Bonus Complaint 21Grand Casino "Bonus Abuse"

[billy_g22]

My PAB went the same. They aren't responsive and won't give a reason why I've had my player account locked except for "bonus abuse" with no specifics. Multiple times I've been told an account manager would contact me but it doesn't happen.

Between supreme play and 21 grand the've withheld $1875 and it looks like I won't be seeing it. I've been trying since the beginning of September.

 

[De Beuker]

Well, I now received an email from maxd telling me that 21Grand did not even bother to discuss the issue with him. Thank you very much maxd for your effort...unfortunately it all doesn't have a good ending. For all players, I think this now issued warning should really be taken seriously, it is just rogue behaviour what they did to me and it is even more rogue to not even discuss it with maxd.

Sorry to hear this Fahrradfoh, I really had high hopes for you to receive your winnings, as you clearly won your money fair and square.

I hope 21G and Supreme Play end up where they belong, at the bottom of the roguepit, not just 'Not Recommended'.
Your winnings got confiscated based on a NON EXISTING term, not a hidden term, as 'hidden' clearly suggests that it could be found when searching carefully.

This is rogue behavior if ever I saw it!
Crooks!

 

[all4greed]

Wow, that ended badly. Guess they don't care much about their reputation.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Last time the Rival white labels went into the pit, it was the rep for 21Grand that was most visibly agrieved that "his" fine establishment was being tarred with the same brush as the others, now - not a peep, he won't even talk to Max. It looks like he was just manipulating all of us, trying to convince us that we were wrong in lumping all the Rival white labels together. Thanks to Max being persuaded, and removing them from the pit, players continued to play because, on the face of it, they were back to "good to go" status, with the CEO of Rival promising that if a white label went bust, Rival would pay the players.
This pair took advantage of this act of mercy, and decided to "screw players" by deliberately targeting them with " too good to be true" offers; taking the money from the losers, but looking for every excuse they could find to confiscate winnings, even to the extent of using the bullshit excuse that the Rival rating system failed to detect these "bonus abusers" until they had made loads of LOSING deposits and had their first win.

We KNOW that the Rival rating system does not JUST bonus ban winners, it CAN detect "bonus abuse" even when players have LOST.

It looks like they deliberately crippled the system to keep the deposits coming in from players they ALREADY KNEW were "bonus abusers", and whom they would NOT be paying once they had won.

This time, it will be a good deal HARDER for the Rival white labels to get out of the pit. It will look bad if Max trusts them AGAIN, and later has to put them in the pit a THIRD time after even MORE players get screwed.

 

[maxd]

Thanks to Max being persuaded ... It will look bad if Max trusts them AGAIN ...

Sorry, but those decisions are well out of my league. Bryan handles all that sort of thing.

 

[Redbush54]

There's a new guy now as David has moved up. You might try his replacement simon at bestpaypartners.net

 

[simonwhite]

There's a new guy now as David has moved up. You might try his replacement simon at bestpaypartners.net

Hi,

As Redbush54 stated, my name is Simon and I have just started at BestPay Partners as the Affiliate Director.

Thank you for bringing these issues to my attention, I will look into them and try and get them resloved as soon as possible.

In the meantime, if anyone else is experiencing issues, please get in touch with me at Simon at bestpaypartners.net so i can deal with them directly.

Thanks

Simon

 

[KasinoKing]

Hi,

As Redbush54 stated, my name is Simon and I have just started at BestPay Partners as the Affiliate Director.

Thank you for bringing these issues to my attention, I will look into them and try and get them resolved as soon as possible.

In the meantime, if anyone else is experiencing issues, please get in touch with me at Simon at bestpaypartners.net so i can deal with them directly.

Thanks

Simon

Hi Simon,

Glad to see you've joined the forum to address these issues after I pointed you to this thread yesterday
I hope you can do a better job than your predecessor.

I also hope you have read the whole thread, but I just in case, I want to make sure you saw this comment posted by Max above:

A bit of free advice: this is the wrong place to claim that things are being dealt with when they are not. Not to put too fine a point on this but if you're bullshitting me on these PABs -- claiming you are settling things with the players when no such thing is happening -- you will find that approach highly unsatisfactory when the truth comes out.

