New Slot Announcement Bonanza by Big Time Gaming

[snorky510238]

So here we have @snorky510238 asking others to disprove his theory that Bonanza has been gimped. In my world it is on the person that make assertions to prove those, not the other way round.

So @snorky510238 - what proof do you have that the game has been gimped or made to disadvantage the player beyond the advertised RTP. And you playing the game extensively since its release is not good enough, because others have played it since release too that haven't been affected as you have claimed to be.

Have they done enough spins? I am not being funny but there are only 3 or 4 games that I feel qualified to make judgements upon because I have done well over a million spins on each.

There are also plenty of players other than myself who claim it’s changed dramatically. Some people are more susceptible to noticing things than others.

 

[snorky510238]

And on the other hand - I've not really found any difference in the game over the years. In fact, over the past few months, I'm getting more D's than normal, including cascades.

But this'll get ignored as is doesn't feed into snorky's ever growing madness. Or because I don't post as often as some, I can't be as hardcore a player as others...

Well you haven’t told us much about your Bonanza background in the past so I don’t know if you’ve done 10,000 or 1,000,000 spins.

Sorry but anyone who’s done less than a million hasn’t got a big enough sample.

Just to ask a question that seems fair in my eyes. All and sundry are pretty much in agreement that games such as IR, Raging Rhino and Thunderstruck, amongst others do not play anything like they used to.

Why is it that I have never seen anyone challenge that theory? But, when it comes to this (and it’s not a theory, it’s the truth), I get loads of people saying I am mad and deluded?

Everyone saying games are regulated and audited. You don’t know that for a fact and if you did, you can’t verify how authentic these checks are.

No, you’re just taking it as read, preaching, from what’s been preached to yourselves. All this stuff you keep bringing up about why would they do this, why do that? Because there’s a shitload of money to be made, that’s why. Wouldn’t be the first time that an organisation that seemingly already had wealth only most can dream of, got a bit greedy and wanted a bit more.

Especially when they can get away with it. Look at all these Casinos that receive huge fines for failing to comply in one form or another. They know they’re doing wrong, they were doing it for years. Do you really think they would be that stupid to carry on if the fine wasn’t worth the risk?

 

[goatwack]

Everyone: list your Bonanza CV

Years played: 4.5

No. of spins: under one million, maybe more

No. of big wins: 3ish

Suspicion of skulduggery: Hell yes

 

[interlog]

Well you haven’t told us much about your Bonanza background in the past so I don’t know if you’ve done 10,000 or 1,000,000 spins.

Sorry but anyone who’s done less than a million hasn’t got a big enough sample.

Just to ask a question that seems fair in my eyes. All and sundry are pretty much in agreement that games such as IR, Raging Rhino and Thunderstruck, amongst others do not play anything like they used to.

Why is it that I have never seen anyone challenge that theory? But, when it comes to this (and it’s not a theory, it’s the truth), I get loads of people saying I am mad and deluded?

Everyone saying games are regulated and audited. You don’t know that for a fact and if you did, you can’t verify how authentic these checks are.

No, you’re just taking it as read, preaching, from what’s been preached to yourselves. All this stuff you keep bringing up about why would they do this, why do that? Because there’s a shitload of money to be made, that’s why. Wouldn’t be the first time that an organisation that seemingly already had wealth only most can dream of, got a bit greedy and wanted a bit more.

Especially when they can get away with it. Look at all these Casinos that receive huge fines for failing to comply in one form or another. They know they’re doing wrong, they were doing it for years. Do you really think they would be that stupid to carry on if the fine wasn’t worth the risk?

Well with that kind of attitude towards casinos / game developers the questions begs why not take up another hobby such as knitting

 

[snorky510238]

Well with that kind of attitude towards casinos / game developers the questions begs why not take up another hobby such as knitting

I did but the Company was selling me dodgy wool.

 

[bamberfishcake]

I did but the Company was selling me dodgy wool.

That just about sums it up.

Everything is a rip-off and designed to break faster than it goes out of date.

The cost of a pint is blooming extortionate, but people still drink it because they enjoy it. Same with slots and most other things that bring pleasure in life - you would rather keep flogging a dead horse for the small satisfaction it brings than quit. Otherwise, you gotta find a new hobby to be discontented with because greed sucks the quality out of it.

By the way, my Bonanza pronouns are 'they, them and DDDDD's', and I like to be referred to as D on Mondays because I identify as a slot machine, just on Mondays.

 

[Full tilt]

If being a good snooker player is the sign of a misspent youth then being a Bonanza millionaire (spins) must signify a misspent adulthood!

I’ve played Bonanza almost daily for 5 years from 2017 to 2022 when I returned to playing online after a 5 year hiatus, and it was my go to game when signing up at a new casino and trying to beat wagering.

