Heads Up on using any Credit Card to Deposit

Hey, I own a gift shop where I live and I just received an email about new regulations regarding cards, prepaid and gifts. I don't mind copying and pasting the entire email from Chase if it is ok to do it here. Will Brian or Max let me know if it is ok? It is interesting and confusing. We use to have our own personal gift cards to load at the store through Chase so this is probably why I received it. Something to do with FinCEN, or something like that. I will await to hear from Brian or Max, or I don't mind forwarding the email to them so they can decipher it.

FinCen is a department of the Treasury, Financial Crimes Enforcement Network responsible for "writing and coordinating the enforcement of anti-money laundering rules for more than 100,000 banks, credit unions, money services businesses (MSBs), insurance companies, securities brokers, casinos, mutual funds, precious metal dealers, and other financial institutions that face the risk of being used by criminals to support enterprises ranging from drug cartels, mortgage fraud rings, terrorist finance networks, and much more."
 
Letter

Yes, they were talking about anti money laundering. From what I read an individual can only get $2000.00 per day on a card or it is flagged. Also, from what I read, pertinent information has to be maintained on each person such as address, license, social security, etc. I think I will forward the letter to Max or Brian and then if they want to post it they can. Thanks for explaining what that group does.
 
Maybe I'm reaching, but could this all be related to the gov seeking greater 'transparency' in prepaid and CC use.... links posted HERE a couple years ago.
 
Yes, they were talking about anti money laundering. From what I read an individual can only get $2000.00 per day on a card or it is flagged. Also, from what I read, pertinent information has to be maintained on each person such as address, license, social security, etc. I think I will forward the letter to Max or Brian and then if they want to post it they can. Thanks for explaining what that group does.

This seems to be the main thrust of this. Gift cards can be anonymous, bought as you would buy anything else in a shop, and if bought with cash, NO personal details of the purchaser can be traced from the transaction. Even if bought with a card, the shop knows the card details, but nothing much else about the purchaser.

This seems quite an extreme measure compared to how these pre-pay services work here in the UK. If such instruments are bought with cash, it is impossible to trace them back through the cash purchase and to the source of the cash, as all the shop checks for is whether the cash is genuine at the point of purchase, and only if the shop has CCTV would they have so much as an image of the purchaser.

The big supermarkets sell many of these gift cards and other pre-pay service. The check out staff have to work as fast as they can to deal with the shoppers in a timely manner, if the instrument used for the purchase is genuine, such as a card accepted by the chip and pin terminal, or cash that is not detected as forged when placed under the UV light scanner, no further checks are needed. I can't imagine supermarkets having to see ID and take down name, address, national insurance number, etc just because you bought a £10 phone top-up, or £50 Amazon gift card.
I don't think we have too many cases where people buy £1000+ worth of gift card in a single transaction either, so a limit equivalent to $2000 per day would not be an issue, and in any case, it could easily be circumvented by getting the equivalent of $1500 at each of the 4 main supermarkets, as well as even more at numerous other local shops. No one shop would see the big picture, and this could easily turn out to be a problem in the US unless the details not only have to be taken and kept, but immediately forwarded to a central database, which in turn has to forward everything back out to EVERY shop where the same customer might buy more pre-pay cards on the same day.

It still seems as though the enforcement and regulations are being directed at the merchants, not the individual customers.

To properly police such a system in real time would need a database at federal level, with all stores, however small, selling any kind of pre-pay product being required to have a real time link to this database, and use Social Security numbers as the unique identifier to track an individual's total pre-pay purchases at the federal level.

How will this go down with the voters? It will affect EVERYBODY, not just online gamblers and terrorists.
 
vinylweatherman

I know what you mean about the trouble but where I live there are stores/pharmacies called CVS and when you buy a money order there you now have to show your drivers license and they scan it. This whole world is getting ridiculous with this stuff.
 
Letter from Chase

Ok...here is the letter I received to my business email address. I just copied and am going to try and paste it here. Maybe some of you that know how to decipher all of this can give us the bottom line. Brian or Max...if this shouldn't be here just delete it =) I am taking out my business email address ouf of the header just for my own benefit. Thank you...

