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Its not so much the number of pardons, but who receives them.
Like 90% of the pardons dealt out by trump is to people connected in one way or another to his administration.
So much for draining the swamp i guess.

Perhaps this has been the case for all presidents?

The swamp won the election.

Its SOP for presidents to issue pardons on the last day. Its a 5 minute news story here and only the big (controversial) ones get mentioned like Julian A. and Bannon for example. However, I've never looked into the specific pardons by individual presidents. Another big one was this guy Marc Rich by Bill Clinton.
 
I don't totally disagree, trying to find a full list though, the bbc posted a dead whitehouse link on their article, which I quote from:

The president can only act on federal, not state, crimes. A pardon cancels a criminal conviction, while a commutation shortens or ends a prison sentence.
Gerald Ford pardoned Richard Nixon for all offences he may have committed, and Jimmy Carter pardoned most who had evaded the Vietnam War draft - both examples of preemptive pardons.

Bill Clinton caused uproar when he pardoned scores of people on his last day in office, including his half-brother, Roger.


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Obama commuted a lot of sentences, over 1,500; trump seems to have two recurring themes, associates or friends of family and rappers :rolleyes: but until I see the full list I reserve judgement.
Yeah, he has pardoned alot of associates and friends.
Just think its a bit backwards with all his talk about draining the swamp.

Another thing he removed at the last minute was the executive order he himself put in place, restricting white house staff from lobbying within 5 years of working in the wh.
Seems to me he is filling the swamp back up.

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"For 125 years, the key adviser to the president on clemency has been the Department of Justice's Office of the Pardon Attorney (OPA) which normally reviews all requests for pardons.[1] However, Trump often bypassed the OPA, and, unlike previous presidents, made the majority of his grants to executive clemency to "well-connected offenders who had not filed petitions with the pardon office or did not meet its requirements."[1] On February 19, 2020, Vermont Senator Patrick Leahy requested information on the process used by Trump in deciding to grant clemency to 11 people the preceding day.[9][10] In response to the criticism of his bypassing of the OPA, Trump said that he is the "chief law enforcement officer of the country."[11] Legal experts raised concerns that Trump was "relying on his personal connections rather than the Justice Department's established review process for finding convicts deserving of clemency."[11] Analysts at Lawfare determined that "seven of the 94 Trump grants came on recommendation from the pardon attorney" and "at least 84 out of 94 Trump pardons had a personal or political connection to the president."[2]"
 
I don't totally disagree, trying to find a full list though, the bbc posted a dead whitehouse link on their article, which I quote from:

The president can only act on federal, not state, crimes. A pardon cancels a criminal conviction, while a commutation shortens or ends a prison sentence.
Gerald Ford pardoned Richard Nixon for all offences he may have committed, and Jimmy Carter pardoned most who had evaded the Vietnam War draft - both examples of preemptive pardons.

Bill Clinton caused uproar when he pardoned scores of people on his last day in office, including his half-brother, Roger.


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Obama commuted a lot of sentences, over 1,500; trump seems to have two recurring themes, associates or friends of family and rappers :rolleyes: but until I see the full list I reserve judgement.
There's a list:
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There's one person who didn't get a pardon. That's enough for me :p

You mean Mr T himself?...I await with interest to see all these criminal cases waiting for donald, I highly doubt Mueller's team would have not picked up on anything mob or criminal related, though could be business irregularities/tax avoidance cases etc...where he gets a fine. But if he was seriously facing jail time, I think he'd look a lot more worried and anxious, I can't see it myself, but who knows these days...
 
You mean Mr T himself?...I await with interest to see all these criminal cases waiting for donald, I highly doubt Mueller's team would have not picked up on anything mob or criminal related, though could be business irregularities/tax avoidance cases etc...where he gets a fine. But if he was seriously facing jail time, I think he'd look a lot more worried and anxious, I can't see it myself, but who knows these days...
Yup Mr T! It's not only Muller investigations...also sexual assault claims, insurrection, tax avoidance. I'd add forging a weather map too but ah well. Enough lawsuits to keep him busy for few years.
 
Another thing he removed at the last minute was the executive order he himself put in place, restricting white house staff from lobbying within 5 years of working in the wh.
Seems to me he is filling the swamp back up.

