North Korea and US politics

[Harry_BKK]

Trump will get it in the neck no matter what he does such is the media bias against him.

Try typing "Trump News" in Google searches. Page after page of anti Trump. I got to the 4th page without finding one reference to the $1,000 givaway. Why? Because they would rather it be Hillary giving it.

Well, his fault really. He's been downplaying it for months.

BTW, the US was informed much earlier about a possible virus outbreak and also had their first case on the 20th Jan 2020!

For some balanced perspective, please google what Republicans and right-wing media were saying when Obama was preparing the bailout package.... pretty please.

 

[Harry_BKK]

On the IRS headquarter's building it's chiselled "Taxes are what we pay for a civilized society.”

View attachment 125461

I think it's true but there also needs to be a saying regarding the tax money wasted by govt, which then doesn't go where it's most needed. And with the violent crime rate soaring we're becoming less civilized.

edit: Also the big firms and billionaires go to great lengths to dodge paying their fair share.

One more time: TAXES are not a socialist invention! I guess that building is maybe 100 or 150 years old. Maybe going back 2000 years would give you a clearer picture.

Since when are big firms and billionaires socialists or were they at any point in time?

 

[mack341]

One more time: TAXES are not a socialist invention! I guess that building is maybe 100 or 150 years old. Maybe going back 2000 years would give you a clearer picture.

Since when are big firms and billionaires socialists or were they at any point in time?

Harry I didn't say it was did I

 

[Harry_BKK]

Harry I didn't say it was did I

Sorry mate, misunderstood your post.

 

[sufferinsilence]

That's kind of a funny statement, considering that Trump might give $1,000 to citizens over 18 years. Not socialist, heh?

Trump is basically trying to buy his re-election. What's a grand gonna do when those people's jobs are going to disappear due to the recession? I reckon if this was his 2nd term there would be no mention of giving every 18+ American $1000 but everything would be reserved for companies.

 

[Harry_BKK]

Trump is basically trying to buy his re-election. What's a grand gonna do when those people's jobs are going to disappear due to the recession? I reckon if this was his 2nd term there would be no mention of giving every 18+ American $1000 but everything would be reserved for companies.

More lipstick on the pig.

Meanwhile, his administration is still in court trying to repeal and eliminate the ACA, the very thing people need right now and surely in the future.

BTW, about a week ago a Corona test in the US had a price pegged at roughly $1,300, might be lower by now as more companies are doing them. So the $1K would not have covered that for a single family member although the latest package from the House has money included to make them free for all.

 

[slotplayer]

Nah mate, nothing is decided yet.

But you see, slotplayer is the best example. Rejecting socialist policies but then welcoming government handouts from his Dear Leader which is the most socialist thing there is.

Hypocrisy at its finest.

And how long will $1000 last? 1 or 2 weeks? Remember most workers in the US don't get anything when they lose their job. So they have no income whatsoever. Sure, $1K will help but it is more like a straw fire than anything else. Enacting proper unemployment and health care insurance would take care of that, but then, hey, that is socialism again....bad, bad.....

I don't think I'm getting the $1K. But you're misinforming again, we have unemployment insurance here and state paid health insurance. I guess you can claim UI benefits online now to.

The $1k is to bridge the workers until the UI benefits kick in. I haven't collected since 2003 and its all changed but back then if I remember correctly it was a good 2-3 weeks before the first check was mailed.

 

[Harry_BKK]

I don't think I'm getting the $1K. But you're misinforming again, we have unemployment insurance here and state paid health insurance. I guess you can claim UI benefits online now to.

The $1k is to bridge the workers until the UI benefits kick in. I haven't collected since 2003 and its all changed but back then if I remember correctly it was a good 2-3 weeks before the first check was mailed.

I did not say you don't have it. Maybe reading my post again will help, because a large part of the workers in the US has neither of the two, or just very limited.

"Enacting proper unemployment and health care insurance would take care of that, but then, hey, that is socialism again....bad, bad."

 

[slotplayer]

I did not say you don't have it. Maybe reading my post again will help, because a large part of the workers in the US has neither of the two, or just very limited.

