Unable to withdraw at Casumo - awaiting verification of documents

[maxd]

ok, so looking at Casumo's privacy policy, it states under legal
...

That's drifting rather far from your original statement which was:

The GDPR does have provisions for the data controller -- in our case the casino -- to pass the data subject's info on to a data processor without explicit consent from the data subject. See GDPR Article 28.

Yes, but not in the case where they are asking for personal details of a third party and their ID for people who have made payments into the Casumo customer bank account.

You were claiming knowledge of the GDPR -- "Yes, but not in the case ..." -- which I challenged you to support with actual evidence.
So far you haven't done that.

All I'm saying is don't say "GDPR means this" or "GDPR says that" without actual evidence. Anyone can claim whatever they like about the GDPR -- shoddy casinos do it all the time -- but we'd all be a lot better off if there was actual evidence given to support the claims.

From personal experience I know how difficult it can be to produce a evidence-supported case from the GDPR text, largely because the GDPR is a complex bit of legislation because of the vast ground it tries to cover. Putting together a valid case about what it says -- or doesn't say -- is not a trivial task. But the alternative is just "fake news" and I think we've all had quite enough of that.

 

[colinsunderland]

That's drifting rather far from your original statement which was:


You were claiming knowledge of the GDPR -- "Yes, but not in the case ..." -- which I challenged you to support with actual evidence.
So far you haven't done that.

All I'm saying is don't say "GDPR means this" or "GDPR says that" without actual evidence. Anyone can claim whatever they like about the GDPR -- shoddy casinos do it all the time -- but we'd all be a lot better off if there was actual evidence given to support the claims.

From personal experience I know how difficult it can be to produce a evidence-supported case from the GDPR text, largely because the GDPR is a complex bit of legislation because of the vast ground it tries to cover. Putting together a valid case about what it says -- or doesn't say -- is not a trivial task. But the alternative is just "fake news" and I think we've all had quite enough of that.

The GDPR states (basically) you can process without consent for various reasons, mainly legal obligations. However, the company should state that in their privacy policy if thats the case, as Casumo do for their customers. A company cannot legally process data of a person who they have no relationship with, without a lawful reason (which, I would suggest are few and far between), and not every situation will be set out in black and white in any document. I could turn it back on you and say, you prove they can process the data in this exact situation, but thats unlikely too for the same reasons, not every situation that can occur will be specifically mentioned.

That was the whole point of my asking the rep, if they are confident they can lawfully process this data, then whats the problem in showing the section of the GDPR they are reliant on? They MUST know this or they shouldn't be processing it. I agree the rep himself probably doesn't know, but a quick walk over to the data controller and a 2 minute conversation should be enough for him to be able to answer the question.

 

[dunover]

Other casinos (ie L&L for example) have stated on here, while a SOW request is being processed they would not delay any withdrawals, so clearly this is a Casumo policy rather than a license requirement.

Maybe @Casumo Casino or @CasumoLouis will confirm the fact. But yes, nearly 24 hours now and withdrawal still being held hostage.

 

[ChopleyIOM]

Other casinos (ie L&L for example) have stated on here, while a SOW request is being processed they would not delay any withdrawals, so clearly this is a Casumo policy rather than a license requirement.

I thought the new regs stated that if they wanted to do any of this stuff they had to do it at the time of a deposit, or basically at any time EXCEPT when someone is requesting a withdrawal.

Am I mistaken in this?

Waiting until someone requests a withdrawal to hit them with a SOW request is clearly a scummy and underhanded tactic to get a customer to play the winnings back, especially as it seems that the accounts are not locked and the customer can still deposit and play.

 

[SpinUk]

I thought this was flat out against the new UKGC regulations?

i.e. Withdrawals can't be held to ransom.

They cannot 100%. Had it twice and argued the toss then showed them the relevant handbook aspect and it was paid.

