Had to close bank account

[Casinomeister]

I'm going to close this thread before it goes any further.

Babs has been performing chargebacks at two - perhaps three casinos. I told her last night that this breaches the forum rules; chargebacks are considered fraudulent activity.

The first time happened several months ago at Club World - the most recent time was with iNetBet.

I'm waiting for the casino to get back to me with further information. So far it looks like they are getting hit up for about $2000 in fines for this activity.

Apparently, Babs felt like bringing this into the open possibly to garner support before a pending suspension (I hadn't got back to her yet on this). I don't really appreciate this.

On another note, there have been some questions about Linda7's account being closed here - it has nothing to do with this thread.

She had created another persona 9111986 for whatever reason, and filed a bogus PAB
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/

Linda7 and 9111986 are the same person, using the same computer. She tried BSing her way out of it, but she blew it, which is a real shame since she is a long time member.

 

[Casinomeister]

Okay, the casino (iNetBet) got back to me with a copy of emails and PMs from Babs. It seems that Babs has been a little "stretchy" with the truth.

She closed her account in October. Coincidentally, it was in October that she asked to take a break from the forum - I placed her in the "Quit Gambling" user group. I let her back in when she requested to have her account reactivated. Which I did since she did not admit to having a gambling problem.

Anyway, after she had her iNetBet account closed they received the chargebacks. They tried contacting her via email - no response.

They see that she's still an active member here so they PM her to find out what happened.

She told them that she was upset that the withdrawals from her bank didn't match the deposits in the casino. She also said that her husband was upset about this and charged back the deposits and closed the card.

So instead of contacting anyone at the casino, she "charges back". Please bear in mind, these were legitimate deposits that she gambled.

She said she was going to send proof to them on Jan 5 - but so far nothing. They have requested proof no less than three times since this happened.

...I may even be banned from here because it looks like I did this on purpose when In fact I only requested a few unauthorized charges back in Oct 2008. I have since been seeing alot more that I did not ask for. I cannot say this enough...

Well, yeah - you did do this on purpose. I have the emails that prove so.

...Once you do a chargeback, even if just on one unauthorized charge, my bank went and reversed ALL deposits (dribbles and drabbles) at a time for the same processor..

Again, I have a statement from you where you admit your husband was angry and charged all this back. Funds that you gambled (and apparently lost).

Like I said, I did just a few of them that I noticed in October (months ago). The casino didnt contact me at all or dispute it so I thought they saw the mistake and that was it. Then...all of these other charges were reversed without me knowing it.

Huh? You closed your casino account and stopped answering your emails. They decided to contact you via PM after seeing your activity here. Why didn't you tell them what was up via a PM?

This stinks - in a real bad way. When you make a chargeback, you are telling the bank that these charges are unauthorized - like a stolen card. Just because a some withdrawals are a few dollars off doesn't mean it was unauthorized. Don't forget you gambled this money away.

Did it ever occur to you that these differences could have been fees from a payment processor that you ended up paying? How was the casino supposed to know that you were debited for those? Why didn't you just contact them and ask them to cover the costs? I'm sure they would have obliged making up for it with a gift coupon at Amazon.com or something. Jeeze! This is iNetBet not some clip-shot joint from Cowboytown.

 

[silcnlayc]

Thanks Bryan for the update. It is extremely appreciated a lot when we get the ending of the story from you.


.

 

[LaurieJim]

i have spoken with babs about this on the phone and she is not going to use a bank card for gaming anymore as sometimes chargebacks can and will happen on the part of the processor or by the player, pre paid cards are just about the best option out there for the u.s player, what amount you have on the card is what you have to use.

i hope that no one will make bad judgement calls against barbara, as she has been under alot of stress and is upset over all this, she has also been a great poster and forum member. is there not a way that this mess can be resolved to suit both parties?............laurie

 

[anniemac]

This is a really sticky, nasty mess. On one hand you have a long-time member here at this forum - well liked and knowledgable. On the other hand, you have someone who knowingly charged back deposits to a casino after gambling them away. This is the knowledge that all of us are privy to.

What to do? What to think? A chargeback is a chargeback, plain and simple. It has to be done by the account holder and with a valid reason. I get charges thru Isagro Holdings among others and yes, they are different from what actually gets charged to my account. Usually by pennies. Reason for this is so your bank or card won't notice them as much as if they were all even dollar amounts. When the screen comes up after your deposit is accepted, it will tell you this.