"Enacting proper unemployment and health care insurance would take care of that, but then, hey, that is socialism again....bad, bad."

I did read it - you said " Remember most workers in the US don't get anything when they lose their job. So they have no income whatsoever."

That's a false statement. Its not most, its not even a large part.

 

[mack341]

How would the usa bring in a 'fairer' system, they have a huge population for one and a huge national debt for two. The biggest prison population, massive drug addiction and homelessness problems. The mind boggles as to the challenges involved for a president or the senators, whilst the democrat's favourite policy is more immigration, even if it hurts the poorer people already there by reducing real wage growth through having a surplus of labour, over demand for public services/assistance etc etc..

the old uk is well up on that list, which doesn't surprise me, but poland does and after checking, we already have nearly a 1,000 of them banged up here as well.

This looks like an interesting article on the british underworld.

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[ guardian 2019 ]

 

[slotplayer]

How would the usa bring in a 'fairer' system, they have a huge population for one and a huge national debt for two. The biggest prison population, massive drug addiction and homelessness problems. The mind boggles as to the challenges involved for a president or the senators, whilst the democrat's favourite policy is more immigration, even if it hurts the poorer people already there by reducing real wage growth through having a surplus of labour, over demand for public services/assistance etc etc..

View attachment 125465

the old uk is well up on that list, which doesn't surprise me, but poland does and after checking, we already have nearly a 1,000 of them banged up here as well.

This looks like an interesting article on the british underworld.

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

[ guardian 2019 ]

You wern't watching Tucker again, were you, he said something about prisons. I didn't really follow it though.

 

[mack341]

You wern't watching Tucker again, were you, he said something about prisons. I didn't really follow it though.

No I've been missing tucker and the gang, youtube is blocking them, hard to find one full upload nowadays, searching for laura ingraham just brings up 20 or so vids, something about someone called nipsey and other things I'm clueless about. Definitely some democrat media censorship happening I feel

Edit: although it won't be the first time I'm on the same wavelength as tucker

 

[slotplayer]

No I've been missing tucker and the gang, youtube is blocking them, hard to find one full upload nowadays, searching for laura ingraham just brings up 20 or so vids, something about someone called nipsey and other things I'm clueless about. Definitely some democrat media censorship happening I feel

Edit: although it won't be the first time I'm on the same wavelength as tucker

Its brutal. Its one of the reasons why I stopped debating as much. I can't find my clips to back up my position.

 

[slotplayer]

Just on the news, 70,000 applied for unemployment in one state and it crashed the site.
Wait till the police get it and they call in the national guard. This could get out of hand fast.

Start learning mandarin.

 

[mack341]

I did think the one thing that would make somebody vote in a different way is when they've lost their job and feel the govt could have acted differently, and they would still have a job.

I do get a sense somebody like bernie will eventually be voted in, not 2020, but maybe 2028, if things deteriorate and people despair of the republicans. [with regard to wealth inequality; some say the middle class has been decimated by the export of jobs overseas, and the senate now want to make it easier for computer techies from abroad to come and work in the US, which will obviously deprive those already looking for work opportunities in those job professions]

edit: it might have been on Fox, but I watched a news story about AT&T making their US staff train indians to do their jobs, and then face being made redundant afterwards

 

[slotplayer]

I did think the one thing that would make somebody vote in a different way is when they've lost their job and feel the govt could have acted differently, and they would still have a job.

I do get a sense somebody like bernie will eventually be voted in, not 2020, but maybe 2028, if things deteriorate and people despair of the republicans.

I think its 4 years to late for Bernie (he's 78 now) in 2028. I'm surprised they picked Biden, he's a such a swamp creature.

 

[mack341]

I think its 4 years to late for Bernie (he's 78 now) in 2028. I'm surprised they picked Biden, he's a such a swamp creature.

I wasn't meaning bernie he's still lively now but 86 would be asking too much, could be that AOC but having watched her the other day I'm not sure how politically bright she is, virtue signalling will only take you so far.

I've been surprised by biden's momentum, I thought it would still be 50/50 with sanders, as I guessed warren's voters would go for him but obviously they haven't.

