My underage son gambled on sportingbet.com

[skiny]

I am not sure why everyone is getting on the gambling site and neteller. The gaming site will ask for documents when a withdrawal is requested and neteller should have verified everything before any deposits were made to the gaming site.

I don't want to seem insensitive here, but I think the big problem here is this child knew what he was doing. He signed up at a gaming site, he knew he was gambling. After he had lost his savings only then did he go to his parents. If he would have won and then put the money back into his savings account, do you think he would have went to his parents then? Who knows, but I really believe that if he had won he would still be gambling at that gaming site.

Its a hard pill to swallow knowing your under age child was gambling and lost his money, but he had to commit fraud somewhere along the lines to be able to fund and gamble at this site. Thank god it was only 1500 dollars and not thousands. IMO, take this as a lesson and make sure your son earns back every penny he lost, then he might think twice about gambling on line.

I am just sayin'.

LH

PS. It is not uncommon for kids to have such large amounts money now a days, my daughter is 9 and has more in the bank then what some middle class families make in a year. I keep a close eye on her bank accounts, and will until she is old enough to get the money out. And that will not be until she goes to college, and hopefully by then she will be smart with her money.

Does keeping an eye on it mean she has access to it? What would a 9 year old need all this money for? Shouldn't it be in a trust fund somewhere? Or in investments?

 

[LHofsdal]

Skiny,

She already has a trust fund and has several other different investments. This is her money, money she has gotten for birthdays, holidays, good report cards etc. My husband and I put money in her investing accounts.

But that is not the point of this thread, lets not derail this thread.

LH

 

[Jasminebed]

Well, your child has a great deal of culpabilty in this issue. He's commited several acts of fraud. I'm inclined to believe the OP.

Butterflyboogie expressed a lot of my feelings on this issue very well.

There is much to be said for natural and logical consequences of your children's behaviour, and losing $1500 or your money is a hard one.

I also understand your outrage at how your child was allowed to do this.

I would begin an investigation through the regulatory agencies, let them sort it.

If these funds are recovered, I strongly recommend you make your son donate them to a charity of your family's choice. Otherwise that really hard lesson every gambler learns (or not) doesn't happen, don't spend money you are not prepared to lose.

And you might want to find out what else he's been doing with his faked ID, and just where he obtained it. I understand that almost every highschool has someone selling false ID to get kids into clubs.

He has some serious explaining to do to his parents, and you have some serious talking to do with your son (your whole family, if you have more children). Gambling addictions (along with many others) hit harder and earlier in young people, and money online can seem unreal. Your son will not be able to buy that car, or take that trip, or whatever plans he was saving towards. He will learn a real and important lesson for him, and one as parents you would not dream of depriving him of, in your quest to raise a mature person who makes wise money choices. That he had savings shows that this is one of the (rightfully so) attributes you realize is important for him.

Please keep us posted on the decisions you make. There are some pretty wise people here, you would be wise to take their advice.

 

[Mavin1]

I find it interesting that the OP had posted the original report of his sons illegal activities and then has not revisted this thread since.

I am not trying to be unsympathetic if this situation is real, but to look at the other side of this publicly posted issue is that it could also be a ploy to damage the move to legalize online gambling in the US.

How many forums possibly has this person posted this rather lengthy problem on? Why has the poster not come back to respond or interact with other posters here? Why would an adult come to a public place to air his childs misdeeds, rather than dealing with his son himself?

This is one of the major arguments Barney Frank obviously comes up against for the difficulty in getting the bill passed, so we in the US can enjoy some form of freedom in online gamming again. The idea that children can so easily acquire wallet accounts and fund casino's, is the very argument against it for the entire adult population. Postings like this is a black eye to the movement for our personal freedoms.

 

[maphesto]

I didn't see this thread until now. I think it's horrible that a parent can feel sorry for his son when he infact behaved like a criminal.

He used illegal activities to gamble online. Take his computer from him and give it back when he knows better.

To the NETeller issue:

When I registred there over a year ago I first didn't have to send docs or anything. But everything was limited and I couldn't use it fully.
To be able to use it more frequently and deposit more or withdraw more I had to have an extended account.

I had to verify my bankaccount and send docs.

If this 16 year old kid deposit 1500$ in total he had an extended account. He is only 16 years old but he has (guessing here) a debit card connected to his savings. If this is the case, I wonder how a parent can even make this happen?