New Legal Rules Applicable to Gift Cards & Other Prepaid Card Programs
1 recipientsCC: recipientsYou More
BCC: recipientsYou Show Details FROM:Chase Paymentech TO:
Message flagged Friday, March 9, 2012 3:35 PM




March 9, 2012

New Legal Rules Applicable to
Gift Cards and Other Prepaid Card Programs
Dear Valued Customer,

Thank you for trusting Chase Paymentech to provide your company with gift card services.

It is our goal to deliver exceptional service, which includes sharing with you the most up-to-date information concerning laws that could affect your gift card program.
OVERVIEW
On July 29, 2011, the U.S. Department of the Treasury’s Financial Crimes Enforcement Network (FinCEN) issued new anti-money laundering rules that are likely to affect you. These rules govern “prepaid access” and are designed to prevent the use of prepaid products (including gift cards) for money-laundering.

All merchants who issue their own gift cards (either directly or through a third-party vendor) and merchants who sell or reload other company’s gift cards are impacted by the rules.

Your specific obligations under these rules will depend upon, among other things:
1.the amount of gift cards you sell to any one person,
2.the amount of value that can be “associated” with any one card during a one day period,
3.whether you allow gift cards to be redeemed for cash, and
4.whether your gift cards are deemed “closed loop” cards
FinCEN has announced that it will begin enforcing these rules after March 31, 2012, so all gift card merchants will need to take action to comply by that date.
What obligations apply?
The most significant obligations under the rule are applicable to “providers of prepaid access” and “sellers of prepaid access” (as those terms are defined in the rules). However, certain obligations apply to all gift card issuers wishing to avoid falling within the definition of a “provider” or “seller” under the rule. (See below for the respective obligations of “providers” and “sellers” under the rules.)

Who is a “provider” under the rules?
A “provider” is a person who exercises principal oversight and control over a covered “prepaid program.” These terms are defined broadly and would generally include any merchant issuing gift cards, unless the merchant’s gift card program falls within an exemption to the rule.

The primary exemption from this definition would apply only if a merchant’s card program meets all three of the following requirements:
1.All of the gift cards are “closed loop” (defined as gift cards that can be used only for goods or services involving a defined merchant or location or set of affiliated locations, such as a specific merchant or merchant chain, or a college campus);
2.No card can have more than $2,000 maximum value “associated” with it on any day, meaning the card’s balance at the beginning of the day plus any loads made that day (regardless of whether any funds are spent) cannot exceed $2,000, and
3.Cards cannot be redeemed, in whole or in part, for cash (beyond any specific dollaramount that might be required by state law).
Unless the foregoing exemption or another exemption applies, a gift card issuer will generally be treated as a “provider” under the rules, and will be subject to the obligations described below.

Who is a “seller” under the rules?
There are two ways a gift card merchant can be a “seller” under the rules.

First, a gift card merchant is a “seller” if it:
1.sells any type(s) of prepaid cards (even phone cards or closed loop gift cards under $2,000) having an combined value of more than $10,000 to any one person during any one day, and
2.has not implemented policies and procedures reasonably adapted to prevent such sales
However, there is an exception for business-to-business bulk sales. A merchant is not a “seller” if it is only selling cards in excess of $10,000 in a day to another business for further distribution or sale to end users/consumers by that business.

Second, if a merchant sells a prepaid card that does not fall within the exemption for “closed loop cards” having less than $2,000 maximum associated value in a day (and that cannot be redeemed for cash), and such cards can be used before personal information about the purchaser is collected by the merchant and verified in accordance with the rules, the merchant is a “seller” (in addition to likely being a “provider”).
What must a merchant do if it is a “provider” or a “seller”?
Merchants that are “providers” or “sellers” under the rules must:
1.Develop, implement and maintain an anti-money laundering compliance program.
2.Collect and retain identifying information about a person who purchases or reloads a prepaid card (including name, address, date of birth, and identification number), and verify that person’s identity.
3.Monitor and report to FinCEN any suspicious activity or transactions over $2,000 relevant to a possible violation of law or regulation.
4.Comply with other FinCEN rules that apply to money services businesses (MSBs)
5.“Providers” must also register as an MSB with FinCEN and retain access to certain records related to prepaid access transaction (including detailed transactional information).
6.“Sellers” must also collect and retain identifying information about a person who obtains any type(s) of prepaid access having a combined value in excess of $10,000 in a day (including name, address, date of birth, and identification number), and verify that person’s identity.
How can a merchant avoid being a “provider” or a “seller”?
First, for its own gift cards, the merchant must ensure that its gift cards are truly “closed loop,” that not more than $2,000 maximum value can be associated with the card on any day, as described above, and that cards cannot be redeemed for cash (except as specifically required by law).

