Roguish Eurocity spam. Claims to be eCogra, but not listed there.

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
I received a spam for Eurocity casino, boasting "new software", and an unbelievable £10,500 welcome bonus.

The software is "iTech Labs". The eCogra seal is displayed.

I have checked the eCogra website (well, I smelled a rat from reading the content of the spam).

Well,

Eurocity - NOT listed at eCogra
iTech Labs - NOT listed at eCogra.

How can a casino hold the eCogra seal, yet NOT appear anywhere in the official eCogra listings?

(That was a rhetorical question BTW:D).

Eurocity duly "grassed up" to eCogra - reply awaited:p
 

maphesto

Dormant account
Joined
Jun 5, 2009
Location
Sweden
I also received this.

The software is however Cassava.. Itech Labs is a test lab.

When you visit their website you see that their affiliateprogram is Purecommission.

Same As Pure Vegas.

This means that they are sisters I guess. This might indicate that a Cassava casino has a rep here.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
I also received this.

The software is however Cassava.. Itech Labs is a test lab.

When you visit their website you see that their affiliateprogram is Purecommission.

Same As Pure Vegas.

This means that they are sisters I guess. This might indicate that a Cassava casino has a rep here.

Well, why didn't they put down Cassava, how are players meant to know, ESPECIALLY those who have been told "don't attempt to open another account at another casino operated by (Cassava)".

Even though the concern about the software might have been cleared up, WHY do they NOT appear as an "accredited portal" on the eCogra site.

To display the seal, the CASINO ITSELF has to be accredited, it is NOT enough that the software is accredited, or maybe a sister casino.

Casinos CANNOT use the seals earned by their sister operations, they MUST each get their own.

If they REALLY have the seal, then eCogra have screwed up, because I could NOT find them listed on the eCogra site, which is EXACTLY what eCogra wants players to do if they are not sure about the validity of a seal displayed on a portal.
 

jetset

RIP Brian
Joined
Feb 22, 2001
Location
Earth
Well spotted VWM :thumbsup: It's important for player safety to expose any site using accreditation to which it is not entitled.

However, I think we should await the response to your eCOGRA report - this may be a case of an operator "jumping the gun" - also reprehensible but perhaps not quite as evil as claiming a seal fraudulently.
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
Well spotted VWM :thumbsup: It's important for player safety to expose any site using accreditation to which it is not entitled.

However, I think we should await the response to your eCOGRA report - this may be a case of an operator "jumping the gun" - also reprehensible but perhaps not quite as evil as claiming a seal fraudulently.


Tex got back to me today.

She told me that Eurocity was a Cassava white label, and had not been granted a seal. She is going to tell them to stop using it.

This does look like "rogue practice" rather than an operator "jumping the gun". They have seals for their main casinos, but this does NOT cover the white labels. Cassava really should know this, yet they just keep on doing this. Cassava have been in the business almost from the start, so there are really no excuses for such "newbie mistakes".

It looks like they KNOW what they are doing, and are constantly pushing and bending the rules as far as they can, but without there ever being SERIOUS consequences. They have been around long enough to know just how far boundaries can be pushed before they shatter completely.

In this case, it seems they can use a seal from one casino to market a white label, but if they get busted, and eCogra find out, they are told to stop using it, and they do - boundary pushed until it creaks, but not so much that it breaks. So long as they comply, nothing further will come of it, but later on, along comes another white label, and maybe another misused seal - repeating the process that they know.

Since eCogra accredit casinos, they can be pretty sure that eCogra are not going to expel their main seal holder brands because a different casino misused the seal, no more than they would expel All Jackpots just because, for example, Golden Lounge had continually misused an eCogra seal.

This seems a weakness in the system, where eCogra treats each white label as an independent entity when it comes to behaviour and consequences, yet Cassava do NOT treat the PLAYERS as though each white label is an independent entity, and players could have winnings from the astonishing* £10,500 welcome bonus if it is deemed that they had "playing patterns" that Cassava didn't like long ago at, say, Reef Club.

From the mailer, and the website, there would be no way players would make the connection, since it is common for the same software to be used at many completely independent casinos, and no-one believes there is a "one account per software" policy anywhere in the industry in general.

* more like unbelievable, a fantasy bonus perhaps:rolleyes: Even the rogues would consider this a step too far, and there must be some pretty draconian "small print" at Eurocity to prevent the vast majority of players from cashing out from the bonus, and I'll bet many that DO manage will have their payments messed around with because they will be considered to have "cheated" through their playing tactics.
 

Jasminebed

Game old gal
Joined
Mar 13, 2008
Location
Ontario
I received spam today, and the spam contains the ECogra Fair and Safe logo. I did visit the webpage, and to be fair it no longer contains the ECogra seal.

Is it worth my efforts to report this affiliate to them? Or do you think they are providing affiliates with this stuff knowingly still to them?
 

maxd

Complaints (PAB) Manager
Staff member
Joined
Jan 20, 2004
Location
Saltirelandia
Is it worth my efforts to report this affiliate to them? Or do you think they are providing affiliates with this stuff knowingly still to them?

Try it, affiliates prone to such "oversights" need to get kicked if and when possible. It's way too easy to make these "mistakes" and the cost to players is way too high. Unless there is a hard and pointy downside these "errors" mysteriously keep popping up.
 

jetset

RIP Brian
Joined
Feb 22, 2001
Location
Earth
If this operator is still up to his/her fraudulent tricks, then most certainly it should be reported again.

Maybe a lawyer's letter will have a greater impact from eCOGRA this time than the initial warning.
 

maxd

Complaints (PAB) Manager
Staff member
Joined
Jan 20, 2004
Location
Saltirelandia
FWIW, found an email in the bowels of my inbox, from one of the folks at the group behind ECC:

It was a case of an affiliate freelancing and deciding what to put on the
mailer... We caught it as quickly as possible, caught him for SPAM as well,
and he has been sanctioned. We do not accept such practices from
affiliates. All ECC mails are sent through Cassava servers, so there is a
lengthy approval process, and such misinformation would never appear from a
mailer we would send.

Also, I'm not seeing the eCOGRA seal any longer (assuming it was on the front page). If they've cleared this up then I'm going to suggest we pull the "Roguish" tag from this thread. Any objections?
 

vinylweatherman

You type well loads
Joined
Oct 14, 2004
Location
United Kingdom
All ECC mails are sent through Cassava servers, so there is a
lengthy approval process, and such misinformation would never appear from a
mailer we would send.

So, if a player receives an offer that has come from a Cassava server, it has come from CASSAVA, and not an affiliate "freelancing". Therefore, if such offers are being sent that if taken, would lead to the player breaking the terms regarding accounts across all Cassava brands, it is CASSAVA that are guilty of "enticement" and breaching the accreditation standard:-

No player shall be involuntarily placed into a situation which breaches the terms and conditions during the course of play.

This clearly happens when Cassava send one of THEIR players an offer to open an account at a sister casino, where doing so would violate the terms and conditions. Especially so, given that the offer does NOT identify just WHICH casinos are covered by such an exclusion.

Where an AFFILIATE makes the offer, then Cassava are not to blame, but IF the email comes "from Cassava servers", it is reasonable to assume it is a "personal invite" from Cassava, which would OVERRIDE any CONDITIONAL statements in the terms and conditions, and this particular term IS conditional in nature, and is specifically overriden where a player receives a "personal invite" to join a sister casino that would otherwise be in breach of the terms.

Given that this has been an ongoing problem, there is clearly NOT "a
lengthy approval process" before mailers are fired out by Cassava for their sister casinos.
 
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