 

[LHofsdal]

I really think this kid should be held accountable for his actions. He is 16 and I am sure he knew exactly what he was doing. When I was 16 if I got caught drinking (which happened a few times) I got my butt kicked and grounded. Did I learn, no, as soon as I was off being grounded I was right back out there drinking again. I knew exactly what I was doing. I knew it was wrong and it was against the law but I still did it. It was my choice.

This parent I do feel for, because it is not easy knowing your child lost his money gambling. But like I said, he knew exactly what he was doing and should be held accountable for it. I know that if my father was still alive and it was me that gambled my savings away, not only would I get the beaten of my life but he would make sure he worked my butt off with nothing short of blood, sweat and tears until he felt I worked the money off and learned a lesson.

I guess we will have to wait to see the outcome of this situation, knowing that they have hard decisions to make and maybe some pretty harsh consequences.

LH

 

[cpdnd31]

Ok so kid faked his age loss his money and your mad at casinos? If my child I would be selling his computer and anything that meant anything to him to get the money back and teach him a lesson. YOU PLAY YOU PAY. My son likes watching me gamble he asked me questions and I am honest. I tell him that when he is 21 and in his own house on his own computer he can gamble. Until then off limits. I get the fact that the kid saw a add on tv for a poker site or something and wanted to compete like a pro. My son saw the same thing I told him thats what aol and yahoo games were for. Teach your kid what responsability is- for he will only get older and guess what mom you wont be there to fix his problems one day. He was wrong!!! Period!!!! You could be mad at the casinos who cant see that your son is 16 or be mad at your kid. He lied!!! not a GOOD TRAIT. Guess what if he has balls of brass to lie to a casino and a bank he probly lied to you many times. Your son is not a sweet little angle that you think he is. Am I bashing you a little yes you know why too many parents out their are cleaning up their kids messes - You know he is wrong but you still are trying to fix it for him- oh hell no - my kid forgot to do a paper at school I told him not my problem you didnt do it you deal with it and he did.

Whats next your kid gets drunk and drives- hey tell the judge but he was served by the bartender after he showed the fake id.

Your kids out 1500 so make him work his lying ass off to get it back maybe then he wont be so quick to lie cheat and steal because thats what he did. Wake up be a parent.

 

[swampwitch]

A few years ago there was a case here of an underage girl in the US who was gambling illegally...I believe it was a Microgaming casino...with her own money. The casino didn't catch her age until about her third or fourth cashout. She complained here, and I seem to remember the majority consensus was too bad so sad for the casino, pay the girl. There were comments that the evil casino would have been happy to keep taking her money if she had been losing.

She was treated like some sort of little hero, while this kid (if indeed he does exist) is being villified. If he had won instead of lost and the father was here to complain that he wasn't being paid, would everyone's attitude be different? This kid knew what he was doing was illegal, as did the girl from years ago. So, what's with the attitude change?

FWIW, IMHO both kids were in the wrong. This boy needs to get himself some sort of menial, smelly job and work his tail off until that money is replaced.

 

[just play]

As a parent of a 20 year old and an 8 year old (both girls) I can say I have been through my share with the older one.

I think fault lies on both parties.

What would happen if the same kid went into a bar, got served drinks, drove away and killed a family? Who's at fault here? The bar shouldn't get off, neither should the kid.

I feel the casino should be partly at fault, same as I would feel the bar should be partly at fault.

As a parent again...there is NO WAY to know what your children are doing at all times, (especially a 16 year old) and if someone here says "I know what my child does at all times, is lying their asses off".

If it was my daughter, she would be punished, things taken away, her life would be shit for a long while. BUT, I would also contact the casino to see how they could let this happen. I know it has been brought up before, but why don't casinos ask for ID BEFORE deposits?

I also agree with the other poster about children these days having more money than we did. It's not uncommon for a child under 18 to have a boat load of cash. My daughter for instance works 2 jobs, she has nice things, money in the bank, pays for her car payment every month/cell phone payment/etc. She is 20, but she has been doing this now since she could drive.

 

[NASHVEGAS]

A few years ago there was a case here of an underage girl in the US who was gambling illegally...I believe it was a Microgaming casino...with her own money. The casino didn't catch her age until about her third or fourth cashout. She complained here, and I seem to remember the majority consensus was too bad so sad for the casino, pay the girl. There were comments that the evil casino would have been happy to keep taking her money if she had been losing.