Second, where a merchant sells or reloads other companies’ gift cards and open loop prepaid cards, the merchant must not sell or reload cards under any covered “prepaid programs” that can be used before customer identification and verification are performed. Check with the cards’ issuers to confirm.

Third, the merchant must not sell any prepaid cards having a combined value in excess of $10,000 to any single person during any one day. The merchant must also implement policies and procedures reasonably adapted to prevent such sales. These policies and procedures must be risk-based and appropriate to the merchant, taking into account facts such as its typical customers, its location(s), and its volume of prepaid access sales.
Resources
This notice provides only general information and should not be construed as legal advice. Merchants are encouraged to consult with their legal counsel for specific advice and to ensure compliance under the rules. For more information, we recommend the following websites:
•FinCEN’s press release regarding the prepaid access rules (with a link to the rules text):
You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

•FinCEN’s notice on its extension of the compliance date for the rules:
You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

•FinCEN’s FAQs on the prepaid access rules:
You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

•FinCEN’s webinar on the prepaid access rules:
You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

If you have questions or need more information on this topic, please contact your Account Executive. You are a valued customer, and we truly appreciate the opportunity to service your payment processing needs.


Sincerely,



Daniel J. Charron
Executive Vice President, Client Services
Chase Paymentech





Copyright & Privacy Policy Info: Chase Paymentech | Privacy Policy | Terms of Use Mgd
® Copyright 2012, Chase Paymentech All Rights Reserved.






Reply to:
Reply to Chase Paymentech
Reply to Chase Paymentech Send
 
Long story short, for your own personal gift cards. The value of the gift card cannot exceed $2,000 at any time. Otherwise you'll need to collect data on who they are and basically get there whole backstory story.
If you sell other people's gift cards or phone cards, you can't sell more than $10,000 per day to them. Unless if you know the card you sold to them will require them to collect personally identifiable information about them before they can use it.
So they basically want retailers to implement policies that would try to throttle them from buying more than $10,000 of other people's gift cards or $2,000 of there own gift cards within a day period. It's not saying that gift cards aren't going to be sold for more than that, but basically put into registers to say hey. You've now sold $2,000 or $10,000, you can't sell anymore.
 
I know what you mean about the trouble but where I live there are stores/pharmacies called CVS and when you buy a money order there you now have to show your drivers license and they scan it. This whole world is getting ridiculous with this stuff.

A while back, I thought I would try out UKash. There was no taking down of my details, just handing over the cash and getting the voucher. It uses the same prepay terminal used for many other things, such as buying electricity and gas credits, phone topups, and even paying some utility bills. The system is designed for the lower end of society where many do not have full bank accounts, or even any kind of credit rating that would allow them to receive services on credit with a monthly or quarterly bill. Ukash in particular is designed for online payments where the customer does not have even a debit card, or does not want to use one for fear it's details will be compromised in doing so. UKash is available in denominations up to £150, although you can get £150 worth from as many places as you care to visit without arousing undue suspicion.

It is possible that the UK will tighten up procedures, but with no ID card system in place, and the service aimed at the more excluded parts of society, going too far will break the system and it will no longer be helping those it was designed to.

Whether UKash is accepted by a particular merchant is down to Ukash. If they decide a certain product or service is not appropriate, they can deny merchant accounts to the sellers of such services, and they will be unable to accept Ukash as a form of payment. No different really to how card work. Online gambling sites can only take deposits if they can find a processor willing and able to bend or break the rules enough to get them through. The attitude for vetting of merchants seems to be "OK until proven otherwise", thus a fake bike shop in Dubai can get a merchant descriptor and account even though it does not actually exist. Even when it starts selling thousands of dollars worth of cycling equipment to individual US customers no-one at the bank seems to think this is anything other than a very successful cycle shop.

Maybe this is what is about to change, and now in order to get a merchant account the business will have to prove that it exists, and supplies the range of products that it's transaction codes indicate. There may also be monitoring of the levels of activity on the merchant account so that if transactions seem at odds with the type of product or service being supplied, further checks will be made.

This will cost the banks a fair bit, which is probably why they didn't do this until they had been forced to by these new regulations.
 
