RTG Max Win reached - 400 plus Re triggered Free Spins Lost

[roygen]

Hi Guys, Just want to get a feedback for now on the problem I just had.

I was playing the Raindance Slot at an accredited RTG Casino.

5 Scatters came up, One chief and 4 Wolves, 100 Free spins were awarded. 100 spins kept retiggering. I was playing at One Dollar Stake. Suddenly with 400+ Free spins remaining at a 5X Multiplier the system reverted me back to normal play.

I immediately contacted live support and was told this "I cannot verify why it was cut, unfortunately we are unable to add free spins , this is done by the system" - There was more to the conversation and was actually terminated by the operator as I was still typing.

I have just sent a private message to The Casino Rep and hopefully this can be resolved privately.

My Questions are:

1, Has anyone had this happen to them ? and if so how was the problem resolved.

2, At the start of a Free Spin feature is it already determined how much will be paid out in total even before you start your spins.

Any feedback would be much appreciated-Thanks

 

[SlotsLover]

max cashout?

Did you reach the maximum cashout of $2500? RTG has a maximum cashout of 50,000 x the line bet. If you were playing all 20 lines at 5c per line, this would be $2500. It's totally possible for this to happen with hundreds of spins x 5.

Hope this was the reason, it's a happy reason to have your free spins cutoff.

 

[XOXOXOXOXOX]

how much did you win? there is a max you can get from the free spins.

 

[funeral979]

At what point were you returned to normal play?

All RTG video slots have a max payout (I think it is 50,000x line bet?...maybe they changed it?)

If you hit the maximum payout...it will stop and then return you to normal play. If you were playing all lines, I think with a $1 wager it would stop you at $2,000?

EDIT: I can see from above posts perhaps it used to be 40,000x line bet which would have been $2,000. I think $2,500 is the correct figure now.

 

[Surasanji]

Hi Guys, Just want to get a feedback for now on the problem I just had.

I was playing the Raindance Slot at an accredited RTG Casino.

5 Scatters came up, One chief and 4 Wolves, 100 Free spins were awarded. 100 spins kept retiggering. I was playing at One Dollar Stake. Suddenly with 400+ Free spins remaining at a 5X Multiplier the system reverted me back to normal play.

I immediately contacted live support and was told this "I cannot verify why it was cut, unfortunately we are unable to add free spins , this is done by the system" - There was more to the conversation and was actually terminated by the operator as I was still typing.

I have just sent a private message to The Casino Rep and hopefully this can be resolved privately.

My Questions are:

1, Has anyone had this happen to them ? and if so how was the problem resolved.

2, At the start of a Free Spin feature is it already determined how much will be paid out in total even before you start your spins.

Any feedback would be much appreciated-Thanks

If you want this to be taken care of privately/quietly... Why are you posting about it before the Rep has gotten back to you?

Anywho to answer your questions:

1) Generally, it is difficult for me to find RTGs that I can play at. As such, I don't. Particularly when I can play elsewhere easier!

2) In a random environment this should not be the case, but I am not certain how it works for RTG. I do believe I've heard some things about jackpots being connected to your level of wager- but I'd love an expert to nod his head on it!

I know there are some threads around here on the RTG systems- apparently some people who /really/ know what's going on posted on them (I think they guy's name is dogboy? Dogface? Dog-Ears? Dog something!)

More bothersome is that your freespins were cut short- and while it could be done by the software, a reason why would be appropriate. if it comes up to software error- well. Not much you can do about that. Mistakes happen.

Still, it be nice to get a little something- particularly if the casino is confirming there was an error of some kind!

 

[anniemac]

There is a cap on the free spins of $2500. When you get to that amount of money, it reverts back to normal.

Hit the same thing only was playing $.20 per spins. Cap was $500.

 

[roygen]

Did you reach the maximum cashout of $2500? RTG has a maximum cashout of 50,000 x the line bet. If you were playing all 20 lines at 5c per line, this would be $2500. It's totally possible for this to happen with hundreds of spins x 5.

Hope this was the reason, it's a happy reason to have your free spins cutoff.

OK - Thats it then- I thought that rule was maximum paid out per spin, but if you count the freespins as ONE PAID spin then it makes sense.

