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100% winnings on Playtech's roulette, just another scam ?

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by Alexandre, May 29, 2006.

    May 29, 2006
  1. Alexandre

    Alexandre Official Rep for Slotsmillion and Ladylucks webmeister

    Occupation:
    Owner
    Location:
    Barcelona, Spain
    To be more precise, it's 97% winnings because the software I'm going to talk about predicts the colour given by Playtech's roulette, red or black, and it only fails when the 0 comes out .
    This happens 1 once for 37 numbers, wich is less than 3%, that's why I say that this software predicts in 97% of the time, the right colour.
    Well, now that I have your attention, I'm going to explain what's all about.
    Have you ever heard about You must register/login in order to see the link. ?
    I found out that a member already asked for that same website days ago:
    http://www.casinomeister.com/forums/ask-casinomeister/12497-online-roulette-teacher.html
    You can find them Googling "roulette", in the sponsored links (they appear at the end, sometimes you have to go for "more sponsored links" to find them).
    Basically, they offer software which is a crack of Playtech's roulette algo, even if they dont claim that.
    It works perfect on fun mode, lets say 100% (forget the 0), on any Playtech casino with the simple roulette or European roulette (the name depends of the casino).
    You download their software and you start chating with a "teacher" which ask you after a while to put a 10 numbers series given by the Playtech' roulette (you play 10 times and you put the numbers in the order given by the roulette in their software).
    So you go on a PlayTech casino, on fun mode, play 10 times, get the numbers and put them it their software and then...it predicts you with 100% winning the outgoing colour as many times as you want (you only loose when the 0 comes out).
    It's not only what they claim, it really happens, I've spent 10 hours using this software and it's true.
    But when you try it for real, it doesn't work.
    You get more or less 50% winning and 50% loss.
    To explain this, they say that on real mode, they only give you 60% winnings because they don't want you to get caught (they also ask you to dont withdraw more than 8K$ per month and per casino), but they can give you a 80% winning version if you pay them 5.000$.
    They also say that their software will work with MicroGaming soon.
    You don't have to download the casino from them (the links to the casinos are in the software) but they ask you which casino you will download and when you'll do it (they say that they have to know how many players using their system will play at the same casino at the same time).
    They have your IP address, so maybe they have a special deal with an affiliate manager and they get their commission by saying exactly at what time and with which IP address the player will come.
    All PT casinos they "promote" are from Sunny Group and Casino Blaster.
    They say that they aren't affiliate and that all they want is 80% of your winnings up to 5.000$ or 5.000$ from he beginning but then they will provide a 80% instead of 60% winning version and they will allow you to play at 2 casinos at the same time (as they only allow a fixed number of spins per day).
    Facts:
    They software only works on fun mode, so Playtechs roulette algo isnt the same on fun mode and on real mode
    Its impossible to crack a real RNG, so Playtechs roulette algo on fun mode isnt a RNG but predetermined series of numbers (which means that they can predict the numbers but they only give the colour to keep it more realistic)

    Questions:
    What is their business model ? Being paid 5.000$ from guys paying them before getting any winnings when they could pay later (they would do that to get the 80% winning version software immediately)? I dont believe it. I think they work for affiliate revenues.
    Who profits from the crime ? The affiliate, Sunny Group, Casino Blaster, Playtech ?
    Was Playtechs roulette predetermined series of numbers cracked by the affiliate without the knowledge of Playtech or did PT provided the info to their affiliation marketing staff ?
    Is this last scenario, we have 2 options: this operation is controlled directly by the affiliation marketing company or they delegated the job to an affiliate.
    I just cant imagine a serious e-gaming company involved in such a stupid short term trick.
    I have recorded a video of the software in process and I have e-mails sent to me by onlinerouletteteacher.com where they explain how the stuff works.
    When Ive said them what I think about this, theyve answered me that I was wrong and that I should try again. Ive sent them 2 more e-mails but at the moment when I write these words, I didnt receive any answer from them.
    Here is a copy of the first e-mail Ive received from them:

     
  2. May 29, 2006
  3. Slotster!

    Slotster! I predict a riot. CAG

    Occupation:
    al Hazard
    Location:
    Location, Location!
    I've already got it to work on Microgaming!

    Go try it right now...

