Casino Hold'em has bad rules at English Harbour Group

[poser]

Hi,

I just played Casino Hold'em in Caribbean Gold and English Harbour Casino:

I couldn't believe it, but when your hand is beats the dealer, but is not at least a pair, YOU LOSE your complete Ante bet !!

This is worse enough, but also is against the rules written on English Harbour website, where it says: If your hand beats the dealer, you WIN !!

I DONT CALL IT A WIN, IF I LOSE MONEY !!!! (lose the ante, push the call bet)


What dou you think of this ??

 

[LonelyHearts]

Its been like that for awhile. I've noticed it too. Dunno why people still mess with English Harbour. They have been doing things like this for years now.

 

[Wildfire7]

Hi,

I just played Casino Hold'em in Caribbean Gold and English Harbour Casino:

I couldn't believe it, but when your hand is beats the dealer, but is not at least a pair, YOU LOSE your complete Ante bet !!

What dou you think of this ??

Hi Poser, this seems very unusual! Surely AK qualifies for both dealer and player. Does the dealer not qualify on AK either then?

If dealer does qualify on AK but player doesn't then it is a major disadvantage, so much so that you are probably best steering well clear of this.

Mike

 

[vinylweatherman]

If this is against the rules displayed, it could be yet ANOTHER bug like the infamous VP "double up" fiasco.

In Cyberstud, PLAY bets are a "push" if the dealer doesn't qualify, but your ANTE still wins.

3 card poker is the same, so I am surprised to hear of a poker variant where you can have the best hand, yet LOSE your money, rather than get a push at the very least.

 

[Eliot Jacobson]

Greetings,

I am writing as the auditor of English Harbour and not on behalf of English Harbour nor any player.

The game of Casino Hold' Em Poker is operating correctly at English Harbour casinos. I have been auditing the game for over 3 years and its return (RTP) is quite fair for a game of its type. There are no bugs with its play.

This statement in paragraph 4 of the rules applies to the situation when the dealer does not qualify:

>Ante bet payouts are based on the Ante paytable.

The Ante paytable specifies the player needs a pair or better to win the Ante bet, otherwise the player loses his Ante bet. I agree that this appears inconsistent with the statement in paragraph 3.

I will contact English Harbour management about this matter and ask that they clean up those parts of the rules that are causing confusion. However, I must restate, the game is functioning properly and is fair.

Best regards,

--Eliot

 

[LonelyHearts]

Greetings,

I am writing as the auditor of English Harbour and not on behalf of English Harbour nor any player.

The game of Casino Hold' Em Poker is operating correctly at English Harbour casinos. I have been auditing the game for over 3 years and its return (RTP) is quite fair for a game of its type. There are no bugs with its play.


Best regards,

--Eliot

You sound like the same guy that came to my home about 3 months ago and sold me some magazines. He stated he was an independent dealer; And didnt work for any magazine company. He also stated he has been selling magazines for 3 yrs. If I would trust him and bought a subscription I would save a bundle and would get my magazines in a few weeks. I took his word and bought a couple. You know what? I haven't seen not 1 magazine. LMAO!

 

[vinylweatherman]

Greetings,

I am writing as the auditor of English Harbour and not on behalf of English Harbour nor any player.

The game of Casino Hold' Em Poker is operating correctly at English Harbour casinos. I have been auditing the game for over 3 years and its return (RTP) is quite fair for a game of its type. There are no bugs with its play.

This statement in paragraph 4 of the rules applies to the situation when the dealer does not qualify:

>Ante bet payouts are based on the Ante paytable.

The Ante paytable specifies the player needs a pair or better to win the Ante bet, otherwise the player loses his Ante bet. I agree that this appears inconsistent with the statement in paragraph 3.

I will contact English Harbour management about this matter and ask that they clean up those parts of the rules that are causing confusion. However, I must restate, the game is functioning properly and is fair.

Best regards,

--Eliot

Are these the USUAL rules for this game, or are English Harbour using a lower RTP rule variant by having the player LOSE the ante with less than a pair.