I had actually reached $2500 from the free spins - Still think that rule sucks though LOL.

Unfortunately - Cos it just cut me off and reverted me back to normal play I did not get a screenshot.

Thanks for putting me straight

 

[mattsgame]

Hi Guys, Just want to get a feedback for now on the problem I just had.

I was playing the Raindance Slot at an accredited RTG Casino.

5 Scatters came up, One chief and 4 Wolves, 100 Free spins were awarded. 100 spins kept retiggering. I was playing at One Dollar Stake. Suddenly with 400+ Free spins remaining at a 5X Multiplier the system reverted me back to normal play.

I immediately contacted live support and was told this "I cannot verify why it was cut, unfortunately we are unable to add free spins , this is done by the system" - There was more to the conversation and was actually terminated by the operator as I was still typing.

I have just sent a private message to The Casino Rep and hopefully this can be resolved privately.

My Questions are:

1, Has anyone had this happen to them ? and if so how was the problem resolved.

Yes. Once the max cap has been hit.

2, At the start of a Free Spin feature is it already determined how much will be paid out in total even before you start your spins.

I do not believe so

Any feedback would be much appreciated-Thanks

As others have suggested you have probably hit the max cap rule of 50k x line bet so in your case 50k x 0.05 which would be $2,500. RTG have always had this rule on their slots, it is a pain but its there.

So if this is the case I suggest the title be changed. It is going to feel like you where robbed still as god knows what you could have won, but unfortunately this is RTG's rule and not the casinos.

Cheers
Matt

EDIT: sorry did not see your reply above as I was typing mine

 

[roygen]

If you want this to be taken care of privately/quietly... Why are you posting about it before the Rep has gotten back to you?

As it happens-My problem has been solved by posting it here before the rep got back to me, Will PM him again and tell him everything is ok now.

By privately, I meant not to name the Casino Involved- But I did not see any harm in trying to get feed back from a situation that I had

 

[roygen]

So if this is the case I suggest the title be changed. It is going to feel like you where robbed still as god knows what you could have won, but unfortunately this is RTG's rule and not the casinos.

Cheers
Matt

Your Right about the Title - How can I change it??

 

[Jasminebed]

WTG on a great win.

I'm glad your mind was put to rest on why it happened.

 

[footdr]

As it happens-My problem has been solved by posting it here before the rep got back to me, Will PM him again and tell him everything is ok now.

By privately, I meant not to name the Casino Involved- But I did not see any harm in trying to get feed back from a situation that I had

So how was it resolved? Is there a cap on free spins? If so, this is new information for me. Please let us all know.

 

[footdr]

WTG on a great win.

I'm glad your mind was put to rest on why it happened.

Why did it happen, I missed the players response if there was one.

 

[mattsgame]

So how was it resolved? Is there a cap on free spins? If so, this is new information for me. Please let us all know.

RTG's 50k x line bet cap also counts in free spins, so as soon as you hit this cap during the free spins the free spins end. In the op's case they had won the max allowed via the max cap rule of $2,500, so the free spins end and you are returned to normal play.

 

[footdr]

RTG's 50k x line bet cap also counts in free spins, so as soon as you hit this cap during the free spins the free spins end. In the op's case they had won the max allowed via the max cap rule of $2,500, so the free spins end and you are returned to normal play.

That sucks, guess I have never been lucky enough to reach the cap, so I wasn't aware of this.

thanks for the reply

 

[nikkidog]

RTG Casino Robbed me of 400 Plus

That happened me at one me on Raindance also at one of the RTG casinos. They told me that I reached the max. amount of free spins which was over 600 free spins when it stopped. I still was able to cash out a pretty good chunk.

 

[KasinoKing]

Did you reach the maximum cashout of $2500? RTG has a maximum cashout of 50,000 x the line bet. If you were playing all 20 lines at 5c per line, this would be $2500. It's totally possible for this to happen with hundreds of spins x 5.

Hope this was the reason, it's a happy reason to have your free spins cutoff.

A "happy reason"???
I can't imagine many players being "happy" to have their free-spins cut short when they still have 100s left...!

Sorry, but this "max win" business is the one and only thing I can't get my head around regarding RTG software.

Apart from a few of the IGT (WagerWorks) slots, I can't think of any other software where they limit your win from free-spins.
I know it's clearly stated in the game rules - but it still just plain SUCKS!

