Slots Fairness Discussion (Cut from Other Thread)

[trancemonkey]

I'm not going to go round in circles with you so i'll leave this as probably my last answer to you in this thread:

So based on statitics, slots are not cold after a huge win, and the player is just delusional, knowing he does'nt stand a chance after that?

I never said they aren't cold after a huge win - i said statistically you are extremely unlikely to get a huge win again shortly after. If you have a 10000 sided dice, and rolling a 1 gives you a huge (2000x) win, the chance of rolling another 0 after you've hit one is still 1 in 10000. Big wins are rare. Huge wins are rarer. When you hit a few big wins on the trot, you are being very very lucky - and these are the types of sessions we all want!

Come'on man, that's just nonsense. The reality he writes about after winning big everything goes on lockdown is'nt just by stats or math. It's a build in feature nobody can overcome. Not even i as i was slamming the slots like crazy on various ways. And i know how to exploit a game if i have that chance.

No feature. No compensation. No cheating.

You keep on saying the opposite of what is true but we never know as you are a designer who designs a genuine game. But we have a game provider who buys / licences the game you create and put a little extra sauce on top of that, as that is the part what we are trying to discuss.

How can i say the opposite of what is true when what i'm saying is true? You have NO proof what you are saying is true other than gut feeling. I KNOW statistics and maths and probability and exactly what goes in to these games, so please don't call me a liar. I'm NOT calling you a liar, i'm merly saying that what you think is happening is happening by chance, and not by some cheaty bullshit we put in to games on purpose.

As for the operator adding "a little extra sauce" - this shows you don't understand how online slots work. If a casino runs our games, they don't' "get the software" - all they do is integrate our RGS (remote gaming server) in to their casino. The games still run on OUR server - not the casinos. They have zero influence over the game - so they can't influence, add, change, or do anything with the game software or maths.


I just cant believe that after a huge win, or wait a day and leave my 'winnings' into my account, to continue playing and simply not hit anything big after that, that that would be stats / math / some calculation and not just a locked down account since it's bounded to a player ID at the game provider i am playing on.

I'll give you another example; year ago i was slamming jackpots like crazy. Avg 4k on big bet. That party was over a while ago and i need to work much harder for 1500 times 2 and the fun is over. Coincidence? Or a choice of the casino to limit certain payouts? I can relate to that choice since it would give the other players barely a chance. But again. It's their floor, it's their machines, it's their choice and they have that option with respects of the RTP. I KNOW this for a reason since the landbased casino's simply buy the slot machines and leave the majority of settings on 'default'. Here's where i come into play my friend.

You really think we build some kind of "rig the machines" settings in to games?! Why do you bother playing at all then?

You can write that land based casino's have a lower RTP compared to online, but as stated, i think those offer a far better chance then online with some deviation or make the math based upon total wins vs total bets which are completely unrealistic and do not even come close to a deposit vs win. What are you talking about? Please clarify upon that subject, as we all would like to know about THAT.

I don't understand what you mean here - land-based DO have a lower RTP than online. That's not even something you could argue - it's a cold hard fact and easy to check!

Ok, my misunderstanding, your a lead designer. In my profession a designer never works on the technical side of things but focusses on his part of the job. That's why he's called a designer. So you still have some guys who are responsible for mathematics and such. ^^

Not every profession has the same job description for the same job title - even in our industry, some producers would be more "designers" and some would be far more hands on (like we are at IGT) with maths, etc... !

Anyway, as per TourettesGuy and a few other people, there is no way whatsoever that i could convince you what i'm saying is true, so as i said before - if you think it's all rigged, just stop playing. That's the best advice i could give you.

And i'll leave you with two questions:

1. If you simply don't believe a word i say, how could i prove it to you - in a perfect world, what is the evidence you would want that would make you believe?
2. Why even bother to ask me anything if you simply don't believe a word i say?

 

[Steviedoo]

I'm not going to go round in circles with you so i'll leave this as probably my last answer to you in this thread:



Anyway, as per TourettesGuy and a few other people, there is no way whatsoever that i could convince you what i'm saying is true, so as i said before - if you think it's all rigged, just stop playing. That's the best advice i could give you.

And i'll leave you with two questions:

1. If you simply don't believe a word i say, how could i prove it to you - in a perfect world, what is the evidence you would want that would make you believe?
2. Why even bother to ask me anything if you simply don't believe a word i say?

Why are you entertaining his questions at this point. He doesn't believe a word you are saying. And he's getting obnoxious and rude to top it all off.

 

[trancemonkey]

Why are you entertaining his questions at this point. He doesn't believe a word you are saying. And he's getting obnoxious and rude to top it all off.

I honestly don't know - sometimes i just feel like i want to try and find that silver bullet that makes them realise that i'm not bullshitting... but you're right, i think at this point it's obvious i've done all i can. Cheers Steviedoo!

 

[goatwack]

I don't think there's anything left that hasn't been dissected or debunked in regards to online slots. I was pretty skeptical at first but through careful analysis and reading through the finer points in this thread, I think Trancemonkey has really been ace in his explanations throughout to be fair

Best part is how he's always kept his cool and not resorted to cheap digs or outbursts. Only balanced and rational explanations, which in itself makes him a contender for forumite of the year in my books

ps slots are rigged

pps only joking

 

[Steviedoo]

I don't think there's anything left that hasn't been dissected or debunked in regards to online slots. I was pretty skeptical at first but through careful analysis and reading through the finer points in this thread, I think Trancemonkey has really been ace in his explanations throughout to be fair

Best part is how he's always kept his cool and not resorted to cheap digs or outbursts. Only balanced and rational explanations, which in itself makes him a contender for forumite of the year in my books

ps slots are rigged

pps only joking

I know, right.

Some posters are also saying the casinos have planted him here to keep us off their trail of rigged-ness.