She was treated like some sort of little hero, while this kid (if indeed he does exist) is being villified. If he had won instead of lost and the father was here to complain that he wasn't being paid, would everyone's attitude be different? This kid knew what he was doing was illegal, as did the girl from years ago. So, what's with the attitude change?

FWIW, IMHO both kids were in the wrong. This boy needs to get himself some sort of menial, smelly job and work his tail off until that money is replaced.

I remember this thread with 19 year old "Irene" but she was not from the US so I am not sure if this is the thread you are referencing or not, Swampwitch. Regardless, an oldie but goodie.

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/bigdollar-steals-money-from-underage-girls.15693/

 

[maphesto]

I wonder what other account that Irene had.

 

[NASHVEGAS]

I wonder what other account that Irene had.

Bryan will probably have to answer the above as she must have been banned after that thread which had a 7 or 8 month half life.

I thought from memory (b4 just reading the thread) that when Irene turned 21, she may have come back and posted in another thread but probably just was recollecting/confusing a post she made in the subject thread. FTR, I have no recollection of Irene being banned. That said, it may be in the forum and I never knew or forgot.

 

[swampwitch]

I remember this thread with 19 year old "Irene" but she was not from the US so I am not sure if this is the thread you are referencing or not, Swampwitch. Regardless, an oldie but goodie.

https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/bigdollar-steals-money-from-underage-girls.15693/

Hmmmm. Maybe that's the thread, but if it is I'm remembering wrong (What? Me wrong? Horrors!). And I could have sworn I had made a post in whatever thread it was expressing no sympathy for the kid, but I can't find any record of such a post. Maybe it was an archived thread. Or, I'm insane.

That's prolly it.

 

[Tengil]

Reality check in order perhaps? The kid is not a criminal nor did he commit several acts of fraud. He opened a Neteller account and lost some money gambling online. Tough luck.

And you can get an extended Neteller account without providing docs, only thing you do is confirm the few cents that they deposit to your account. So if the parent(s) really wants to hunt down someone it should be Neteller.

At least he told his parents so he feels ashamed and the lost money hurts. So he probably learned his lesson and wont be gambling again (hopefully). He could be presented to some "horror" stories of addicted gamblers so he could see what it ultimately could lead to.

 

[P.V.]

As a parent of a 20 year old and an 8 year old (both girls) I can say I have been through my share with the older one.

I think fault lies on both parties.

What would happen if the same kid went into a bar, got served drinks, drove away and killed a family? Who's at fault here? The bar shouldn't get off, neither should the kid.

I feel the casino should be partly at fault, same as I would feel the bar should be partly at fault.

As a parent again...there is NO WAY to know what your children are doing at all times, (especially a 16 year old) and if someone here says "I know what my child does at all times, is lying their asses off".

If it was my daughter, she would be punished, things taken away, her life would be shit for a long while. BUT, I would also contact the casino to see how they could let this happen. I know it has been brought up before, but why don't casinos ask for ID BEFORE deposits?

I also agree with the other poster about children these days having more money than we did. It's not uncommon for a child under 18 to have a boat load of cash. My daughter for instance works 2 jobs, she has nice things, money in the bank, pays for her car payment every month/cell phone payment/etc. She is 20, but she has been doing this now since she could drive.

If in fact this happened then everyone involved is at fault. The minor for wondering off in uncharted water, the parent for allowing access to a savings account, Neteller for allowing a minor to deposit and transfer funds to a Casino and the Casino for not having a better verification procedure in place.


Several Casino's do have ID systems in place that flag whether a player when registering is of age but it's not 100% full proof, that's why many ask for ID documents.


You make a valid point, why don't they ask for pre-verification before play is allowed and only wait until a withdraw is made? I can assure you that if online gambling is legalized in the U.S. some sort of pre-verification process is going to have to take place, before you play, to convince lawmakers that every possible step is being taken not to allow minors to gamble.


With the above being said I'm suspect to the validity of this complaint without more supportive information.

 

[Simmo!]

Irrespective of the wrongs or rights of what the kid did, this does raise an interesting point, and that is that a casino has a responsibility to ensure minors don't gamble.

