50 free spins at aspinalls = 0, NOTHING, NADA

[Miss_Token]

Today, for october 12, i receive 50 free spins at aspinalls casino.
I play 50 free spins and i WON 0
No 5 bucks, no 1 bucks, no 0,50 cents, CERO

I talk with a chat representativa and she says:

Abigail: Welcome! It is great to have you with us. I am here to help you with anything you might need assistance with!
Me: hi abigail
Me: i receive 50 free spins at avalon today
Me: and i won 0
Abigail: Hi XXX
Me: in 50 free spins
Me: its normal?
Me: 0!! as you can see in my account
Abigail: XXX, the free spins that are credited to your account offer you the same chances of winning as when you would deposit.
Me: ok...so its normal lol
Abigail: It is a rare occurrence, however it does happen
Me: well, nothing to do. Can you send me this conversation to my account please...??
Abigail: you are able to copy the chat, as I will will be placing a notification on your account with this chat
Me: ok. I want to close my account please
Me: and never receive promos again to my email
Abigail: One moment please.

Of course, i close my account. Im lucky to not was playing my own money.
What do you think?




Expired Image

Expired Image

 

[rouletteguy]

Bit of a P.O. I know but it happens, I imagine there is some sort of wagering requirement for any amount won on the free spins so it is unlikely they cheated you. Random is as random does. But I'm sure someone who knows will tell you if they are rogue or not.

 

[Miss_Token]

Bit of a P.O. I know but it happens, I imagine there is some sort of wagering requirement for any amount won on the free spins so it is unlikely they cheated you. Random is as random does. But I'm sure someone who knows will tell you if they are rogue or not.

I know that there is a chance to this to happen, for me is just bad luck, im not worried about it is random or not, it was no my money. I just think is funny and i want to show you guys

 

[Nifty29]

What do I think?

I think that almost every one of your posts are complaining about not winning, and many of them with free money.

The casino gave you free spins - free - and you didnt win anything. It sucks, but you are not out of pocket as a result so I dont see what the all the bitching and moaning is about. Believe me, you are by no means the first to win nothing on free spins, and particularly on Avalon.

If this is a reason for closing a casino account then I reckon you have until about Christmas time before you run out of casinos to play at.

It is clear from your previous postings that losing makes you angry/upset, so maybe it is time to give gambling a rest? IMO when it gets to the stage where it is no longer enjoyable it becomes pointless.

 

[Miss_Token]

What do I think?

I think that almost every one of your posts are complaining about not winning, and many of them with free money.

The casino gave you free spins - free - and you didnt win anything. It sucks, but you are not out of pocket as a result so I dont see what the all the bitching and moaning is about. Believe me, you are by no means the first to win nothing on free spins, and particularly on Avalon.

If this is a reason for closing a casino account then I reckon you have until about Christmas time before you run out of casinos to play at.

It is clear from your previous postings that losing makes you angry/upset, so maybe it is time to give gambling a rest? IMO when it gets to the stage where it is no longer enjoyable it becomes pointless.

OMG nifty, im here not to to complain, im just show you people something and ask for opinion. I dont believe you took this so seriusly...its just a post.
Im not angry, this was not my money, and i dont understeand why you are so angry, talkig about my last post...

I was laughing when this happen and i come here to show you, thats all.

I suppose you are not in a good mood today, for me this was another sesion in a online casino, a bad one, but thats all. What´s really bad its you been so unpleasant with me, telling me that i need to stop gambling.

For your records i have lost a lot more that 50 free spins at 20ctv, thats not the problem. Sometime i have won a lot too. I KNOW WHAT GAMBLING IS, i dont need you to tell me what i need to post or not.
BYE!

 

[Nifty29]

OMG nifty, im here not to to complain, im just show you people something and ask for opinion. I dont believe you took this so seriusly...its just a post.
Im not angry, this was not my money, and i dont understeand why you are so angry, talkig about my last post...

I was laughing when this happen and i come here to show you, thats all.

I suppose you are not in a good mood today, for me this was another sesion in a online casino, a bad one, but thats all. What´s really bad its you been so unpleasant with me, telling me that i need to stop gambling.

For your records i have lost a lot more that 50 free spins at 20ctv, thats not the problem. Sometime i have won a lot too. I KNOW WHAT GAMBLING IS, i dont need you to tell me what i need to post or not.
BYE!

It is obvious that you were complaining. If you weren't, why go post your live chat and close your account??? It makes no sense to close one's casino account if one doesn't have a complaint/issue. I mean, if it was just funny and you were just mucking around why publicly name the casino etc?

I am not being unpleasant. You asked what I thought and I told you, based on your post and your previous posts. I didnt personally attack you or put you down, I stated that most of your posts are complaints about losing - I didnt make it up, go read your previous posts.