Ok...here is the letter I received to my business email address. I just copied and am going to try and paste it here. Maybe some of you that know how to decipher all of this can give us the bottom line. Brian or Max...if this shouldn't be here just delete it =) I am taking out my business email address ouf of the header just for my own benefit. Thank you...

New Legal Rules Applicable to Gift Cards & Other Prepaid Card Programs
1 recipientsCC: recipientsYou More
BCC: recipientsYou Show Details FROM:Chase Paymentech TO:
Message flagged Friday, March 9, 2012 3:35 PM




March 9, 2012

New Legal Rules Applicable to
Gift Cards and Other Prepaid Card Programs
Dear Valued Customer,

Thank you for trusting Chase Paymentech to provide your company with gift card services.

It is our goal to deliver exceptional service, which includes sharing with you the most up-to-date information concerning laws that could affect your gift card program.
OVERVIEW
On July 29, 2011, the U.S. Department of the Treasury’s Financial Crimes Enforcement Network (FinCEN) issued new anti-money laundering rules that are likely to affect you. These rules govern “prepaid access” and are designed to prevent the use of prepaid products (including gift cards) for money-laundering.

All merchants who issue their own gift cards (either directly or through a third-party vendor) and merchants who sell or reload other company’s gift cards are impacted by the rules.

Your specific obligations under these rules will depend upon, among other things:
1.the amount of gift cards you sell to any one person,
2.the amount of value that can be “associated” with any one card during a one day period,
3.whether you allow gift cards to be redeemed for cash, and
4.whether your gift cards are deemed “closed loop” cards
FinCEN has announced that it will begin enforcing these rules after March 31, 2012, so all gift card merchants will need to take action to comply by that date.
What obligations apply?
The most significant obligations under the rule are applicable to “providers of prepaid access” and “sellers of prepaid access” (as those terms are defined in the rules). However, certain obligations apply to all gift card issuers wishing to avoid falling within the definition of a “provider” or “seller” under the rule. (See below for the respective obligations of “providers” and “sellers” under the rules.)

Who is a “provider” under the rules?
A “provider” is a person who exercises principal oversight and control over a covered “prepaid program.” These terms are defined broadly and would generally include any merchant issuing gift cards, unless the merchant’s gift card program falls within an exemption to the rule.

The primary exemption from this definition would apply only if a merchant’s card program meets all three of the following requirements:
1.All of the gift cards are “closed loop” (defined as gift cards that can be used only for goods or services involving a defined merchant or location or set of affiliated locations, such as a specific merchant or merchant chain, or a college campus);
2.No card can have more than $2,000 maximum value “associated” with it on any day, meaning the card’s balance at the beginning of the day plus any loads made that day (regardless of whether any funds are spent) cannot exceed $2,000, and
3.Cards cannot be redeemed, in whole or in part, for cash (beyond any specific dollaramount that might be required by state law).
Unless the foregoing exemption or another exemption applies, a gift card issuer will generally be treated as a “provider” under the rules, and will be subject to the obligations described below.

Who is a “seller” under the rules?
There are two ways a gift card merchant can be a “seller” under the rules.

First, a gift card merchant is a “seller” if it:
1.sells any type(s) of prepaid cards (even phone cards or closed loop gift cards under $2,000) having an combined value of more than $10,000 to any one person during any one day, and
2.has not implemented policies and procedures reasonably adapted to prevent such sales
However, there is an exception for business-to-business bulk sales. A merchant is not a “seller” if it is only selling cards in excess of $10,000 in a day to another business for further distribution or sale to end users/consumers by that business.

