigger company would consider putting it back for completion of the WR, which by the reps account is so enormous due to the carry over from both 200% bonuses taken earlier that the likely outcome is that the player will never make WR and just bust out trying, and this would mean no payout and no bad PR for the casino.


The odd thing is that we have a casino that is making a big deal over €1.30 and a €100 20% bonus, yet on the other hand is happy to throw "deposit 500 get 1000" offers around as though €1000 means nothing to them, but €1.30 is such a big deal.

The rep doesn't seem to want to comment on what would have happened had the OP clicked "decline" when offered the last €100 bonus, but with everything else the same, but his detailed analysis of the activity suggests that the outcome would not have been different, except it would have been €16,900 that turned into €1500.

 

[chuchu59]

There's no Logic in 17 000 Euros disappearing with a click of a button, rules, no rules, terms and conditions, or no terms and conditions. For example silver sands casino doesn't allow any withdrawing with the amount that you still need to WR on, it just leaves it there for you to finish. You keep calling me careless, ignorant and few other names I've seen you post here. But that's ok, i am not worried about it, i just don't want to see this happen to others, and believe me it will. All they need to do is make a change that allows players to keep their wagering amount, is that to much to ask for? You defending them like this just makes them carry on with these ridiculous rules and so called regulations of theirs, which in no way benefits us as players one single bit.

Even after nearly one week i have not even received my so called 1500 that was suppose to be put in my account, due to them having "problems" with their system.

If they haven't changed Silver Sands is powered by Realtime Gaming and the cashier simply doesn't allow withdrawals before wagering requirements are complete. If you patronize them regularly I would be worried as they are one of the bad RTG casinos.

 

[just play]

I was referring to the fact that he didn't have a clue about what the bonus terms were....there could have been a 20% max bet term for instance, in which case he would have been totally screwed. Its "lucky" (depending on what happens now) that the term he breached COULD turn out to be a system bug of sorts that "forced" him into a situation that the terms state he shouldn't have been allowed to be in.

However, it now appears that the bonuses concerned were NOT welcome bonuses at all and that the rules Matt found may not apply. It also shows that the OP was not a "newb" at this casino, and may well have KNOWN that his balance needed to be under $1 to claim another bonus, else he wouldn't have been able to claim the second part of the welcome bonus (which he says he did). It also means he actually had MORE opportunities to check out terms and ask questions etc.

As I said earlier though, VWM has full access to the casinos systems, which is how he was able to accuse the rep of deliberately misleading the membership by posting untruths, so we should wait for him check the players history before calling it IMO.

Its interesting to note that intercasino (accredited) and some other casinos a while back had the same policy regarding carry over WR, but it didn't stop them being accredited and caused only a few "grrrr" posts in the forum, as it was in the terms and players knew what the score was as a result. It seems now that its suddenly absolutely rogue and scandalous, purely because it cost a careless player $17k. If it was $17 or $170 the thread would be a tenth of its size, which makes no sense at all to me. The view seems to be that they're rogue fraudsters if they confiscate large amounts, but its OK if its a small amount.....there's no logic in that at all. Maybe its because intercasinos bonus terms were so good otherwise with low WR?

Ok gotcha on first paragraph.

Mattsgame...I'm hoping you will chime in here on what the terms are if they were a Wednesday promotion.

I'm not familiar with Intercasino, someone else will have to chime in on that.

As I said earlier though, VWM has full access to the casinos systems, which is how he was able to accuse the rep of deliberately misleading the membership by posting untruths, so we should wait for him check the players history before calling it IMO.

Yes, everyone saw your jab at VWM the first time.

 

[mattsgame]

However, it now appears that the bonuses concerned were NOT welcome bonuses at all and that the rules Matt found may not apply. It also shows that the OP was not a "newb" at this casino, and may well have KNOWN that his balance needed to be under $1 to claim another bonus, else he wouldn't have been able to claim the second part of the welcome bonus (which he says he did). It also means he actually had MORE opportunities to check out terms and ask questions etc.