Requirements for remote casinos

6.99 Where remote casino operators are unable to complete or apply the required CDD measures115 in relation to a particular customer at the point the CDD threshold for transactions116 is reached, and are accordingly required to cease transactions or terminate the business relationship with the customer117, they should adopt the following procedure: • at the point where the threshold is reached, remote casino operators should put all funds owed to the customer into an account (or equivalent) from which no withdrawals can be made • further deposits can be made to that account as long as they too are locked into it until CDD is completed • bets can be made from the account, again providing any winnings are locked until CDD is completed 110 Regulation 39(6). 111 Regulation 39(7). 112 Regulation 39(8). 113 Regulation 31. 114 Regulation 31(2). 115 These measures are discussed in paragraphs 6.8 to 6.17. 116 See paragraphs Outdated URL. 117 In accordance with regulation 31(1). 52 • once CDD is completed, the account can be unlocked and business continue as normal • if CDD cannot be completed, then the operator must proceed in line with regulation 31(1)(c) and terminate the existing business relationship with the customer • if funds are to be repaid, then the amount repaid should consist of all funds owed to the customer at the point that the threshold was reached, plus all deposits made at that point and thereafter • funds should be refunded back to the originating account, and: o there should be appropriate risk mitigation o where it is suspected that the funds are the proceeds of crime, remote casino operators should submit SARs or seek a defence (appropriate consent) before refunding any of the funds • if the refund is to be completed back to another account (whether partially or completely): o risk assessment must be done that should take into account information such as:  multiple destinations – is the customer requesting that the money be sent to several bank accounts?  high risk destination – is the customer requesting that the money be returned to a country where there is a significant money laundering or terrorist financing concern?  above €2,000 – is the amount above the threshold for CDD? o there should be appropriate risk mitigation o where it is known or suspected that the funds are the proceeds of crime, remote casino operators should submit SARs or seek a defence (appropriate consent) before refunding any of the funds • there should be ongoing monitoring of the account and, if necessary, reporting of findings via relevant fraud monitoring services in the public and private sector. 6.100 The customer should be made fully aware of the procedures adopted by the remote casino operator when they first register with the operator so that there is no misunderstanding at a later stage.

 

[dunover]

They cannot 100%. Had it twice and argued the toss then showed them the relevant handbook aspect and it was paid.

Yes I see but it basically says they CAN hold on to withdrawals while the process is being undertaken and then these should be paid either when the process is complete OR if it cannot be completed, in which case deposits made AFTER the process was initiated would be refunded as well as the withdrawals actioned beforehand. Unless I'm mistaken. Needless to say I haven't heard a thing back since sending all this personal stuff to them.

 

[SpinUk]

Yes I see but it basically says they CAN hold on to withdrawals while the process is being undertaken and then these should be paid either when the process is complete OR if it cannot be completed, in which case deposits made AFTER the process was initiated would be refunded as well as the withdrawals actioned beforehand. Unless I'm mistaken. Needless to say I haven't heard a thing back since sending all this personal stuff to them.

This bit - you comply or they terminate the relationship. But they have to pay you. If you want to maintain the relationship (carry on playing there) then of course you have to comply - but that is fair and common across all regulated businesses.

What they can’t do is ransom your withdrawal and deposits after the event if you don’t play ball.

if CDD cannot be completed, then the operator must proceed in line with regulation 31(1)(c) and terminate the existing business relationship with the customer • if funds are to be repaid, then the amount repaid should consist of all funds owed to the customer at the point that the threshold was reached, plus all deposits made at that point and thereafter

 

[dunover]

This bit - you comply or they terminate the relationship. But they have to pay you. If you want to maintain the relationship (carry on playing there) then of course you have to comply - but that is fair and common across all regulated businesses.

What they can’t do is ransom your withdrawal and deposits after the event if you don’t play ball.

if CDD cannot be completed, then the operator must proceed in line with regulation 31(1)(c) and terminate the existing business relationship with the customer • if funds are to be repaid, then the amount repaid should consist of all funds owed to the customer at the point that the threshold was reached, plus all deposits made at that point and thereafter

So I'm actually better-off saying 'stuff your SOW' and then getting the withdrawal processed and account then shut?

 

[SpinUk]

Depends if you want to jump through their hoops. But yes, you can.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

Surely the best thing that could happen long term is for players to just close their accounts when casinos employ this tactic of holding withdrawals to ransom? That way there would be no incentive for them to do it this way over asking pre deposit.

I think we are at a stage where players are going far above and beyond what they should reasonably be asked to provide for a bit of online gambling.

 

[Gaz237]

So I'm actually better-off saying 'stuff your SOW' and then getting the withdrawal processed and account then shut?

If I am reading Spinuk's post right, you would be better off depositing a large chunk of money risk free.

If you win, then jump through their hoops.

If you lose, tell them to bog off and get your deposits back and your withdrawal processed.

Surely I have got that wrong?

 

[Jono777]

Surely the best thing that could happen long term is for players to just close their accounts when casinos employ this tactic of holding withdrawals to ransom? That way there would be no incentive for them to do it this way over asking pre deposit.

I think we are at a stage where players are going far above and beyond what they should reasonably be asked to provide for a bit of online gambling.

One of the best things I've read recently and spot on.

Can understand SoW for those depositing £10K on a regular basis but for the 10 Million low rollers who throw £20-£25 in here and there and in the main simply recycle their small withdrawals, cannot and never will understand why all this BS?

 

[chiya]

My VIP manager at Casumo told me five (5) times that the ONLY way I could ever withdraw and see the money in my account was to complete the SOW.
The SOW was impossible for me to complete, so I ofc gambled the money away...
Casumo even sent me in an deposit bonus after I lost the money.