The reason I made the remark about giving gambling a rest is that it concerns me when I see a member get upset about these things (i.e.losing from free spins etc ), as it usually indicates that member might not be enjoying their gaming and that seems to end badly more often than not. I certainly didnt mean to offend you or suggest you have a problem, it was just friendly advice from one member to another.

 

[Miss_Token]

It is obvious that you were complaining. If you weren't, why go post your live chat and close your account??? It makes no sense to close one's casino account if one doesn't have a complaint/issue. I mean, if it was just funny and you were just mucking around why publicly name the casino etc?

I am not being unpleasant. You asked what I thought and I told you, based on your post and your previous posts. I didnt personally attack you or put you down, I stated that most of your posts are complaints about losing - I didnt make it up, go read your previous posts.

The reason I made the remark about giving gambling a rest is that it concerns me when I see a member get upset about these things (i.e.losing from free spins etc ), as it usually indicates that member might not be enjoying their gaming and that seems to end badly more often than not. I certainly didnt mean to offend you or suggest you have a problem, it was just friendly advice from one member to another.

Ok, i show the name of the casino. Maybe thats wrong. BUT IF YOUR READ carefully you can see that i always be nice with support, and i have never say nothing bad about the casino.

Of course i complain in a lots of post, the things at online casino are not good (and there are many members who complain about their poor performance) i dont know why you came here and say that things to me...

If any time i need to make a REALLY COMPLAIN i will make a PAB. I close my account because i didnt care about that casino, i never play there, they give me free spins, i didnt won anything, i ask for close my account... i was very respectful with support.
But, its your opinion and really, i dont want to fight with you, this was a funny thing for me...50 free spins and 0 won its funny or not?

 

[steveh35]

To look on the plus side as the free spins would be 1 coin at 20 lines maybe if you had then played at your normal rate you might have won something as the odds of going much more without a win must be slim.

It is annoying to get a low amount with free spins and down right maddening to get nothing but it would also be annoying to get a feature or a big win on spin 50 at £$0.20 a go when my next spin might be at £$2.00.

I do think personally Avalon has gone Thunderstruck/Ladies Night way maybe they realised that the free spin feature was costing them too much.

 

[Perc]

Bad luck, but Avalon sucks most of the time.

Right after I read this, I loaded up a casino that gave me 15 spins on Dolphin Coast, not sure I've ever had that good of a run when spins were given to me. It can definitely go either way, most of the time I've only gotten a few bucks.

 

[Nate]

Im lucky to not was playing my own money.

What do you think?

Hi - Miss Token

It is frustrating to get ZERO on Avalon from 50 Spins.... To be honest, i have never seen that from many years of playing online. To clarify, you didnt even get ONE 3 of a kind or even a 2 of a kind?

What do I think?

I think that almost every one of your posts are complaining about not winning, and many of them with free money.

The casino gave you free spins - free - and you didnt win anything. It sucks, but you are not out of pocket as a result so I dont see what the all the bitching and moaning is about. Believe me, you are by no means the first to win nothing on free spins, and particularly on Avalon.

If this is a reason for closing a casino account then I reckon you have until about Christmas time before you run out of casinos to play at.

It is clear from your previous postings that losing makes you angry/upset, so maybe it is time to give gambling a rest? IMO when it gets to the stage where it is no longer enjoyable it becomes pointless.

I think the OP was looking for a positive response and not an attack. Whilst you may not view it as such, your post comes across as arrogant and rude.

Nate

 

[De Beuker]

50 dead spins in a row is extreme, that its exactly your 50 free spins is even more extreme.
I play the 32RED daily, which is also 50 spins, and I've never seen anyone hit ZERO with all coins used.
And its a habit of me to check the lowest scores too after the tourney ended.
Lowest I've ever seen was 1440 coins, lowest I've ever got was 1860.

Knowing Avalon, these low scores are usually built up by 2oak crowns/treasure chests and 3oak/4oak low paying symbols.
Hardly any winning spins, but you'll always get between 10-20 PAYING spins.

I'd love to know the odds of not hitting one single paying spin fifty times in a row on a game that pays for several 2oak, has wilds, pays for 2 scatters and has 20 winlines.
A million to one?
I think thats on the high side...it might be alot less.

So I think it was definately worth a post.
I hope your luck turns for the better, positive thing, it cannot possibly get worse!

 

[winnington]

I was thinking the exact same thing about the 32Red tourney being 50 spins.

I've never had a score close to 0, and I've played that tournament many hundreds of times... and also often check the lowest scores. Based on what I've seen, if the OP truly didn't win a penny, I'm guessing it would be something be that would happen around 1 in 100,000 or even 1-in 1,000,000+ times.

 

[De Beuker]

For the record, just played my daily.
Score: 4350 (bad)
Paying spins: 22
Dead spins: 28

50 dead spins is unreal.