Second, if a merchant sells a prepaid card that does not fall within the exemption for “closed loop cards” having less than $2,000 maximum associated value in a day (and that cannot be redeemed for cash), and such cards can be used before personal information about the purchaser is collected by the merchant and verified in accordance with the rules, the merchant is a “seller” (in addition to likely being a “provider”).
What must a merchant do if it is a “provider” or a “seller”?
Merchants that are “providers” or “sellers” under the rules must:
1.Develop, implement and maintain an anti-money laundering compliance program.
2.Collect and retain identifying information about a person who purchases or reloads a prepaid card (including name, address, date of birth, and identification number), and verify that person’s identity.
3.Monitor and report to FinCEN any suspicious activity or transactions over $2,000 relevant to a possible violation of law or regulation.
4.Comply with other FinCEN rules that apply to money services businesses (MSBs)
5.“Providers” must also register as an MSB with FinCEN and retain access to certain records related to prepaid access transaction (including detailed transactional information).
6.“Sellers” must also collect and retain identifying information about a person who obtains any type(s) of prepaid access having a combined value in excess of $10,000 in a day (including name, address, date of birth, and identification number), and verify that person’s identity.
How can a merchant avoid being a “provider” or a “seller”?
First, for its own gift cards, the merchant must ensure that its gift cards are truly “closed loop,” that not more than $2,000 maximum value can be associated with the card on any day, as described above, and that cards cannot be redeemed for cash (except as specifically required by law).

Second, where a merchant sells or reloads other companies’ gift cards and open loop prepaid cards, the merchant must not sell or reload cards under any covered “prepaid programs” that can be used before customer identification and verification are performed. Check with the cards’ issuers to confirm.

Third, the merchant must not sell any prepaid cards having a combined value in excess of $10,000 to any single person during any one day. The merchant must also implement policies and procedures reasonably adapted to prevent such sales. These policies and procedures must be risk-based and appropriate to the merchant, taking into account facts such as its typical customers, its location(s), and its volume of prepaid access sales.
Resources
This notice provides only general information and should not be construed as legal advice. Merchants are encouraged to consult with their legal counsel for specific advice and to ensure compliance under the rules. For more information, we recommend the following websites:
•FinCEN’s press release regarding the prepaid access rules (with a link to the rules text):
You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

•FinCEN’s notice on its extension of the compliance date for the rules:
You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

•FinCEN’s FAQs on the prepaid access rules:
You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

•FinCEN’s webinar on the prepaid access rules:
You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.

If you have questions or need more information on this topic, please contact your Account Executive. You are a valued customer, and we truly appreciate the opportunity to service your payment processing needs.


Sincerely,



Daniel J. Charron
Executive Vice President, Client Services
Chase Paymentech





Copyright & Privacy Policy Info: Chase Paymentech | Privacy Policy | Terms of Use Mgd
® Copyright 2012, Chase Paymentech All Rights Reserved.






Reply to:
Reply to Chase Paymentech
Reply to Chase Paymentech Send

The primary exemption from this definition would apply only if a merchant’s card program meets all three of the following requirements:
1.All of the gift cards are “closed loop” (defined as gift cards that can be used only for goods or services involving a defined merchant or location or set of affiliated locations, such as a specific merchant or merchant chain, or a college campus);
2.No card can have more than $2,000 maximum value “associated” with it on any day, meaning the card’s balance at the beginning of the day plus any loads made that day (regardless of whether any funds are spent) cannot exceed $2,000, and
3.Cards cannot be redeemed, in whole or in part, for cash (beyond any specific dollaramount that might be required by state law).
Unless the foregoing exemption or another exemption applies, a gift card issuer will generally be treated as a “provider” under the rules, and will be subject to the obligations described below

If the merchant sells gift cards for a certain restaurant or business(such as target, etc) they are exempt as land as no card has a maximum value of $2000.00 or more and the card cannot be redeemed for cash. Meaning they are exempt from the regulation.

the entire point of the email is that allowing cards to be used for "money laundering" is illegal and to avoid money laudering the card shouldn't be allowed to redeemed for cash or used for illegal purposes. Use of the card for online gambling transactions could be considered money laudering when you look at recent DOJ prosecutions of processors and online gambling website owners.

In other words, they are tightening the use of pre-paid and gift cards.

All of this follows suit will the current buzz on the Bankers Forum, specifically, due dilligence, and following Reg GG rules as well as Reg E and ZZ
 
footdr

Footdr I think you are right about this. I believe this is just another way to thwart online gaming. I also believe this is to ready the US for up and coming legalized online gaming. Think about it, if they disuade all of the avenues to deposit the player gets more and more distraught to the point you don't want to go to the trouble to try and find a way to deposit. Then, if the US opens the market players would be more apt to play at these places IMO. I know recently 3D went through a period where it was next to impossible for a US player to deposit and the one place you could do it through had a $500 a week limit. I went from gold status to now I am silver ***....big difference on the loyalty platform. :( Now there is another option so I have to start the climb again.
 