Its interesting to note that intercasino (accredited) and some other casinos a while back had the same policy regarding carry over WR, but it didn't stop them being accredited and caused only a few "grrrr" posts in the forum, as it was in the terms and players knew what the score was as a result. It seems now that its suddenly absolutely rogue and scandalous, purely because it cost a careless player $17k. If it was $17 or $170 the thread would be a tenth of its size, which makes no sense at all to me. The view seems to be that they're rogue fraudsters if they confiscate large amounts, but its OK if its a small amount.....there's no logic in that at all. Maybe its because intercasinos bonus terms were so good otherwise with low WR?

.

It does seem as though it was not the welcome bonus. So what bonus was it? a daily bonus? a V.I.P bonus? This is the general terms and conditions Outdated URL (Invalid) Then we have the V.I.P terms Outdated URL (Invalid) almost all of these bonuses have the same term I referred to earlier in the thread or link to the general bonus terms and conditions.

You are right mate about Intercasino but this scenario was also impossible at Intercasino as they made sure you zeroed out from what I remember correctly.

If 17K is that important to them, they must be strapped for cash as a bigger company would consider putting it back for completion of the WR, which by the reps account is so enormous due to the carry over from both 200% bonuses taken earlier that the likely outcome is that the player will never make WR and just bust out trying, and this would mean no payout and no bad PR for the casino.

All along you have been technically correct about the terms but this paragraph sums up most of the casinos on the accredited list if a genuine mistake was made and I believe it was here I mean this is over a measly 1.30 that was left in his account when he made another deposit.

I have done this myself a couple of times, yes we should always zero out but at times I just load up the casino and go straight to banking (its worse on the flash casino) and the times that this has happened to me customer service just go in and remove it and say Congratulation your free to withdraw. W

Ok gotcha on first paragraph.

Mattsgame...I'm hoping you will chime in here on what the terms are if they were a Wednesday promotion.

Only the OP can tell us which bonus he took, the problem is Casino Plex link to those terms on almost all of their bonuses as their general terms and conditions.

Op which bonus did you take or were offered?

The terms are horrible and this is one of the reasons I stopped promoting them a while back along with the withdrawal limits and silly hoops players had to go through that Simmo mentioned earlier.

 

[garya125]

Hi Everyone

Im a new member and thought i was an experienced online gambler until i saw this site!

Just wanted to say good luck to Bladefury. Although as it has been pointed out several times regarding the T & C's I have to say i find it disgusting that you can lose 17K by clicking one button. In the very least the software should be giving him several warnings explaining very clearly that if he exited the game he would lose.

Also the attitude from some experienced members on here i find extremely irritating. If the player was aware of what the £100 bonus would do, would he have exited the game? I have to say i would have been completely unaware of this as well and can only sympathize with Bladefury. You have to realise that people arent as clued up on this subject as you are. And i dont believe waiting on an apology and then trying to get a reaction out of Bladefury helps either, especially as you would know he is extremely frustrated as we all would be.

Bladefury - Good Luck to you, Dont let them get away with this. Make as much noise as you can !

 

[Nifty29]

Hi Everyone

Im a new member and thought i was an experienced online gambler until i saw this site!

Just wanted to say good luck to Bladefury. Although as it has been pointed out several times regarding the T & C's I have to say i find it disgusting that you can lose 17K by clicking one button. In the very least the software should be giving him several warnings explaining very clearly that if he exited the game he would lose.

Also the attitude from some experienced members on here i find extremely irritating. If the player was aware of what the £100 bonus would do, would he have exited the game? I have to say i would have been completely unaware of this as well and can only sympathize with Bladefury. You have to realise that people arent as clued up on this subject as you are. And i dont believe waiting on an apology and then trying to get a reaction out of Bladefury helps either, especially as you would know he is extremely frustrated as we all would be.

Bladefury - Good Luck to you, Dont let them get away with this. Make as much noise as you can !

Know the OP do you Gary?

 

[dionysus]

Know the OP do you Gary?

lol, well, that's a bet I'd take

 

[MisterBJ]

Know the OP do you Gary?

Gary must don't know. You played the first Columbo before Peter Falk...

 

[vinylweatherman]

Know the OP do you Gary?

Can't see it from their profiles, so I don't suppose you hacked into Bryan's back end and spotted them having the same IP address or something along those lines.