I believe Joe can undo any presidential executive orders if he so wishes or put this one back in, but as a bit of a swamp denizen himself I highly doubt he will :cool:
 
I believe Joe can undo any presidential executive orders if he so wishes or put this one back in, but as a bit of a swamp denizen himself I highly doubt he will :cool:

He can and he already did undo some. I don't think he can undo an undone EO, he would have to write a new one and I don't think this one is high on his priority list. Altho I don't think it'd be a bad regulation really.

Doesn't seem like Trump was really draining the swamp then as he let loose some creatures at the last hour ;) He just wanted to fill it with his own creatures anyway. I think that's clear at this point in time.
 
I believe Joe can undo any presidential executive orders if he so wishes or put this one back in, but as a bit of a swamp denizen himself I highly doubt he will :cool:
Like suffer said he will probably have to write a new one.

But for all Trumps talk about draining the swamp, he is acting real swampy with his pardons and last minute executive order changes.
And i know this is not proof, but look at this video of Trump leaving the white house.

111.gif
 
I believe Joe can undo any presidential executive orders if he so wishes or put this one back in, but as a bit of a swamp denizen himself I highly doubt he will :cool:
He's done 17 today. One was the travel ban I mentioned back on Dec. 5th. He stopped the border wall funding and keystone pipeline construction. (Of course we're spending $500 million to build a wall in Jordan and $10 million for gender studies in Pakistan.)

Dr. Anthony Fauci?

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He's done 17 today. One was the travel ban I mentioned back on Dec. 5th. He stopped the border wall funding and keystone pipeline construction. (Of course we're spending $500 million to build a wall in Jordan and $10 million for gender studies in Pakistan.)

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$10 million is probably less of a cost than the transport and security of Trump when he went golfing for the weekend :p
 
:laugh:

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“I wouldn’t have accepted this detail with the new administration if I weren’t willing to take a moderate gust of wind for the president,” said Cole, who appeared completely unscathed by a direct hit to the chest from a breeze that came within inches of Biden"
 
It’s all verifiable fact, unlike the normal conspiracy theory that you put together .
Still no evidence to prove the fraud?? Didn’t think so.
I don’t understand what you mean about my past in here ? I don’t think any of my posts have been taken down , I’ve never received a warning and I have never been banned or received an infraction, so obviously there’s no issues with my previous actions or posts
Post all of those facts
 
After listening to Biden's rhetorical speech I tip my hat to those who did such a great job of getting him to perform so well today. Medical intervention must be so advanced for some.
"Democracy has prevailed"? What with all of that controlled censorship and manipulation?
"Unity"? While calling the oppositions supporters domestic terrorists in recent days and calling to quash them?
"We are good people" While pushing the doctrines out of Communist China with the support of big tech and corporate media?
Will he drop the bogus impeachment of Trump?
Will he drop the awful persecution of those that appose his administration and policies and allow free speech on social platforms now he is in power ?
Will he squash the prosecution into his son and his own personal profiting via his sons involvement in China and the Ukraine etc ?
Will he continue to suppress with the media's help of hiding his sons child abuse videos and contents of his laptop?
Will we see the quietly use of therapeutics and the lifting of lock downs in order to get Americans back to work in order to provide a feel good factor and boost the economy for the start of his tenure?
And where was Hunter in the crowd?
We will see.
Yeah. For me it is just the start of huge division and unrest

there Is a lot here ...most of it seems to be gleaned from those far right extreme news sources...
 
there Is a lot here ...most of it seems to be gleaned from those far right extreme news sources...
Well, The Daily Beast which is a far-left outlet suggests that there ought to be secret police set up in order to spy on Trump supporters which they consider to be far-right. That's 70 million people. Now that is dumb.
 
Well, The Daily Beast which is a far-left outlet suggests that there ought to be secret police set up in order to spy on Trump supporters which they consider to be far-right. That's 70 million people. Now that is dumb.

You mean this article?

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I don't think it's a bad idea to keep a closer watch on domestic terrorists. I don't particularly care what side they're on or which color they have, when extremists are planning an attack that should be investigated. Everyone with a smartphone and the slightest bit of knowledge about "the internet" knew what was going to happen on January 6, yet there was an underwhelming security and police presence at the Capitol because apparently they weren't informed. Right... right...
 
Post all of those facts
Here's the first fact - from Fox News.

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Any chance of you ever posting anything of real substance or fact rather than the crap you lift from QAnon and other conspiracy theory sites?
Not once have you ever posted any kind of fact or evidence to prove what you post, though I do remember back in the Covid thread you were avidly posting videos to prove that 5G was the real cause of Covid and it was all part of a big conspiracy..... if thats your idea of proof God help us all.
 