 

[vorcirion]

I think its 4 years to late for Bernie (he's 78 now) in 2028. I'm surprised they picked Biden, he's a such a swamp creature.

At least Biden knows how to make the government to do something. You have your non-swamp creatures running the show now. Jared Kushner leading the WH's coronavirus team And rest of the agencies probably understaffed with no real expertise in anything.

 

[slotplayer]

I wasn't meaning bernie he's still lively now but 86 would be asking too much, could be that AOC but having watched her the other day I'm not sure how politically bright she is, virtue signalling will only take you so far.

I've been surprised by biden's momentum, I thought it would still be 50/50 with sanders, as I guessed warren's voters would go for him but obviously they haven't.

I think the progressive movement is done. The country will either stay with Trump or go back to the establishment candidate.

 

[ShadyFei]

Here is Trump’s Coronavirus Calendar. A record of Trump’s downplay and denial in Trump’s own words. So there can be no doubt about what he said and when he said it.

He didn't declare the COVID19 a Hoax, he declared their politicization of it a hoax. The media spun it.

“Despite creating some confusion with his remarks, Trump did not call the coronavirus itself a hoax. "

Trump definitely called it a hoax - at 1:05 in video

(Worth noting: This video was posted four days ago. Cases of coronavirus in the U.S. are now surging past 25,000. And even that number is deceivingly low due to the lack of adequate testing in the US.)

Watch from the source:



Or from Twitter for the comments:

 

[slotplayer]

Slow to start but they're doing a decent job here.

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[Harry_BKK]

Slow to start but they're doing a decent job here.

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Funny how quick you are to defend your Dear Leader. Whereas all he has done in the last few days is blaming others, telling the American people that the government is not a shipping clerk (although declaring a national emergency effectively puts the government in charge) and asked to have unemployment numbers delayed among other things.

That poll was taken 18th and 19th March, since then the number of COVID-19 cases in the US has more than doubled. They will most probably double again in the next 2 days. Do a poll then to see what the population is thinking.

You are basically claiming victory after the first 100 yards of a marathon. Wait until this flattens out and things return to normal, then you will have a much clearer picture. The numbers will then show if he indeed has done well.

 

[slotplayer]

Funny how quick you are to defend your Dear Leader. Whereas all he has done in the last few days is blaming others, telling the American people that the government is not a shipping clerk and asked to have unemployment numbers delayed among other things.

That poll was taken 18th and 19th March, since then the number of COVID-19 cases has more than doubled. They will most probably double again in the next 2 days. Do a poll then to see what the population is thinking.

He can say whatever he wants, I look at the actions.

 

[Harry_BKK]

He can say whatever he wants, I look at the actions.

What actions?

 

[slotplayer]

What actions?

They just showed a segment on CNN how they're working 24 hours to produce ventilators.
I didn't watch it but overheard it.

That information is all out there if you care to look.

 

[Harry_BKK]

They just showed a segment on CNN how they're working 24 hours to produce ventilators.
I didn't watch it but overheard it.

That information is all out there if you care to look.

The Chinese officially informed the WHO and the US on 3rd January 2020.

The first case was somewhere in November 2019. I am sure your intelligence agencies were aware in December 2019 and briefed your Dear Leader.

Up to about 10 days ago, or let's say 3rd March 2020 to keep it simple, your Dear Leader downplayed it even as it was jumping into his and your face. "It will go away like a miracle".

That is minimum two and up three months of inaction and lying into your and every US citizen's face.

Oh, I nearly forgot, he closed the border to China or so he says. Bollocks, he did not as dozens of flights were still arriving in the US every week throughout Feb and the beginning of March. He prohibited Chinese and other nationals who were in China in the last 14 days to enter the US, but he did not close the border. It is right that it might have bought you a little more time to figure out what to do and he decided to squander it away with lies and propaganda, e.g. "I don't need the numbers to double because of one ship."

The people who did most of the action so far are the governors, certainly not your Dear Leader.

To quote you, the information is all there if you care to look .... past Faux News et al that is.