Tbh I don't understand the mentality people seem to have, that when issues arise that prohibits them from withdrawing their money, the only logical route to take is to gamble with the said money? What would you have done íf you had won more? You'd still be stuck in the same situation. You should've never gambled the money and kept fighting them.

 

[Mr_Slot5]

One of the best things I've read recently and spot on.

Can understand SoW for those depositing £10K on a regular basis but for the 10 Million low rollers who throw £20-£25 in here and there and in the main simply recycle their small withdrawals, cannot and never will understand why all this BS?

It's because they're putting arbitrary accumulative limits on deposits and/or withdrawals rather than actually taking the time to look at specific account history.

Why should someone who deposits 10k over the course of 5 years be scrutinised the same as someone who deposits 10k in a week? For the vast majority of players there is absolutely no need for the level of intrusiveness that is being seen.

 

[PaaskeDenmark]

i just logged into my Casumo account and had 7 free spins then when trying to use i get this message, anyone had this??? wtf

Sorry friend
Currently you're not eligible to use bonuses. Speak with us in the chat if you need more information.

 

[maxd]

... I could turn it back on you and say, you prove they can process the data in this exact situation ...

I'm not the one who said "GDPR says XYZ". You claim it, you prove it. Responding to that by saying "no, you prove it doesn't" is lame.

As I've repeatedly said, proving almost anything using the GDPR is a non-trivial task. The case typically needs to be made with reference to several parts of the GDPR because that's just the way the document is structured.

Finally, since neither of us are data protection lawyers I respectfully suggest that neither of us is likely to "prove" a damn thing. We can point to relevant and meaningful sections of the GDPR -- as I tried to do in my recent Who are the GDPR violators? -- but that's about as good as amateurs like us can do. It is irresponsible to claim otherwise. Until the courts or a relevant body like ICO.org.uk make a judgement applicable to the case (s) we are discussing we are simply engaging in spirited speculation.

I agree the rep himself probably doesn't know, but a quick walk over to the data controller and a 2 minute conversation should be enough for him to be able to answer the question.

I suspect you either aren't reading what I've been saying or for reasons known only to you you've been ignoring most of it. So I'll say it again:

In almost all cases that I've had to discuss anything related to the GDPR with a rep it was blatantly obvious that they were under instruction from their legal people to say nothing and (if absolutely necessary) pass the issue on to them for comment. In other words the reps are out of the GDPR loop by design so asking them to comment, explain or elaborate on such issues is very much a waste of time.

Reps are not generally free to drop by the Legal Department for a wee chat about the GDPR, or anything else for that matter. You are imagining how you'd like things to be not how they really are.

 

[dunover]

i just logged into my Casumo account and had 7 free spins then when trying to use i get this message, anyone had this??? wtf

Sorry friend
Currently you're not eligible to use bonuses. Speak with us in the chat if you need more information.

LOL....ditto Exactly the same.

 

[ternur]

I'm not the one who said "GDPR says XYZ". You claim it, you prove it. Responding to that by saying "no, you prove it doesn't" is lame.

As I've repeatedly said, proving almost anything using the GDPR is a non-trivial task. The case typically needs to be made with reference to several parts of the GDPR because that's just the way the document is structured.

Finally, since neither of us are data protection lawyers I respectfully suggest that neither of us is likely to "prove" a damn thing. We can point to relevant and meaningful sections of the GDPR -- as I tried to do in my recent Who are the GDPR violators? -- but that's about as good as amateurs like us can do. It is irresponsible to claim otherwise. Until the courts or a relevant body like ICO.org.uk make a judgement applicable to the case (s) we are discussing we are simply engaging in spirited speculation.



I suspect you either aren't reading what I've been saying or for reasons known only to you you've been ignoring most of it. So I'll say it again:


Reps are not generally free to drop by the Legal Department for a wee chat about the GDPR, or anything else for that matter. You are imagining how you'd like things to be not how they really are.

@maxd, I think there have been some misunderstandings in this thread. If I'm correct, @colinsunderland (and myself) were referring to @Lobo's case where the casino asked for ID's of third parties (which showed on their bank statement as transferrers of funds).

The point from that case was and is about the legal basis for processing personal data of these third parties.

 

[colinsunderland]

I'm not the one who said "GDPR says XYZ". You claim it, you prove it. Responding to that by saying "no, you prove it doesn't" is lame.

No I'm sorry, it isn't. You are asking me to prove something that isn't there in black and white, as it should be obvious to any reasonable person, that it isn't allowed. Therefore it is impossible to prove. Processing someones data who is neither a customer, has no relationship with a company, and has not given consent is clearly not acceptable. If it is acceptable, considering the scope of the processing, then it will be covered in the act somewhere. It isn't (from my reading of the act), therefore it is safe to determine that it is not allowed.

When I get time over the weekend I will email Casumo's data controller and ask the question and report back with the response.