It can't be any harder than hacking into a casino's back end can it

On a serious note,

From what I see, Gary took the trouble to fill in a good profile, whereas Bladefury was brief, probably because of this burning issue of the 17K. Gary has already contributed elsewhere, so it seems the probable explanation for his "good luck" reply here is down to him suddenly realising that not all casinos were as fair and reasonable as he had thought, and that joining here may have saved him from a similar fate. Without access to non public information, there is nothing to suggest a probable link between the two.

 

[Nifty29]

Can't see it from their profiles, so I don't suppose you hacked into Bryan's back end and spotted them having the same IP address or something along those lines.

It can't be any harder than hacking into a casino's back end can it

On a serious note,

From what I see, Gary took the trouble to fill in a good profile, whereas Bladefury was brief, probably because of this burning issue of the 17K. Gary has already contributed elsewhere, so it seems the probable explanation for his "good luck" reply here is down to him suddenly realising that not all casinos were as fair and reasonable as he had thought, and that joining here may have saved him from a similar fate. Without access to non public information, there is nothing to suggest a probable link between the two.

Ummm....yeah....that why I ASKED him. If I had KNOWN I wouldn't need to ASK.

I didn't outright call him a LIAR or a FRAUD, like you did with the Plex rep....which was really inappropriate IMO.

 

[Jasminebed]

The fact that its a bad term is immaterial..

I think the fact that the term is a rogue term is very relevant. Here, if a term is illegal or unenforceable, it cannot be binding, even if it forms part of a contract.

As an example, it's illegal to refuse to rent an apartment to someone because they have children. If I sign a lease saying "no children allowed" and later have a child, I can't be turfed, regardless of what the contract says.

Lenders have maximum amounts they can charge for penalties, a clause with a percentage that exceeds that allowed by law couldn't be enforced.

The OP's 17K should be reinstated and he should be allowed to try to complete WR.

 

[Simmo!]

You have to realise that people arent as clued up on this subject as you are. And i dont believe waiting on an apology and then trying to get a reaction out of Bladefury helps either, especially as you would know he is extremely frustrated as we all would be.

It's a fair point. I recently asked a friend who was a relative "newbie" to online slots to review one of my websites and he came back with words that effectively said he hadn't got a clue about half the terms I was using. It's easy to forget what the gambling world looks like as a newbie - and bonuses of all things can be the most complex! The casinos still sell them as "free money" - underhandedy in many instances - and if you don't know this industry, you could be forgiven for thinking they are a good thing. I'm sure it was a bonus that first incentivised me to play.

Experienced members here need to recognise that some people genuinely are starting out and not jump on the back of everyone because they are sceptical. I understand this industry breeds mistrust but try to keep an open mind. Just be polite until you know the score - it's not difficult

 

[garya125]

Hi Again

I was just giving my opinion (which may not be worth much)but just my opinion on what i had read. I do not know Bladefury in anyway. Im from Belfast, Northern Ireland and just thought i would comment on what i had read. I joined the site to read about other peoples experiences with BetFred as i have had a problem with them. I was going to pitch a bitch then I started reading other peoples issues with multiple casino's and realised my problems with Betfred dont compare to what is happening to other people.

People should realise that its not about taking sides with other members on here but coming together as a community and fighting against rogue casino's etc, that are cheating people out of money. It would be much better if everyone worked together instead of making jibes at each other.

I dont know who is high up on here but you are very welcome to get my ip address and Bladefurys with his permission and check our locations. It would be a humongous coincidence if we lived anywhere near each other. Or if you have any other ways to find out you can work away.

To nifty - You seem to spend a hell of a lot of time on here. Do you get paid? I think its time you opened the curtains and came to the realisation that there is a world outside your window.

To the WeatherMan - You are right. Im glad I came accross this site yesterday after i typed Trouble with Betfred into google. I am much more knowledgeable even after just one day. I bet Bladefury wishes he would have found this site before his trouble!

 

[The Dude]

Just to chime in real quick - let's quit making this a personal issue. No personal jibes please.

Some people spend a hell of a lot of time here because this is a home away (or within) a home for them. Do not pass judgement on them. I'm glad they are here - but I value all members of this forum whether newbie or oldtimer.

FWIW, the only person paid here is Max.