 

[Harry_BKK]

They just showed a segment on CNN how they're working 24 hours to produce ventilators.
I didn't watch it but overheard it.

That information is all out there if you care to look.

Here's one good example of your Dear Leader's actions or better said "non-action". This was on the 5th Feb when it was already rampant in China.

 

[Harry_BKK]

They just showed a segment on CNN how they're working 24 hours to produce ventilators.
I didn't watch it but overheard it.

That information is all out there if you care to look.

And one more to show you the "actions' of your Dear Leader.

On the left, amount of tests/day and confirmed cases (blue line) in SK that ultimately led to the flattening of the curve, on the right the US. Does that look like "ACTION" to you???

 

[slotplayer]

CNN already showed it flattening out the other day in Washington State where the virus first started but it was only a sign and more time was needed.

CNN just showed a segment saying the FDA approved a new test that shows the results I think they said within an hour.

 

[Harry_BKK]

CNN already showed it flattening out the other day in Washington State where the virus first started but it was only a sign and more time was needed.

CNN just showed a segment saying the FDA approved a new test that shows the results I think they said within an hour.

And which part has anything to do with the "actions" of your Dear Leader?

IIRC, he called the Washington governor a snake and AFAIK, he had nothing to do with the new test which comes from a company based in California, a state your Dear Leader denigrates all the time.

 

[Harry_BKK]

CNN already showed it flattening out the other day in Washington State where the virus first started but it was only a sign and more time was needed.

CNN just showed a segment saying the FDA approved a new test that shows the results I think they said within an hour.

IMO, the US barely scratched the surface and that curve will have an upward trajectory for some time to come, sadly. Feb and March had some major events like Mardi Gras where thousands and thousands of people mingled. Nobody thought of cancelling any events.

Germany was no better with the carnival, that is why those regions are worst affected.

Austria the same, the skiing season was into its last weeks and it was "important" to have the resorts and bars full for the best profit.

Northern Italy is the gateway to the Alps with millions of tourists.

The UK kept pubs etc open until a few days ago.

etc etc.

 

[slotplayer]

And which part has anything to do with the "actions" of your Dear Leader?

IIRC, he called the Washington governor a snake and AFAIK, he had nothing to do with the new test which comes from a company based in California, a state your Dear Leader denigrates all the time.

Again, so what. We don't need constant soothing and coddling and the nanny state here.

 

[slotplayer]

Many events are canceled here. Schools, NBA/NHL, MLB.

We have a Federalist system here, you know this. Each governor does what is best for their state. NY/NJ have lock downs but not here in my state yet any way.

This was March 12, 2020

 

[mack341]

Here is Trump’s Coronavirus Calendar. A record of Trump’s downplay and denial in Trump’s own words. So there can be no doubt about what he said and when he said it.



Trump definitely called it a hoax - at 1:05 in video

(Worth noting: This video was posted four days ago. Cases of coronavirus in the U.S. are now surging past 25,000. And even that number is deceivingly low due to the lack of adequate testing in the US.)

Watch from the source:



Or from Twitter for the comments:

Sorry Shadyfei, that has been clipped, it's accepted even by the fact checker sites that he is referring to the democrat/msm criticism of his handling of the coronavirus outbreak.

"coronavirus"..... different part of speech clipped with the first part missing 'and this is their new hoax'

dailysignal website:

“They tried anything,” said Trump about a minute after his first mention of the coronavirus. “They tried it over and over. They’d been doing it since you got in. It’s all turning. They lost. It’s all turning. Think of it. Think of it. And this is their new hoax.”

When looking at the entirety of Trump’s remarks, it appears the “new hoax” comment refers to the Democrats’ alleged “politicizing” of his response to the coronavirus threat—not the coronavirus itself.

The Hill, the Daily Beast and Slate, among other news outlets, reported that the “hoax” comment referred to Democrats’ criticism.

Slate’s headline was “Trump Slams Democrats Over Coronavirus Criticism: ‘This Is Their New Hoax,’” while the Daily Beast headline read, “Trump: Democrats’ Coronavirus Criticism a ‘New Hoax.’”