KK

 

[Stovetopp]

As it happens-My problem has been solved by posting it here before the rep got back to me, Will PM him again and tell him everything is ok now.

By privately, I meant not to name the Casino Involved- But I did not see any harm in trying to get feed back from a situation that I had

At least admit that you were wrong in accusing some institution of theft or robbery when the problem really was your not reading the rules

 

[footdr]

At least admit that you were wrong in accusing some institution of theft or robbery when the problem really was your not reading the rules

I think they did by what they last posted. Obviously, the title of thread was written when they were ticked off because they didn't know this rule, I have played for 6 years and never knew this rule nor never have I read it in any terms and conditions.
Can someone post the actualy terms and conditions that state this rule and the link so that we players can read it. thanks

 

[vinylweatherman]

The casino could have avoided this had the CS not given evasive answers that lead to players thinking they have something to hide. Why did the CS not actually look into the matter, rather than dismissing the player with a "I don't know" type of responce, and then imply "you'll just have to live with it" by then adding the line about "the system" being responsible, and nothing could be done by management.

The rule has always been there because operators wanted it to allow them to operate to a tighter liquidity model than other casinos that pay extreme variance events in full. There is therefore NO excuse for the CASINO not knowing anything about this. Raindance is the one slot where this cap is hit more often than any other, and as soon as the slot was named I knew the reason why this had happened, and I don't work for casino CS

 

[Tirilej]

I believe you can find the rule in the paytable for each game.
(Is it called paytable? Don't remember)

 

[KasinoKing]

I think they did by what they last posted. Obviously, the title of thread was written when they were ticked off because they didn't know this rule, I have played for 6 years and never knew this rule nor never have I read it in any terms and conditions.
Can someone post the actualy terms and conditions that state this rule and the link so that we players can read it. thanks

It's always the last statement in the rules on the pay-table of each slot. (e.g. Rain Dance below)

Free-spins only count as ONE paid spin, which is why this rule comes into effect most frequently on slots which can give 100s of spins, or have stacked wilds on all the reels.

KK

 

[roygen]

At least admit that you were wrong in accusing some institution of theft or robbery when the problem really was your not reading the rules

Not sure if I was wrong to be honest ?

If live support had of explained this rule to me then i would not have had to post on this forum to get my answer.

The answer I got from the Live Support left me thinking that I had been robbed of my spins.

I did read the rules and mis-interperated them- I do apologise for that.:notworthy

I had already contacted the Rep and apologised for my misunderstanding, he has already replied and thanked me for informing him that my issue had been resolved by the knowledgeable forum members.

I had already asked to see if i could change the thread title- But no answer yet. I have tried but cannot see how to change it.

 

[SlotsLover]

that's the rule and that's the best you can do

A "happy reason"???
I can't imagine many players being "happy" to have their free-spins cut short when they still have 100s left...!

Sorry, but this "max win" business is the one and only thing I can't get my head around regarding RTG software.

Apart from a few of the IGT (WagerWorks) slots, I can't think of any other software where they limit your win from free-spins.
I know it's clearly stated in the game rules - but it still just plain SUCKS!

KK

yes, the rule SUCKS, but it's the rule. and it's the BEST you can possibly do on any spin, so YES, it's a happy reason to have your free spins cutoff. it's like complaining about going over the max win on a 10x max cashout bonus code, the rule sucks, but it's the best you can do, so if you are not happy with the best you can do, when can you be happy

 

[nisosbar]

yes, the rule SUCKS, but it's the rule. and it's the BEST you can possibly do on any spin, so YES, it's a happy reason to have your free spins cutoff. it's like complaining about going over the max win on a 10x max cashout bonus code, the rule sucks, but it's the best you can do, so if you are not happy with the best you can do, when can you be happy

What you seem to be arguing is that players should be happy about a variance which is lowered arbitrarily to their disadvantage. I disagree.

 

[roygen]

Just happened again -14 free spins disappeared

Just hit this , had 14 free spins left then disappeared after the hit. Must admit I am on a good run but still think the 50000 x max line bet rule sucks.

At least now that I am more educated, I understand what happened this time.