 

[Nifty29]

Hi - Miss Token

It is frustrating to get ZERO on Avalon from 50 Spins.... To be honest, i have never seen that from many years of playing online. To clarify, you didnt even get ONE 3 of a kind or even a 2 of a kind?



I think the OP was looking for a positive response and not an attack. Whilst you may not view it as such, your post comes across as arrogant and rude.

Nate

Actually, the op asked what I think, and I told them. I must have missed the part about positive replies only required.

Of course the result they got from the spins was awful, but at the end of the day they were free so nobody has lost anything. I don't think there was any point posting the live chat to show they closed their account, apart from showing they were behaving unreasonably. What did the op think the rep was going to do.... give them another 50 spins? Sorry, but this is one of the reasons a lot of live chat reps are so rude and dismissive.....dealing with players whining all the time.

Sorry if it comes across rude, but if you are going to whinge all the time then you have to expect that not everyone is going to agree with you. If one isn't prepared for contrary points of view, one shouldnt post in a public forum.

 

[KasinoKing]

I'd love to know the odds of not hitting one single paying spin fifty times in a row on a game that pays for several 2oak, has wilds, pays for 2 scatters and has 20 winlines.
A million to one?
I think thats on the high side...it might be alot less.

My guess would be MUCH higher - nearing impossible!
I've been playing slots near-enough daily for 5 years and find it hard to imagine what the odds of 50 win-less spins are on ANY game...

I think I've got the reel layouts for Avalon somewhere - anyone want to volunteer to work it out?

KK

 

[Nate]

Actually, the op asked what I think, and I told them. I must have missed the part about positive replies only required.

Of course the result they got from the spins was awful, but at the end of the day they were free so nobody has lost anything. I don't think there was any point posting the live chat to show they closed their account, apart from showing they were behaving unreasonably. What did the op think the rep was going to do.... give them another 50 spins? Sorry, but this is one of the reasons a lot of live chat reps are so rude and dismissive.....dealing with players whining all the time.

Sorry if it comes across rude, but if you are going to whinge all the time then you have to expect that not everyone is going to agree with you. If one isn't prepared for contrary points of view, one shouldnt post in a public forum.

Point made... Point taken...

Costs us nothing to be humble when we do things. The world already lacks humility...

{/DERAIL}

KK - I also cannot picture 50 blank spins... I've played Avalon LOTS and fail to visualise this specific scenario...

 

[Nifty29]

Point made... Point taken...

Costs us nothing to be humble when we do things. The world already lacks humility...

Also a good point and well made

 

[nisosbar]

50 dead spins in a row is extreme, that its exactly your 50 free spins is even more extreme.
========
I'd love to know the odds of not hitting one single paying spin fifty times in a row on a game that pays for several 2oak, has wilds, pays for 2 scatters and has 20 winlines.
A million to one?
I think thats on the high side...it might be alot less.

So I think it was definately worth a post.
I hope your luck turns for the better, positive thing, it cannot possibly get worse!

This is true - to find the silver lining here, if you believe MG gives player a fair game, then it shows that players can also win really big - that is, 50 paying spins out of 50 spins.

 

[Miss_Token]

Hi everyone. I dont want nothing more that comment this especific situation.

When it happens, i went to support not to ask for a free chip, i came there just to ask "'IS THAT NORMAL"? . When the answer was yes, i close my account there. Why? because im a player for about 8 years, 2 in online casinos and have never seem 50 deads spins in a row. If that is normal in that casino, so i dont want to spend any money there, just simple as that.
I reapeat: I didnt won nothing, not even 1 scaters. Of course this need to be show in a post....!!!


I think im very lucky: this never happen, so maybe the luck turns back and give a big jackpot (1 in 1000000000000 odds)

Thanks everyone for your post.

 

[all4greed]

I know nothing about that game (can't play there), but it looks like it's 20 lines. Fifty spins, no wins = sucks. Just shows you what can happen.

I've probably seen some winning screenshots but don't recall.

 

[Bencuri]

Today, for october 12, i receive 50 free spins at aspinalls casino.
I play 50 free spins and i WON 0
No 5 bucks, no 1 bucks, no 0,50 cents, CERO


Of course, i close my account. Im lucky to not was playing my own money.
What do you think?

It is a strange event. Avalon never paid out for me well either, along with the other top Microgaming slots, so I am not surprised the payout was bad, but I wouldn't have expected it to be that bad. I think it is the best that you closed that account, because you didn't loose much by choosing not playing there. There are casinos with much better payout that offer more fun while playing.

Anyway this is a very good example to understand how Microgaming can afford to offer that much free spins. A few months ago I received 100 free spins in one of their casinos, I think alltogether I won 10-20$, I don't remember exactly how much, but it was a video slot with all lines active. It is kind of ridiculous. And it had happened before in several other cases as well. By now I understood that no matter how much free spins you get, very likely you won't win much, becuse the slot will be very tight when playing. I don't say it's not worth trying, because it is free money, but in spite of the big numbers you shouldn't expect much.