At no point in the rally did Trump directly call the novel coronavirus outbreak a “hoax” or “conspiracy.” In fact, he referred to the respiratory virus as a “public health threat” and reiterated that “we have to take it very, very seriously. That’s what we’re doing. We are preparing for the worst.”

 

[mack341]

Even our beloved BBC, who like to bash Trump at any opportunity, went with that conclusion:
this is the whole segment, watch it till the end, where he says and 'this is their new hoax'



Coronavirus: Trump calls criticism Democrat 'hoax'

US President Donald Trump has called criticism from Democrats over his reaction to the global coronavirus outbreak as a "hoax".
“The Democrats are politicising the coronavirus,” he said at a campaign rally in South Carolina.

 

[mack341]

My instincts regarding Dr Fauci may have not been too far out, he loves killary clinton

'tell her I love her more than ever'

[Cheryl mills being hillary's counsel and chief of staff.]

I doubt he ever sends such glowing praise Trump's way, and must've been extremely butthurt when donald beat his favourite.

 

[sufferinsilence]

My instincts regarding Dr Fauci may have not been too far out, he loves killary clinton

'tell her I love her more than ever'

[Cheryl mills being hillary's counsel and chief of staff.]

I doubt he ever sends such glowing praise Trump's way, and must've been extremely butthurt when donald beat his favourite.


View attachment 125824

View attachment 125825

Dr. Fauci is the only one who has said anything meaningful during these pressers the past days.

But yeah, have him fired because he likes Hillary!

 

[slotplayer]

A little Tribute to Mr. T

 

[Playford7]

Orange man bad, started the Chinese virus.
The end.

 

[vorcirion]

My instincts regarding Dr Fauci may have not been too far out, he loves killary clinton

'tell her I love her more than ever'

[Cheryl mills being hillary's counsel and chief of staff.]

I doubt he ever sends such glowing praise Trump's way, and must've been extremely butthurt when donald beat his favourite.


View attachment 125824

View attachment 125825

Gee...wonder why someone wouldn't send praise to Trump's way. Because he really values everything that Fauci values...like science and brain activity etc. No actually...you tell me why Fauci should praise Trump.

 

[mack341]

I've only watched about 30 secs of dr fauci, too much going on in the uk re announcements, he might be a decent, good guy.

But the dismissive response to that potential treatment raised my eyebrows, the body language was shifty, sure trump may have been over playing it as the cure in the hope the virus problem goes away and the stock market goes back up.

looking at that message he sent to hillary, it mentions her speech

' A world in transition: charting a new path in global health'

I wonder what was in that speech he loved so much ?

Edit: for my sins I just read it, other than a phrase that gets mentioned a lot 'country ownership' not sure what to make of it...

 

[sufferinsilence]

I've only watched about 30 secs of dr fauci, too much going on in the uk re announcements, he might be a decent, good guy.

But the dismissive response to that potential treatment raised my eyebrows, the body language was shifty, sure trump may have been over playing it as the cure in the hope the virus problem goes away and the stock market goes back up.

looking at that message he sent to hillary, it mentions her speech

' A world in transition: charting a new path in global health'

I wonder what was in that speech he loved so much ?

What I took away from it is he wanted to see some results for himself first before promising the American people it was "the" cure. I think most scientists would react like he did.

 

[mack341]

The concept of “country ownership” is of recent origin and there is little agreement on a definition.

It rose out the 2005 Paris Declaration on Aid Effectiveness and the 2008 Accra Agenda, and is defined by Population Action International as “an institutionalized process that allows for the participation, as equal partners, of governments, non-state actors — such as civil society and the private sector — and parliamentarians in the development, implementation and monitoring of national development plans.”

To achieve country ownership, less aid — and thus less power — should be given to governments and much more aid should be provided to the non-state sector

Citizens, acting individually, cannot hold governments accountable. But foreign aid should eventually be able to create a strong, vibrant non-state sector with institutions increasingly capable of holding governments accountable, and the time for country ownership will have arrived.

Who then holds this powerful 'non-state sector' to account?