 

[funeral979]

I see it says "Feature Completed" at the top. Are you sure you got cut off?

Usually it says "Maximum Payout Awarded"

 

[roygen]

100% Sure- The same thing happened to me earlier on today on Raindance, it just reverted me back to normal play- I still had 400+ spins left to go. Never seen the "Maximum Payout Awarded"appear. Actually if it had of said that on the raindance slot it would have saved a lot of drama i experienced earlier.

Maybe the rep can explain why "Maximum Payout Awarded" did not appear on either slot ? ( Maybe because they were both hit on free spins)?

 

[bsilva028]

It's always the last statement in the rules on the pay-table of each slot. (e.g. Rain Dance below)

Free-spins only count as ONE paid spin, which is why this rule comes into effect most frequently on slots which can give 100s of spins, or have stacked wilds on all the reels.

KK

excuse me my ignorance but:
maximum win per paid spin is 50.000 times bet per line dont means 50.000x per line?

if the player was betting$0,05 per line the maximum win should be $0,05 *50.000 in each line??
with 20 lines shouldnt be $2500 per line maximum win? making a total of $50.000?

 

[KasinoKing]

excuse me my ignorance but:
maximum win per paid spin is 50.000 times bet per line dont means 50.000x per line?

if the player was betting$0,05 per line the maximum win should be $0,05 *50.000 in each line??
with 20 lines shouldnt be $2500 per line maximum win? making a total of $50.000?

I can understand your confusion due to the way it is worded in the rules, but it does mean 50,000 x your bet per ONE line.

i.e. if you were only playing ONE line or only FIVE lines @ 5c your maximum win is still $2,500 - the same as for playing ANY number of lines.

If you think you have a chance of hitting this maximum, the best thing to do is not play maximum lines.
This is especially true on Count Spectacular where if you hit 5 expanding wilds during NORMAL spins your win will be capped to such an extent that it's not really worth EVER playing this 25-line slot at more than 5 lines.

KK

 

[bsilva028]

I can understand your confusion due to the way it is worded in the rules, but it does mean 50,000 x your bet per ONE line.

i.e. if you were only playing ONE line or only FIVE lines @ 5c your maximum win is still $2,500 - the same as for playing ANY number of lines.

If you think you have a chance of hitting this maximum, the best thing to do is not play maximum lines.
This is especially true on Count Spectacular where if you hit 5 expanding wilds during NORMAL spins your win will be capped to such an extent that it's not really worth EVER playing this 25-line slot at more than 5 lines.

KK

the maximum bet that ti got once in RTG was in the end of 2010 was $1600 betting 0,05 per line (20 lines) free spins on crystal waters. and only hit more than 1000x bet 1 time in my life

after that the max bet that i got in rtg was never high than 50x, so probably i will not get the 50,000x, but thanks, if It happen.....

I am already informed

 

[SlotsLover]

I don't disagree, BUT

What you seem to be arguing is that players should be happy about a variance which is lowered arbitrarily to their disadvantage. I disagree.

of course, I would prefer to play without that rule, but that is the rule. You can choose not to play if you are unsatisfied with that rule. However, on any given spin, there are two possibilities.

1. win an amount less than 50,000 x bet per line (or win nothing).

or

2. win the maximum amount.

As # 2 > # 1, my preference is that the second possibility occur. As this is the best possible outcome, I will be very happy whenever this happens to me (although I've never had it happen on any slot for me in over 10 years of playing).

 

[chuchu59]

I have gotten 100 free spins thrice in Warlock's Spell and 50 spins twice at T-rex but not once did I get the max payout. If, in the future I do get it, I just hope it the supposed payout doesnt exceed the max payout by anything more than 20%.

 

[SlotsLover]

rain dance

I believe it happens most often on rain dance because any retrigger (even if only three scatters--5 scatters is 100 spins) gives another 100 spins, which I do not believe is the case on Warlock's or T-Rex.

I have gotten 100 free spins thrice in Warlock's Spell and 50 spins twice at T-rex but not once did I get the max payout. If, in the future I do get it, I just hope it the supposed payout doesnt exceed the max payout by anything more than 20%.

 

[Simmo!]

Sorry, but this "max win" business is the one and only thing I can't get my head around regarding RTG software.