Now, what to do about cleaning this mess up? I don't think there is any other option other than to pay up. When I had the chargeback to QT not too long ago, while QT was very nice and reopened my account while I cleared it up, I was still responsible for it. They didn't care that Netspend had done it, just that I paid it. I cleared it up and all is good. That is the only option that is going to be acceptable to the casinos affected.

It is what it is. These deposits that were chargedback have to be cleared up and then move on from there.

I am sure that Babs is upset by this. Just fix it and it will go away. All will be good.

 

[LaurieJim]

This is a really sticky, nasty mess. On one hand you have a long-time member here at this forum - well liked and knowledgable. On the other hand, you have someone who knowingly charged back deposits to a casino after gambling them away. This is the knowledge that all of us are privy to.

What to do? What to think? A chargeback is a chargeback, plain and simple. It has to be done by the account holder and with a valid reason. I get charges thru Isagro Holdings among others and yes, they are different from what actually gets charged to my account. Usually by pennies. Reason for this is so your bank or card won't notice them as much as if they were all even dollar amounts. When the screen comes up after your deposit is accepted, it will tell you this.

Now, what to do about cleaning this mess up? I don't think there is any other option other than to pay up. When I had the chargeback to QT not too long ago, while QT was very nice and reopened my account while I cleared it up, I was still responsible for it. They didn't care that Netspend had done it, just that I paid it. I cleared it up and all is good. That is the only option that is going to be acceptable to the casinos affected.

It is what it is. These deposits that were chargedback have to be cleared up and then move on from there.

I am sure that Babs is upset by this. Just fix it and it will go away. All will be good.

this is good sound advice annie, get in contact with the inet promo dept or emily babs and see how this can be taken care of in a honorable way, its not the end of the world.......they are a good casino and i dont think they are out for blood, just the money they are out of pocket.........all these matters can be worked out, im sure.....chin up!!!!...............laurie

 

[babs7262]

The reason I took a break was because of the mess with Inet not reverse. I did contact them advising them of the unauthorized amounts and told them to close my account and that I was tired of them taking out the wrong amounts. The reason why it was gambled with was because the my deposit showed the right amount but my bank took a different amount out

You say Club World was done in the same manner when in fact it was OVER 1 1/2 years and I showed them proof (because they asked for it right away, not months later after my online statement was purged). I still gamble at Club World every now and then and they even gave me a $50 Christmas present so adding Club World to this mess was totally unjust. Tom and I are on good terms and we shared several phone calls at the time.

The reason why I ddint show proof on here on this one is because when I did with Club World people still didnt believe me and I put my whole banking life online for all to see and Im not going to do it this time.

My husband was not pissed about my gambling and only knew of me bitching outloud (because I talk to myself outloud from being here alone all day) about the extra money on every deposit. I didnt even take all of the wrong amount ones because I considered a win and deducted that to be fair and have more than what I was suppose to have. Maybe I went about it the wrong way but these were not fraudulant and by the time they asked me in January (like about 2 weeks ago) my online purged and I can only see to November. They give me 20 pages to see online at a time and I deposit frequently to 3 dice so it purged fast.

I since then had other problems with my bank of 12 years and closed that account (well, not closed but left it with $3) in December and opened a bank of america account and have never deposited with my Visa debit again with any RTG or MG. I had no activity or no deposit history with QT or DECard until all of this happened and started using this method so this NEVER happens again.

Im sorry if this came across as fraudulant and Ill have to live with that and possibly be banned or lose the respect of some of you. Its something that cant be changed at this point. If every single transaction from purchases added more every single time , you would lose tens of hundreds of dollars and this isnt right to me and never will be right in my eyes.

I am not the first to do this (not making an excuse, just a fact) and I wont be the last to do a chargeback in which you felt you were right in doing so. I feel being banned is wrong because of all of the good that has been done by trying to be part of a community and helping others and throwing something away for one thing just because I am not believed is just wrong. I would think that if people were to get banned from breaking a rule then ALL of us would be at one point whether its flaming, swearing, spamming, etc... Noone is perfect (not that I think I did anything wrong) and if you think I did something wrong, it wasnt meant to be that way and I hope you dont throw me away for this incident.

