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MG Blackjack

Discussion in 'Online Casinos' started by ftg, Jun 2, 2004.

    Jun 2, 2004
  1. ftg

    ftg Banned User - bogus claim - violation of <a href="

    I am playing a lot of bj in various software platform, namely Boss, RTG and MG.

    I find Boss and RTG is normal although it could be very streaky but that's gambling/variance.

    However for MG's bj, while I believe they do deal a fair game in flat-betting (I have been up and down quite a bit in autoplay), abnormal hands do happens when I am incresing my bet in a recorvery series.

    In my opinion, MG's bj do have a strategy to penalty those who use short of negative progression (don't put me wrong, I am not saying I can win by negative progression but I have never be able to win using a mild negative progression but for RTG and BOSS, sometimes it works but sometimes it not.) For example, deal second could be employed whenever the software detects
    1. the last hands is a loss for player
    2. the currcent bet size is = or > the last bet.

    In this way, the dealer can secure a win for the players while others using flat-betting still find the game fair.

    This is what I am experiencing for months: whenever (100%) I have higher bets, the win/loss ratio decrease dramatically to at least 1:3.

    Anyone has similar experience?

    Anyone can suggest how to test whether the software is performing something like that?
  2. Jun 2, 2004
  3. Clayman

    Clayman Dormant account

    Pennsylvania, USA
    I just keep track of bj/w/l/t by each different bet size. In 220 hands betting $80 or more, I have 13 BJ's, 100 wins, 86 losses & 21 ties. Which is alot better than expected. In fact, I have a better record on bets = or > $14 than I do on bets < $14. So I don't worry about it.

    You have to realize too that all betting systems are equally worthless.
  4. Jun 2, 2004
  5. ftg

    ftg Banned User - bogus claim - violation of <a href="

    The reason why I believe this is what is happening is I have just double checked my records, my recent loss of 10 or more hands in a straight all happened when I am increasing my bet size. I have never experienced such loss streak when I am flat-betting. Is it a co-incidence? No. I don't think so.
  6. Jun 2, 2004
  7. Clayman

    Clayman Dormant account

    Pennsylvania, USA
    Yes it's a coincidence. I've experienced 23 "no win" streaks of 10 in a row, 18 @ 11, 8 @12, 7 @13, 2 @14, 1 @15, 1@ 16 & 1 @17. And I mostly flat-bet.

    So you better get used to it. They will happen.
  8. Jun 2, 2004
  9. ftg

    ftg Banned User - bogus claim - violation of <a href="

    I have such lossing streaks experience too in other RTG and Boss and Wagerlogic casinos. But when I increase bet size (in the matter of the next 10 - 40 hands), sometimes it will have more loss than wins and sometime the opposite.

    But with MG, it ALWAYS happens the next 10-40 hands are loss >>>>>> wins. and never wins > loss.

    I mean some betting patterns are being penalized once its reconized. I really means that the behaviour is so strange in MG's BJ. (Vegas Strip BJ as its lowest HA.)

    Perhaps I am not accurate in what I am saying but I don't trust MG.
  10. Jun 2, 2004
  11. ftg

    ftg Banned User - bogus claim - violation of <a href="

    Perhaps I am really the unlucky one.

    Just for the last few days, talking about no-win streak, I have

    1@10, 6@11, 1@14, 1@15.

    Not to mention more than 7@9.

    This is a sample of less than 8000 hands.

    Many sessions are with sd of 2.5-3.0

    I am considering to quite all MG casinos thought some of them really offer good weekly bonus.
  12. Jun 3, 2004
  13. bethug

    bethug Banned User - Winner of the "<a href="http://www.c

    I do very well at rtg casinos. But stick to the good ones
  14. Jun 3, 2004
  15. ShadyPlayer22

    ShadyPlayer22 Dormant account

    east coast USA
    rtg casinos seem fair enough. losing streaks do happen. ive lost 10 hands in a row many times. i remember recently on one casino I won or tied 20 times in a row which increased my balance from $400 to around $3500. streaks happen.

    If you want to be absolutely certain you are being dealt random fair hands, play with LIVE dealers online.

    a few places are goldenpalace.com, carnival casino.com, casinowebcam.com or clubdicecasino.com
  16. Jun 3, 2004
  17. ShadyPlayer22

    ShadyPlayer22 Dormant account

    east coast USA
    sigh, sorry im not paying attention to what im writing :p

    i meant MG seems fair enough not rtg. Rtg sucks big donkey for me anyway.
  18. Jun 3, 2004
  19. ftg

    ftg Banned User - bogus claim - violation of <a href="

    What's your experience with MG?
  20. Jun 3, 2004
  21. ShadyPlayer22

    ShadyPlayer22 Dormant account

    east coast USA
    i meant MG software seems fair enough NOT RTG. I corrected myself.

    For instance today, I played at Jupiter Club. Deposited $50 and cashed in with $1000.

    I didnt count my winning or losing hands, but If I would have taken a guess Id say I won about 3/4's of the hands today.

