Time to sell NetEnt shares?

Yes , when I hear there is a new netent release I don't feel any curiosity/excitement to play it because you know exactly what to expect . 3 scatters bring a mediocre bonus . Ingame features which pay 2x or 5x etc Nothing much of interest . And the graphics are nothing special either
Compare it to a blueprint game with far superior graphics and way bigger variety of features such as king kong cash or jungle jackpots . These games also pay fairly low variance like netent but they are far more interesting to play . Then you have BTG of course with the insane potential and innovative concepts . Merkurs are simple games but they can pay massive so that ensures their popularity . Novos and microgaming have their followers although a lot of their new releases are a bit samey also . But I can't imagine anyone saying Netent is their favourite provider ? Even quickspin games are more fun and better produced these days !

Netent's last big release was Planet of The Apes I believe and that is a real dud imo . Boring basegame , boring random features that don't pay and scatter bonuses that give you a disappointing 10-50x pretty much always
Ahh you beat me to it. I was going to allude to this very game myself, having played it at length the other day. It was terrible.

I don't mind the quick spins, or the high variance, but boy is that base game off the mark. It's like they've removed any sense of fun. The features are ropey at best, with no hope of anything better than 10x. After waiting and losing about £30 I hastily left this abomination, without so much as a bonus.

I had most wins over the weekend on Netent's classics, or games I hadn't played in years. They're like a throwback and completely different to anything made by them these days. Games like Phantom, Red Hiding Hood, Dracula etc are all identical, and all play like high variance games, yet pay like lv ones. If Netent's business model remains as it is, it really would be time to sell those shares :cool:
 
NetEnt's main problem is that all the good people have left, and they haven't found anyone good to replace them with... The games honestly feel like they are designed by mathematicians and not players / producers...
 
NetEnt's main problem is that all the good people have left, and they haven't found anyone good to replace them with... The games honestly feel like they are designed by mathematicians and not players / producers...
It all makes sense. I'd wondered what had happened with some of their newer games, especially aesthetically. The graphics are sub-par on every release, barring stock movie chimp cut-outs from PotA.

And mathematically speaking, every new title plays exactly the same, all using their finely-crafted template they've been honing for years. Older games would differ greatly in terms of interactive experience. Simple games really....Wild Turkey looks and plays vastly different to say, Lucky Angler. Which in itself is totally different to Excalibur etc.

If maths is all they're focusing on now, it certainly shows. Every other aspect has gone to the dogs :cool:
 
Yup - this is my belief... i could be wrong, but the games all feel like they are working with a "template" game.
i.e a set of maths that they think works (and you would think they would have the data to prove / disprove this)
 
Netent are far too formulaic, there's too many unexciting and dreary, juvenile games. Then you have the 'myth' of Netent Variance, a pernicious way of making the games SEEM low in variance with a maximum win of 400x bet and yet all seem to have my 'egg timer' effect when you play them and they constantly behave like you've just won 2500x...... Playing them is usually death by a thousand cuts. Jungle Spirit they NEARLY got right, but somehow made the base game so eye-wateringly bad that I can't play it any more. The Bullshit Butterflies, same old win multiples of 10.5x, 11x, 13.5x, 18x, 22x 27x, 36x and the rare 45 or 80x. They missed a trick there by restricting the random in-play feature to 80x and thus removing all hope which you may have in say the WD feature. Bonanza made the base game good with some huge potential, and rarer FS but with an average of 100x bet in the final results, in some ways like DoA works.

Thunderkick and Play'n Go continue to make better games that appeal more to the experienced player rather than churn out crap that seems to be aimed at newcomers who try a casino online for the first time so have ELC graphics to ease their new visitors in with. How many Netent games have 400x as the max win, based on the same math model with a few tweaks? They need to start making exciting games, I mean WHAT THE F*CK DID THEY DO WITH TWIN SPIN?? :mad::mad: There was the chance to maybe make it high-variance and even give a possibility of a full bar/diamond screen for nearly 8000x, but oh no! we got some shit html5 graphics tossed off onto a near-clone of that Oriental-themed block-pay game (the forgettable name escapes me right now) to make a decent slot awful. When push comes to shove they seem to be using the same basic algorithm/math model for all their games nowadays and they all have the same effect - get 50 credits down, you're buggered 95% of sessions.