Like any business...there will always be a disgruntled employee...who would be willing to blow the whistle on them. There has yet to be one.

 

[goatwack]

I know, right.

Some posters are also saying the casinos have planted him here to keep us off their trail of rigged-ness.

Like any business...there will always be a disgruntled employee...who would be willing to blow the whistle on them. There has yet to be one.

There are. It's just that they're inanimate and lying at the bottom of the ocean :machinegu

 

[Steviedoo]

There are. It's just that they're inanimate and lying at the bottom of the ocean :machinegu

Nice. Spit out coffee...

 

[Tourettesguy]

Slots are completly random and fair at all times.

About this trancemonkey member, you have to ask yourself some questions.
-Why does this member go through all the work posting so much here?
-Will this member convince any member suspecting slots are not fair to be 100% random and fair? Ofcoarse not..
-So why does this member even bother?
-Have you ever really got any good answer from this member that change your mind?
-Anyone really know this member?
-Whats the reason he/she came here in the first place?
-Whats to gain for this members "work"? I know why Im goin to work...
-If something really was fishy about slots and programming, would this member reviel it here on the forum? There isn´t anything fishy about slots and programming(?)..so why even be here fighting a war that cannot be won?

Online gambling is probably one of the biggest industry there is involving money. If I was a big shot in this world I gladly would pay a person like trancemonkey to use members here that wanna believe slots are 100% random and fair at all time and turn them against the few members that question the randomness and fairness of the programmed slots. Its like a pyramid scam...seen this irl even in my family about health care products, probably pure shxx everyhting but it sells itself when people you know say this is an awesome product. When people wanna believe something its easy to turn them against the few doubters...

Just keep this in mind.

 

[gilliebean]

Slots are completly random and fair at all times.

About this trancemonkey member, you have to ask yourself some questions.
-Why does this member go through all the work posting so much here?
-Will this member convince any member suspecting slots are not fair to be 100% random and fair? Ofcoarse not..
-So why does this member even bother?
-Have you ever really got any good answer from this member that change your mind?
-Anyone really know this member?
-Whats the reason he/she came here in the first place?
-Whats to gain for this members "work"? I know why Im goin to work...
-If something really was fishy about slots and programming, would this member reviel it here on the forum? There isn´t anything fishy about slots and programming(?)..so why even be here fighting a war that cannot be won?

Online gambling is probably one of the biggest industry there is involving money. If I was a big shot in this world I gladly would pay a person like trancemonkey to use members here that wanna believe slots are 100% random and fair at all time and turn them against the few members that question the randomness and fairness of the programmed slots. Its like a pyramid scam...seen this irl even in my family about health care products, probably pure shxx everyhting but it sells itself when people you know say this is an awesome product. When people wanna believe something its easy to turn them against the few doubters...

Just keep this in mind.

If I was the gambling kind I'd bet good money you've lost big at Rizk recently... oh wait...

Clearly ranting and convincing yourself slots are rigged helps you sleep at night, most of us call ourselves a twat and move on without being bitter. It's far healthier.

Each to their own I suppose, but attacking a fellow CM member who is merely defending a slur against an industry he's clearly passionate about is IMO overstepping the mark.

 

[TheAddict]

Seems to know his shit from previously working in the awp sector as well. The AMA thread is testimonial to his knowledge Imo. I've been slotting compensated games since 6yrs old and quickly assumed the random game if it be be on or offline must be a balls in a bag distribution as he continuously described.

Fair play to the guy for repeating himself and not getting agitated while doing so.

 

[Bloatgoat]

Look man, this thread is'nt put in place because people where losing. It was a questioning of how fair online slots actually where. And that alot of things that happen are no coincidence. I am a big player but also one that likes to work for a big winning. The harder i work the better i feel afterwards after slamming a jackpot. I consider this as a sport, i am going in with a certain mindset and plan to get out even or with profit. I am not playing to kill any time. You can consider me as a 'pro' slot player how stupid that sounds. Some are pro in board games such as roulette or others are pro with cards. It differs at each person.

I believe in a system that the industry sets out to keep players coming back. So if is that with returning low wins or in the end with a minimum profit they already made their goal. The gaming providers who licence out games are the one who host the party. And thus add features to protect themself from any type of exploiting. How many people did not get payed out after a huge win which on accident, was discovered as the player abusing the 'slot' ?

I believe there's alot of confusion online with certain statements. I had to figure it out the hard way that the opposite was true. But after my experience i am certain that online play is simply not for me. It's too fuzzy, and it messes with your mind too much. You can agree, disagree, i dont care actually, but we know the business is having rotten online casino's. I can find a pretty much large amount of online documentation regarding to online slots, how they are designed, and how 'misleading' the RTP number actually can be. As someone wrote in here, you could have 99% RTP, and still have 50% deviation so that the reality is less then 70% RTP. That is my point in here.

Is that fair? Honestly no. If you offer the RTP in a number on a info tab, be man enough to provide the rest of the details as well. You seem to dodge certain types of questions as well in here, and only answer that what benefits you or your job in general. But you cant answer or explain really how some occasions really seems dodgy, flaky or keep throwing near misses all the time. And how it is possible that online i can make a greater loss with the same money as playing on land based. Compensated or not, put me behind a real slot and i can tell you within 1 minute if it's going or not.

As i said, i know people who dumped over 300.000 euro's into online slots, and are having serious losses of over 240.000 euro's. How random is that to you. Imagine how many spins that where depending on betsize. If i had 300.000 to play with, i'd defenitly work on getting ahead rather then leaving with a terrible loss.

We all play to win (i hope so) but online is'nt my game. The few pennies here and there is bullcrap.

 

[interlog]

If you play to win then you're playing a losing battle. Slots are not designed to give you a profit whether you play them online or offline.

 

[Tourettesguy]

If I was the gambling kind I'd bet good money you've lost big at Rizk recently... oh wait...