Sounds to me very much like a corporate take over and let's get rid of democracy and sovereign government.

 

[vorcirion]

I've only watched about 30 secs of dr fauci, too much going on in the uk re announcements, he might be a decent, good guy.

But the dismissive response to that potential treatment raised my eyebrows, the body language was shifty, sure trump may have been over playing it as the cure in the hope the virus problem goes away and the stock market goes back up.

looking at that message he sent to hillary, it mentions her speech

' A world in transition: charting a new path in global health'

I wonder what was in that speech he loved so much ?

Why you, Trump and Fox are so obsessed with Hillary? You need some psychological help or what's going on?
It's like you can't get her out of your mind. You've kept thinking that she's still going to run for the president...or maybe she'll be someone's VP pick. Now you need to bring her up again for some reason. That's so 2016...get over it already!

 

[mack341]

What I took away from it is he wanted to see some results for himself first before promising the American people it was "the" cure. I think most scientists would react like he did.

Good results were already out there in respected journals, but I agree a cautious approach is not the worse way to approach it, but I felt he was leaning too much towards dismissive rather than neutral or even hopeful there was something in the results.

 

[slotplayer]

Vcon, Where you been?

 

[mack341]

Why you, Trump and Fox are so obsessed with Hillary? You need some psychological help or what's going on?
It's like you can't get her out of your mind. You've kept thinking that she's still going to run for the president...or maybe she'll be someone's VP pick. Now you need to bring her up again for some reason. That's so 2016...get over it already!

She's a 'change maker', bill clinton called her that, but the average, conservative minded citizen isn't going to get much of a say in the type of change. That's what this country ownership must be about, bypassing the electorate and their elected govt.

 

[sufferinsilence]

Good results were already out there in respected journals, but I agree a cautious approach is not the worse way to approach it, but I felt he was leaning too much towards dismissive rather than neutral or even hopeful there was something in the results.

I know, I posted one of those over in the coronavirus topic but they're also testing other drugs like Remdesivir. It's just my guess that he wants to see some results for himself first.

 

[sufferinsilence]

The concept of “country ownership” is of recent origin and there is little agreement on a definition.

It rose out the 2005 Paris Declaration on Aid Effectiveness and the 2008 Accra Agenda, and is defined by Population Action International as “an institutionalized process that allows for the participation, as equal partners, of governments, non-state actors — such as civil society and the private sector — and parliamentarians in the development, implementation and monitoring of national development plans.”

To achieve country ownership, less aid — and thus less power — should be given to governments and much more aid should be provided to the non-state sector

Citizens, acting individually, cannot hold governments accountable. But foreign aid should eventually be able to create a strong, vibrant non-state sector with institutions increasingly capable of holding governments accountable, and the time for country ownership will have arrived.

Who then holds this powerful 'non-state sector' to account?

Sounds to me very much like a corporate take over and let's get rid of democracy and sovereign government.

Yeah man, in the USA some weird orange corporate man is already trying to do that...

 

[ladyhawke]

News from North Korea is that Trump sent a personal letter to Kim Jon Un that apparently offers help with COVID-19 (Source: Time Magazine).

In the letter, she (Kim's sister) said Trump explained his plan to “propel the relations between the two countries … and expressed his intent to render cooperation in the anti-epidemic work,” an apparent reference to the global coronavirus outbreak. She said her brother expressed his gratitude for Trump’s letter.

Apparently, last month Trump's administration was concerned about North Korea's vulnerability to a potential coronavirus outbreak due to its limited medical capabilities, and as such would support aid organisation efforts to contain the virus.

So his administration will provide help for NK, but when it comes to his own country, Trump tells the states it is not his fault the states have shortages of medical equipment, and that they are on their own.

Nothing new to see here, I guess, as this is just Trump in his usual full-on not my fault, nothing to do with me, not my responsibility, someone else's fault mode!

Now I believe in the USA, a governor is elected to run each state, and has to ask for Federal help - the government can't just "march in and take over".

However, by declaring a National emergency, Trump has effectively taken control back from the states, and should be leading the response, irrespective of the colour of the voters.