The way the game seems to have changed in my view is the frequency and quality of bonuses: years back you’d be looking at 100X plus bonuses regularly although they seemed harder to land. I’ve never had so many sub 10X bonuses as I’ve had the last year or so and I’ll often go a month now without playing it.

Regarding updates in my own personal experience I find it will go dead for a week or so after some revisions; almost as though it‘s building up its RTP from zero again before it loosens up. I’ve noticed with the latest version the amount of times it will throw in the LD together to give the feature after a cascade which happened very rarely years back.

 

[snorky510238]

If being a good snooker player is the sign of a misspent youth then being a Bonanza millionaire (spins) must signify a misspent adulthood!

I’ve played Bonanza almost daily for 5 years from 2017 to 2022 when I returned to playing online after a 5 year hiatus, and it was my go to game when signing up at a new casino and trying to beat wagering.

The way the game seems to have changed in my view is the frequency and quality of bonuses: years back you’d be looking at 100X plus bonuses regularly although they seemed harder to land. I’ve never had so many sub 10X bonuses as I’ve had the last year or so and I’ll often go a month now without playing it.

Regarding updates in my own personal experience I find it will go dead for a week or so after some revisions; almost as though it‘s building up its RTP from zero again before it loosens up. I’ve noticed with the latest version the amount of times it will throw in the LD together to give the feature after a cascade which happened very rarely years back.

Good to see someone who is in touch with reality. This is pretty much exactly what I have seen.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

And yet the guy who actually has some data as opposed to 'feelings' checks his numbers and finds no change. (Reelsoffun a few posts back.)

 

[snorky510238]

Q: How mch does a bonus buy on Bonanza cost?

A: 80x stake

Doesn't that tell you enough?

Yes, it means that according to most, the average bonus pays x100 so that must be wrong and is obviously far less.

 

[dunover]

Yes, it means that according to most, the average bonus pays x100 so that must be wrong and is obviously far less.

It's 90x bet.

 

[mack341]

I think it might have been in another thread but Reelsoffun was explaining how the typical number of spins in a session can fall short of getting that big win and your rtp back up [in the individual session].

So I think evolution/btg can just play with parameters, shift rtp into pointless micro wins and also take out the middle sized wins and put them into rarer wins, which fall outside the typical spin count of a session.

The general size of the 'megaways' number in the bonus round now feels gimped, rarely goes above 5,000 and often less than 2,000.

Whereas I think the original release was a lot 'wilder' and unpredictable, they've tamed it and pruned it to make it more profitable for the casino [and therefore slot maker] while still hitting 96% rtp give or take 2%.

-------------

Though unrelated, I heard recently that the software experts at Twitter were unable to work out why the twitter algorithm resulted in Elon Musk's tweets being repressed, simply could not locate and unpick the part in the algorithim responsible for that behaviour in order to fix it.

Which made me think the ukgc would not have a clue about the programs of these slots, and a 'networked' industry working to protect itself could probably hoodwink them.

I think I did post somewhere last year about the rules regarding testing and test houses having to be toughened up, proposals to that end. To eliminate or reduce any chance of chicanery, through lack of real independence as an example.

 

[Jono777]

I think it might have been in another thread but Reelsoffun was explaining how the typical number of spins in a session can fall short of getting that big win and your rtp back up [in the individual session].

So I think evolution/btg can just play with parameters, shift rtp into pointless micro wins and also take out the middle sized wins and put them into rarer wins, which fall outside the typical spin count of a session.

The general size of the 'megaways' number in the bonus round now feels gimped, rarely goes above 5,000 and often less than 2,000.

Whereas I think the original release was a lot 'wilder' and unpredictable, they've tamed it and pruned it to make it more profitable for the casino [and therefore slot maker] while still hitting 96% rtp give or take 2%.

-------------

Though unrelated, I heard recently that the software experts at Twitter were unable to work out why the twitter algorithm resulted in Elon Musk's tweets being repressed, simply could not locate and unpick the part in the algorithim responsible for that behaviour in order to fix it.

Which made me think the ukgc would not have a clue about anything at all

I think I did post somewhere last year about the rules regarding testing and test houses having to be toughened up, proposals to that end. To eliminate or reduce any chance of chicanery, through lack of real independence as an example.

Good post matey but had to make a slight but important amendment

 

[ChopleyIOM]

It's 90x bet.

Which at 96% RTP, works out to what Bonanza's feature has historically always paid on average, 86x bet.

 

[ritae]

Well well, Bonanza delivered today! 1940X!

Imagine a diamond on the first reel

 

[dunover]

Well well, Bonanza delivered today! 1940X!

Imagine a diamond on the first reel

Yep, a diamond for one of those 10's on reel 1 or other non-green gem, extra 4800x on the spin.