One more thing: I would like again to apologize to the affected casino that was an innocent bystander. I made peace with the rep and felt horrible and asked if there was anything I could do. This rep will always have my respect for listening to me and understanding what happened to them without calling me names or accusing me of any intentional harm. I choose not to share this reps pm's just incase they dont want to be involved with this situation but you know who you are and I thank you for your understanding and how you accepted my apology when you could of just blown me off and not believed me.

 

[babs7262]

this is good sound advice annie, get in contact with the inet promo dept or emily babs and see how this can be taken care of in a honorable way, its not the end of the world.......they are a good casino and i dont think they are out for blood, just the money they are out of pocket.........all these matters can be worked out, im sure.....chin up!!!!...............laurie

From what I heard they are telling bryan that with the fines its over $2K. I did about $180 give or take because I dont remember and to clear my name I would have to pay it ALL. I cannot afford that, simple as that and besides that , why should I pay back something I feel wasnt the right amount to begin with? Honorable? If it was 3dice or some other casino like 32rd that didnt have so many confusing technical terms that made your head spin and come up with excuses why THEY shouldnt pay wins to people, why should I pay something I dont think should be paid back when they dont? I usually like taking the higher road as I did when I DIDNT do that $40 I thought was wrong on that very last ClubWorld one a long time ago. Remember that one? I had every right to do that one but chose not to because I didnt want to stir the waters and wanted to keep peace with Tom. Im not taking a backseat this time and pay $2K for $180 that I felt I was right in doing.

Im sorry, thats how I feel. There was an instance when I thought I won a jackpot at 3dice because of a system glitch. They had to look into it and gave me $50 in the meantime. I found out (thanks RObwin) what happened and that I didnt win it. THe first thing I did was pm Enzo and offer to pay that $50 back because I felt it wasnt mine to keep. I do what I feel is the right thing to do and I dont feel I owe Inet money. If I do get banned, I will miss all of you and hope to see you on chat at the casino. I got alot out of this forum and appreciate everyone in here that gave me rep points and became my friend. I still feel that people shouldnt judge one situation out of daily writings of over 2 years but its out of my hands and Ill respect whatever decision bryan makes.

Take Care and I wont be responding anymore because there is really nothing left to say. I stated my side, apologized to the right people and stated how I felt about the banning. Peace to all

 

[RobWin]

Good lord, how in the world could $180.00 possibly turn into $2,000.00....that just does not seem realistic unless you are dealing with Guido the Loan Shark or someone like that...

 

[jas2587]

Good lord, how in the world could $180.00 possibly turn into $2,000.00....that just does not seem realistic unless you are dealing with Guido the Loan Shark or someone like that...

I know when I have went to deposit say $30 an it says $29.95 will be charged to your account I click ok then I commit myself to pay that amount

it has never went over the say $30 ever

the charges can go that high cause with a chargeback then the casino owes the processer it is no different then a bounced check an with a bounced check there is a fine an if the processer keeps putting that (((check)) thru an not getting paid up goes another fee which can add up

when you do a chargeback an go ahead an play the money you are spending the processor or the casino's money it isn't yours anymore as you did a chargeback

so sorry to say it will add up
an just because you talked to the rep here dont mean they have the right to say sure n/p they are in no ways no different then a ummmm bank teller not a branch manager

hope this makes sense an not meant to offend any one at all

it is just the way i read it

Cindy

 

[anniemac]

Jas,

You are right. One bounced check can cost you a bunch. Everytime it goes back through there is a charge.

It doesn't make any difference if it is a casino or your water bill, you gotta pay it. That's all there is to it. The casinos has every right to expect payment and to collect it however they are able.

Such a mess.

 

[silcnlayc]

yes, they are different from what actually gets charged to my account. Usually by pennies.

This has been known since the implementation of the UIGEA..many threads have been written on the different amounts taken by casinos ..this is not a new thing that just started..and not to be down about this, but if you gamble and deposit, you KNOW this and accept it when it pops up with a different amount posted telling you what will be charged before you click ok. No way around that for USA players.

I am not condemning you on this, just stating the facts that are written throughout this forum..and deposits with QT/Netspend or any other card for that matter..for they do it credit cards too...this amount in differences has always been there since day one of the UIGEA...for the processors protection and we also received emails in the beginning of this change from many casinos telling us this in writing to not be alarmed if the amount debited is different than asked for and in my case it has always been to my benefit, not the other way around.