 

[garya125]

True Bill - Apologies .

 

[The Dude]

Back to the issue at hand. I really think this sucks. I haven't had the time to fully read into the matter 100%, but for a seemingly legitimate player losing this kind of money because of a failure to abide by certain terms is just nauseating. I would have expected that there were safeguards in place with the software to eliminate mistakes like this. But I'm guessing Playtech is unable to do this? They have the money to blow on a condominium sized booth at the ICE, but they can't protect players from making a mistake via their software and bonusing schemes.

This is how far we've gone in this industry with bonuses. The casinos have their lawyers to write up these terms, and whether or not you think they are fair, you break them, tough titty.

It's a shame that this has gone on for about 20 frustrating pages with nothing to do but accept the consequences of breaking the terms and conditions of a bonus. As far as I'm concerned, this is a decision to be made by the casino on whether or not to pay this player. Again what I've seen so far (caveat, I've relatively breezed through this thread), but what I've seen is that this is truly predatory. Why isn't there a safeguard implemented to negate these sort of problems?

 

[Mouche12]

I think the fact that the term is a rogue term is very relevant. Here, if a term is illegal or unenforceable, it cannot be binding, even if it forms part of a contract.

As an example, it's illegal to refuse to rent an apartment to someone because they have children. If I sign a lease saying "no children allowed" and later have a child, I can't be turfed, regardless of what the contract says.

Lenders have maximum amounts they can charge for penalties, a clause with a percentage that exceeds that allowed by law couldn't be enforced.

The OP's 17K should be reinstated and he should be allowed to try to complete WR.

I strongly agree with what you've said. This issue has several sides to it, but at the core of it we have this unfair/illegal (predatory) term which in many jurisdictions would not be enforceable.

If this matter cannot be resolved via AskGamblers (I sincerely hope it will though), filing a lawsuit would IMO be a good alternative, if the OP can afford to.

Let's all keep our fingers crossed for a happy outcome.

 

[Mousey]

Back to the issue at hand. I really think this sucks. I haven't had the time to fully read into the matter 100%, but for a seemingly legitimate player losing this kind of money because of a failure to abide by certain terms is just nauseating. I would have expected that there were safeguards in place with the software to eliminate mistakes like this. But I'm guessing Playtech is unable to do this? They have the money to blow on a condominium sized booth at the ICE, but they can't protect players from making a mistake via their software and bonusing schemes.

This is how far we've gone in this industry with bonuses. The casinos have their lawyers to write up these terms, and whether or not you think they are fair, you break them, tough titty.

It's a shame that this has gone on for about 20 frustrating pages with nothing to do but accept the consequences of breaking the terms and conditions of a bonus. As far as I'm concerned, this is a decision to be made by the casino on whether or not to pay this player. Again what I've seen so far (caveat, I've relatively breezed through this thread), but what I've seen is that this is truly predatory. Why isn't there a safeguard implemented to negate these sort of problems?

Well, now that they've confiscated the player's money they can't say it's not done due to expense. Playtech can now afford to hire someone to 'tidy up' their withdrawal thingy.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Back to the issue at hand. I really think this sucks. I haven't had the time to fully read into the matter 100%, but for a seemingly legitimate player losing this kind of money because of a failure to abide by certain terms is just nauseating. I would have expected that there were safeguards in place with the software to eliminate mistakes like this. But I'm guessing Playtech is unable to do this? They have the money to blow on a condominium sized booth at the ICE, but they can't protect players from making a mistake via their software and bonusing schemes.

This is how far we've gone in this industry with bonuses. The casinos have their lawyers to write up these terms, and whether or not you think they are fair, you break them, tough titty.

It's a shame that this has gone on for about 20 frustrating pages with nothing to do but accept the consequences of breaking the terms and conditions of a bonus. As far as I'm concerned, this is a decision to be made by the casino on whether or not to pay this player. Again what I've seen so far (caveat, I've relatively breezed through this thread), but what I've seen is that this is truly predatory. Why isn't there a safeguard implemented to negate these sort of problems?