Welcome to the forum - and good luck!
KK

 

[billy_g22]

Email sent to Simon. Thanks very much whoever pointed him here and fingers crossed I can finally get some answers.

 

[fahrradfloh]

Hi Simon,

Glad to see you've joined the forum to address these issues after I pointed you to this thread yesterday

KK

Thank you very much KasinoKing for that!

 

[bowlingbob]

I havent deposited in here in a while but they are calling me so much from international numbers and its at all hours of the day when I am work and when I am asleep. They are so desperate for business that they are telling me lies on the phone. Telling me when after I complained about the slots being tight there and he told me if I make a deposit in the cashier he will give me a tip and tell me which games are hot and which ones are not. Now that is total bs if they know on the server side what machines are going to pay then its not random after all like I wanted to believe. Its been a nightmare with them I am about to change my number.

 

[maxd]

FYI I am trying to contact Simon regarding the outstanding and unresolved 21 Grand and SupremePlay issues (several PABs). We'll see what we see.

 

[vinylweatherman]

I havent deposited in here in a while but they are calling me so much from international numbers and its at all hours of the day when I am work and when I am asleep. They are so desperate for business that they are telling me lies on the phone. Telling me when after I complained about the slots being tight there and he told me if I make a deposit in the cashier he will give me a tip and tell me which games are hot and which ones are not. Now that is total bs if they know on the server side what machines are going to pay then its not random after all like I wanted to believe. Its been a nightmare with them I am about to change my number.

The more they phone, the LESS likely they are a safe place to play. It seems the agent will say anything they think you want to hear that might sway you into depositing. Their "tips" are probably nothing more than which games IN THE PAST have been "hot". This would offer NO guidance at all as to what to expect in the future.

Their phone tactics also seem to be based on wearing you down until you DO deposit, just to get the calls to stop. This is evidence of SEVERE cash problems at the casino, and shows how much they NEED more players to deposit. The way Rival in general have dealt with players is WHY they have found deposits have dried up, and why they have to try SO HARD to persuade players to start depositing again.

 

[BingoT]

Hey Max I have been talking to Simon for the past week via Email.
I told him about this & to contact you asap.
Lets see what takes place now.
Last Activity: Yesterday 01:11 PM Simon was seen
Did he contact you yet Max?
~T~

 

[maxd]

Did he contact you yet Max?

Yes. It seems he's busy getting up to speed and I haven't had a chance to get back to him yet.

 

[Nifty29]

The worst part of this is that the guy who couldn't sort it out last time has been promoted. Very reassuring!

Of course, some affiliates will tell you there is nothing to worry about....so I guess there is nothing to worry about!

After all, the Rival white labels are only in the 'Not Recommended' section so there is no need to be alarmed. It's not like they are in the 'Rogue' section .

I mean, even if a casino is in the Rogue Pit, the other casinos owned and operated by the same people should be just fine. There is no way those same rogue owners will try the same rogue tactics at another one of their casinos......nahhhhhh.

Sorry if it's a bit OT, but it is kinda relevant.

 

[GI Joe]

I was contcted by Simon a few days ago. He wanted Casino Traffic...

I told him he was on the CM list - he told me that he would return to me as soon as the casinos was removed from this list.

lets see where it ends!

Gi Joe

 

[Nifty29]

he told me that he would return to me as soon as the casinos was removed from this list.

Ummm.....I wouldn't go reserving a space for them GIJoe

Anyway, they get enough airtime from their existing solid gold affiliates

 

[billy_g22]

Simon had a casino player manager contact me regarding my issue.

They say I've had my account locked because I made 3 withdrawals in the past right at or near the %100 bonus threshold. (Though I've made a ton of deposits) The player manager was very nice and we had a pretty lengthy conversation.