 

[mariafbb]

boom, made y'day a withdraw and same thing happend to me too.
now waiting to see how long it takes to get my wins

 

[dunover]

boom, made y'day a withdraw and same thing happend to me too.
now waiting to see how long it takes to get my wins

Don't hold your breath - I am now on second day and nothing seems to have progressed. I have had a reply to my PM but radio silence as far as the casino goes.

 

[Nordog]

So all of you who are hit with sow and extra verification checks, does it always happen on withdrawal? Can someone share if they experienced that to be allowed to deposit? And you who have gotten these requests what amount do you gamble for? Small or high?

Seems i will steer away from casumo if this keeps up, if this is a new strategy they use.

 

[Gaz237]

The wheels seem to be falling off the wagon at Casumo.

 

[Borgie]

So nobody can withdraw at casumo unless they are prepared to sell their mother, give 10 pints of blood or go round all their mates asking for their passports

I don't have an account at Casumo and guess who wont be getting one !

 

[maxd]

...You are asking me to prove something that isn't there in black and white ...

If you can't provide the evidence then don't say "the GDPR says this" or "the GDPR does that". If you state something as a fact then bloody well be prepared to prove it. If you can't then either keep your suppositions to yourself or be very clear that you are speculating. Otherwise you're simply spreading misinformation which, especially when it comes to the GDPR, is all too plentiful already thank you very much.

And whether something is "obvious to any reasonable person" or not is an awfully flaccid argument when you are talking about casino misbehavior. As we all know a good many casinos operate on a "we'll do it until the law says we can't" basis. Your "any reasonable person" argument isn't worth spit when it comes to dealing with that kind of MO. You're basically just typing because you like the sound of your keyboard or whatever.

My point is that almost no one here has actually read the GDPR never mind processed it to the point where they can speak in an informed manner about it. Which by the way includes me: if I'm going to say something about what the GDPR does or doesn't say I damn well do my homework to make sure I know what I'm talking about and what I'm saying is true and verifiable.

If you are going to make statements as fact about the GDPR the same requirements would and should apply to you. Dodging it later by saying "well it's not there in black and white" is BS.

 

[Gaz237]

So nobody can withdraw at casumo unless they are prepared to sell their mother, give 10 pints of blood or go round all their mates asking for their passports

I don't have an account at Casumo and guess who wont be getting one !

Maybe they have had tough month and there's not enough coffers in the pot.

 

[irish-ranger]

The wheels seem to be falling off the wagon at Casumo.

I really don’t think the wheels are falling of the wagon just because a few members on Casinomeister are pissed off.
You have to remember these guys are a massive operator and have thousands playing on their platform daily.
They really don’t give a flying fuck for everyone who closes and account they prob get 5 new members.

 

[colinsunderland]

If you can't provide the evidence then don't say "the GDPR says this" or "the GDPR does that". If you state something as a fact then bloody well be prepared to prove it. If you can't then either keep your suppositions to yourself or be very clear that you are speculating. Otherwise you're simply spreading misinformation which, especially when it comes to the GDPR, is all too plentiful already thank you very much.

And whether something is "obvious to any reasonable person" or not is an awfully flaccid argument when you are talking about casino misbehavior. As we all know a good many casinos operate on a "we'll do it until the law says we can't" basis. Your "any reasonable person" argument isn't worth spit when it comes to dealing with that kind of MO. You're basically just typing because you like the sound of your keyboard or whatever.

My point is that almost no one here has actually read the GDPR never mind processed it to the point where they can speak in an informed manner about it. Which by the way includes me: if I'm going to say something about what the GDPR does or doesn't say I damn well do my homework to make sure I know what I'm talking about and what I'm saying is true and verifiable.

If you are going to make statements as fact about the GDPR the same requirements would and should apply to you. Dodging it later by saying "well it's not there in black and white" is BS.

Edit posted too quicky lol and lost the body of text I wrote out, will respond later

 

[ternur]

My point is that almost no one here has actually read the GDPR never mind processed it to the point where they can speak in an informed manner about it.

Well I have. And continue to work with issues related to the GDPR almost daily.

One thing about the GDPR I sincerely agree with you: It's a very complex piece of legislation. It's binding and must be applied in its entirety across the EU (as any regulations is). But it still leaves some national leeway. And that certainly does not make it easier to understand.

The CJEU monitors the application of EU primary and secondary law and ensures its uniform application throughout the EU. The GDPR is the key act of the EU's (secondary law) acquis communautaire regulation data protection.

Before the CJEU establishes enough case law relating to the GDPR, we'll just have make with informed observations about the GDPR and how it's being applied.

I feel it's safe to say that the GDPR has been a paradigm shift in privacy. One of the most important laws in the EU's history in my opinion. And a moneymaker to lawyers.