Clearly ranting and convincing yourself slots are rigged helps you sleep at night, most of us call ourselves a twat and move on without being bitter. It's far healthier.

Each to their own I suppose, but attacking a fellow CM member who is merely defending a slur against an industry he's clearly passionate about is IMO overstepping the mark.

He has atleast won your mind goin personal agaist doubters(me) Thats how it works.. Sure Ive lost on Rizk 40 times in a row after winning the first time..hm.. But no way near what Ive lost on other casinos during my time playing online since before this forum opened in 1999 and Im still alive. Just noticed my old "cut out here" still is alive and I wonder why? ..Me myself just hoped to enter a certain slot at the right time when it gives which do happen time to time but its programmed to give sometimes..the reels and everything is just an graphical illusion...But I understand if more complex thing behind the randomness...such as the certain account history, IP/personal details(links to other account at other casinos) and deposit/withdrawal behavior and bet behaviors during gamplay)and like you I looked the other way when Ive see strange unrandom patterns and strange acting during slots gameplay.


Btw, what is a compensating slot? Read it somewhere here...

An other thing I wonder..if I sign up through an affiliate link and deposit €100 and lose. Around €25(25%) goin to the affiliate pocket.... How could the games have 95% payout and the casino still profiting? Add to that €100 there is a 100% signup bonus and after that an average bonuses (fake money)of 50% with matchoffers and freebies attached to my accounts deposits and gameplay. How could the casino stay alive when games pay 95% of deposits back while more than 50% of players deposit dissapears to affiliates and bonuses included in gameplay?? Add then cost for casino employees and licenceing and all that? And some day tha account hold ofcoarse win and cashout...

 

[interlog]

An affiliate doesn't get anywhere near to 25% of a 100 loss of a player. There are numerous deductons being made from the 100 before the 25% commission is paid.

 

[Bloatgoat]

Yeah, that as well. Affiliate stuff. I have an account somewhere as well that guarantees 40% on top of the deposit vs losses. So if someone would follow my link, signup, deposit a 100 and lose the 100, a 40% (40) is for me. This means out a lifetime.

So they have to calculate that as well. There's no slot in the world doing a 95% rtp with 10 to 40% comission on the affiliate markerteer.

If you play to win then you're playing a losing battle. Slots are not designed to give you a profit whether you play them online or offline.

Duh. The trick is to leave at the right moment. Takes discipline. Without it it's guaranteed you lose it all.

 

[rena35]

I myself play for enjoyment and an occasional win. If i could ever win big enough on the games i play, it would be a great day indeed. After years of playing, i sometimes question the fairness of the slots. If they were designed to lose and never return a profit then it seems like there are much better things to do with money then giving it to slots. I have to hope one day i will win a good amount. Been playing for years now. As far as fairness goes, I have to believe the fair part or i need top stop playing online and go to bingo .

 

[Steviedoo]

Slots are completly random and fair at all times.

About this trancemonkey member, you have to ask yourself some questions.
-Why does this member go through all the work posting so much here?
-Will this member convince any member suspecting slots are not fair to be 100% random and fair? Ofcoarse not..
-So why does this member even bother?
-Have you ever really got any good answer from this member that change your mind?
-Anyone really know this member?
-Whats the reason he/she came here in the first place?
-Whats to gain for this members "work"? I know why Im goin to work...
-If something really was fishy about slots and programming, would this member reviel it here on the forum? There isn´t anything fishy about slots and programming(?)..so why even be here fighting a war that cannot be won?

Online gambling is probably one of the biggest industry there is involving money. If I was a big shot in this world I gladly would pay a person like trancemonkey to use members here that wanna believe slots are 100% random and fair at all time and turn them against the few members that question the randomness and fairness of the programmed slots. Its like a pyramid scam...seen this irl even in my family about health care products, probably pure shxx everyhting but it sells itself when people you know say this is an awesome product. When people wanna believe something its easy to turn them against the few doubters...

Just keep this in mind.

Just a random question....then why are you still playing online slots?

If they are as you say. Why are you still gambling away?

 

[Bloatgoat]

Just a random question....then why are you still playing online slots?

If they are as you say. Why are you still gambling away?

Everyone has the right in here to question online slots.

 

[Steviedoo]

Yeah, that as well. Affiliate stuff. I have an account somewhere as well that guarantees 40% on top of the deposit vs losses. So if someone would follow my link, signup, deposit a 100 and lose the 100, a 40% (40) is for me. This means out a lifetime.

So they have to calculate that as well. There's no slot in the world doing a 95% rtp with 10 to 40% comission on the affiliate markerteer.



Duh. The trick is to leave at the right moment. Takes discipline. Without it it's guaranteed you lose it all.

And when would that moment be?
I suppose you never lose when you go to the land based casino? It's like you've figured out how to beat those land based slots. And imagine how much money you could make on the internet by selling us your Strategies and secrets. Maybe you should tell us your strategy so the rest of us can also be like you and know the exact moment when to leave or stay at a slot.

You press spin and hope for the best. It doesn't take a genius to do that.
Sounds like your a real player.

 

[Steviedoo]

Everyone has the right in here to question online slots.

Absolutely.

And I was curious why he still plays.

cuz the poster seems to always be so disappointed and in agony from playing.

 

[Bloatgoat]

Ok i give you an example. I enter the casino with a 1000. I know i have a few fav slots i'd like to give a try. So i go in side, get my baverage since i'm VIP, greet a few people from staff, and take a seat to my fav slot. I have a 1000. And my goal is to get ahead. I dump in the first 200 and start exploring the machine. My minimum bet is always 4 up to 20 a spin. Within usually, 30 seconds up to 1 minute, the machine is somehow telling me already what it's going todo. It's by either handing out a relative small win (100 up to 300) which makes me ahead already, or it's very silent and it chews up the money i have in just a few spins. Usually, at the end of that 200, it should supposed to hit a bonus. The bonus will tell you alot of it drops or not. If it drops then there might be room for 'more' which requires experience in slotplay in general.