Big Time Gaming seem to 'hand build' few but good quality games, Netent are production-line dross mainly, the polar opposite. If you look at Netent's first 100 slots you have about 60-70 'new' models, look at their last 100 you have about 15 - this is where they're coming unstuck, players have got wise to it. The innovation has gone and they spew out game after game because they feel they're expected to do so, rather than the fact they enjoy doing it. They get the odd one right like Warlords or The Turd FTUT, but it's a scattergun approach.

Now take Southpark slots for example, popular games both of them. So they lose the license for the theme, so why not (like Playtake did with the Marvel games via the Age Of The Gods series) use the same mechanic and use a bit of imagination for the graphics so their fans get a cheap and exact replacement? No, they're too busy at Mothercare buying books to inspire their next run of game artwork. At the moment other smaller developers are feeding on their bloated corpse.

Some salient ideas Netent! (pass me my fee in used Sterling at ICE next week):

1. Redo South Park Reel Chaos. Players like the game.
2. Don't be afraid to rip-off other developers for proven winners, re. Book Of Dead. This game is popular as the original BoRe Deluxe is a big hit but not many casinos offer Novo, but they all for some reason offer YOUR slots and many offer Play'n Go too - go figure!
3. Why not have rehash some existing games with more potential, i.e. 'Twin Spin Six' again look what Novo did with BoRe......OK admittedly I could drop a bollock here because knowing my luck they'd give us 'St*rb*rst Six' but at least it's a new mechanic.
4. Ditch the pathetic juvenile infantile graphics. It's beyond a joke now and with the games having to be removed from Free Play due to Licensing/RG rules your exposure is being limited.
5. Don't be afraid to do a controversial game like Bonanza - yes, players will come on here and bitch because they're not getting a 150% RTP and a 1000x win every 500 spins, but it's exciting.

Come on!

If you ask nicely I will consider applying to be your Product Director and will seriously improve your revenues with relatively little expense.
 
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Well said Dunover . Even a game like Wonky Wabbits is popular , despite having no feature and fairly limited potential (does anyone really ever get 7 wilds haha ?) because it's unique and somewhat fun but these games they churn out nowadays are pointless and forgettable . This phantom one seems very uninspiring , for example
 
Netent are far too formulaic, there's too many unexciting and dreary, juvenile games. Then you have the 'myth' of Netent Variance, a pernicious way of making the games SEEM low in variance with a maximum win of 400x bet and yet all seem to have my 'egg timer' effect when you play them and they constantly behave like you've just won 2500x...... Playing them is usually death by a thousand cuts. Jungle Spirit they NEARLY got right, but somehow made the base game so eye-wateringly bad that I can't play it any more. The Bullshit Butterflies, same old win multiples of 10.5x, 11x, 13.5x, 18x, 22x 27x, 36x and the rare 45 or 80x. They missed a trick there by restricting the random in-play feature to 80x and thus removing all hope which you may have in say the WD feature. Bonanza made the base game good with some huge potential, and rarer FS but with an average of 100x bet in the final results, in some ways like DoA works.

Thunderkick and Play'n Go continue to make better games that appeal more to the experienced player rather than churn out crap that seems to be aimed at newcomers who try a casino online for the first time so have ELC graphics to ease their new visitors in with. How many Netent games have 400x as the max win, based on the same math model with a few tweaks? They need to start making exciting games, I mean WHAT THE F*CK DID THEY DO WITH TWIN SPIN?? :mad::mad: There was the chance to maybe make it high-variance and even give a possibility of a full bar/diamond screen for nearly 8000x, but oh no! we got some shit html5 graphics tossed off onto a near-clone of that Oriental-themed block-pay game (the forgettable name escapes me right now) to make a decent slot awful. When push comes to shove they seem to be using the same basic algorithm/math model for all their games nowadays and they all have the same effect - get 50 credits down, you're buggered 95% of sessions.