 

[Miss_Token]

Thank you all for your comments.
I closed my account at the casino because I do not think that this result can be random. But for me it was just a minor incident, though he had never seen such a bad result.
I know that this casino is accredited and I know that what happened to me is part of the possibilities, so I will pass. It is a pleasure to receive your views.

Just for the records: i do have good things to say about 3dice or kerching casino... so please dont think that i am a grumpy girl, lol.


I would like to hear from a representative of microgaming ...

 

[De Beuker]

My guess would be MUCH higher - nearing impossible!
I've been playing slots near-enough daily for 5 years and find it hard to imagine what the odds of 50 win-less spins are on ANY game...

I think I've got the reel layouts for Avalon somewhere - anyone want to volunteer to work it out?

KK

With 'alot less' I meant that it might be a billion to one.
I'm keeping stats now from the 32RED tourneys, ever since Nedplay and Golden lounge joined I have 3 entries every day.
So far (6 tourneys) the avarage is 23 paying spins against 27 dead spins.
So thats almost 50/50.
The lowest I got was 19 paying spins, the highest 29.

Does anyone know what the odds are of hitting black (or red) 50 times in a row on roulette?
We could get a rough idea of the odds.

KK, I'd love to calculate the odds according to the reelstrip layouts, but I have no idea how to do that.

 

[lnspin]

The lowest I got was 19 paying spins, the highest 29.

Does anyone know what the odds are of hitting black (or red) 50 times in a row on roulette?
We could get a rough idea of the odds.

.

If there was no Green 0, an just red and black, it would be one in

Scientific Notation
1.125899907 x 10 to the 15th

Regular number:
1125899907000000

one quadrillion ,one hundred twenty five trillion ,eight hundred ninety nine billion ,nine hundred seven million.

It will never happen

 

[Miss_Token]

With 'alot less' I meant that it might be a billion to one.
I'm keeping stats now from the 32RED tourneys, ever since Nedplay and Golden lounge joined I have 3 entries every day.
So far (6 tourneys) the avarage is 23 paying spins against 27 dead spins.
So thats almost 50/50.
The lowest I got was 19 paying spins, the highest 29.

Does anyone know what the odds are of hitting black (or red) 50 times in a row on roulette?
We could get a rough idea of the odds.

KK, I'd love to calculate the odds according to the reelstrip layouts, but I have no idea how to do that.

So, if 50 spins in a row with no winnigs if imposible.... why this happen to me?? do you thing this is like some kind of cheat?

 

[Rusty]

My guess would be MUCH higher - nearing impossible!
I've been playing slots near-enough daily for 5 years and find it hard to imagine what the odds of 50 win-less spins are on ANY game...

I think I've got the reel layouts for Avalon somewhere - anyone want to volunteer to work it out?

KK

I will give it a shot KK but I'm really busy at the moment so if someone else has some free time then be my guest.
I don't think for a moment the game was rigged to pay zero, even a corrupt outfit wouldn't be that dumb.

However it will be interesting to know the true odds of this happening and it is possible that such a result is symptomatic of the RTP being reduced for complimentary games - of course you have to believe that the RTP can be changed for MG slots and the RTP and variance is controlled by dynamic weighting for that to be theory to even be a starter.

Otherwise we just have to say extraordinarily bad luck. How bad we shall calculate.

 

[KasinoKing]

These are the reels for Avalon. I've had them so long I've forgotten where I got them now...
I also don't have the key for the symbols, but it's pretty easy to work out; The "0" will be the wild and the highest number (11) the Scatters, then the other numbers will be the symbols in descending value order.

Should be relatively simple to enter the data into Excel & work out the odds of 1 non-winning spin (even I can do that!), but I'm not sure I can remember how to calculate the odds of N non-winning spins in succession - so I might need some help with that! (My brain's a but rusty - if you'll excuse the pun! )

Reel 1	Reel 2	Reel 3	Reel 4	Reel 5
0	0	0	0	0
7	6	10	9	10
5	9	5	8	8
10	4	9	4	5
2	1	2	6	6
9	8	8	5	11
7	5	1	7	7
5	7	3	2	9
10	2	10	1	3
2	10	5	7	6
9	3	9	9	7
11	9	11	8	9
8	4	4	4	3
4	1	6	6	1
10	10	8	5	10
8	5	1	10	8
7	11	3	3	5
5	10	10	9	1
10	3	4	8	4
2	7	7	4	2
9	6	6	7	9
1	2	2	11	8
6	10	9	6	2
4	6	7	10	4
3	8	8	3	10
6	5	3	6	8
1	9	6	10	5
8	4	8	2	9
4	1	2	9	10
6	8	10	10	1
1	7	5	1	9
8	3	9	8	10
3	9	7	5	2
9	2	4	7	7

What I have already worked out from this info, is the odds of getting 5-wilds on one of the 20 win-lines is 1 in 2,270,771 spins, 5 scatters is 1 in 186,977, and triggering the free-spins (3 or more scatters) is 1 in 166.88

KK

 

[Miss_Token]

Oh!