 

[StuLawre]

I've had some great hits the last couple of weeks and am well up....I play £100-£200 a day (similar to Dazza's strategy) and I must be one of the few who it is kind to! I get a lot of 30-50x bonuses, but nearly lost my iPad to the wall the other day when a £2 bonus paid £3.60....but you can't have it all. Playing it as much as I do though, I do agree-there has been a definite shift in the dynamics of the game this last week. Long runs of dead spins (I actually had 27 dead on the bounce yesterday) a lot fewer 'L's dropping (used to average 10 per £100, £1 spins) but now it's more like 5 or 6. The reel make-ups seem to offer more ways but less wins and the cascade wins have gone right down. Anyhoo, thats just my feelings. I probably do a good couple of thousand spins a day.

 

[Reelsoffun]

It's 90x bet.

That’s assuming that the bonus buy version is identical to the non bonus buy version and that the features are played out exactly the same way, which isn’t usually the case and is why bonus buys tend to be slightly different overall RTP as I’m uk i can’t see what they say the RTP is for the bonus buy version.

 

[dunover]

That’s assuming that the bonus buy version is identical to the non bonus buy version and that the features are played out exactly the same way, which isn’t usually the case and is why bonus buys tend to be slightly different overall RTP as I’m uk i can’t see what they say the RTP is for the bonus buy version.

It's 96.00% normal play, 96.11% using only bonus buys.

 

[Reelsoffun]

It's 96.00% normal play, 96.11% using only bonus buys

As expected, just confirms that when your buying a bonus its not actually the same as triggering one naturally, which is OK to me i understand it has to be like that, but many players wont understand that and this is where the problem lies in transparency. IMO there should be disclaimers in the help file of any game where the feature buy bonus does not have the exact same chance or distribution of a normally triggered bonus.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

As expected, just confirms that when your buying a bonus its not actually the same as triggering one naturally, which is OK to me i understand it has to be like that, but many players wont understand that and this is where the problem lies in transparency. IMO there should be disclaimers in the help file of any game where the feature buy bonus does not have the exact same chance or distribution of a normally triggered bonus.

Is that what it means though? It could just mean that there's a win/wins in the basegame distribution that simply doesn't exist in the bonus buy pool that means the overall RTP is tweaked a bit. I've seen it happen at 3Dice whereby their game tweaks (which do come with entirely transparent patch notes you have to click through the first time you play the game after the changes have been made), explain what the changes are, and why the RTP has changed slightly. (On Gemini they put in a bigger max prize by tweaking the reels that actually increased the RTP a bit, whereas on Berrini's Fortune they made the three scatters trigger a bit 'softer' to reduce the chance of a zero pay, but that actually dropped the game's overall RTP a bit.)

I completely agree with you that any changes to the profile/volatility of a game should be communicated to players, even if the overall RTP remains unchanged, but I'm not sure how we can conclude that a Bonanza bonus buy is different to a naturally triggered bonus, and why BTG would even want to go to the effort of doing so?

 

[Reelsoffun]

"It could just mean that there's a win/wins in the basegame distribution that simply doesn't exist in the bonus buy pool"

Well of course as there is NO base wins in the bonus buy pool.

Well something has to be different due to buy bonus is only a fixed 12 spins natural one is a 12,17,22,27 trigger etc.

Of course the fact its only 90x (86.5x) factoring in the HE it does fit in with the possible removal of the 17+ spin triggers but that in itself also proves they are not the same entirely, so im still saying that there is no guarantee that its using the exact same feature math.

Yes they could effectively force a re trigger to balance what the "normal" one would have produced but were told each spin is independent, so they using a pool or not? which is it? it can't be both.....I doubt they doing that either.

Im not saying its wrong that they are not the same, Im just saying people need to realize that its not going to be case most of the time, the math is probably different. It will still be the RTP stated.

You're gonna lose 4% either way lol

LOL sorry but why would they bother doing so? To make a new game of course come on chops you know me better than that, but you saying why would they bother is like saying why would any provider go to all that trouble to make any new game?

 

[dunover]

As expected, just confirms that when your buying a bonus its not actually the same as triggering one naturally, which is OK to me i understand it has to be like that, but many players wont understand that and this is where the problem lies in transparency. IMO there should be disclaimers in the help file of any game where the feature buy bonus does not have the exact same chance or distribution of a normally triggered bonus.

It's a deviation of 0.11% or in other words about 1/999th greater than playing normally.

 

[slot_zombie]

Riddle me this...

Why is it on some casinos, fast spin on Bonanza means a win is coming, a slow spin is a dead spin.

On other sites it's a complete opposite and you are looking for the slow spin. The fast spin = dead spin.

 

[snorky510238]

Yep, shite once you learn the quirks. Well, shite in any case but you know what I mean. Why would you program it that way?