    RED
    RED
    BLACK
    BLACK
    BLACK
    RED
    BLACK
    BLACK
    RED
    RED
    RED
    RED
    BLACK
    BLACK
    RED
    BLACK
    RED
    BLACK
    RED
    BLACK

    (Repeat x infinity)

    Please note, I've included some wrong colours in there intentionally so as to not look suspicious, but you'll never get more than five in a row wrong. Probably. (If you do, we'll just ignore it)

    That's pure comedy!
     
  4. May 29, 2006
  5. Linus

    Linus Dormant account

    Occupation:
    asdf
    Location:
    TX
    Alex, they're not predicting anything, and they haven't cracked any codes. They're just substituting their own program for the casino's, after you download their software, so it looks like their system works. It doesn't.

    You need to get your system professionally cleaned/re-installed. Who knows what trojans/viruses they've put on your computer. You should also change any passwords - from a clean computer - immediately.
     
    1 person likes this.
  6. May 29, 2006
  7. GrandMaster

    GrandMaster Ueber Meister CAG

    Occupation:
    Mathematician by day, online gambler by night.
    Location:
    UK
    Getting paid $5000 by suckers. I thought this was obvious.
     
    1 person likes this.
  8. May 29, 2006
  9. tiger2006

    tiger2006 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    Lager
    Location:
    Germany
    Is the Software online roulette teacher realy spamfree, no trojan or virus?

    Because you hit the button to load example downloading software from gpc.
    Is the install downloading file the same as on orginal gpc homepage?
    After installing you must given your real name and adress in this fileld.
    during the online roulette teacher software is backstage of this procedur.
    I ask me why.

    So i have now deinstalled the software from the system because not sure of this software.
    Is better believe me.


    LG tiger2006
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2006
  10. May 29, 2006
  11. orbiter 1

    orbiter 1 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    vehicle technician
    Location:
    uk
    online roulette teacher scam

    Hi all i fell for this scam about a month ago i got the exact same reply as alexandre.
    they have got to be affiliated in some way to certain casinos or else there would be no point in them plugging their system.
    i have lost count of the number of e-mails i sent(over 20)
    i lost a 150 bankroll in ten minutes guess thats how vunerable we all are to scammers.
     
  12. May 29, 2006
  13. derelict

    derelict Dormant account

    Occupation:
    ..
    Location:
    ....
    It's undoubtedly more akin to a PC game 'trainer' in that it fiddles with the game's memory to cause it to behave in a certain way.

    In addition to the $5000, they're obviously affiliated with the groups they promote, so if you guys want to go after them, you might use that as a starting point. There and with whatever payment processor they're using for the five grand.
     
  14. May 29, 2006
  15. orbiter 1

    orbiter 1 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    vehicle technician
    Location:
    uk
    online roulette teacher

    they wanted the 5000 to be paid through netteller which is why they say you can use the software for a week to make the money to send to them.
    the problem is you dont make a penny it just sucks your bankroll dry.
    they must then collect there affiliate money and a percentage of your deposits,i checked one of their casinos affiliate programs and they get paid a good sum of money for people signing up.THIS IS ONE PLACE TO STAY WELL CLEAR OF!!!!!!
     
  16. May 29, 2006
  17. derelict

    derelict Dormant account

    Occupation:
    ..
    Location:
    ....
    Sorry you got burned, but seriously, warning people who knew better in the first place isn't going to do much good. If you do want to do something about it, PM me and I'll see what I can do.
     
  18. May 29, 2006
  19. orbiter 1

    orbiter 1 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    vehicle technician
    Location:
    uk
    ONLINE ROULETTE TEACHER

    Thanks derelict but its not worth pursuing,I lost 150 just have to put it down to experiance. I guess there's a sucker for every seat in the world. lol
    If this stops just one more person from getting scammed i'm happy.
     
  20. May 30, 2006
  21. Slotster!

    Slotster! I predict a riot. CAG

    Occupation:
    al Hazard
    Location:
    Location, Location!
    "You can't cheat an honest man"

    There's a programme here in the UK called 'The Real Hustle', that analyses and explains various different cons, tricks, scams and hustles. Essentially, they explain that any potential 'mark' has to be willing to be slightly dishonest, and expecting to make a quick buck by any means neccesary...

    These chaps are exploiting exactly that.

    If you're able to morally accept potential 'winnings' by what is apparently 'beating the system' - you deserve everything you get IMHO....
     