Thanks KK for that information...i didnt know that you can have all the reels from one machine. I cannot do anything with that, but maybe some user can... know what are the chances of getting 50 dead spins in a row.

Thanks anyone for this information.

 

[De Beuker]

Oh!

Thanks KK for that information...i didnt know that you can have all the reels from one machine. I cannot do anything with that, but maybe some user can... know what are the chances of getting 50 dead spins in a row.

Thanks anyone for this information.

Wel, according to my personal experiences it should be somewhere in the neighbourhood of one out of one quadrillion ,one hundred twenty five trillion ,eight hundred ninety nine billion ,nine hundred seven million.

In other words, if the entire population of this planet starts spinning now, non-stop for the next 100.000 years it might still never happen.

So yes, I think you were kinda ripped off.
It was free, I know, but thats not the point.
An event like this just should not happen.
Not without the reels beeing weighted

I've experienced a few of these impossible sequences of dead spins myself, but that was always during a freespinround with lots of retriggers.
That more or less convinced me that freespinrounds are somehow predetermend.

Problem is, you can never prove it.
They will always tell you that it IS possible, no matter how astronomically small the chances are.
Truly random, you know..

 

[Jasminebed]

That is some run of bad luck. Did they give you all the lines for the free spins? I know in the past I've had freespin offers that were NOT all lines, eg once 10 lines @ 1cent on Mad Hatters, a game that is 30 lines.

I even recall reading a grumble because someone was sent a free spin offer from somewhere that was one line, one coin on some game or other.

 

[Miss_Token]

That is some run of bad luck. Did they give you all the lines for the free spins? I know in the past I've had freespin offers that were NOT all lines, eg once 10 lines @ 1cent on Mad Hatters, a game that is 30 lines.

I even recall reading a grumble because someone was sent a free spin offer from somewhere that was one line, one coin on some game or other.

Hi jasmine... i see you always at 3dice
They give 50 free spins at 20 lines, 1 coin.
It was almost funny, didnt get nothing but, what can i do?

 

[Rusty]

Here are my calculations based on the reel layout from KK.
I am not so good at Maths so look out for errors.

Where W=wild and Sn = symbol identifier
Number of instances follows = and reel combinations shown in brackets.

Any Two of a Kind or more

W, S1/S2/W, any, any, any = 275,128 (1x7x34x34x34)
S1/S2, W, any, any, any = 235,824 (6x1x34x34x34) * Wild excluded reel 1 because calculated above

510,952 totalx20 lines = 10,219,040

Any Three of a kind using wilds (wilds used above and scatters excluded)

W, S3 to S10, W, any, any = 30,056 (1x26x1x34x34) * scatter excluded from reel 2 (makes no win)
S3 to S10, W, W, any, any = 30,056 (26x1x1x34x34) * scatter excluded from reel 1 (makes no win)

60,112 totalx20 lines = 1,202,240

Any 3 of a kind or more (wilds and scatters excluded)

s1,s1,s1, any, any = 20,808 (3x3x2x34x34)
s2, s2, s2, any, any = 31,212 (3x3x3x34x34) * an oddity?
S3, S3, S3, Any, Any = 20,808 (2x3x3x34x34)
S4, S4, S4, Any, Any = 31,212 (3x3x3x34x34)
S5, S5, S5, Any, Any = 31,212 (3x3x3x34x34)
S6, S6, S6, Any, Any = 31,212 (3x3x3x34x34)
S7, S7, S7, Any, Any = 31,212 (3x3x3x34x34)
S8, S8, S8, Any, Any = 55,488 (4x3x4x34x34)
S9, S9, S9, Any, Any = 73,984 (4x4x4x34x34)
S10, S10, S10, Any, Any = 73,984 (4x4x4x34x34)

401,132 totalx20 lines = 8,022,640

Any 2 scatters or more

353,736 (3x3x34x34x34) * 3 because scatter

353,736 totalx10 = 3,537,360 * Multiply by 10 possible 2 of a kind combinations on 5 reels

Total winning combinations (note most of these return much lower than bet)

10,219,040
01,202,240
08,022,640
03,537,360

22,981,280 TOTAL

Total possible combinations 45,435,424 (34x34x34x34x34)

22,981,280 in 45,435,424 chance of any spin returning more than zero (1.977* negligibly better than an even chance)

Probability of 50 complimentary spins returning zero = (1/2)^50 = 1,125,899,906,842,624 actually that is calculated at even

money and the odds are actually worse.

To give that number some meaning lets assume that 10,000 people play this offer each and every day, that's 3 million 560 (356 days in a year Rusty?))

thousand every year. How long before we can expect someone to complain they won zero?
31,626,401 Years! That is over 31 Million years LOL.