Big Time Gaming seem to 'hand build' few but good quality games, Netent are production-line dross mainly, the polar opposite. If you look at Netent's first 100 slots you have about 60-70 'new' models, look at their last 100 you have about 15 - this is where they're coming unstuck, players have got wise to it. The innovation has gone and they spew out game after game because they feel they're expected to do so, rather than the fact they enjoy doing it. They get the odd one right like Warlords or The Turd FTUT, but it's a scattergun approach.

Now take Southpark slots for example, popular games both of them. So they lose the license for the theme, so why not (like Playtake did with the Marvel games via the Age Of The Gods series) use the same mechanic and use a bit of imagination for the graphics so their fans get a cheap and exact replacement? No, they're too busy at Mothercare buying books to inspire their next run of game artwork. At the moment other smaller developers are feeding on their bloated corpse.

Some salient ideas Netent! (pass me my fee in used Sterling at ICE next week):

1. Redo South Park Reel Chaos. Players like the game.
2. Don't be afraid to rip-off other developers for proven winners, re. Book Of Dead. This game is popular as the original BoRe Deluxe is a big hit but not many casinos offer Novo, but they all for some reason offer YOUR slots and many offer Play'n Go too - go figure!
3. Why not have rehash some existing games with more potential, i.e. 'Twin Spin Six' again look what Novo did with BoRe......OK admittedly I could drop a bollock here because knowing my luck they'd give us 'St*rb*rst Six' but at least it's a new mechanic.
4. Ditch the pathetic juvenile infantile graphics. It's beyond a joke now and with the games having to be removed from Free Play due to Licensing/RG rules your exposure is being limited.
5. Don't be afraid to do a controversial game like Bonanza - yes, players will come on here and bitch because they're not getting a 150% RTP and a 1000x win every 500 spins, but it's exciting.

Come on!

If you ask nicely I will consider applying to be your Product Director and will seriously improve your revenues with relatively little expense.

You summed up my thoughts exactly... here here
 
I'm actually looking forward to meeting NetEnt face to face next week in London. I like a good rant :p

Anyone else get a e-mail from Novibet today offering free spins on that new NetEnt Opera game? I won a grand total of £0.00 from 25 spins. Says it all really, have no intention of playing that game again.
 
I'm actually looking forward to meeting NetEnt face to face next week in London. I like a good rant :p

Anyone else get a e-mail from Novibet today offering free spins on that new NetEnt Opera game? I won a grand total of £0.00 from 25 spins. Says it all really, have no intention of playing that game again.

A small favour: Can you please ask them why Canada is banned from playing their games...we can never get a straight answer from them...thank you
 
A small favour: Can you please ask them why Canada is banned from playing their games...we can never get a straight answer from them...thank you
Because they like Canadians.:)
 
A small favour: Can you please ask them why Canada is banned from playing their games...we can never get a straight answer from them...thank you

They told me they never wanted Canadians to play their slots in the first place. Hopefully Nicola can convince them to reconsider their stance and allow Canadians to game on their slots again. Maybe even allow Canadians to win progressives on Hall of Gods.
 
Yup - this is my belief... i could be wrong, but the games all feel like they are working with a "template" game.
i.e a set of maths that they think works (and you would think they would have the data to prove / disprove this)

Its exactly how all their games feel to me and why I haven't really bothered playing them. Its rinse and repeat of the same ideas they had 10 years ago. It's like RTG and their 'template'. You just KNOW you are playing Netent or RTG given the way the entire game and variance is set up. The Swirly Spins game is the exception but contains the variance.

Netent are working on a formula that has brought success to them (In the past). They know Starburst can give off a loss of 40x or 50x in batches and if somebody increments their bet, they will NEVER break the bank.