To be banned or not, will be left up to Bryan...whatever his decision, will be accepted by me and many others...personally, if you try to make restitution in good faith, all is good here, becasue a gambler ALWAYS pays their debts or ones that he caused to be created....



.

 

[Casinomeister]

Actually the numbers are:
21 deposits (charged back)
$273 total
the fine was $75 per transaction (it was thought to be $100 per)

$1575 in fines + $273 = $1848 Total

So what now?

 

[winbig]

imo, babs, you should either try to re-reverse all charges and try and work it out from there, or get on some sort of payment plan with iNet to see about paying this money back. Seeing as how we're talking about 1800 in fines alone, maybe they could cut you a break on some of these fines?

And on the flip side - $75 to $100 for each transaction that was reversed? This seems kind of steep. I feel that my bank is outrageous with their returned check fees, which are $39....

And on the other hand, when you look at the big picture, iNet's processor has every right to increase their rates if there are too many chargebacks from their players.

 

[Jasminebed]

imo, babs, you should either try to re-reverse all charges and try and work it out from there, or get on some sort of payment plan with iNet to see about paying this money back. Seeing as how we're talking about 1800 in fines alone, maybe they could cut you a break on some of these fines?

And on the flip side - $75 to $100 for each transaction that was reversed? This seems kind of steep. I feel that my bank is outrageous with their returned check fees, which are $39....

And on the other hand, when you look at the big picture, iNet's processor has every right to increase their rates if there are too many chargebacks from their players.

Oh babs hun, what a mess this has turned into. I don't think all 21 chargebacks were initiated by you, but you are now responsible for them. Hopefully the affected casinos will offer you time to pay the processor fees, and since casinos routinely cover part of these costs for players, I hope they will give you a break on them.

It took a lot of courage for you to bring this out in the forum, and I do hope that others can learn from your experience.

And I hope that we do not lose you as a participant in this forum.

 

[jas2587]

imo, babs, you should either try to re-reverse all charges and try and work it out from there, or get on some sort of payment plan with iNet to see about paying this money back. Seeing as how we're talking about 1800 in fines alone, maybe they could cut you a break on some of these fines?

And on the flip side - $75 to $100 for each transaction that was reversed? This seems kind of steep. I feel that my bank is outrageous with their returned check fees, which are $39....

And on the other hand, when you look at the big picture, iNet's processor has every right to increase their rates if there are too many chargebacks from their players.

Steep lets see it goes from Babs to a processor to a casino then again to a processor an to her bank then they all get chargedbacked wether She did it or her Husband did it so then the process is reversed from the bank to the processor to the casino to them emailing babs she so they say ignores the emails they pm her dont know what heppened there she has admitted doing it here

why are you all patting her on the back she er her Husband reversed the charges she should pay the cost

as for bank account you can get your statements mailed to you even if you opt out of paper statements I can go online an get 2 years or more of statements



have none of you all read Bryans post at all #27 an #38
they speak for theirselves as to what happened

long standing members make mistakes tooo it happens

Cindy

 

[winbig]

Steep lets see it goes from Babs to a processor to a casino then again to a processor an to her bank then they all get chargedbacked wether She did it or her Husband did it so then the process is reversed from the bank to the processor to the casino to them emailing babs she so they say ignores the emails they pm her dont know what heppened there she has admitted doing it here

why are you all patting her on the back she er her Husband reversed the charges she should pay the cost

as for bank account you can get your statements mailed to you even if you opt out of paper statements I can go online an get 2 years or more of statements



have none of you all read bryans post at all #27 an #38
they speak for theirselves as to what happened

long standing members make mistakes tooo it happens

Cindy

FTR, I'm not patting anyone on the back. Just offering some advice, which you could see if you read my post in its entirety.

 

[jas2587]

FTR, I'm not patting anyone on the back. Just offering some advice, which you could see if you read my post in its entirety.

an it starts
I did read your post entirely I read the whole thread several times

"""why are you all patting her"""

does not refer to one person key word ""All""

 

[winbig]

an it starts
I did read your post entirely I read the whole thread several times

"""why are you all patting her"""

does not refer to one person key word ""All""

Yes, but "all" covers everyone, not just certain people. A better way to say it would be 'why are some of you.'