It's not even a necessary term. What's the big problem with simply having some 2nd line CS agent manually reverse the mistake and let play carry on from where it left off. There is no means for the casino to get scammed, as the second the withdrawal hits audit it would be clear that the WR had not been met, and so the dodgy player could not go sneaking big hits with a bonus through their radar just by exploiting the fact that the software can't pick this up.

The only benefit of this term is to provide an occasional opportunity to skim a big hit from a careless player, and then say "it's in the terms we can do it, so tough".


It's like those life insurance companies that tried it on with Cancer patients who were denied payouts because they failed to disclose some minor childhood ailment that their GP managed to treat successfully. The ombudsman overruled the scope of such terms, saying that the ailment had to somehow be relevant to the illness they were claiming for, such as seeing a doctor about a lump, and not mentioning this when getting insurance for Cancer.

The UK authorities have had a field day over the last few years overruling what they considered predatory terms in consumer insurance, loan, and banking contracts. It has cost the companies involved billions, and fresh scandals just keep getting unearthed.

I think Playtech software CAN block such withdrawals. I have seen it happen to my benefit when playing accredited Playtechs some years ago, long before they introduced any kind of WR counter. Main Street started out as Playtech, and their cashier blocked any "illegal" withdrawals and told me to amend the amount requested. It could not simply be forced through.

My suspicion is that dodgy operators have disabled this in the same way that rogue RTG outfits have disabled the part of the cashier that shows players how much WR has been set, and how much they have made.


So, no software protection, and then a zero tolerance approach to players who make a single click out of sequence.

It seems they WOULD have paid had the OP not just sent the email he did, but waited for CS to reply and remove the old WR as a matter of routine. Now, if the answer is always going to be "OK", there is no need to twiddle thumbs awaiting a reply.

I have my doubts, and I believe that even if the OP had declined that €100, they would still have had the win confiscated due to the legacy of that €1.30 Now, if this case sucks, how much more would it suck where there was no bonus involved at all, just a €500 deposit. The €1.30 would have created the same problem, but since no bonus was in play, the rep could not have used the "it's in the bonus terms" argument, accusing the player of not checking what he should have because he started off with a WR. Of course, the casino is never going to admit this, but a look at the reps detailed timeline of events makes it clear that the OP had not even cleared the legacy WR from the €1.30 balance, so bonus or not on that 500 deposit, legacy WR remained, and the outcome would have been the same, deletion of everything but €1500 upon withdrawal.

 

[Bladefury]

Just to let everyone know, the actual 1500 Euros they did allow me to withdraw, they still haven't bothered to transfer to my account. This after 9 days.

 

[Playforfun]

Predatory. + dishonest hanging on a letter.

There is no way one can see a reason to confiscate this win.


The technical "done by the system" clause has been nullified in kindergarten.

 

[Balthazar]

Guys this thread is too important to hijack it with old issues between fellow forum members.

 

[Mouche12]

Mmmm, I am eagerly awaiting Bladefury's progress at AskGamblers.

In the meantime, if Casino Plex is reading this thread, they are probably laughing their heads off. Pisses me off.

 

[Jasminebed]

It was not my intention to thank an insult, but rather the rest of the post from a new member.

Surely that doesn't surprise many.

 

[The Dude]

Ok guys, I've moved the posts where this seemed to be getting derailed and placed them in the attic. In the future, please be aware of how "thanking" a post can be seen as high-fiving. And if there are any personal comments within that post, it may seem as though you are agreeing with that particular comment, even though there are other more valid comments being made.

Let's keep this thread on track. Thank you.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Just to let everyone know, the actual 1500 Euros they did allow me to withdraw, they still haven't bothered to transfer to my account. This after 9 days.

Their initial decision was bad enough, but this is plain rogue. They are breaking their own terms, the SAME term they used to confiscate this win. (Remember, the term that also said the deposit would be returned, just not the winnings).

If they were going to do this, you would have the money by now. This looks like they are backpeddling, but are not yet admitting it. The problem for them is that they claimed that the term was written in stone, and no matter what the circumstances, nothing was going to change, but it HAS. If they can change the part about refunding the deposit, they can damn well change any other aspect, it's not set in stone.

They could be hedging their bets, as by returning the deposit, they can no longer put the whole amount back for completion of wagering, so someone somewhere has not ruled out a positive outcome for the player, despite the rep indicating that no amount of pressure is going to make them change their mind.