A casino in general usually sets the slot in such a manner that it gives out a few handpays of lets say 1000 and not in once 4000. The reason for this is that the machine afterwards will become cold and might screw other guests as well.

If i lose the 200, no big deal, i seek another slot, and repeat the above. In all times i use my players card. At usually 2 or 3 attempts i hit something and i am ahead. Depending on how much i am ahead i calculate already what i can afford to lose from here. I've hit the 3 other slots so i might attempt another 4th one. With the profit of the casino, is where i start playing 'large'. Combination of 15 up to 30 a spin. Sometimes it hits, and sometimes it does'nt. But when it does i know right where i am going and that is the first 2 slots again i made a loss. Again, i keep track of the money that's going in, and i keep track of the money that i came in with + profit of casino.

Depending on how a game goes i can decide to continue playing and hit a large jackpot, or return to base and call it a day. It really takes discipline if you are ahead 2 grand and knowing you might hit more, and you need to leave. Because there is a chance the casino can win that back. Since we have various land based casino's in holland and i happen to know the best seats, i usually go a few times in one month, and return in a while. I am sure that there alot of players who chase the simular as i do , but i have over 3+ years of experience on one and the same slot. I can dream the the progression and know when it's about to hit.

Some slots have stats on them as well. They tell you if a machine has hit for a while or not. I always attempt a relatively cold machine. Sometimes it work, sometimes not.

Trust me i had my tilt moments as well. But i've learned from that and keep making progression. I always tip the staff upon a handpay. Keep 'm happy. They where not so happy a while ago when i crammed up to 19k in cash in jackpots. I kept banging (winning) machine after machine. They offered me a dine for me and my gf free of costs (stake ofcourse) and somehow hinted that i was done for that day. I am all about tech, computers, and i am more at home at slots then typical board games such as blackjack or roulette. I mean, me and a friend of mine learned our lesson being in Belgium and lose like each 1 grand in less then 30 minutes on roulette. It pretty much brings alot of shame calling his mother for fueling back home, lol. Since that day i swored off any board game.

And my method works. Ofcourse there are cold days in a casino as well. No matter what you do you cant hit jack shit. No big deal. Head home and come back a few weeks later. You shoud'nt as well chace jackpot / handpays all the time. Cause sometimes a machine already spits out a few hundreds which you will lose if you continue to keep playing. Take the ticket, i mean 5 tickets of each 500 still is a good amount of money.

The above here, does'nt really work online. And that is why i revived this thread. Warn others as i may say, because it's simply not random, and there is no other choice in another slot with the same game as you have on landbased casino. Again; i think it's player ID bound or something. I've never won a decent amount of money anyways online. Even with my betting behaviour i sometimes experiment with bets up to 40 to 60 a spin.

Please remember this: the trick is to play 'big' with money of the casino, and not yours. If you lose it, it's no big deal. You still or should have the money of your own in your pocket.

 

[TheAddict]

U live in the uk bloat? Wanna go for a few beers?
Id like in on this gaurunteed profit within 20 mins on landbased casinos. Inbetween we can go round pubs and you can rinse the random games that you can tell are going while i get zee beerz in!


Edit. Just read your latest response. Holland huh? Nevermind the drinks, lets go and get blazed!

 

[interlog]

Ok i give you an example. I enter the casino with a 1000. I know i have a few fav slots i'd like to give a try. So i go in side, get my baverage since i'm VIP, greet a few people from staff, and take a seat to my fav slot. I have a 1000. And my goal is to get ahead. I dump in the first 200 and start exploring the machine. My minimum bet is always 4 up to 20 a spin. Within usually, 30 seconds up to 1 minute, the machine is somehow telling me already what it's going todo. It's by either handing out a relative small win (100 up to 300) which makes me ahead already, or it's very silent and it chews up the money i have in just a few spins. Usually, at the end of that 200, it should supposed to hit a bonus. The bonus will tell you alot of it drops or not. If it drops then there might be room for 'more' which requires experience in slotplay in general.

A casino in general usually sets the slot in such a manner that it gives out a few handpays of lets say 1000 and not in once 4000. The reason for this is that the machine afterwards will become cold and might screw other guests as well.

If i lose the 200, no big deal, i seek another slot, and repeat the above. In all times i use my players card. At usually 2 or 3 attempts i hit something and i am ahead. Depending on how much i am ahead i calculate already what i can afford to lose from here. I've hit the 3 other slots so i might attempt another 4th one. With the profit of the casino, is where i start playing 'large'. Combination of 15 up to 30 a spin. Sometimes it hits, and sometimes it does'nt. But when it does i know right where i am going and that is the first 2 slots again i made a loss. Again, i keep track of the money that's going in, and i keep track of the money that i came in with + profit of casino.

Depending on how a game goes i can decide to continue playing and hit a large jackpot, or return to base and call it a day. It really takes discipline if you are ahead 2 grand and knowing you might hit more, and you need to leave. Because there is a chance the casino can win that back. Since we have various land based casino's in holland and i happen to know the best seats, i usually go a few times in one month, and return in a while. I am sure that there alot of players who chase the simular as i do , but i have over 3+ years of experience on one and the same slot. I can dream the the progression and know when it's about to hit.

Some slots have stats on them as well. They tell you if a machine has hit for a while or not. I always attempt a relatively cold machine. Sometimes it work, sometimes not.