They sure did not pull any punches.

"Donald Trump is, in fact, the first president since Herbert Hoover to lead his party to losing the presidency, the House, and the Senate all in a single term. Along with being the first president to be impeached twice and the first game-show host elected to the office, that’s Trump’s claim to the history books. Well, that and 400,000 dead Americans and the failed coup d’état business.

“But the judges!” you protest. Fair point: Trump’s absurd attempts to overturn the election through specious legal challenges were laughed out of court by the very men and women he appointed to the bench. Even his judges think he’s a joke."
 
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They sure did not pull any punches.

"Donald Trump is, in fact, the first president since Herbert Hoover to lead his party to losing the presidency, the House, and the Senate all in a single term. Along with being the first president to be impeached twice and the first game-show host elected to the office, that’s Trump’s claim to the history books. Well, that and 400,000 dead Americans and the failed coup d’état business.

“But the judges!” you protest. Fair point: Trump’s absurd attempts to overturn the election through specious legal challenges were laughed out of court by the very men and women he appointed to the bench. Even his judges think he’s a joke."

They're not his judges, they are the system's judges, just because he nominally appointed them doesn't mean they give one jot about papa Don and his (so-called) deplorable voters.

Biden wins 400 odd counties out of a possible 3,000, even lower than hillary, and 81 million votes is the absurdity, I'll no more accept the validity of this election than believe the bush admininstration didn't know the wmd story was baloney.

Anyway it's over, Hunter Biden's dad is president. :p
 
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They're not his judges, they are the system's judges, just because he nominally appointed them doesn't mean they give one jot about papa Don and his (so-called) deplorable voters.

Biden wins 400 odd counties out of a possible 3,000, even lower than hillary, and 81 million votes is the absurdity, I'll no more accept the validity of this election than believe the bush admininstration didn't know the wmd story was baloney.

Anyway it's over, Hunter Biden's dad is president. :p
Isnt it pretty much how it was in the 2016 election?
Small rural counties vote republican, and bigger urban counties vote democrats.
Thats the only reason Trump even stood a chance in the first place.
The votes from small states like wyoming counts as 3.5 californian votes when it comes to the electoral college system.


5 friends try to decide what restaurant to eat at.
Mike, Sarah and John vote for burger king, but bob and linda votes for mcdonals, and that means its 7-3 in favor of mcdonalds because bob and linda come from Wyoming.
Thats the american voting system.
Bit weird.

I really dont get how it can be so hard to understand that the guy who lost the popular vote in 2016 didnt win the election 2020.
Simple fact is that the majority never wanted him as president in the first place, and having to endure 4 years with him in the white house made people realize they better cast their vote this time around or there might be another 4 years.
And it wasnt even close, Trump himself called 306 electoral votes a landslide win. ;)
 
The reason why it doesnt matter if Joe Biden didnt win hundreds of counties... If you look at the way States voted, and look at how counties within those States voted, then you will realise that there was no point in Trump winning 500 counties with populations of 1,000 people or less when Biden can win 1 county in California with a population of 10,000,000 people - it is what normal people call SIMPLE MATHEMATICS - yet another fact, not fiction, not theory, not assumption, not a feeling but pure and simple fact.

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Isnt it pretty much how it was in the 2016 election?
Small rural counties vote republican, and bigger urban counties vote democrats.
Thats the only reason Trump even stood a chance in the first place.
The votes from small states like wyoming counts as 3.5 californian votes when it comes to the electoral college system.


5 friends try to decide what restaurant to eat at.
Mike, Sarah and John vote for burger king, but bob and linda votes for mcdonals, and that means its 7-3 in favor of mcdonalds because bob and linda come from Wyoming.
Thats the american voting system.
Bit weird.

I really dont get how it can be so hard to understand that the guy who lost the popular vote in 2016 didnt win the election 2020.
Simple fact is that the majority never wanted him as president in the first place, and having to endure 4 years with him in the white house made people realize they better cast their vote this time around or there might be another 4 years.
And it wasnt even close, Trump himself called 306 electoral votes a landslide win. ;)

I think trump gained over a million more voters in california this time over 2016, that's effectively a survey result in itself on the president's popularity taken from a democrat stronghold.

After all the riots and violence, where democrat goveners/mayors were weak and tolerated the riots and damage, voters would overwhelmingly vote in a democrat president?