  22. May 30, 2006
  23. derelict

    derelict Dormant account

    Occupation:
    ..
    Location:
    ....
    I don't guess you'd mind then if your mom lost her savings to a nigerian scammer. That's an extreme example, but I see no reason to accept this type of behavior.

    Still, if he's not willing to pursue it, I don't really care enough to find out what wonderful surprises their .exe may hold.
     
  24. May 30, 2006
  25. soflat

    soflat Senior Member

    Occupation:
    Scientist
    Location:
    Florida
    What were you planning to do with the software? How much were you going to take the casinos for?
     
  26. May 30, 2006
  27. nafanny29

    nafanny29 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    financail adviser
    Location:
    London, England
    Tell me this thread is wind-up!!!!

    Sending off $5000 for a device to cheat casinos.

    Ok if it actually works you would be investigated to the hilt by any casino you manage to beat for $1000s and $1000s playing roulette, and of course they would never pay you. If the casino saw that your results were out of the relms of proberbility there is NO WAY you would be paid.

    And downloading "software" from a dodgy source is jusk asking for huge problems and proberly a serious identity theft.
     
  28. May 30, 2006
  29. Slotster!

    Slotster! I predict a riot. CAG

    Occupation:
    al Hazard
    Location:
    Location, Location!
    If she thought she could gain several thousand quid from apparently doing nothing, then yes. Or no. Whatever... The theory stands. The only time ANYONE can get stung by a financial con that requires acceptance and participation, is if they're under the assumption they are going to profit financially.

    Nigerian/Wherever scammers are scum.
    People who get sucked in are greedy and stupid.

    My mum would struggle anyway, she can't even switch a computer on - much less pick up an email.
     
  30. May 30, 2006
  31. quber

    quber Senior Member

    Occupation:
    spy
    Location:
    Europe
    I can't believe any one falls for these (or any) types of scams. If I had software that could beat the system why would i sell it? They are telling people to play low bets so as not to alert the casinos, why would I risk people playing big bets and exposing my software? Because it can't work!!!

    The RNG can't be predicted, the games are played on the casino's servers, not on your computer, your computer is just fed the results to be displayed to you.

    Remember, If it sounds 'too good to be true' then it is.
     