Footdr I think you are right about this. I believe this is just another way to thwart online gaming. I also believe this is to ready the US for up and coming legalized online gaming. Think about it, if they disuade all of the avenues to deposit the player gets more and more distraught to the point you don't want to go to the trouble to try and find a way to deposit. Then, if the US opens the market players would be more apt to play at these places IMO. I know recently 3D went through a period where it was next to impossible for a US player to deposit and the one place you could do it through had a $500 a week limit. I went from gold status to now I am silver ***....big difference on the loyalty platform. :( Now there is another option so I have to start the climb again.
The u.s. is far from legalizing online gambling at websites based overseas and we do not know what u.s. based legalized gambling will be or if it will include slots and be RNG based. I personally don't want them to legalize u.s. gambling unless it includes the current websites/casino groups we currently play. I fear it will end up being a fiasco, IRS wise. I trust the casinos we currently play more than I do the u.s. government.
 
Footdr I think you are right about this. I believe this is just another way to thwart online gaming. I also believe this is to ready the US for up and coming legalized online gaming. Think about it, if they disuade all of the avenues to deposit the player gets more and more distraught to the point you don't want to go to the trouble to try and find a way to deposit. Then, if the US opens the market players would be more apt to play at these places IMO. I know recently 3D went through a period where it was next to impossible for a US player to deposit and the one place you could do it through had a $500 a week limit. I went from gold status to now I am silver ***....big difference on the loyalty platform. :( Now there is another option so I have to start the climb again.

A rather risky way too.

This measure affects EVERYBODY, not the minority who still struggle to gamble online despite all the current obstacles.

People who never gamble online, don't know anybody who does, and believes it is sinful in any case, are going to ask WHY these measures have been brought in that require them to hand over all these personal details to the damn SHOPKEEPER! Such people will see no benefit to imposing these new rules, but WILL see them as more "big brother" intrusion by private companies (the shops), as well as the state.

The official line makes NO mention of this being a measure to stem the flow of US money out of the country and into gambling websites, and will affect ALL major users of such pre-pay services.

It may even get mistaken for the underhand workings of the film and music industry, after their failure to get SOPA through, they attack the means to purchase content through the internet from non-US based suppliers.


In practice, it won't work anyway, as most online players do not deposit anything like $2000 per day. The keeping of transaction records is already being done, so this just formalizes what they are already doing. Having this written down though could make non-gamblers think that it is not enough for the shops to take down their details, but the gift card company now has to go through every transaction in detail. Gift cards are often used to prevent too much personal information being exchanged between customer and company, otherwise they would just use their debit or credit cards, and not have to pay reload fees, etc.

Neteller advertise their Net+ card as a means to make payments more securely because your own banking or card information is not shared with the merchant, and with the desktop virtual Net+ card, the card number generated only works once, so the merchant CANNOT "double dip", or take an additional charge later just because they have the information from the first purchase.
 
While we in the gambling community tend to take these regulations 'personally', from what I've been reading they are also directed toward keeping money in the states. So much money is sent out of state 'home' to folks in other countries, etc. Buy up a bunch of cards come payday and send 'em to 'momma'.... But the regulations, the tweaking of them, and renewed concentration on enforcing them will probably impact those who try to use them for gambling online.

It's freaking mess, is what it is.
 
While we in the gambling community tend to take these regulations 'personally', from what I've been reading they are also directed toward keeping money in the states. So much money is sent out of state 'home' to folks in other countries, etc. Buy up a bunch of cards come payday and send 'em to 'momma'.... But the regulations, the tweaking of them, and renewed concentration on enforcing them will probably impact those who try to use them for gambling online.

It's freaking mess, is what it is.

What is wrong with that? Not every country is as rich as the US, and provided the money has been earned legally, why not help less fortunate family members by sending it home - or would the US prefer that these less fortunate family members sneak illegally into the US so as to keep the money there, along with being better placed to work illegally, commit crime, and be a burden on the state.

Helping people make a better life in their own countries is better than forcing them to sneak into the rich countries because it is the only way they can share in the wealth.

People enjoying a better life in a poorer country are also less likely to fall for the lure of organised crime and terrorism - they have more to lose if things go wrong.
 
What is wrong with that? Not every country is as rich as the US, and provided the money has been earned legally, why not help less fortunate family members by sending it home - or would the US prefer that these less fortunate family members sneak illegally into the US so as to keep the money there, along with being better placed to work illegally, commit crime, and be a burden on the state.