Trust me i had my tilt moments as well. But i've learned from that and keep making progression. I always tip the staff upon a handpay. Keep 'm happy. They where not so happy a while ago when i crammed up to 19k in cash in jackpots. I kept banging (winning) machine after machine. They offered me a dine for me and my gf free of costs (stake ofcourse) and somehow hinted that i was done for that day. I am all about tech, computers, and i am more at home at slots then typical board games such as blackjack or roulette. I mean, me and a friend of mine learned our lesson being in Belgium and lose like each 1 grand in less then 30 minutes on roulette. It pretty much brings alot of shame calling his mother for fueling back home, lol. Since that day i swored off any board game.

And my method works. Ofcourse there are cold days in a casino as well. No matter what you do you cant hit jack shit. No big deal. Head home and come back a few weeks later. You shoud'nt as well chace jackpot / handpays all the time. Cause sometimes a machine already spits out a few hundreds which you will lose if you continue to keep playing. Take the ticket, i mean 5 tickets of each 500 still is a good amount of money.

The above here, does'nt really work online. And that is why i revived this thread. Warn others as i may say, because it's simply not random, and there is no other choice in another slot with the same game as you have on landbased casino. Again; i think it's player ID bound or something. I've never won a decent amount of money anyways online. Even with my betting behaviour i sometimes experiment with bets up to 40 to 60 a spin.

Please remember this: the trick is to play 'big' with money of the casino, and not yours. If you lose it, it's no big deal. You still or should have the money of your own in your pocket.

What an utter load of rubbish with respect. A slot doesn't tell you anything. It doesn't give hints or clues. If it does it is truly broke.

 

[trancemonkey]

There are. It's just that they're inanimate and lying at the bottom of the ocean :machinegu

I had a bullet proof vest and some armbands so I survived

 

[trancemonkey]

Slots are completly random and fair at all times.

About this trancemonkey member, you have to ask yourself some questions.
-Why does this member go through all the work posting so much here?
-Will this member convince any member suspecting slots are not fair to be 100% random and fair? Ofcoarse not..
-So why does this member even bother?
-Have you ever really got any good answer from this member that change your mind?
-Anyone really know this member?
-Whats the reason he/she came here in the first place?
-Whats to gain for this members "work"? I know why Im goin to work...
-If something really was fishy about slots and programming, would this member reviel it here on the forum? There isn´t anything fishy about slots and programming(?)..so why even be here fighting a war that cannot be won?

Online gambling is probably one of the biggest industry there is involving money. If I was a big shot in this world I gladly would pay a person like trancemonkey to use members here that wanna believe slots are 100% random and fair at all time and turn them against the few members that question the randomness and fairness of the programmed slots. Its like a pyramid scam...seen this irl even in my family about health care products, probably pure shxx everyhting but it sells itself when people you know say this is an awesome product. When people wanna believe something its easy to turn them against the few doubters...

Just keep this in mind.

Come and meet me at the MeisterMeet then...

And if I can't convince you.. Why bother even asking me any questions?!

And I think there are many people who have listened to what I've said and maybe changed their mind - they were just not like you and incapable of changing their mind...

 

[Bloatgoat]

U live in the uk bloat? Wanna go for a few beers?
Id like in on this gaurunteed profit within 20 mins on landbased casinos. Inbetween we can go round pubs and you can rinse the random games that you can tell are going while i get zee beerz in!


Edit. Just read your latest response. Holland huh? Nevermind the drinks, lets go and get blazed!

Sorry, I am in Holland. Not UK. As for alcohol and gambling, this is a really bad combination. I do drink beers but not while i'm playing. There is a reason to.

What an utter load of rubbish with respect. A slot doesn't tell you anything. It doesn't give hints or clues. If it does it is truly broke.

Ofcourse. I am one of the few who has a VIP, won a brand new car, won a travelling cheque worth of 7500 euro which i can spend in one year as i desire.

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And that. You see, with online slots it's actually pretty much decided in the first place.



On landbased, i feel there's another hidden game within the game itself. It's called slam that button at the right moment.

Watch from remaining spin 4, you'll see what i mean. If i'd let the game continue without pressing in anything i am pretty sure the bonus had a lower outcome. That's an advantage for a player if your really really good and know when it's coming. I cant express this any more clear for you. In Online it's different. When i think i should press that button, there's a delay in the moment i press, and all the rows seem to fall in a complete different order (or just a near miss order). I miss that type of action landbased has to offer compared to online.

Online play is capped. Trust me. How much more samples do you need from a player like me?

I defenitly avoid a serious shitload of slots stationed into any casino in general. The day i started going to a casino, i kept hitting a wall and got angry why popping in 250 woud'nt gain me much profit. Then i realised (thanks to youtube) that i was playing the wrong game(s). After i figured out things over course of time, i slowly became a high limit player, and i was THE guy who was cramming jackpots all over the place. It did'nt really take long for the manager to discover me and offered me a VIP status. At first i asked him, how is it able you where looking for me and not the other 10000 of guests. He said your always playing with playerscard and we can track the amount of points you are saving. He stated they coud'nt track the wins/loss or the money i was putting in, he said they where'nt allowed for that. But i'm sure the technology is there to actually do.

So before i knew i was VIP, and i have some benefits on top of other players. I'll give you a few examples.

- I call the guy up at night, and tell him i want a reservation in any location i prefer to have dinner. Done.
- Every casino i am going into, the moment i identify myself, there's a host waiting for me, saying hello n stuff.
- All that i want that's on the menu table, food, alcohol, complete stake, free.
- Parking is free, every location in holland basicly, really saves esp in Amsterdam (day parking can be 50 euro)
- They organize special events. Theater, some concert or anything i would like, on costs of the casino.

I'm not really biting to all the offers they make. Sometimes i have a dinner, sometimes i drink just one beer after a few wins, and then i leave. I know from my own job that you shoud'nt be that much involved in casino activities as your world really starts working around that of a casino and not the things you where used todo. Being a big gambler is fun, trust me, but there's some other downsides lurking around the corner every day.