Agreed but I guess it's because RTG licence their software to a lot of small-time operators with poor cashflow. And also worth noting is that in the UK in land-based casinos you get a £4,000 max cashout too so it's not unique, although that one is because of the law.


PS. Changed the thread title as previously suggested.

 

[Slotster!]

Out of interest - has anyone hit a bigger hit on any other software? MG etc? I.e - More than would be allowed were it an RTG slot.

I'm just wondering if they actually state there's a max, as opposed to other software just being configured RTP wise to not pay out over a similar figure.

 

[vinylweatherman]

Out of interest - has anyone hit a bigger hit on any other software? MG etc? I.e - More than would be allowed were it an RTG slot.

I'm just wondering if they actually state there's a max, as opposed to other software just being configured RTP wise to not pay out over a similar figure.

The "show me the money" screenshots would host instances where an RTG slot would have capped the payouts under the same circumstances. Since the RTG rule is based on line bet, rather than total bet, the more lines a slot has, the worse this rule appears when invoked. The 50 line Rudolph's Revenge caps max line bets to 1000x total stake, shown by the $1 spin being capped after the accumulated win reached $1000. It also means that with some RTG slots, playing fewer lines increases the RTP, since it is line bet, not total bet, that determines the cap value. With Raindance, playing fewer lines would increase the cap as a percentage of total bet, which would significantly increase the payouts on the rare occasions that the full 100 spins are won, and a stream of retriggers are generated. Moving the cap higher increases the amount of the RTP paid to players at the top end of variance, rather than being confiscated due to the cap being hit.

 

[chuchu59]

Agreed but I guess it's because RTG licence their software to a lot of small-time operators with poor cashflow. And also worth noting is that in the UK in land-based casinos you get a £4,000 max cashout too so it's not unique, although that one is because of the law.

Actually, the poor cashflow is not an excuse if the operators set a low max bet limit. They are greedy and hope players bet big but when they win big, they want the wins capped.

 

[bsilva028]

Out of interest - has anyone hit a bigger hit on any other software? MG etc? I.e - More than would be allowed were it an RTG slot.

I'm just wondering if they actually state there's a max, as opposed to other software just being configured RTP wise to not pay out over a similar figure.

in mg not but in rival yes
in 2009 in sloto, playing 20 lines $0,01 per line won $1700

 

[KasinoKing]

in mg not but in rival yes
in 2009 in sloto, playing 20 lines $0,01 per line won $1700

Which slot was that on???

KK

 

[bsilva028]

Which slot was that on???

KK

it was an "I-SLOT" i dont remember the name it was in 2009, it was my 1st big win on a casino
i got 5 wilds in free spins

 

[slotplayer]

Out of interest - has anyone hit a bigger hit on any other software? MG etc? I.e - More than would be allowed were it an RTG slot.

I'm just wondering if they actually state there's a max, as opposed to other software just being configured RTP wise to not pay out over a similar figure.

I won somewhere around $23K on Reel Baron a few years ago. Not sure if it was bigger than the RTG. I bitched a little to support about the poor play and they tossed me a $1K vip bonus. I was totally shocked.

The only thing I remember is there were two spins back to back that won like $11K each. I'm sure I was betting really highly though.
Here is a screen but its rather small. I know I have a big screen of it somewhere but can't find it. I think I took the screen afterwards and lowered the wager.

 

[MaryJean]

I've learned a lot in this thread but a rule has always baffled me

It's always the last statement in the rules on the pay-table of each slot. (e.g. Rain Dance below)

Free-spins only count as ONE paid spin, which is why this rule comes into effect most frequently on slots which can give 100s of spins, or have stacked wilds on all the reels.

KK

The statement in KK's rule copy, that says "Random Jackpot contribution is no more that 1.5% of the total Return to the Player"

What "contribution" are they talking about? Who "contributes" what, where and when?

Thanks for your great help everyone!
MaryJean

 

[LaHutti]

The statement in KK's rule copy, that says "Random Jackpot contribution is no more that 1.5% of the total Return to the Player"

What "contribution" are they talking about? Who "contributes" what, where and when?

Thanks for your great help everyone!
MaryJean

Every time you spin, a small percentage of your bet goes to the random jackpot, so everyone who plays the slot contributes to the pot.