 

[mariafbb]

Don't hold your breath - I am now on second day and nothing seems to have progressed. I have had a reply to my PM but radio silence as far as the casino goes.

dunno but I've put my docs in around 11 AM , now my account is verified and money on the way..so I guess all great here

 

[Lobo]

So all of you who are hit with sow and extra verification checks, does it always happen on withdrawal? Can someone share if they experienced that to be allowed to deposit? And you who have gotten these requests what amount do you gamble for? Small or high?

Seems i will steer away from casumo if this keeps up, if this is a new strategy they use.

I was hit with a brutal SOW (blocked for withdrawals) after I had deposited a good amount of money (and a healthy balance).
Casumo for sure want you to deposit while the SOW is active. They even sent me a deposit bonus to use.
The SOW I think is individual and Casumo are making them up as you go. From me they asked:

- Signed letter from a lawyer that prooved where money is coming from.
- The finances (books) from my company signed by a registered accountant.

I refused to give them that. Then they asked for:

- Monthly paycheck.
- Account statements from my VISA-account (which I had used to deposit with)

After that they asked for:

- The saw I had more than one account on the statements so they asked for account statements from all my accounts.
- They saw I had recieved money from 3rd parties, so they demanded a signed letter stating where they money are coming from + ID's from the 3rd parties.

No doubt Casumo is making a good amount of money of these SOW in the short run.

Casumo used to be a great Casino. Now they are a big predatorian beast!

 

[goatwack]

'Flaccid argument' are words I'm only all too familiar with, sadly

 

[maxd]

... I feel it's safe to say that the GDPR has been a paradigm shift in privacy. One of the most important laws in the EU's history in my opinion. And a moneymaker to lawyers.

I agree 100%. IMO the GDPR is 75% of a wonderful thing. It's the missing 25% -- basically case law and published interpretations from the likes of ICO -- that we sorely need in order to make the most of it.

Until that missing 25% materializes casinos will abuse the GDPR (because they can) and armchair gurus -- myself included -- will pontificate ad naseum about what they think it means (because they must). In the vacuum that currently exists regarding the GDPR's real world, on the ground, implementation we will, for now, simply have to live with that.

 

[PaaskeDenmark]

LOL....ditto Exactly the same.

they fixed it for me mate. ITs uk players as account is euro it blocks now when getting free spins etc. Security fixed the issue and they gave me 7 spins on book of dead instead

 

[dunover]

I was hit with a brutal SOW (blocked for withdrawals) after I had deposited a good amount of money (and a healthy balance).
Casumo for sure want you to deposit while the SOW is active. They even sent me a deposit bonus to use.
The SOW I think is individual and Casumo are making them up as you go. From me they asked:

- Signed letter from a lawyer that prooved where money is coming from.
- The finances (books) from my company signed by a registered accountant.

I refused to give them that. Then they asked for:

- Monthly paycheck.
- Account statements from my VISA-account (which I had used to deposit with)

After that they asked for:

- The saw I had more than one account on the statements so they asked for account statements from all my accounts.
- They saw I had recieved money from 3rd parties, so they demanded a signed letter stating where they money are coming from + ID's from the 3rd parties.

No doubt Casumo is making a good amount of money of these SOW in the short run.

Casumo used to be a great Casino. Now they are a big predatorian beast!

I have provided more info to a single entity in the last 4 days (yes, they are still hanging on to my money and moving the goalposts every time I send some info) than I ever have in my entire life.

I was asked for bank screenshots at one stage on chat and e-mail. Gave them. Now it's pdf's and one on my accounts does not have that tool, only CSV. I have provided so much detail that if you saw it you'd see immediately the trail of transactions in online banking that match 100% with what I deposited.

I am at the stage when I can do no more with the facilities online I have at these banks.

I feel exposed, violated almost yet this casino is willing to let me keep depositing whilst supposedly being unsatisfied with my source of funds. Obviously I haven't deposited and 4 days later my w/d is still being withheld.

I am at the crunch point now - either the latest and about 6th. sending of docs will be enough, or it won't. If not we'll have to see how they act as regards keeping my 4-figure withdrawal and 4-figure deposits. I can tell you now this whole matter was NOT instigated at the specified 2k deposits trigger but after far more. This obviously means that by delaying the SoW request then more money is given them before the time they initiated the SoW procedure, way over the 2k, which they presumably keep regardless.

I am not sure whether I will play again after this - yes, I understand Casumo have been fined heavily by the UKGC and are therefore paranoid about this, but I can only ask you guys to trust me that if you saw the docs I sent already, you'd be 100% satisfied they're all good. I simply cannot face another 4 days of stress and aggravation just for the privilege of losing my money at somebody's casino, at another site.

 

[colinsunderland]

I have provided more info to a single entity in the last 4 days (yes, they are still hanging on to my money and moving the goalposts every time I send some info) than I ever have in my entire life.