I've came a long way, actually i never touched one gambling device in my life, since i saw people financially go down. Untill a relative passed away, i never had any urge to visit the casino untill then. It gave distraction. It's sometimes in life very hard to cope with someone you lose. So the casino seems like an (expensive) outcome. As i went along, i realised i need to do this with great discipline. And before i knew i became very good at what i do.

 

[Steviedoo]

On landbased, i feel there's another hidden game within the game itself. It's called slam that button at the right moment.

Watch from remaining spin 4, you'll see what i mean. If i'd let the game continue without pressing in anything i am pretty sure the bonus had a lower outcome. That's an advantage for a player if your really really good and know when it's coming. I cant express this any more clear for you. In Online it's different. When i think i should press that button, there's a delay in the moment i press, and all the rows seem to fall in a complete different order (or just a near miss order). I miss that type of action landbased has to offer compared to online.

so you think that when you touched the screen when the olympus god and wilds came on...you were the one who controlled the outcome?

no seriously.

 

[goatwack]

What I'm getting from this is that land-based slots are easy to manipulate via timed button-presses and pro skillz, but online doesn't adhere to these tricks and techniques and thus must be rigged.

To be fair, most of us have tried everything with certain games, and the results always vary. Surely the greatest indicator that they're (fairly) random!

 

[Jd666]

What I'm getting from this is that land-based slots are easy to manipulate via timed button-presses and pro skillz, but online doesn't adhere to these tricks and techniques and thus must be rigged.

To be fair, most of us have tried everything with certain games, and the results always vary. Surely the greatest indicator that they're (fairly) random!

Its so true, just ask all the grannies who bash the buttons and rub the balloons on the Partytimes.
They go up everytine..... honest

 

[Bloatgoat]

so you think that when you touched the screen when the olympus god and wilds came on...you were the one who controlled the outcome?

no seriously.

Actually, the 'touching' was something that worked in the past. You could 'stop' a rheel / symbol at the right time when it was about to come. I had a habbit of still touching it anyway. But you "miss" my point completely. I press the button at the right time and it comes down with a win. Pleas stay ontopic. Geez.

 

[gilliebean]

Bashing a screen or a button mid spin, is about as futile as me shouting 'COME ON YOU B@STARD' when waiting for the D to drop in Bonanza.

But as it's worked on occasion - I thought maybe I would share my 'method' with you all...knock yourselves out!!

 

[Steviedoo]

Actually, the 'touching' was something that worked in the past. You could 'stop' a rheel / symbol at the right time when it was about to come. I had a habbit of still touching it anyway. But you "miss" my point completely. I press the button at the right time and it comes down with a win. Pleas stay ontopic. Geez.

Yes. Stay on topic. Of course. But...

But when is the right time. How do you know. Cuz I'm pretty sure this is not why you won. You won cuz you got lucky when you pressed spin. That's it.

 

[Bloatgoat]

Follow your guts....



Watch from remaining spin 7, i do it again.

This is something i just cant 'hack' online. Thats why i dislike all the copy'd flash games with a different algorithm. Some games really operate very intuitively.

 

[trancemonkey]

Follow your guts...

Watch from remaining spin 7, i do it again.

This is something i just cant 'hack' online. Thats why i dislike all the copy'd flash games with a different algorithm. Some games really operate very intuitively.

And this video proves what exactly?

If you think slam stopping has any effect on the outcome in any game then you’re my ideal target player... I’m gonna design stuff in to my Games just to get your money

 

[Bloatgoat]

And this video proves what exactly?

If you think slam stopping has any effect on the outcome in any game then you’re my ideal target player... I’m gonna design stuff in to my Games just to get your money

If you want to design a sticking game, make sure it's got some action, thrills and somehow be an adverture every time you play it. This game packs it all for me. There is no chance in the world you could redesign this in a flashed based package and keep my attention.

The quality of flash games will never be as much as close to a real slot. I'm playing it because i like it. It's the same reason why i drive fast cars (Audi RS6's). I need that 'thrill'.

If you have any other answer to the 2 video's i showed you, i slammed the button on the right time causing a hit. The rheels dont lie, dont overdraw something else suddenly, it gives me exactly what i wanted.

Unlike online, when you stop it suddenly, it seems to communicate first with homebase, and with some latency drop something completely different. They offer the functionality, but they strip it from being exploited. That is how fair your online play is.

 

[funnymunny]

If you want to design a sticking game, make sure it's got some action, thrills and somehow be an adverture every time you play it. This game packs it all for me. There is no chance in the world you could redesign this in a flashed based package and keep my attention.

The quality of flash games will never be as much as close to a real slot. I'm playing it because i like it. It's the same reason why i drive fast cars (Audi RS6's). I need that 'thrill'.

If you have any other answer to the 2 video's i showed you, i slammed the button on the right time causing a hit. The rheels dont lie, dont overdraw something else suddenly, it gives me exactly what i wanted.

Unlike online, when you stop it suddenly, it seems to communicate first with homebase, and with some latency drop something completely different. They offer the functionality, but they strip it from being exploited. That is how fair your online play is.

 

[interlog]

Sorry, I am in Holland. Not UK. As for alcohol and gambling, this is a really bad combination. I do drink beers but not while i'm playing. There is a reason to.



Ofcourse. I am one of the few who has a VIP, won a brand new car, won a travelling cheque worth of 7500 euro which i can spend in one year as i desire.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

And that. You see, with online slots it's actually pretty much decided in the first place.



On landbased, i feel there's another hidden game within the game itself. It's called slam that button at the right moment.

Watch from remaining spin 4, you'll see what i mean. If i'd let the game continue without pressing in anything i am pretty sure the bonus had a lower outcome. That's an advantage for a player if your really really good and know when it's coming. I cant express this any more clear for you. In Online it's different. When i think i should press that button, there's a delay in the moment i press, and all the rows seem to fall in a complete different order (or just a near miss order). I miss that type of action landbased has to offer compared to online.