I would be surprised if there are no mistakes in my calculations though as I did them manually so if you spot any feel free to

chime in and we can recalculate.

 

[Miss_Token]

Here are my calculations based on the reel layout from KK.
I am not so good at Maths so look out for errors.

Where W=wild and Sn = symbol identifier
Number of instances follows = and reel combinations shown in brackets.

Any Two of a Kind or more

W, S1/S2/W, any, any, any = 275,128 (1x7x34x34x34)
S1/S2, W, any, any, any = 235,824 (6x1x34x34x34) * Wild excluded reel 1 because calculated above

510,952 totalx20 lines = 10,219,040

Any Three of a kind using wilds (wilds used above and scatters excluded)

W, S3 to S10, W, any, any = 30,056 (1x26x1x34x34) * scatter excluded from reel 2 (makes no win)
S3 to S10, W, W, any, any = 30,056 (26x1x1x34x34) * scatter excluded from reel 1 (makes no win)

60,112 totalx20 lines = 1,202,240

Any 3 of a kind or more (wilds and scatters excluded)

s1,s1,s1, any, any = 20,808 (3x3x2x34x34)
s2, s2, s2, any, any = 31,212 (3x3x3x34x34) * an oddity?
S3, S3, S3, Any, Any = 20,808 (2x3x3x34x34)
S4, S4, S4, Any, Any = 31,212 (3x3x3x34x34)
S5, S5, S5, Any, Any = 31,212 (3x3x3x34x34)
S6, S6, S6, Any, Any = 31,212 (3x3x3x34x34)
S7, S7, S7, Any, Any = 31,212 (3x3x3x34x34)
S8, S8, S8, Any, Any = 55,488 (4x3x4x34x34)
S9, S9, S9, Any, Any = 73,984 (4x4x4x34x34)
S10, S10, S10, Any, Any = 73,984 (4x4x4x34x34)

401,132 totalx20 lines = 8,022,640

Any 2 scatters or more

353,736 (3x3x34x34x34) * 3 because scatter

353,736 totalx10 = 3,537,360 * Multiply by 10 possible 2 of a kind combinations on 5 reels

Total winning combinations (note most of these return much lower than bet)

10,219,040
01,202,240
08,022,640
03,537,360

22,981,280 TOTAL

Total possible combinations 45,435,424 (34x34x34x34x34)

22,981,280 in 45,435,424 chance of any spin returning more than zero (1.977* negligibly better than an even chance)

Probability of 50 complimentary spins returning zero = (1/2)^50 = 1,125,899,906,842,624 actually that is calculated at even

money and the odds are actually worse.

To give that number some meaning lets assume that 10,000 people play this offer each and every day, thats 3 million 560

thousand every year. How long before we can expect someone to complain they won zero?
31,626,401 Years! That is over 31 Million years LOL.

I would be surprised if there are no mistakes in my calculations though as I did them manually so if you spot any feel free to

chime in and we can recalculate.

OMG!!!!!!!!

Nothing to tell...im so happy that it was not my money, but still feeling a little ripped.
Or maybe im feeling special lol i can say that i am 1 in 187897987987897 LOL.
Maybe someone from ladbrokes can explain this????

 

[Rusty]

Yes you were truly blessed.
I also suffered a bout of dyslexia when I stated there were 356 days in a year - never mind I can't be bothered editing it now.

 

[De Beuker]

Thanks for your effort Rusty!

Funny how close your calculation comes to my personal experience that every 2nd spin gives at least some return.

For me this is solid proof that the games are not as random as they pretend they are.
Either the game was broken or its rigged. Simple.
I'm sure that if something similar had happened with Blackjack (like losing 50 hands in a row without even a single push) HELL would have broken lose.

I'm also sure that if something similar had happened on Rival software even more hell would have broken lose.

But its Microgaming, AND its a slotgame, so I guess they'll get away with it.
In Microgaming We Trust.

10.000 people spinning 24/7 for 31 MILLION years... WTF are we talking about here?!?


Edit: Simmo, you compared the odds to hitting a jackpot.
The odds of hitting a jackpot on TS1 (5xThor) are 1/3.600.000
So by the time you run into an event like this, you should have hit around 90.000 jackpots.
The odds are not even in the same universe.

 

[Rusty]

Thanks for your effort Rusty!

Funny how close your calculation comes to my personal experience that every 2nd spin gives at least some return.

For me this is solid proof that the games are not as random as they pretend they are.
Either the game was broken or its rigged. Simple.
I'm sure that if something similar had happened with Blackjack (like losing 50 hands in a row without even a single push) HELL would have broken lose.

I'm also sure that if something similar had happened on Rival software even more hell would have broken lose.

But its Microgaming, AND its a slotgame, so I guess they'll get away with it.
In Microgaming We Trust.