[/derail]

But, I do understand what you're trying to get across...just might want to word it different next time

 

[anniemac]

No matter how or who says it, it all boils down to the same thing. Chargebacks were made. Now they have to be paid. No more, no less.
There is just no way around it.

 

[silcnlayc]

No matter how or who says it, it all boils down to the same thing. Chargebacks were made. Now they have to be paid. No more, no less.
There is just no way around it.

Agreed. The casino, processor, nor the bank initiated this process. The player did.

We all do make mistakes during our lifetime, but it is how we take care of a mess we have created that speaks volumes about ones own integrity. Hopefully the right choice is made here.

.

 

[Swede]

Here's my take and solution to this mess. Most have already been said but may be worth repeating:

Bank fees and fines are a bitch these days, bounced checks costs $20-75 depending and overdrawing your bank account just as much. I'm sure the $75 fine per transaction CM mentions is correct, it sounds just about right to me. Babs herself says she doesn't have the money to wipe out this debt so it would be nice to see Emily Hanson or someone else from Inet contact her to try and work something out. Perhaps a good portion of the fees can even be waived?! If I were the creditor in this case, I would surely try to set up some sort of payment plan. Even if I could only get twenty bucks a month, it would be better than nothing and plus it would give the other party a chance to make restitution and get past the whole ordeal.

Also, these are gambling losses and should always be paid in accordance with unwritten rules and the important honor system. I surely hope this will get resolved soon.

Just my two cents,

Swede

 

[jas2587]

Here's my take and solution to this mess. Most have already been said but may be worth repeating:

Bank fees and fines are a bitch these days, bounced checks costs $20-75 depending and overdrawing your bank account just as much. I'm sure the $75 fine per transaction CM mentions is correct, it sounds just about right to me. Babs herself says she doesn't have the money to wipe out this debt so it would be nice to see Emily Hanson or someone else from Inet contact her to try and work something out. Perhaps a good portion of the fees can even be waived?! If I were the creditor in this case, I would surely try to set up some sort of payment plan. Even if I could only get twenty bucks a month, it would be better than nothing and plus it would give the other party a chance to make restitution and get past the whole ordeal.

Also, these are gambling losses and should always be paid in accordance with unwritten rules and the important honor system. I surely hope this will get resolved soon.

Just my two cents,

Swede

very well put Swede

 

[Luigi810]

I was playing last year and I knew I didn't have that much money in the bank but the casino kept on taking my deposits, I think it's because I had my bank for so long and they seen all the deposits I made, they just trusted me, or the fact that when you use credit instead of bebit it takes longer to go threw, I'm not sure, but anyways, a week into this my bank called me up and told me I was over 7,000 overdrawn, I wanted to puke, eventually I checked online with the casino history section and I did make deposits over 5,000, money I didn't have in the bank and the rest was fees..My bank asked me if I wanted to dipute the charges, boy was I tempted, but I couldn't do that, I had no choice but to pay..BUT, at first I said NO WAY did I play that much, I was so mad at the casino for robbing me, it wasn't until I checked with my history that I knew it was me, if I didn't check with the history, I think I would have disputed, I would have though they were wrong and not me..Needless to say, more charges went through after that and I had to pay almost 10,000.00 back to my bank..
Sometimes we are wrong too, NOT saying Babs could have made a mistake, I'm sure she is more aware on what she plays than me, I just play without writing down what I spent and I delete the emails that they send letting me know of my deposits, I always hid everything from my husband..
Mistakes can happen, with ourselves, with banks and with casinos..
IMOP, I think Babs is innocent, she's to smart to mess up..

 

[winbig]

I think all has been said here that could be said, but I have to agree with you on this one, Swede...

I do think that iNet should be made 'whole' again, and be repaid any and everything they are due, that they had to pay out of pocket. If they were charged $75 per transaction, then that's what they should be paid back (along with reversed charges.) Not a penny more and not a penny less. It'd definitely be a great thing if they were able to cut babs a break on the extra fees, but that's totally up to iNet's discretion.

Regarding babs' future here at the forum, I can't speculate on, because that's entirely in the hands of Bryan. I, like others, would hate to see her go...because when it all boils down, I think babs is a great person to have around.