Online play is capped. Trust me. How much more samples do you need from a player like me?

I defenitly avoid a serious shitload of slots stationed into any casino in general. The day i started going to a casino, i kept hitting a wall and got angry why popping in 250 woud'nt gain me much profit. Then i realised (thanks to youtube) that i was playing the wrong game(s). After i figured out things over course of time, i slowly became a high limit player, and i was THE guy who was cramming jackpots all over the place. It did'nt really take long for the manager to discover me and offered me a VIP status. At first i asked him, how is it able you where looking for me and not the other 10000 of guests. He said your always playing with playerscard and we can track the amount of points you are saving. He stated they coud'nt track the wins/loss or the money i was putting in, he said they where'nt allowed for that. But i'm sure the technology is there to actually do.

So before i knew i was VIP, and i have some benefits on top of other players. I'll give you a few examples.

- I call the guy up at night, and tell him i want a reservation in any location i prefer to have dinner. Done.
- Every casino i am going into, the moment i identify myself, there's a host waiting for me, saying hello n stuff.
- All that i want that's on the menu table, food, alcohol, complete stake, free.
- Parking is free, every location in holland basicly, really saves esp in Amsterdam (day parking can be 50 euro)
- They organize special events. Theater, some concert or anything i would like, on costs of the casino.

I'm not really biting to all the offers they make. Sometimes i have a dinner, sometimes i drink just one beer after a few wins, and then i leave. I know from my own job that you shoud'nt be that much involved in casino activities as your world really starts working around that of a casino and not the things you where used todo. Being a big gambler is fun, trust me, but there's some other downsides lurking around the corner every day.

I've came a long way, actually i never touched one gambling device in my life, since i saw people financially go down. Untill a relative passed away, i never had any urge to visit the casino untill then. It gave distraction. It's sometimes in life very hard to cope with someone you lose. So the casino seems like an (expensive) outcome. As i went along, i realised i need to do this with great discipline. And before i knew i became very good at what i do.

That was a very misleading Youtube video title (click bait anybody). It wasn't a jackpot. The jackpot is a full screen of Kronos that I triggered myself a number of times - online of all places ironically

 

[Bloatgoat]

Ok. I'm out. Screw you internet hippies.

 

[goatwack]

There's nothing quite like civilized internet discourse, is there

 

[interlog]

Ok. I'm out. Screw you internet hippies.

Why screw us? What else did you expect. It is you claiming to be able to trigger wins on slots that are designed not to be able to do that. The minute you triggered those free spins on Kronos the win amount was already determined.

And of course casinos wil look after you once you start spending money. I got the same treatment when I went to Vegas many blue moons ago. They want you to continue to spend because at the end of the day you are going to lose. Even you, despite you claiming different.

 

[electronictonic]

They were absolutely fucking BRUTAL for me tonight...100% match at Sportingbet £200 starting balance
devoured the balance @ £2 a spin in less than 10 minutes..no bonuses biggest win was x3 haha get fucked, RTP felt like 25%.
never got above starting balance

Now breakoutcasino 2 bonuses x21 and x31 £150 starting balance lasted around 15 mins never got above starting balance.

Slotsmillion £150 starting balance, biggest win x25 no bonuses, never got above starting balance and went in 15 mins and that
is me done for a while, gave back 6k in a month, after all those big wins they have gone back to their sheer fucking brutality! .

 

[Bloatgoat]

It takes discipline to tee off at the right moment, in any casino. Wether that's online or landbased, just leave when your ahead. It's what i do for a very long time now and with great succes. I've cancelled my account since today on online, and explained why. I proberly get a standard respons in return, but trust me as i say, that online slots are completely different then landbased casino.

I'm sure things are very genuine, so genuine they found a reason to legally take you up the ass. The advertised RTP or TRTP is a joke. You may disagree, but i know better. I've bin in land based casino's for 4 years now. And i've never had so much bad luck online as on landbased. As some people stated already in this thread, it's too obvious. I really hope people learn from some postings in here and take the advise, to leave online slots for what they are. You'll thank me and others later.

As i said i cancelled my account. They can take the money and stick it up their greedy ass. I'm done with online play, the crap flash based games, the shitty returns and their tactics to keep you playing.

 

[Tourettesguy]

We dont have landbased casinos in Sweden..only one which the goverment runs to get money to all so called refugees here.

 

[gambyx7]

The famous MG fairness...on low-med slot...

- 0.50 bet
- NO FREE SPINS in over 300 spins...
- biggest win was 16x, second best 6x...
- estimated rtp 40% (from 65 balance to zero)

MG - what should I say?

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[Bloatgoat]

We dont have landbased casinos in Sweden..only one which the goverment runs to get money to all so called refugees here.

Well in Holland, landbased is also owned by the state. But that does'nt mean the RTP's and all are fare lower. I'd suggest you goto such land based casino's and learn the games you play. As for refugees, it's european suicide as i exactly know what you mean. But this refugee thing is'nt coincidence. It's a well planned circus the EU has decided for every country in europe. It will change europe with irreversible ways.

I really hope tide turns around at some point, in a sense that people from various country's sack their goverment and take their country's back. Other then that i feel europe is very lost. This model or system cannot be held forever with everyone on benefits.

The famous MG fairness...on low-med slot...

- 0.50 bet
- NO FREE SPINS in over 300 spins...
- biggest win was 16x, second best 6x...
- estimated rtp 40% (from 65 balance to zero)

MG - what should I say?

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

Quit playing online. This is the exact thing why i quit in general, and advise others to do the same thing as well.

 

[Tourettesguy]

Well in Holland, landbased is also owned by the state. But that does'nt mean the RTP's and all are fare lower. I'd suggest you goto such land based casino's and learn the games you play. As for refugees, it's european suicide as i exactly know what you mean. But this refugee thing is'nt coincidence. It's a well planned circus the EU has decided for every country in europe. It will change europe with irreversible ways.