Trump got 11 million more votes than 2016, isn't that a sign of approval of his first term from the average citizen who didn't vote for him in 2016, and yet biden steams ahead with 81 million.

From my experience in the uk it doesn't happen, we won't see boris johnson win 17% more votes and then be overtaken by starmer, there tends to be a consensus one way or the other.
 
I think trump gained over a million more voters in california this time over 2016, that's effectively a survey result in itself on the president's popularity taken from a democrat stronghold.

After all the riots and violence, where democrat goveners were weak and tolerated the riots and damage, voters would overwhelmingly vote in a democrat president? Trump got 11 million more votes than 2016, isn't that a sign of approval of his first term from the average citizen who didn't vote for him in 2016, and yet biden steams ahead with 81 million.

From my experience in the uk it doesn't happen, we won't see boris johnson win 17% more votes and then be overtaken by starmer, there tends to be a consensus one way or the other.
Yes the election was stolen. Deep state will keep republicans away from the White House. No point for republicans to vote anymore.
 
I think trump gained over a million more voters in california this time over 2016, that's effectively a survey result in itself on the president's popularity taken from a democrat stronghold.

After all the riots and violence, where democrat goveners/mayors were weak and tolerated the riots and damage, voters would overwhelmingly vote in a democrat president? Trump got 11 million more votes than 2016, isn't that a sign of approval of his first term from the average citizen who didn't vote for him in 2016, and yet biden steams ahead with 81 million.

From my experience in the uk it doesn't happen, we won't see boris johnson win 17% more votes and then be overtaken by starmer, there tends to be a consensus one way or the other.
There was a consensus tho, right?
2016, most americans did not want him as president.
2020, most americans did not want him as president.

Is it hard to see how the people disliking him would grow after him sitting on twitter 24/7 for 4 years?
 
Bernie even predicted Trumps attempt at stealing the election.
He was building up to it for months tho, so i guess it wasnt the biggest surprise.
Still funny.


I think Trump knew early last year when Covid started to kick in and he did nothing to help the American people that he wasnt going to win the election.
So he started his fake news bit, were the only way he could lose was if it was stolen, he built up his propaganda based on this, and just kept repeating the message. Many millions believed him, many millions still believe him, but one thing that Trump and his machine couldnt produce was evidence, as there never is evidence when you invent a lie.
He knew a long time ago he only had one route back to the Whitehouse, and thankfully the American people did manage to Stop the Steal....
 
I think Trump knew early last year when Covid started to kick in and he did nothing to help the American people that he wasnt going to win the election.
So he started his fake news bit, were the only way he could lose was if it was stolen, he built up his propaganda based on this, and just kept repeating the message. Many millions believed him, many millions still believe him, but one thing that Trump and his machine couldnt produce was evidence, as there never is evidence when you invent a lie.
He knew a long time ago he only had one route back to the Whitehouse, and thankfully the American people did manage to Stop the Steal....
I mean, he wasnt even trying to hide it in the end.
Calling up senators begging/threatening/bargaining (all in the same call) for them to "find" an exact number of votes for him.
Kind of sad.
 
I saw a map on Twitter that ideally one only needs to win 5 counties to win the Presidential election if everyone who's eligible would vote.

I've tried to find it again but failed but that even surprised me.
Breaking it down to counties is pretty pointless either way.
More than half the population live in less than 150 of the 3000+ counties.
So Bidens 500+ (not 400 odd) counties, depending on which they are of course, are more than enough to win the election.
 
Breaking it down to counties is pretty pointless either way.
More than half the population live in less than 150 of the 3000+ counties.
So Bidens 500+ (not 400 odd) counties, depending on which they are of course, are more than enough to win the election.

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Only 139 people live here, about 135 adults. You'd only need 68 votes to win a county :p

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Over 10 million inhabitants, probably a couple more kids tho. 3 million people voted D, 1.1 million R. Still only 1 county won ;)
 
Breaking it down to counties is pretty pointless either way.
More than half the population live in less than 150 of the 3000+ counties.
So Bidens 500+ (not 400 odd) counties, depending on which they are of course, are more than enough to win the election.
And when you look at the states a lot of the high population counties are in, they are in heavily democrat states, For example the most populous county in the US is in California which is staunchly Democrat and one county has over 10 million residents.
Compare this with Texas which has 3 of the smallest counties in the states, all with less than 150 residents.
Its not rocket science, just needs some people to open their eyes and leave QAnon alone for a while...
 

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