Helping people make a better life in their own countries is better than forcing them to sneak into the rich countries because it is the only way they can share in the wealth.

People enjoying a better life in a poorer country are also less likely to fall for the lure of organised crime and terrorism - they have more to lose if things go wrong.


You know the speil... the Feds can't track the money so it must be going to some nefarious use... like (the old standby 'worry') terrorism.... and money laundering....

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.
 
In cracking down on gambling, the US have made it HARDER to trace the flow of money related to terrorism, as such flows have to be identifed from all the false alerts that are just US players determined not to let "big brother" dictate how and where they spend their money.

If gambling were allowed, such players would NOT have to resort to such devious methods, and it would be easy to tell the difference between gambling transactions and "terrorist" ones.

It also provides a convenient excuse for an accusation of funding a terrorist cell, just admit to being an online gambling high roller, and that all those reloads were lost to the casinos. The penalties would be far less that getting involved with terrorism. Keeping offshore trade out of the US has only made life easier for the terrorists, as they can blend in with the rest of the "grey market" economy.

This debate may also make terrorists more aware of what they were missing out on, or warn them that this loophole is about to be closed and to get out now whilst few records have been kept.
 
I received two of these for $25
Time to get a new card.

Dear James,

We are writing to advise you that our systems show there was 1 transaction initiated on 2/8/2012 3:35:21 PM, as follows:

- $25, Card # 4-1634, with descriptor xxxxxxxxx; for your xxxxx Casino account xxxxx.

There was a delay on the processor's end in settling this transaction which resulted in it not being posted to your credit card until today's date.

Please do not hesitate to contact us, if you have any questions or require additional information.

Best regards,

Financial Department
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
 
Related to the customer due diligence and new concentration on prepaid cards.... I got an alert email from FINCEN today...

You do not have permission to view link Log in or register now.
 
I Have not been able to reload my Netspend card via WU but if I buy a relaod pack I can.

Inet put a 5 day hold on my Netspend card a few weeks ago, so will not use Netspend there, again.

WU seems to be the problem with reloading and not Netspend. I have had countless phonecalls with netspend and they are clueless as to why I cannot use WU to reload....but that is CS, maybe.

WU may have a few crackdowns imvho.


Wu is used to wire money abroad and is used regularly by foreign nationals here in the USA, as you all probably know and have witnessed problems, as I deliver to hispanic stores and heard a complaint from a customer when it didn't go through straight away...the customer was told to wait and come back to try again...I thought uh oh...I could not reload using WU for the past 3 weeks with WU.

I am not savvy with these matters at all but have read most of the posts here, so maybe it is the Wire Act raising it's head....I can see pros and cons, just so you.
 
WU hasn't worked consistently for loading in months. I use Moneygram if I load in a store. Most of the time I transfer between my bank and the card. Costs less and is instant. Drawback is you can't load but $100 at a time.
 
In cracking down on gambling, the US have made it HARDER to trace the flow of money related to terrorism, as such flows have to be identifed from all the false alerts that are just US players determined not to let "big brother" dictate how and where they spend their money.

If gambling were allowed, such players would NOT have to resort to such devious methods, and it would be easy to tell the difference between gambling transactions and "terrorist" ones.

It also provides a convenient excuse for an accusation of funding a terrorist cell, just admit to being an online gambling high roller, and that all those reloads were lost to the casinos. The penalties would be far less that getting involved with terrorism. Keeping offshore trade out of the US has only made life easier for the terrorists, as they can blend in with the rest of the "grey market" economy.

This debate may also make terrorists more aware of what they were missing out on, or warn them that this loophole is about to be closed and to get out now whilst few records have been kept.

Passage of UIGEA made it easier to deposit via credit/debit card. I could never get deposits to go through prior to its passage and only used ewallets to deposit and get paid by casinos. It created additional "work-arounds", while it was supposedly passed to protect the u.s. public, it has done the opposite by allowing our money to be seized without providing us any legal options to recover it.
 
Email today from Bankersonline.com

The email was discussing the new BSA and regulations regarding international wires.

So things just keep moving along with banks attempting to stop gambling transactions.

Just another heads up.

use checks if you can to withdrawal
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Click here for Red Cherry Casino

Meister Ratings

Back
Top