 

[The Dude]

You sound like the same guy that came to my home about 3 months ago and sold me some magazines. He stated he was an independent dealer; And didnt work for any magazine company. He also stated he has been selling magazines for 3 yrs. If I would trust him and bought a subscription I would save a bundle and would get my magazines in a few weeks. I took his word and bought a couple. You know what? I haven't seen not 1 magazine. LMAO!

Please don't belittle other members (flaming). Eliot Jacobson is a valued member of the forum that has been both insightful and instrumental in solving a number of techno casino problems. I wouldn't compare him to a magazine subscription guy.

 

[paulyt]

Please don't belittle other members (flaming). Eliot Jacobson is a valued member of the forum that has been both insightful and instrumental in solving a number of techno casino problems. I wouldn't compare him to a magazine subscription guy.

This.

Also, who buys Mag subs (well anything really) from door-to-door salesmen these day? My feeling is if you are stupid enough to buy anything from door-to-door salesmen you deserve to be scammed. [/offtopic]

 

[Jasminebed]

I don't play at English Harbour. Is Casino Hold'Em the same as a one player table version of Texas Hold'em? If so, I've never heard of the dealer having to have a hand to "qualify".

From Buzzluck's Texas Hold'em Bonus Poker:

Texas Hold'em Bonus Poker pits you against the Dealer in "heads-up" hands, and either the Dealer or you -the player-, whoever has the best five-card poker hand at the end, will win. In other words, you only have to have a hand that beats the Dealers hand to win.

Complete Rules

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I went and had a look at 3Dice's pay table for this game.

And also at MG

 

[LonelyHearts]

This.

Also, who buys Mag subs (well anything really) from door-to-door salesmen these day? My feeling is if you are stupid enough to buy anything from door-to-door salesmen you deserve to be scammed. [/offtopic]

Yea? Cmon dude how many bonuses have you taken this month and bust out of? Or deposits you've lost? Now who's scamming who?

...my last 2 deposit with RTG have both disappeared quickly and the bonus pays have been disgusting.

Yep, I've experienced the same thing. The money disappears quicker than a brides nightie. Even taking a deposit bonus is as useless as tits on a bull.

 

[aka23]

I don't play at English Harbour. Is Casino Hold'Em the same as a one player table version of Texas Hold'em? If so, I've never heard of the dealer having to have a hand to "qualify".

From Buzzluck's Texas Hold'em Bonus Poker:

Casino Hold'em is a different game from Texas Hold'em Bonus. Vegas Technology / Odds On SW apparently has non-standard rules for this game, which differ from all other implementations of the game I have seen (including Playtech, Net Ent, RTG, Boss, World Gaming, Gale Wind, and land based setups) . This unique pair plus rule substantially increases house edge.

 

[poser]

It is obvious that EH Casinos (Vegas Technology / Odds On) have rules never seen in any other implementations of the game.

To a big disadvantage for the player.

And most important: This special rule will completely change the way you have to play the game for lowest house edge.

In so many situation, why would you risk 2 x Ante, if you have only small chances of getting at least 55.

At least they should call the game st like "Online Hold'em" to indicate that it is NOT "Casino Hold'em".

RTG calls their implementation "Caribbean Hold'em" for example.

BTW: Did you ever played the 7 reels slots ? Now I had some winning combinations there where the outcome was wrong (even a nonexisting payline was indicating a win).

 

[aka23]

To a big disadvantage for the player.

And most important: This special rule will completely change the way you have to play the game for lowest house edge.

In so many situation, why would you risk 2 x Ante, if you have only small chances of getting at least 55.

You don't need to get a 55 to win. You can win with a 22 to 44, if the dealer doesn't qualify. The difference in payout occurs on hands where you have a high card and the dealer doesn't qualify. This happens more than one might think. The dealer doesn't qualify on about 20% of hands. I'd crudely estimate that on ~1/4 of those hands, the player has only a high card (assuming play with standard strategy), resulting in a -2 payout on 5% of hands and a ~10% difference in house edge (HE is defined per initial bet)... increasing house edge by a factor of more than 4x. Note that expected loss per wager is significantly smaller due to the raises... but still is much higher than with standard rules.

 

[poser]

Yes, I can win...

BUT, I will actually lose money in this "win"..

For me, thats not a WIN !!