I really hope tide turns around at some point, in a sense that people from various country's sack their goverment and take their country's back. Other then that i feel europe is very lost. This model or system cannot be held forever with everyone on benefits.

But the Swedish goverment casino give 50% payout..or is it 49%.. and how bad will that be irl when we complain about "96%" here so no thanks!
And yes I know..Sweden is pretty much lost already and with this METOO campains the lefties are sacrifiying themselfs to cover up the real sex crimes made by these adult "men" coming here in thousands every month.. Merkel started this which now is unstoppable..dont understand how she can live with herself now, Id kill myself.

 

[Bloatgoat]

Then you need to stop playing slots, and aim for card based games. Or goto germany, and seek a proper casino over there. Not spielhalle, not tankstelle, but a proper casino. There are lots of them. And you could simply book a weekend or a day or 2 if the distance is too great. They dont have the classical slots they generally have from the USA (WMS, IGT and so on) but there's lots of choice in Germany so i've seen.

As for merkel; when she's 'gone' the damage is already done and irreversible. This is politics in 2017. They do their work now and by the time things are out of control, those are already far gone. In politics only their carreer is what counts, no longer the voice of the people. I realy hope mild right wing party's come up in europe fast, otherwise the future for europe is very very dark. It will escalate because people no longer would take the shit they have to deal with every day.

We see the very same things happening in Holland. And it woud'nt take any much longer anymore for escalation. France is a good example of how such a once beautiful country is being wrecked by the cause of immigration. And politics are not doing what is supposed todo, such as closing borders, but stamping on "more and more" of the same, as a mixed future of people. Obediant people.

It's very simple. They are following a plan dictated from EU in Brussel. Those who say things should be done different are being sacked or demonized. The only thing they care of is their fat salary every month. Crimes are somehow being penalised very very low for some obvious reason. We are at the stake of people taking measures into their own hands by now. Stay safe.

 

[Tourettesguy]

Ok trancemonkey, Ive analysed this "Valley of Gods" slot from Yggrasil... Have you ever played it? If you wanna se slots that is not random you can look at that slot. So many pattersn you recognize hwne playign it that is not random.
If you won o na spin, you mostly you get same symbols on reels 1,2 and 3 on tha first stop before opening up more positions. For ex those red bird symbols. You never see the green cat symbols on that first level...and on the second level if you win o nthe first you very often gets those green cat symbols on reel 1, 2 and 4....and not other wins so you lose. Same with oraange snake symbol...you get it quite often along with green cats when all positions is cleared but there is levels certain symbols can not stop in winnign positions. Really rigged it is in many way... And with that second highest symbols, a green bigger cat...it often stops in forst level on reel 1,2 and 3 in different combos...but almpost never that same paying gold godess or what its called. And playing this slot logn enough youll know if you will reach next lever or not before tha bonus spins starts.. its like the slot have only a few variations of symbols availibe to show...and you get almost same spins over and over...you recognise the spins even though htere are millions teoretical combos. And the slot act the same for a long time..same spins over and over....also the reels are locked to each other that reel after the other cant stop in certain position depending of hos the last reel stopped...for ex you will never get several reels in a row with 3 of the same symbols close together on a stack and the next 2, 3 or more reels look the same...there are always a reel of 1 or 2 same symbols between those reels with stacks of 3...but...there is a but, it CAN happen and the slot CAN give spins you have never seen before in very short periods...eventhough its not theoreticaly hard to get or high paying... My conclusion is that the slot is only "random" and very short peruiods...inbetween 98% of the time you spins those same spins you see all the time.
This is a perfect example of slot that exploit itself how badly programmed some slots are... Its sad because I like it very much...It do pay sometimes good but it ruin the fun when its so obvious the reels and symbols are just a show for the lottery in the background. Ive not seen this on any other slot in my life, why they do this? Is it just lazy programming and making the slot go faster when when no hard mathematcial programming need obviusly? Its like only when you get those sets of spins that you dont reconize from before you feel the slot is alive and doin some work in the background. Normally you just play with a dead animal and pre-programmed outcome of spins...and there is ofcorase these loong periods with 10-25 spins in a row with zero payout... Its like the slot syncing the payout when those come...the nomber of dead spisn in a row depends of how much ahead you are in payout from a certain timestamp. And sometimes you dont see long periods of zero payouts in a row..maybe becayse the slot dont need to sync becose you are already below average payout.

While I talk Yggrasil.. another thing with Rainbow Ryan...when you hit free spins, often you dont win anything on first 6 free spins but then you will win a quite big win on the last spin when you hit 7 free spins. It is not random ofcoarse.. How could they program the slot so bad when people like you says slots are completly random and dont know anything about what you hit the spins before? Its not much that IS random with slots. Same with freespins...if you are dealt 10 free spins from the casino, the slot "feels" how many spins you have cause if you dont hit much on all first spins you will hit a feature or something bigger on that last spin. Its happen me almost everytime I get 5-15 free spisn from Rizk for ex. I never hit 100x bet on Pyramid: Q f I but now serveral tiems i na row Ive won 5 or 15 free spisn Ive hit atleast one really big win on those free spins. Do the slot according to you "feel" what the player have in account to play with, do the slot "check" the player account in some way when the player enter the slot?
Sorry for misspellings and bad grammar maybe..

 

[Bloatgoat]

Trancemonkey should be playing with his own money for example rather being on the devside for once.

 

[trancemonkey]

Trancemonkey should be playing with his own money for example rather being on the devside for once.

I do play with my own money - regularly. Online and offline. In many countries too... please don't assume that i'm not a player, because i am.
I may not gamble as much as some people on here, but i gamble enough - and to be honest, i would never be able to design a game if i HADN'T played with my own money - because you need to understand the emotions, the psychology, the feelings of winning / losing...