10.000 people spinning 24/7 for 31 MILLION years... WTF are we talking about here?!?

Yeah but that is according to my mental arithmetic and that has been known to go awry and I did base the final figure on 356 days a years.

Still, you made nice guesstimate I think.

I do think it is obvious that this was an extraordinary event.
Absolute proof for me would be if that feat were repeated on the same offer.
Barring that some statistical analysis of those that played these free spins that showed a pattern of below average returns.

However, I am certain the slot was not rigged to pay out zero though this statistical aberration (abomination?) may have been a side effect of the weighting going awry because the RTP was set below a certain thresh-hold. (a bug in other words)
Pure speculation on my part though.

EDIT.

I have noticed my calculations were incorrect at the end of my post and not only the 356 days a year mistake. (I rushed the end analogy, sorry)
What does this mean, well it means that if my calculations are correct this event was actually much more unlikely than I originally thought.

1,125,899,906,842,624 which is the probability of the event occuring - divided by 3,650,000 which is the number of attempts made at the 50 spins in one year with ten thousand people playing the promo each day.

How many years does that make that we can expect such a probability to occur in.

308,465,727 Years.
So actually well over 300 million years LOL

Just for fun (The figure is meaningless really) that is 56,294,995,342,131,200 spins

Wonder if that would be a big enough sample size?

Another fun fact is that you would on average pick all 6 winning lottery numbers scooping the jackpot (UK 49 balls 6 picks, almost 14, million to one to hit all 6 numbers) over 80 Million times before pulling off this feat again.
Fair to say it was rather unlikely event.

I will sleep on this and see if I have made any silly mistakes tomorrow.

 

[Miss_Token]

***Information upgrade***

Hi everyone i want to make a upgrade to all this.

Today i receive a email from aspinalls (in spanish) offer me to enter to a free tourney (it was a generic marketing mail).
Of course i wrote back that i had ask for close my account because of the "50 free spins dead in a row". They ask me that maybe it was a problem with the software and that i need to re-install. They give me the 50 free spins again.
I DIDNT ASK FOR THIS FREE SPINS, indeed, i had unistall this casino...

I have good luck (with 3 bonus rounds in this 50 free spins)
Expired Image

Then i went to play (with that 18 bucks) to dolphins coast, and i think that in the spin number 30 i won a BIG WIN for 151 bucks.


Expired Image

I have a lot of thoughts about this, but the first is that aspinalls give a solution and this situation gave a good turn for me (im still have a lot to playtrough)
Everyone can make his own opinion. Im just came here to make this upgrade.

 

[De Beuker]

Thats nice of them, congrats on the win!

Now, if anyone can explain to me how a 100% TRULY RANDOM slotgame can produce 50 dead spins in a row (and God knows how much more if she would have had 100 free spins) because of a SOFTWARE ERROR i'd be delighted.

 

[winnington]

Why would MG or a licensee rig free spins of all things?

It doesn't make sense. Promotional free spins like this are supposed to be used to make someone want to deposit and play. To rig free spins, which are almost always at minimum denomination/minimum credits per line makes no sense, since it would actually make people not want to deposit.

I'd be more likely to believe there was a conspiracy if it happened after depositing, or only happened when increasing bet size, or something of that nature.

Clearly, either something extremely extraordinary happened, or there was an error on the back end of the system (maybe the same dead spin was sent over and over?) but I really don't believe anything was "rigged" here.

 

[vinylweatherman]

It was the CASINO that brought up "software error". Given the astronomical probabilities calculated for this sequence ocurring naturally, this DOES merit investigation.

18 bucks from THREE bonus rounds during free spins isn't impressive either. You are lucky to get ONE bonus round (it's 1 in 166 chance or thereabouts) in 50 spins.

Now if this happens AGAIN, with it's one in 300 million year probability if we all play Avalon for the rest of time, serious questions need to be asked about whether these offers really ARE genuine spins on a slot, or a predetermined comp that can be zero, that is played out on a "special" version of the game loaded temporarily into the lobby to provide "eye candy".

The 1 in 300 million year calculation assumes that these were 50 independent spins on an unweighted Avalon slot game. It would be meaningless if the free spin offers do NOT work like this.

 

[all4greed]

They ask me that maybe it was a problem with the software and that i need to re-install.

So you had a version that allowed for 50 spins to not pay anything? What a strange statement.

 

[Rusty]

It was the CASINO that brought up "software error". Given the astronomical probabilities calculated for this sequence ocurring naturally, this DOES merit investigation.

18 bucks from THREE bonus rounds during free spins isn't impressive either. You are lucky to get ONE bonus round (it's 1 in 166 chance or thereabouts) in 50 spins.

Now if this happens AGAIN, with it's one in 300 million year probability if we all play Avalon for the rest of time, serious questions need to be asked about whether these offers really ARE genuine spins on a slot, or a predetermined comp that can be zero, that is played out on a "special" version of the game loaded temporarily into the lobby to provide "eye candy".