 

[Slotster!]

Their initial decision was bad enough, but this is plain rogue. They are breaking their own terms, the SAME term they used to confiscate this win. (Remember, the term that also said the deposit would be returned, just not the winnings).

If they were going to do this, you would have the money by now. This looks like they are backpeddling, but are not yet admitting it. The problem for them is that they claimed that the term was written in stone, and no matter what the circumstances, nothing was going to change, but it HAS. If they can change the part about refunding the deposit, they can damn well change any other aspect, it's not set in stone.

They could be hedging their bets, as by returning the deposit, they can no longer put the whole amount back for completion of wagering, so someone somewhere has not ruled out a positive outcome for the player, despite the rep indicating that no amount of pressure is going to make them change their mind.

I'm guessing of course, but it's probably more likely just they're really not mithered about pushing a withdrawal through - far too busy concentrating on how to fleece more players out of their winnings.

What makes me laugh is when players are expected to abide by every single last aspect of every imaginable term or else face the consequences - yet some outfits can pretty much get away with doing what they like on the flip side.

By laugh, of course I mean vomit.

Regardless of any terms and conditions or made up on the spot 'rules' - the content of this thread alone outs Casinoplex as a place to be wholly, entirely and completely avoided by everyone. Forever.

 

[Bladefury]

This is the response from one of the Casino reps on askgamblers.

With regards to this complaint, I, as CasinoPlex representative have checked the history of this particular player and here are my findings :
On the 26th March 2013 player deposited 500 Euro and got bonus of 1000 Euro with 50x wagering requirement
He lost all the balance less 31,30 Euro without reaching the wagering requirements which were clearly stated in this offer.
On the 31st March 2013 the player played using the 31,30 Euro in his balance and deposited 500 EUR when the balance went down to 2,5 Euro and got another 100 Euro Bonus ( 50x wagering requirement ), so he started to play again with 602.50 Euro and with a wagering requirement of min 1000 to play.
Player decided to play on European roulette where Stake % Contribution is only 5% as stated at URL Not Found / Outdated it means that he had to wager another 20,000 Euro before withdrawing winnings.
He decided to withdraw at 04:02 GMT with a balance of €17,007.50 and system automatically cut 14,407.50 of winnings + 1,000 of first bonus + 100 of second bonus
Following that, the player got 362 Euro converting comp points in real money and continued to play at BlackJack Multihand 5 and now he has 12 Euro in his balance
All is totally clear and right also because, apart from the clear rules stated on the CasinoPlex website, where rules are stated very well, player can:
1) Check, all the time in cashier menu, the status of wagering required, wagering reached , bonus balance and real balance.
2) Each time a player accepts a bonus , a pop up tells him there is a wagering requirement attached and he is free to accept or refuse the bonus
3) When a player tries to effect a withdrawal, it is clearly stated in each withdrawal method that if he withdraws without reaching the wagering required, bonuses and winnings will be deducted,
The message also invites the player to check in the bonus section in the cashier menu to see exactly how much he has to play or if reached, the wagering requirement
4) Player can check in cashier all the history, bet by bet , transaction by transaction


I know nothing will come of this. If anything just anybody who was thinking to play at this casino must stay far away.

 

[vinylweatherman]

This is the response from one of the Casino reps on askgamblers.