I was asked for bank screenshots at one stage on chat and e-mail. Gave them. Now it's pdf's and one on my accounts does not have that tool, only CSV. I have provided so much detail that if you saw it you'd see immediately the trail of transactions in online banking that match 100% with what I deposited.

I am at the stage when I can do no more with the facilities online I have at these banks.

I feel exposed, violated almost yet this casino is willing to let me keep depositing whilst supposedly being unsatisfied with my source of funds. Obviously I haven't deposited and 4 days later my w/d is still being withheld.

I am at the crunch point now - either the latest and about 6th. sending of docs will be enough, or it won't. If not we'll have to see how they act as regards keeping my 4-figure withdrawal and 4-figure deposits. I can tell you now this whole matter was NOT instigated at the specified 2k deposits trigger but after far more. This obviously means that by delaying the SoW request then more money is given them before the time they initiated the SoW procedure, way over the 2k, which they presumably keep regardless.

I am not sure whether I will play again after this - yes, I understand Casumo have been fined heavily by the UKGC and are therefore paranoid about this, but I can only ask you guys to trust me that if you saw the docs I sent already, you'd be 100% satisfied they're all good. I simply cannot face another 4 days of stress and aggravation just for the privilege of losing my money at somebody's casino, at another site.

Have you provided affiliate income details to them with where it came from? Just asking as it's against most programme's t&c's to do that, and is against Casumo's which I pointed out to them when I told them clearly I cannot and will not supply that information. That was over 18 months ago now, and I'm still waiting for them to come back to me and tell me how I can submit SOW documents if required, which they told me they would do, so I presume they don't have a problem with me not supplying them. If they do have a problem, then they shouldn't be accepting deposits from me, as I was very clear in that I won't supply affiliate income details to them.

They do seem strange at the moment, I went on live chat last night to verify a new card I had made a couple of deposits with and a small withdrawal to last night, and was told they don't need it verifying as it hasn't been used much Fully expected to get up this morning to 'please provide verification before we process your withdrawal', but no, withdrawal approved!

 

[dunover]

Have you provided affiliate income details to them with where it came from? Just asking as it's against most programme's t&c's to do that, and is against Casumo's which I pointed out to them when I told them clearly I cannot and will not supply that information. That was over 18 months ago now, and I'm still waiting for them to come back to me and tell me how I can submit SOW documents if required, which they told me they would do, so I presume they don't have a problem with me not supplying them. If they do have a problem, then they shouldn't be accepting deposits from me, as I was very clear in that I won't supply affiliate income details to them.

They do seem strange at the moment, I went on live chat last night to verify a new card I had made a couple of deposits with and a small withdrawal to last night, and was told they don't need it verifying as it hasn't been used much Fully expected to get up this morning to 'please provide verification before we process your withdrawal', but no, withdrawal approved!

Yes, they have a pdf of my every day depositing current account which includes affiliate payments both directly into it and cash payments from Neteller it into after aff payments have been withdrawn from there. Most aff payments don't actually mention the programme unless you expand the transaction info. They have a Neteller screenie which shows aff payments coming in as a source of income which are identified. They have my whole 2018-19 tax return on pdf, my second current account that I sent the depositing money through into my everyday current account from which the deposits were made from. They have a copy of my photocard DL, a photo of me holding it, a copy of my Govt bonds balance, screenshots of ISA account showing money transferred to this second current account which funded the depositing current account. They have a pdf of my phone bill too.

In other words, this casino has more information to hand about me than anybody else ever has, aside from me. Yet despite it being bleedin' obvious it's all kosher, the goalposts move, screenshots become demands for pdf's and the BS continues.

 

[colinsunderland]

Yes, they have a pdf of my every day depositing current account which includes affiliate payments both directly into it and cash payments from Neteller it into after aff payments have been withdrawn from there. Most aff payments don't actually mention the programme unless you expand the transaction info. They have a Neteller screenie which shows aff payments coming in as a source of income which are identified. They have my whole 2018-19 tax return on pdf, my second current account that I sent the depositing money through into my everyday current account from which the deposits were made from. They have a copy of my photocard DL, a photo of me holding it, a copy of my Govt bonds balance, screenshots of ISA account showing money transferred to this second current account which funded the depositing current account. They have a pdf of my phone bill too.

In other words, this casino has more information to hand about me than anybody else ever has, aside from me. Yet despite it being bleedin' obvious it's all kosher, the goalposts move, screenshots become demands for pdf's and the BS continues.

This sounds like the type of stuff Videoslots were asking for until the backlash got them to change it.
Thats ridiculous, no way would I supply what they are asking for, my account would be closed and I would be expecting my money to be paid. I've had mortgages with much less info than that. Is it AML or RG?

 

[dunover]

This sounds like the type of stuff Videoslots were asking for until the backlash got them to change it.
Thats ridiculous, no way would I supply what they are asking for, my account would be closed and I would be expecting my money to be paid. I've had mortgages with much less info than that. Is it AML or RG?