The fact that Sportingbet, or any casino for that matter, relies on Neteller or someone else to check age verification leaves them open to abuse. If the US Bill goes through, where Minors gambling is a big concern, this excuse won't cut it. They'd be jeopardising their licence.

The only way you can safely get this right is by asking for ID on each new deposit method at the time it is attached to an account, but name one casino that does that? Not even established bookies and lotteries do it to the best of my knowledge. It's obvious that that would be a huge barrier to getting signups, and unless they all do it together those that try it will suffer competitively, big time. That ain't gonna happen, so for age verification to be 100% effective there has to be a regulatory directive.

This issue is down to the regulators and licening jurisdictions to enforce IMO so I think they are the correct channel to complain through right now.

 

[rockycatt]

i found this if it's any help its googled

by Finance1o1.blogspot.com ® Member since:
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Best Answer - Chosen by Voters

In the United States, the new federal law says that: A credit card cannot be issued to someone under age 21, unless they have a co-signer (who is 21 or over), or can provide proof of a means to repay.
Source(s):
Financial Adviser

 

[kauphy]

How does a 16 year old get their hands on 1500 dollars to begin with. Second of all if the child has a checking account and they are under 18 years of age they would have to get their parents to co-sign their withdrawals or deposits. The bank does not give that kind of money to a minor without the parents permission. Did the bank even call you to tell you about this large withdrawal from your child's bank account?

i had a checking account when i was 16 without anything from my mom and dad. but that was along time ago so maybe its changed since then.

 

[jas2587]

by Finance1o1.blogspot.com ® Member since:
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In the United States, the new federal law says that: A credit card cannot be issued to someone under age 21, unless they have a co-signer (who is 21 or over), or can provide proof of a means to repay.
Source(s):
Financial Adviser

my daughter is 22 she has had a credit card since she was 17 she has a credit score of 745

much better then mine lol
she is so lucky

Cindy

 

[manofsteel]

The only way to know for sure what your options are as well as the possible consequences is to enlist the help of professional legal counsel. Doing so would likely cost you as much or more than the 1500 euro your son lost and there is no guarantee you would get your money back. As the other responses mentioned, you could even be at risk of this issue seriously backfiring on you.

In gambling terms, you would be continuing to gamble and that would called "chasing your losses," and that's never a good thing. That's life, you make money from good decisions and you can easily lose it all from one bad decision.

At least your son learned his lesson while he is living with you rather than blowing living expenses while living on his own. Perhaps the next step here is to get early help for his gambling problem rather than continuing to tangle with the casino.

I don't think the casino is in the wrong here. The only way the casino's could say they are doing everything they could do in their power to prevent underage gambling is to require identity verification before the first deposit for all users, but no casino I know of does this, so the casino is probably operating within the licensing requirements of its jurisdiction. As long as the casino is following those requirements, then I can't see the licensing jurisdiction jumping in to provide a positive resolution for you.

 

[P.V.]

The only way to know for sure what your options are as well as the possible consequences is to enlist the help of professional legal counsel. Doing so would likely cost you as much or more than the 1500 euro your son lost and there is no guarantee you would get your money back. As the other responses mentioned, you could even be at risk of this issue seriously backfiring on you.

In gambling terms, you would be continuing to gamble and that would called "chasing your losses," and that's never a good thing. That's life, you make money from good decisions and you can easily lose it all from one bad decision.

At least your son learned his lesson while he is living with you rather than blowing living expenses while living on his own. Perhaps the next step here is to get early help for his gambling problem rather than continuing to tangle with the casino.

I don't think the casino is in the wrong here. The only way the casino's could say they are doing everything they could do in their power to prevent underage gambling is to require identity verification before the first deposit for all users, but no casino I know of does this, so the casino is probably operating within the licensing requirements of its jurisdiction. As long as the casino is following those requirements, then I can't see the licensing jurisdiction jumping in to provide a positive resolution for you.

Well due to the restrictions here I can't upload the rules pertaining to minors @ Alderney, appears that my screen shot is too large. The Alderney licensing authority would look down on this via their website rules and the poster has a valid complaint. Now whether they would take action towards the Casino is a different story and of course a full investigation would need to take place as to whether this really happened.

Also Alderney does require pre-verification, if needed to verify a player.