With regards to this complaint, I, as CasinoPlex representative have checked the history of this particular player and here are my findings :
On the 26th March 2013 player deposited 500 Euro and got bonus of 1000 Euro with 50x wagering requirement
He lost all the balance less 31,30 Euro without reaching the wagering requirements which were clearly stated in this offer.
On the 31st March 2013 the player played using the 31,30 Euro in his balance and deposited 500 EUR when the balance went down to 2,5 Euro and got another 100 Euro Bonus ( 50x wagering requirement ), so he started to play again with 602.50 Euro and with a wagering requirement of min 1000 to play.
Player decided to play on European roulette where Stake % Contribution is only 5% as stated at URL Not Found / Outdated it means that he had to wager another 20,000 Euro before withdrawing winnings.
He decided to withdraw at 04:02 GMT with a balance of €17,007.50 and system automatically cut 14,407.50 of winnings + 1,000 of first bonus + 100 of second bonus
Following that, the player got 362 Euro converting comp points in real money and continued to play at BlackJack Multihand 5 and now he has 12 Euro in his balance
All is totally clear and right also because, apart from the clear rules stated on the CasinoPlex website, where rules are stated very well, player can:
1) Check, all the time in cashier menu, the status of wagering required, wagering reached , bonus balance and real balance.
2) Each time a player accepts a bonus , a pop up tells him there is a wagering requirement attached and he is free to accept or refuse the bonus
3) When a player tries to effect a withdrawal, it is clearly stated in each withdrawal method that if he withdraws without reaching the wagering required, bonuses and winnings will be deducted,
The message also invites the player to check in the bonus section in the cashier menu to see exactly how much he has to play or if reached, the wagering requirement
4) Player can check in cashier all the history, bet by bet , transaction by transaction


I know nothing will come of this. If anything just anybody who was thinking to play at this casino must stay far away.

Not quite the same story given here. The most controversial tale, that it all started with the €1.30 balance has vanished from the excuse. As this was a pertinent fact given in the explanation here, we have a rep changing the story in order to make themselves look better.

However, it's now "all about €2.50" from the second bonus adding a massive WR on top of the final €500 deposit and €100 bonus. Now if they have removed the WR from the €1.30 from the story, why not the WR from the €2.50 (which also is not quite the same story as given here, where it is implied the last bonus was claimed when the balance was €31.30).

The real question is whether the WR on the final €100 bonus was properly met, and also whether the description of the messages in the cashier are correct, something that can only be verified by playing there and taking screenshots when it is known that WR has not been completed.

Further, a 20% bonus that has 50x WR set, and is phantom anyway, is a TERRIBLE deal to start with, so yet another reason to avoid them.

Try Gambling Grumbles for a third variation of the story from the rep. This is such a load of bollocks!

If my bank software lost €17K of my savings because I withdrew it before a limited term ended the regulator would be all over it, mainly because the software should have prevented me from making such an error in the first place. They would then be ordered to reinstate the balance as before, and fix the software to prevent such a thing from happening again.

When €17K is a stake, a mere warning popup is just not good enough, the player should be FORCED to go to CS rather than be able to make such a decision via the software. In most cases, I am sure the player would see sense and realise they didn't want to recoup just their starting deposit when they were that far ahead.


The rep is trying to imply that a player willingly, and KNOWINGLY, and of sound mind and judgement, pissed away 17K at the click of a mouse because they wanted their initial €1500 back right away, and did not want to risk not making WR with 17K more than €1500 in their balance.

This is a crock of shit, and if any player made such a decision, they are clearly not "of sound mind and judgement" at the time they did it.

In some cases, it might be a misclick, having visited the page just to check the status, clicking the wrong one of two buttons in order to back out and carry on. Easy to do if tired, drunk, distracted, or even just a bit confused at which button means what option.

Now the casino has broken TWO of it's rigid terms. They have removed the WR from the €1.30 against the stated terms, and also not paid the €1500 they said they would pay under another section of the terms.

The terms are not so rigid after all, so they CAN make changes after the fact given individual circumstances (like not wanting to mention that WR had not even been completed on the first bonus because of the €1.30 balance).

Using a leftover €2.50 as their excuse isn't much different though, and I am surprised askgamblers have swallowed this reasoning (or have they).

 

[Mouche12]

Particularly this part of your thread VWM hits the nail right on the head:

The rep is trying to imply that a player willingly, and KNOWINGLY, and of sound mind and judgement, pissed away 17K at the click of a mouse because they wanted their initial €1500 back right away, and did not want to risk not making WR with 17K more than €1500 in their balance.

This is a crock of shit, and if any player made such a decision, they are clearly not "of sound mind and judgement" at the time they did it.

The OP mentioned earlier in this thread that he only received a pop-up telling him that he would LOSE THE BONUS (a meagre 20%) - that's why he went ahead. Indeed, Casino Plex are desperate coming up with as many reasons/twists they can so as not to reinstate the OP's winnings. I think this really calls for an in-depth investigation. Are Gambling Grumbles able to this?