Time has passed them and they are beginning to remind me of NOKIA / Blackberry and the smart phone market. Nokia had the lions share and lost it in a blink of an eye as competitors just created better products. Blackberry had similar failures.

Coupled with the fact that they have introduced POOR HTML products, made all lines mandatory, are afraid of variance and are chasing the Toddler Market (Fairy Tale Legends) - there seems to be absolutely no motivation to play their games. I CANNOT see them creating a Slot like Thunderstruck 2 or even Immortal Romance which are really awesome games IMPO.

Something that has stuck in the back of my mind for the past few years is that NetEnt have always made their slots to be a Light and Graphic Display rather than focusing on the their pay tables and actual game play. As mentioned in another post - It would seem that the slots are designed by mathematicians and artists and nobody actually bothers with anything else like the actual end product, game play and long term appeal.

Nate
 
Sure. Never made much sense to me either that decision. Yet another country where they are losing income from :oops:

My guess is that it's a licencing decision... there is not obvious reason why they would choose not to have their games live.
 
Coupled with the fact that they have introduced POOR HTML products, made all lines mandatory, are afraid of variance and are chasing the Toddler Market (Fairy Tale Legends) - there seems to be absolutely no motivation to play their games. I CANNOT see them creating a Slot like Thunderstruck 2 or even Immortal Romance which are really awesome games IMPO.

Nate

Hey Nate - i'd agree with all of your points except the one about lines.
Making lines mandatory can make the maths much easier, but also less than 1% of people play at less than max lines (apart from those that think PIMPED gives them an advantage for doing so).
There are many markets now where we nearly always have fixed lines - in fact, i don't remember ever doing a line selectable game.
 
Hey Nate - i'd agree with all of your points except the one about lines.
Making lines mandatory can make the maths much easier, but also less than 1% of people play at less than max lines (apart from those that think PIMPED gives them an advantage for doing so).
There are many markets now where we nearly always have fixed lines - in fact, i don't remember ever doing a line selectable game.

Fair enough - If you never had it, then it won't be a problem. I am not really concerned about new releases with fixed lines - Rather the older ones that had the option and now don't anymore.

Are NetEnt too lazy to actually bother with it? I mean PNG have migrated their games to HTML as they were. The Math model already existed for most of the old Netent games. You have me wondering whether it was changed now... :what:

Nate
 
Fair enough - If you never had it, then it won't be a problem. I am not really concerned about new releases with fixed lines - Rather the older ones that had the option and now don't anymore.

Are NetEnt too lazy to actually bother with it? I mean PNG have migrated their games to HTML as they were. The Math model already existed for most of the old Netent games. You have me wondering whether it was changed now... :what:

Nate

Going to fixed lines wouldn't change the maths model .. it just means the game would only have the max lines maths in it. And for most games the maths doesn't change just because you change the number of lines..
 
Their games are irrelevant now you have Red Tiger which often throws in random features, and you can hit something massive in the base game, so there is a sense of what might come out of the blue, then you have Blueprint again not too dissimilar
to Red Tiger, plenty of random features and a variety of bonuses, the random features can throw in big wins on them also, then there is Big Time Gaming, Danger High Voltage when the 6x can drop in the base game and throw in a massive win, on top of two good bonus games that can pay massive!, sure NetEnt tried it with Koi but you never win anything out of it...you just cannot get a big base win on their slots, so all your hopes are pinned on the bonus which more often than not pays x10 - x50 at best.

Pretty much nailed it with the comments here slots designed by mathematicians, when I see one of their slots pop up I have no desire to rush and play it, because I know how it is going to play before I even open it, for all the other providers
there is not so much predictability as with NetEnt, they are way way down the list nowadays, most of us seen this coming a mile away.
 
Fair enough - If you never had it, then it won't be a problem. I am not really concerned about new releases with fixed lines - Rather the older ones that had the option and now don't anymore.