 

[Stovetopp]

The "show me the money" screenshots would host instances where an RTG slot would have capped the payouts under the same circumstances. Since the RTG rule is based on line bet, rather than total bet, the more lines a slot has, the worse this rule appears when invoked. The 50 line Rudolph's Revenge caps max line bets to 1000x total stake, shown by the $1 spin being capped after the accumulated win reached $1000. It also means that with some RTG slots, playing fewer lines increases the RTP, since it is line bet, not total bet, that determines the cap value. With Raindance, playing fewer lines would increase the cap as a percentage of total bet, which would significantly increase the payouts on the rare occasions that the full 100 spins are won, and a stream of retriggers are generated. Moving the cap higher increases the amount of the RTP paid to players at the top end of variance, rather than being confiscated due to the cap being hit.

You are correct mathematicaly . However, by not playing the maxlines, you are in danger of hitting the
lines that "would have" given you the max payout. ON THE OTHER HAND YOU CAN HIT THE MAXPAYOUT WITH SAY YOUR 10 LINE BET......I have tried this "system" and have never been successful

 

[Nifty29]

I'm pretty sure dogboy stated the effect on rtp is very small (less than 1%).

Still sucks though. I got an almost total screenful of gold nugget wilds in paydirt and received 2000xbet when the actual win should have been around 20000xbet.

 

[chuchu59]

I'm pretty sure dogboy stated the effect on rtp is very small (less than 1%).

Still sucks though. I got an almost total screenful of gold nugget wilds in paydirt and received 2000xbet when the actual win should have been around 20000xbet.

Dogboy's statement simply pulls the wool over your eyes as this encompasses play by all players, most of which wont get the max payout anyway. Actually, a 1% rtp is very significant and may sometimes determine whether or not you are able to cashout especially with a bonus in play since wrs tend to be hefty at rtg.

In your case Nifty, your win would have been 9 times l;arger making it a monster win instead of a big win. Of course, yours is an extreme case and there will always be some at the borderline ie the actual win only exceeds the max payout by a few percentage points. It could make a huge difference to individual players especially when their unit bets are huge and it could be even more damaging to a casino with poor cashflow as Simmo puts it. It would be interesting to know how much $$$ was saved from this max payout over the years but of course this is something no-one will tell us. Could well be in the millions range but what we get is the effect is less than 1% of rtp

 

[vinylweatherman]

Dogboy's statement simply pulls the wool over your eyes as this encompasses play by all players, most of which wont get the max payout anyway. Actually, a 1% rtp is very significant and may sometimes determine whether or not you are able to cashout especially with a bonus in play since wrs tend to be hefty at rtg.

In your case Nifty, your win would have been 9 times l;arger making it a monster win instead of a big win. Of course, yours is an extreme case and there will always be some at the borderline ie the actual win only exceeds the max payout by a few percentage points. It could make a huge difference to individual players especially when their unit bets are huge and it could be even more damaging to a casino with poor cashflow as Simmo puts it. It would be interesting to know how much $$$ was saved from this max payout over the years but of course this is something no-one will tell us. Could well be in the millions range but what we get is the effect is less than 1% of rtp

Given how often this happens with Raindance, I am not so sure of this.

A proper mathematical analysis would confirm.

 

[zap987]

Most likely the effect of the max payout is considered when designing the slot for a specific RTP. It lets them create more 2000xbet wins instead of fewer bigger hits. Sure it sucks when you hit that 20000x bet win but maybe there just wouldn't have been as many wilds on the reels (or rather more low paying symbols), if not for the max payout rule you might have won 0.

 

[Nifty29]

Given how often this happens with Raindance, I am not so sure of this.

A proper mathematical analysis would confirm.

Dogboy stated these stats as a result of his mathematical analysis....in fact THE mathematical analysis as its his job to test these things on the exact games we are talking about.

No evidence has ever been offered to suggest that dogboy has ever been incorrect in relation to RTG software, so I'm not sure why you wouldn't accept his far better informed analysis.

The figure,based on all play from all players, makes perfect sense. We hear about the max cap situations in the forums, we don't hear about every other spin do we? A few swallows does not a summer make (except for maybe that girl I met over summer when i was 17 )

The RTP effect is not per player, but rather for the game overall.