In the end. I'm getting $500 of the original $1875. He said there is no way to prove I wasn't using a 3rd party software to know my bonus thresholds and I'm receiving some of the money because it was their fault for not stopping it sooner. He also said that originally he was told by his boss to give nothing but my deposits back. Which would have been only $50.

I'm happy to be receiving something...After 3 months $50 would have been a slap in the face. But I still feel I did nothing wrong and if they didn't want me to play with bonuses they should have just bonus banned me.

 

[takethemoney]

Simon had a casino player manager contact me regarding my issue.

They say I've had my account locked because I made 3 withdrawals in the past right at or near the %100 bonus threshold. (Though I've made a ton of deposits) The player manager was very nice and we had a pretty lengthy conversation.

In the end. I'm getting $500 of the original $1875. He said there is no way to prove I wasn't using a 3rd party software to know my bonus thresholds and I'm receiving some of the money because it was their fault for not stopping it sooner. He also said that originally he was told by his boss to give nothing but my deposits back. Which would have been only $50.

I'm happy to be receiving something...After 3 months $50 would have been a slap in the face. But I still feel I did nothing wrong and if they didn't want me to play with bonuses they should have just bonus banned me.

Sorry, but this is complete and utter bull shit on the casino's part, representative of a rogue casino.

 

[De Beuker]

Simon had a casino player manager contact me regarding my issue.

They say I've had my account locked because I made 3 withdrawals in the past right at or near the %100 bonus threshold. (Though I've made a ton of deposits) The player manager was very nice and we had a pretty lengthy conversation.

In the end. I'm getting $500 of the original $1875. He said there is no way to prove I wasn't using a 3rd party software to know my bonus thresholds and I'm receiving some of the money because it was their fault for not stopping it sooner. He also said that originally he was told by his boss to give nothing but my deposits back. Which would have been only $50.

I'm happy to be receiving something...After 3 months $50 would have been a slap in the face. But I still feel I did nothing wrong and if they didn't want me to play with bonuses they should have just bonus banned me.

Aah, so using a spreadsheet to keep track of your wagering is now also a reason to confiscate winnings?
(You better watch out KK!!)

And WR is WR, nowhere in the T&C's is written that you MUST play a certain percentage over the required WR.
If the manager does not like that, he can bonusban the player, or close his account, but can NEVER be a reason to confiscate winnings.
Thats as rogue as it gets imo.

Avoid these places like the plague.

 

[KasinoKing]

They say I've had my account locked because I made 3 withdrawals in the past right at or near the %100 bonus threshold. (Though I've made a ton of deposits) The player manager was very nice and we had a pretty lengthy conversation.

In the end. I'm getting $500 of the original $1875. He said there is no way to prove I wasn't using a 3rd party software to know my bonus thresholds and I'm receiving some of the money because it was their fault for not stopping it sooner. He also said that originally he was told by his boss to give nothing but my deposits back. Which would have been only $50

What?
He was very nice while he was robbing you?
Sounds like being mugged by a thug who says "please" and "thank you"

So much for Simon "putting right previous wrongs" - off to my rogue list they go.

KK

 

[Mousey]

3rd party software to know my bonus thresholds

sooooo.... they're psychic! .. I guess using a pencil and a piece of paper and your brain to track wagers would still get winnings confiscated...

My last statement on this idiocy... the same thing Bryan says, the same thing we all say... over and over and over... ad nauseum...

Unless a player is a proven fraud/crook (multiple accounts, using someone else's CC, etc.), if the player has complied w/the T&C and met stated WR, then... PAY THE PLAYER, THEN BAN HIM if you no longer want his action....

 

[takethemoney]

I guess this is one of those casinos that believe anything that will not allow them to vacuum all the money out of your wallet must be cheating on your part. Sick bastards!

 

[billy_g22]

I never said I agreed with the decision. Just that the rep was a nice guy. There is no way I would advise anyone to play at either of these casinos after this. It's been a long drawn out mess and in the end i lose out on $1400. Like I said before, I'm just done with this whole thing and really getting something was better than I expected after all the time it took.

It's pretty easy to cash out near the %100 threshold. All you have to do is check once in a while to see if the WR are met in the cashier...