 

[chayton]

There was a woman who won the evil player of the year award here on casinomeister a few years ago (it was Rhonda, if anyone remembers. I tried to find the thread but it's not where it's supposed to be) but part of her thing was that after getting caught out with a forged screenshot and a couple other things, she said it was her teenaged son (or daughter?) who actually did the gambling...and forged the screenshot etc.

I'm also pretty sure there was another case that was similar that also turned out to be a scam, but I don't remember the specifics.

I think it would be interesting to know how often the online casinos get a variation of that story? Someone hacked into my account and played my money, someone hacked into my account and made multiple deposits and lost, my son/daughter/friend used my account and lost my money. I'll bet there are quite a few, right?

I'm not saying the OP is scamming, I don't have any opinion one way or another about that. But if the OP is legit, it would really suck. Like the one time the dog really DID eat someone's homework, if you know what I mean.

 

[Casinomeister]

I wonder what other account that Irene had.

siegfriedB
120sam
ulf

Reality check in order perhaps? The kid is not a criminal nor did he commit several acts of fraud...

He may not be a criminal, but whenever you knowingly lie when filling out a contract - that's fraud.

You acknowledge and agree that by checking the “Agree” box when opening your Account, you agree to abide by the following terms and conditions (“Terms of Use”) concerning your use of the NETELLER Service.
...
2. General

2.1 It is a condition of membership that you agree to these Terms of Use, which form a legally binding contract once you become a Member.

...

4. Eligibility

4.1 In order to use the NETELLER Service, you must (i) be at least 18 years of age and of the age of majority, whichever is older, in your country of residence;


15.6 IN NO EVENT SHALL NETELLER, ITS AFFILIATES, HOLDING COMPANIES, SUBSIDIARIES, AGENTS OR SUBCONTRACTORS BE LIABLE TO YOU OR ANY THIRD PARTY FOR ANY INDIRECT, SPECIAL, CONSEQUENTIAL, PUNITIVE, EXEMPLARY OR INCIDENTAL DAMAGES, WHETHER BASED ON NEGLIGENCE, WILFUL MISCONDUCT, TORT, CONTRACT (INCLUDING WITHOUT LIMITATION FUNDAMENTAL BREACH OR BREACH OF A FUNDAMENTAL TERM) OR ANY OTHER THEORY OF LAW, OR FOR ANY DAMAGES FOR LOSS OF DATA, LOSS OF INCOME, FAILURE TO REALISE EXPECTED REVENUES OR SAVINGS, LOSS OF PROFITS OR ANY ECONOMIC OR PECUNIARY LOSS

So the teenager is SOL there. You don't lie when filling out a form like this.

It still boggles the mind that he was able to get away with this since Neteller does do their due diligence. I'll check with Neteller to see what's up with that.

It just seems that there is more to this story than what meets the eye.

 

[moraaltjedd]

Dear all,

Thanks for your opinions and thoughts on this matter - I do really appreciate all of them.
I have already punished my son for his actions, for example, I won't give him access to the computer for the coming weeks.

Of course I understand that it's also the responsibility of my son for the money that is lost. But I just tried to make clear that I don't understand how he could gambled this all away. And that this website says Neteller is reliable.
THEY accepted the money of my son. And THEY keep the money: and they know it's underage money.

It's just hard for me as a parent to understand this. And maybe some of you are right, and is this just a lesson for my son. But when I was writing this complaint my opinion was that a casino shouldn't accept funds of an underage person, and that opinion hasn't changed since then.

 

[NASHVEGAS]

Dear all,

Thanks for your opinions and thoughts on this matter - I do really appreciate all of them.
I have already punished my son for his actions, for example, I won't give him access to the computer for the coming weeks.

Of course I understand that it's also the responsibility of my son for the money that is lost. But I just tried to make clear that I don't understand how he could gambled this all away. And that this website says Neteller is reliable.
THEY accepted the money of my son. And THEY keep the money: and they know it's underage money.
It's just hard for me as a parent to understand this. And maybe some of you are right, and is this just a lesson for my son. But when I was writing this complaint my opinion was that a casino shouldn't accept funds of an underage person, and that opinion hasn't changed since then.

"and they know it's underage money."

Been a few days since I read the initial posts so could you please refresh my memory on if the casino et al has unequivocally acknowledged and/or validated that the wager was in fact underaged. Thanks!