AML by the sound of things.

 

[Andy Walker]

Be careful. If Casumo think you can't afford to gamble on the stakes you do, you will be hit with an impossible SOW.
If you are not successful in verifying your account within 30 days it will be permanently locked and money confiscated.

As for me, they asked for ID and signed statements from persons I barely know. That was impossible for me to get, and that was the only option if I wanted to withdraw. I was ofc free to deposit and they sent me deposit bonuses during that time.
Never send them bank statements if you have recieved money other than your paycheck. F.ex you've sold something online. You'll have to send in ID's and statements from those persons, which in most cases can be impossible to get.

Short summary: Are you hit with a SOW at Casumo and you have deposited more than your paycheck in one of the recent months, you might have a really hard time.

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I wish you good luck, and I hope it'll be solved. Keep us updated.

Can you verify it is within the terms and conditions of a Casino to confiscate money if suitable documents are not submitted within 30 days because its not outside the realms of possibility that someone could be taken into hospital and not be able to do anything within that time frame.

 

[Andy Walker]

Hi there @interlog

The reason for this is because we have a lot of players who wants to be able to play during the time. Because most of our players have valid documentation, they can just continue doing what they like during the time of the verification. Even though it might take a long time to verify, they can still play and win, but withdrawal has to wait until verification has been completed.

Us asking for a SoW doesn't mean that a player is actually doing anything bad, it's just a simple check. If we do actually find any proof of something bad, the account will be blocked and you wouldn't be able to deposit or withdraw any funds.
But if that is not the case, as in most of our SoW cases, we don't want to restrict the players from using our services.

/Louis

Yet another grey area which leaves the player open to unneeded scrutiny, you have admitted that it has been identified that allowing a player to deposit without being fully verified is an error on the Casinos part as you said quote "The reason for this is because we have a lot of players who wants to be able to play during the time. Because most of our players have valid documentation, they can just continue doing what they like during the time of the verification" by way of saying some players a minority do not have valid / suitable documentation.

Why doesn't the company have a blanket policy of you don't have valid documentation then you can't deposit and play for real money. The thing is that money won is real for the player and may be a considerable amount that could make a difference to the company its just numbers / the bottom line. Surely from historical records you know that this has happened before and in some cases has ended with misery for the player, great PR.

 

[Lobo]

Can you verify it is within the terms and conditions of a Casino to confiscate money if suitable documents are not submitted within 30 days because its not outside the realms of possibility that someone could be taken into hospital and not be able to do anything within that time frame.

When I realized it was impossible for me to give Casumo what they wanted (signed statements and photo ID's to other persons) all I wanted was to withdraw and close my account. But my VIP manager confirmed 5 times on email that the ONLY way I ever was to withdraw from Casumo again was to provide such documents and pass the SOW.
I really needed that money, but I saw it as lost and gambled it away.
I was ofc free to deposit more. They even sent me a deposit bonus.

Be very very very careful if you one month have deposited more than your monthly paycheck.

My case is currently behing handled by the MGA.

Edit: Being a VIP for 3+ years I trusted Casumo like my own bank so I even deposited 2500eur right after I was hit with the SOW. I was sure my money were safe :/

 

[Lobo]

Yes, they have a pdf of my every day depositing current account which includes affiliate payments both directly into it and cash payments from Neteller it into after aff payments have been withdrawn from there. Most aff payments don't actually mention the programme unless you expand the transaction info. They have a Neteller screenie which shows aff payments coming in as a source of income which are identified. They have my whole 2018-19 tax return on pdf, my second current account that I sent the depositing money through into my everyday current account from which the deposits were made from. They have a copy of my photocard DL, a photo of me holding it, a copy of my Govt bonds balance, screenshots of ISA account showing money transferred to this second current account which funded the depositing current account. They have a pdf of my phone bill too.

In other words, this casino has more information to hand about me than anybody else ever has, aside from me. Yet despite it being bleedin' obvious it's all kosher, the goalposts move, screenshots become demands for pdf's and the BS continues.

Ditto. Scary af.
Casumo has over 100 employees, and if just one of them have some bad intensions and want to make som quick bucks on the black market, our docs are worth a small fortune.
Anyone with these docs can get a cellphone number, bank account, mail box etc in your name...

Shady employees are everywhere.

 

[miksaxxx]

Well I have. And continue to work with issues related to the GDPR almost daily.

One thing about the GDPR I sincerely agree with you: It's a very complex piece of legislation. It's binding and must be applied in its entirety across the EU (as any regulations is). But it still leaves some national leeway. And that certainly does not make it easier to understand.

The CJEU monitors the application of EU primary and secondary law and ensures its uniform application throughout the EU. The GDPR is the key act of the EU's (secondary law) acquis communautaire regulation data protection.