The 1 in 300 million year calculation assumes that these were 50 independent spins on an unweighted Avalon slot game. It would be meaningless if the free spin offers do NOT work like this.

I don't believe that this can be a preset amount awarded as comps and represented as a random game because they certainly would not award zero.

The only theory that makes sense to me is that the RTP of the slots can be altered and during the comp period or perhaps specifically for comp play it was lowered considerably causing this extreme result.
That may still mean this was a very unlikely event but perhaps much more likely than if the RTP was 95% and no weighting were used.

It is not unlikely that comp play would be set a lower RTP because the idea of the comps is not to give you a rewarding experience but to get you logged back into the casino.

One more way to look at the 50 blank spins at 20 lines is to consider it is the same as playing 1 line and hitting zero for 1,000 consecutive spins on a slot that has wild symbols and pays for 2 of a kind (forgetting scatter wins).

Does not seem plausible does it?

I agree it warrants further investigation.

I wonder if the Op - Miss Token -would be good enough to take screenshots of the playlog so each spin is visually represented - a lot of hassle I know - but it could be very helpful in analysing what may of occurred.

 

[Miss_Token]

I don't believe that this can be a preset amount awarded as comps and represented as a random game because they certainly would not award zero.

The only theory that makes sense to me is that the RTP of the slots can be altered and during the comp period or perhaps specifically for comp play it was lowered considerably causing this extreme result.
That may still mean this was a very unlikely event but perhaps much more likely than if the RTP was 95% and no weighting were used.

It is not unlikely that comp play would be set a lower RTP because the idea of the comps is not to give you a rewarding experience but to get you logged back into the casino.

One more way to look at the 50 blank spins at 20 lines is to consider it is the same as playing 1 line and hitting zero for 1,000 consecutive spins on a slot that has wild symbols and pays for 2 of a kind (forgetting scatter wins).

Does not seem plausible does it?

I agree it warrants further investigation.

I wonder if the Op - Miss Token -would be good enough to take screenshots of the playlog so each spin is visually represented - a lot of hassle I know - but it could be very helpful in analysing what may of occurred.

I will do that if you can explain me how.... i learn fast

 

[Seventh777]

I will do that if you can explain me how.... i learn fast

I hopefully have made this easier to understand for you (with pictures lol)

Old Attachment (Invalid)

The info Rusty needs is the reel positions per spin, which appear when you click on view, hope this helps.

 

[Seventh777]

I don't believe that this can be a preset amount awarded as comps and represented as a random game because they certainly would not award zero.

The only theory that makes sense to me is that the RTP of the slots can be altered and during the comp period or perhaps specifically for comp play it was lowered considerably causing this extreme result.
That may still mean this was a very unlikely event but perhaps much more likely than if the RTP was 95% and no weighting were used.

It is not unlikely that comp play would be set a lower RTP because the idea of the comps is not to give you a rewarding experience but to get you logged back into the casino.

One more way to look at the 50 blank spins at 20 lines is to consider it is the same as playing 1 line and hitting zero for 1,000 consecutive spins on a slot that has wild symbols and pays for 2 of a kind (forgetting scatter wins).

Does not seem plausible does it?

I agree it warrants further investigation.

I wonder if the Op - Miss Token -would be good enough to take screenshots of the playlog so each spin is visually represented - a lot of hassle I know - but it could be very helpful in analysing what may of occurred.

Just a thought, I wonder if the slots used in tournaments have different settings as such, I think anyone whom has played Tomb Raider, Loaded, Ladies Night, TS1 and Avalon to name but a few, will nearly all agree they play a whole lot different when using real money, and if so then using a slot configured for tournaments for free spins may yield some erratic returns.

Not that i`m saying tourney slots could be configured to - say, give you a feature right at the end of your go, or increase in coinage with each rebuy until you hit that soft cap needed to have a chance before wasting continues etc, etc, nope, not saying anything like that happens lol.;o

 

[Rusty]

Thanks Seventh777 that was a very helpful post.

Miss_Token Seventh is right that what I really want is the reel stop positions for all 5 reels on each spin. You don't have to take screenshots as you can work the stop positions out for yourself by referring to KasinoKing's post earlier in this thread which lists all the reel stop positions and explains how each symbol is represented.
It may actually be quicker for you just to take screenshots but don't post them here they would take up too much space - instead PM me and I will give you an email to send them to.

It is still a very laborious task I am afraid
It is up to you if you want to devote the time to it - nobody would think any the less of you if you didn't give up your time on such a boring project and we can't be sure the results will reveal any more than we already know so don't feel that you need to do this.

 

[Seventh777]

Thanks Seventh777 that was a very helpful post.

Yw, I think we`ve scared her off though, I have that effect on woman.