Are NetEnt too lazy to actually bother with it? I mean PNG have migrated their games to HTML as they were. The Math model already existed for most of the old Netent games. You have me wondering whether it was changed now... :what:

Nate
I personally believe the reason is that fixed-lines slots are much more profitable, the more so if they are low variance. It is almost impossible for the player to get ahead and the fluctuations of payouts to players are much lower for the casino; in other words, the casino just sees a steady inflow of revenue.

I could give roulette as an example: If a player bets on 34 numbers on roulette, they will almost never get ahead and will lose in a nice steady manner. If a player bets on a single number on roulette and parlays the win, they can win a huge amount of money; in my lifetime, I have seen a number come up three times in a row. Of course, the player loses everything over time due to the house edge but the fluctuations and problems with money management this creates for the casino are huge.
 
I hate the removal of the adjustable paylines. It's another element taken away from the player in an already limited interactice medium. Netent know players can be savvy and play in different ways with all manner of wildly variable results.

It appears than the company is heading in a very blatant, business-only mindset to the detriment of the player. The games spin too fast, the payouts are too low, the bonuses too hard to trigger and most famously, once you fall behind you can forget about redeeming your session :mad:

Production- wise their slots are taking a massive downturn too. The games seem rushed and lacking in overall quality. Quickspin have overtaken them, and Playtech put them to shame these days, not to mention Play n Go etc. They're over-reliant on their back catalogue, but once that goes they will become a laughing stock.

Their apathy towards licences is baffling too. Even MG take more care in handling the source material. Aliens, the chimp game- terrible. And when they get it spot on with South Park.....they can it :what: Idiots.

I miss being able to adjust paylines, even if by just one or two. The days of getting £200+ from my legendary last 5p spin on DOA will now be consigned to the history books, unfortunately :cool:
 
it seems like they have no idea what the players want or they do but don't care. I think it's going to take a while for Netent to become just a laughing stock, but once that happens, I think their games will become even worse as they try to claw back some profits. I think the only way for Netent to survive long-term is to change their strategy back to what they used to be, market leaders, now they are only self-proclaimed market leaders. I've tried to talk to them about it in a polite, promotional-focused chat but they're pretty adamant they're doing great and players love their games and features more than ever, so no change needed
 
As Einstein said:
Insanity Is Doing the Same Thing Over and Over Again and Expecting Different Results

Their ship is slowly sinking so what are they going to do to turn it around? nothing just full steam ahead towards the Iceberg. This is the perfect time for them to make a ballsy slot and move out of their comfort zone and make a big bold statement, they will blow it of course.
Instead of will just be another game with a film license to lure the newbie players in with the same old maths *yawn*

Actually they could seize this and perhaps do an industry first? how about invite a few very long time slot players to put their heads together and make a slot based on what the players want? a slot designed by players for players something like that would not be a bad idea given their apparent slide, it is going to take a leap out of their comfort zone to get back on top, until they do something different, it's only going to sink a little more each year.
 
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As Einstein said:
Insanity Is Doing the Same Thing Over and Over Again and Expecting Different Results

Their ship is slowly sinking so what are they going to do to turn it around? nothing just full steam ahead towards the Iceberg. This is the perfect time for them to make a ballsy slot and move out of their comfort zone and make a big bold statement, they will blow it of course.
Instead of will just be another game with a film license to lure the newbie players in with the same old maths *yawn*

Actually they could seize this and perhaps do an industry first? how about invite a few very long time slot players to put their heads together and make a slot based on what the players want? a slot designed by players for players something like that would not be a bad idea given their apparent slide, it is going to take a leap out of their comfort zone to get back on top, until they do something different, it's only going to sink a little more each year.

'A slot designed by players for players' - that is Unibet's motto, plus I know providers have done this already, as well as Casinos. The problem is that this whole 'Netent is not the same' is not a problem for them, they're still raking it in, they're still successful so it's just moaning from the losing players. Until they themselves have a moment of clarity and realise they're no longer dominating and have not been the industry leaders for some time, it's just going to keep getting worse as far as the games go. But for the majority of Casinos, they know players play Netent games so they're still pushing them. We all just have to stop playing them altogether :)
 

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