  32. May 30, 2006
  33. Alexandre

    Alexandre Official Rep for Slotsmillion and Ladylucks webmeister

    Occupation:
    Owner
    Location:
    Barcelona, Spain
    Hi everybody,

    Could we focus the debate on the ability of the software to predict 100% of the time the right colour of any Playtechs roulette (and who is behind it) and forget the legitimate but unnecessary questions about you should not use this kind of tricks, how bad you are dirty cheater ?
    It is a fact that the software works on demo mode.
    It isnt a spyware, it doesnt trick or substitute your casino software, ect
    I installed it on a PC, and played roulette from another PC, from a PlayTech casino which was already downloaded there a long time before.
    Take as a fact that in demo mode, Playtech roulette gives predetermined series of numbers, or at least of colours.
    It isnt a spyware because I have all the tools and the ability to detect one and even if its a home made one which means that it is not yet registered by the anti virus companies, it doesnt communicate with a server out there as Ive checked every single packet of data coming to and going out of my PC.
    For those who want to investigate properly this case, I will ask you to read carefully my first post as Ive spent time to give as much information I couldwhen I read some of the answers posted, I doubt thats what their authors have done.
    Ill try now to answer to everybody.
    @Slotster: sorry, but none of your comments deserve that I spend time on it
    @Linus: As Ive said just before, its impossible because the software was hosted on another PC
    @GrandMaster: no, because if you read what I first wrote, they ask you for 80% of your winnings up to 5.000 (so you pay after using they software which is an ASP application which means they can cut it whenever they want). I think that this is clearly a pretext, they hide their real business model, and their status (affiliate, affiliation marketing company, etc), behind that. If they get the 5.000, perfect, its a bonus, but as Orbiter1 said it:
    @Tiger2006: same as for Linus
    @Orbiter: You should have done it easier.playing with 0.10$ to validate the softwarebut its true that when youve seen this software working perfectly for 1 day, getting you 100% winnings in demo mode, your doubts disappear. Ive tested this with 4 people, we were using different PCs, from different places, one of them is a professional player and the other develops casino softwares, so thats why we were very sceptic from the beginning till the end.
    @Derelict: same as for Linusbut tell us what could you do if I would PM you ?
    @Nafanny29: You are perfectly rightbut that is where the scammers pitch is the most interesting. They explain that you cant withdraw more than 6 to 8K$ a month, that you have to loose (thats why the real version software doesnt work 100%). For the same reason (not being caught) they ask you to tell them in which casino you will play, this way they know how many people they have using their software in each casino (personally, I think that it is the way they track their players, as an affiliate or whatever).
    Believe me, all their pitch is just perfect and kudos to them because weve spent time chating with them, with multiple accounts at the same time, and everything theyve said fits perfectly with their version.
    Quber: Very good questionand their answer is just brilliant. The friend of mine who works for an operator told me that if somebody has developed a real software like that, he would act more or less the same way they do because casinos know exactly who is behind a player as they have his credit card number, IP address (and they can ask for much more when they have to pay you), etc.. You cant use a software like that alone as casinos would catch you after the 2nd withdrawal. You can open and account in each Playtech casino, but many casinos are operated by the same company and you could take a little bit of money once or twice in several casinos but soon youll get caught and they wouldnt pay you anymore.
    So the best way would be to have players working for you.
    Players would be like your affiliates.
    The problem is that this way, the story is going to be revealed very fast and Playtech would patch his software.
    On the other hand, the same friend explained to me that he believes that it is impossible to crack the RNG behind a casino software.
    He says that Playtechs real roulette is a real RNG, uncrackable, but that the demo version cant be a RNG otherwise you couldnt predict the colours.
    He says then that the Playtechs demo roulette gives predetermined series of numbers.
    For me, this is the real scoop behind this story, and everybody can verify it within 5 minutes, downloading the software and feeding it with a series of 10 numbers given by any Playtech casinos roulette. From then you can predict the next colours which will come out from the roulette. I did it so may times, with different casinos, predicting up to the next 100 colours (I could have done more, I was just getting bored) and the only time the software was wrong, was when the 0 was coming out.
    The second conclusion which is, ay least to me, very important is:
    Who and how profits the crime ?
    Did he cracked the predetermined series of numbers algo or was it given to him ?
    Is it just an affiliate or is itat this point, Im repeating myself, unfortunately.
    I must admit, as the conclusion of this second post, that Im a bit disappointed by the answers provided.
    I hoped that maybe some of you would have downloaded the software and investigated but I see that except those who knew it already, none of the people who posted here tried to verify by themselves what Ive said, otherwise I wouldnt have to repeat again and again that IT REALLY WORKS IN DEMO MODE and that it is exactly why this scam is so disturbing because it imply many things.
    It is those things I would like to discuss here, and not the it doesnt work, you shouldnt even have dreamt of it, how dare you ? and other easy to verify or just uninteresting issues.
     
  34. May 30, 2006
  35. Slotster!

    Slotster! I predict a riot. CAG

    Occupation:
    al Hazard
    Location:
    Location, Location!
    Alexandre - my comments on this thread are intended in a 'general' way towards scams online and off... This is surely a legitimate 'tangent' considering the subject matter of your post? It's all my opinion in terms of 'financial' scams, where the lure is the potential to earn easy money - of which this is a classic example.

    Moreover, I reiterate my opinion that anyone who tries it deserves all they get. I understand entirely (and share!) the 'technical' and 'inquisitive' nature of your post; I would suggest however that you understand the natural progression onto talking about scams and financial 'systems' in general.
     
  36. May 30, 2006
  37. soflat

    soflat Senior Member

    Occupation:
    Scientist
    Location:
    Florida
    The fact that it works in play-money mode is kind of interesting. Maybe there is a predetermined set of numbers, or some such thing in play mode.

    But you can't make money in play mode, and Orbiter said it does not work in real-money mode.

    If it worked they wouldn't sell it, and they definitely would not publicize it. All they would have to do is hit a few numbers in a row parlaying their winnings and they could have lived on easy street. A few wins in a row is normal and would not have alerted the casinos.
     
  38. May 30, 2006
  39. nafanny29

    nafanny29 Dormant account

    Occupation:
    financail adviser
    Location:
    London, England
    Alezandre maybe playtechs roulette has a set pattern in play mode. Say 300 preset numbers that repeat to infinity. And that anyone with the complete list would know what numbers are coming once they have seen any 10 in a row.

    Then they could present this "system", back it up with "proof" to anyone who is skeptical.

    They would then fleese your $5000 and when the user tries it on the real software it all goes horribly wrong.

    Possible? Cleaver too if it is something like this!!
     

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