Before the CJEU establishes enough case law relating to the GDPR, we'll just have make with informed observations about the GDPR and how it's being applied.

I feel it's safe to say that the GDPR has been a paradigm shift in privacy. One of the most important laws in the EU's history in my opinion. And a moneymaker to lawyers.

Do you ternur ask your client to take selfie with passport when he/she is making something criminal and send them to casino SOW ?

 

[Guntis]

Just to add a bit from my experience. My deposits normally are £800 - 1K a week and for last years I only have been playing at Casumo and Betsafe
where I never had any problems at all.

Around a half year ago Betsafe asked for proof of income and if I feel comfortable with my gambling habit because I was having bad luck and in 2 hours time made around 48-50 deposits form my Paypal account. After that, I had to send them my payslips and written confirmation that I'm absolutely fine and have no gambling problems.


At Casumo last month, I have updated my bank card details and made a few deposits. On withdrawal, they asked for a bank statement with my address on it and pictures of the card, which is a standard procedure.

Had to send them a front and back and literally in 20 min time received an email that the card has been verified and my winnings transferred.

In overall, my experience at Casumo was good.

 

[Slottery]

As some reps here have stated, these SOW requests are triggered on certain threshold is met, reason why these are really pain in **** for players is that so many times it only will be seen when you request withdrawal and somebody actually go through your account, pretty much like KYC, if you have used new payment method or have something not verified, it will be requested when you request withdrawal, i really don't believe that casinos are making it with purpose as paying one withdrawal is not that big thing for them, they pay many every minute (not referring to Casumo here but in general what threads here have been within last years, this topic just is active now),

It's quite terrible situation and practice, i really wonder why some big ones haven't been implemented more player friendly way to process these. Slotsmillion last week (if i remember right what was reading from here) introduced £300 monthly deposit limit for all UK players what can be increased by completing SOW process, that's already much nicer to be aware that SOW don't surprise you on time of your withdrawal, like it currently do for many places (information based on threads here).

Casinos are all the time innovating new bonus programs and other things to their operations and everywhere, i really wonder that so few are interested about UX when it's coming to SOW, or maybe i'm totally wrong and many are, these casinos just don't get to threads here, Casumo for example have been quite innovative and able to do many things very well, so this could be something to use some brain power, operation managers and legal team together for sure could come out with something for better UX around this, maybe it's not priority, but as so popular brand, could expect something better in SOW process as well.

 

[dunover]

Well, the latest is this bollocks:

"Kindly be informed that your withdrawal has been cancelled .
Please send us all the required documents.
As soon your account is verified you can request a new withdrawal if you wish and we'll make sure to handle it as quick as we can!
Have a great day.
Kind regards, ****"

So 4 days after initiating it on Thursday, they've cancelled it. I've exhausted all documents available to me to supply for SOW.

So it's limbo. They will of course let me play it back and spunk it, which I will not.

I'm having my money held to ransom, despite making every effort to resolve this, I've now run out of stuff available to send them that's possible from my online banking. I'm screwed now.

 

[Borgie]

Well, the latest is this bollocks:

"Kindly be informed that your withdrawal has been cancelled .
Please send us all the required documents.
As soon your account is verified you can request a new withdrawal if you wish and we'll make sure to handle it as quick as we can!
Have a great day.
Kind regards, ****"

So 4 days after initiating it on Thursday, they've cancelled it. I've exhausted all documents available to me to supply for SOW.

So it's limbo. They will of course let me play it back and spunk it, which I will not.

I'm having my money held to ransom, despite making every effort to resolve this, I've now run out of stuff available to send them that's possible from my online banking. I'm screwed now.

So is the only option for them to pay what they owe you and the account be closed then?

 

[Lobo]

Well, the latest is this bollocks:

"Kindly be informed that your withdrawal has been cancelled .
Please send us all the required documents.
As soon your account is verified you can request a new withdrawal if you wish and we'll make sure to handle it as quick as we can!
Have a great day.
Kind regards, ****"

So 4 days after initiating it on Thursday, they've cancelled it. I've exhausted all documents available to me to supply for SOW.

So it's limbo. They will of course let me play it back and spunk it, which I will not.

I'm having my money held to ransom, despite making every effort to resolve this, I've now run out of stuff available to send them that's possible from my online banking. I'm screwed now.

Exactly the same thing like my case... I was stupid enough to donk my money off.

What kind of docs are they requesting? Some kind of 3rd party docs which is difficult for you to provide?

 

[dunover]

Exactly the same thing like my case... I was stupid enough to donk my money off.

What kind of docs are they requesting? Some kind of 3rd party docs which is difficult for you to provide?

Pdf's of an ISA account which doesn't have a facility to download pdf's like my current accounts do, and those I have supplied.
I've simply run out of possibilities now. To be honest, if I did have this then it would never be enough, the goalposts would move and it would be something else.