    I like MG software above any other.
  22. Jun 3, 2004
  23. jpm

    jpm Dormant account

    :lolup: LMAO, how do you really feel??
  24. Jun 4, 2004
  25. sw2003

    sw2003 Dormant account

    somewhere :)
    Personally I find MG's blackjack games sort of weird! Note that I did not say that they cheat or anything like that. It is just that whenever you start the game, there is a tendency for the player to lose a lot of the hands, say 9 times out of 10, straight away. It will of course even out in the long run. But in the short term at the beginning you can suffer quite a bit of losses. If you check the statistics, you will find that the dealer's first card is a 10 constitutes a ridiculous percentage of 40%--60% whereas the theoretical expected value should be at 30.769%. The first card is an Ace can also goes up to as high as 44% when the theoretical value in the long run is 7.69%. This happens a lot, to me anyway. You would expect that roughly half the time at the beginning you would win quite a bit first and half the time you would suffer quite a bit of losses first. I find that this is not the case. Probably 9 times out of 10 you will lose a lot first and it takes a long while before the player has a chance to be able to make up some lost ground.

    I don't know if it is designed so that players who bet too big for their bankroll will go bankrupt before they have a chance to pull even? The game is and should of course be fair in the long run. At least I think it is fair in the long run. I mean why not? Why not design a software so that it will kill all the people with too small a bankroll for their bet? It is totally undetectable, at least it is so when you don't know what to look for, because it is fair in the long run. People will always blame themselves or be blamed for using too large bets while all the time unaware that the software is exploiting their careless bet size and helping them to bankrupt themselves.

    This is just my two cent worth of a thought based on time spent playing too many MG blackjack!
  26. Jun 4, 2004
  27. GrandMaster

    GrandMaster Ueber Meister CAG

    Mathematician by day, online gambler by night.
    Save you playcheck logs in a spreadsheet. I am happy to analyze them to verify the percentages you claim.
  28. Jun 4, 2004
  29. Clayman

    Clayman Dormant account

    Pennsylvania, USA
    If a player bets too big for his bankroll, he will go bust with completely fair software and have no one to blame but himself.

    Of course, what is "too big" is open for debate. How much do you like to bet on how big of an opening bankroll?

    Take Grandmaster up on his offer to analyze your logs - we may all learn something!
  30. Jun 4, 2004
  31. DeMango

    DeMango Dormant account

    Postal Clerk, Residential Contractor
    Englewood, FL USA
    One tenth of one percent is fairly safe. Set your session risk of ruin at 33%.
  32. Jun 4, 2004
  33. ftg

    ftg Banned User - bogus claim - violation of <a href="

    I really find your posting useful and informative. And I do believe MG is fair in some situation.

    My first post actually addressed the "intelligence" the software built in to penalize those with some kind of patterns. I do find I contineously be penalized whenever I increase and keep increasing my bet size for the next couple of bets after a loss. (note that it's a couple of bets.)

    This is also true for Baccarat.

    Today I just finished a session of Baccarat with the following results:
    Player 348
    Banker 300
    Tie 53

    which means very normal. However let's look at closely the last 80 hands.

    I am to blam myself as I became crazy at the last 80 hands betting only on Banker and the result is

    Player 54
    Banker 22
    Tie 4

    The last 80 hands is 3.9 sd below expection which means 1 in 20K event.

    Notice that I have many example of this WHENEVER I increase (and continueouly increasing) bets in a lossing situation, no matter in Baccarat or in BJ.

    Notice also whenever I am not betting like that (or varying bet size continueously up and down), that kind of SD have never happened.
  34. Jun 4, 2004
  35. GrandMaster

    GrandMaster Ueber Meister CAG

    Mathematician by day, online gambler by night.
    I just thought about it and realised that I won't be able to extract the dealer's up card from the logs, so you will have to keep track of this yourself, but I can certainly look at losing streaks at the beginning of the sessions.
  36. Jun 5, 2004
  37. Clayman

    Clayman Dormant account

    Pennsylvania, USA
    Thanks for your kind words.

    I don't really know what to tell you except that I doubt whatever it is your going thru will continue forever.
    Notwithstanding your last 80 hands at baccarat, which, btw, really were pretty unlucky to say the least, although 80 hands isn't alot of hands to draw a "rigged" conclusion from (at least in this case) , I find it difficult to accurately define the length of "increasing bets" or when they start, etc. In other words, you need to define your hypthesis a little more precisely.
    You say stuff like "my recent loss of 10 or more hands in a straight all happened when I am increasing my bet size. I have never experienced such loss streak when I am flat-betting." Did you actually increase your bet each and every hand of those 10 hands in a row? When you say "But with MG, when I increase bet size, it ALWAYS happens the next 10-40 hands are loss >>>>>> wins. and never wins > loss.", I really wouldn't know how to verify that if I had your logs. Except I'm pretty sure I could find a streak where the next 10 thru 40 hands aren't ALWAYS loss > wins after an increased bet.
    If you have logs, we can analyze them as best we can.
    In the mean time, since you think the software is fair when you flat-bet, maybe do more flat-betting and fewer negative progressions or at least negative progressions of fewer hands.
    Overall, while it may seem like the software is recognizing betting patterns, I still tend to doubt it since I win alot of bets when I increase my bet with MG.
    And remember, at least in BJ, you ARE supposed to lose 4% more hands than you win. You only win like 43% of the hands, so don't expect it.
  38. Jun 5, 2004
  39. ftg

    ftg Banned User - bogus claim - violation of <a href="

    This has been continue up to now for months. Whenever I lost patience and increasing bets, the win/loss pattern will always like that:


    Between losse is mostly a signle win.

    For my Baccarat reulsts, the last few hands:

    The unlucky part is I have quite a lot of similar examples in MG's VSBJ and Baccarat.

    In other software platform, with the same playing strategy, I did hit badly sometimes but sometimes I do win but with MG, no, it's a suicide.

    Got to leave. will be back and continue some hours later.
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2004

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