Corona virus - Covid 19 discussion

[goatwack]

The Children's Aid Society has been brought into the fray, with, I guess, the aim being to remove truckers' kids as a great compliance tool.

Parents of said children generally stating the kids are catered for, happy to be there, and that the Covid mandates have been of far greater detriment to their children anyway, i.e lack of socializing in groups, seeing doctors without their families etc, I'm sure the list is pretty extensive.

 

[geordiecolin]

The Children's Aid Society has been brought into the fray, with, I guess, the aim being to remove truckers' kids as a great compliance tool.

Parents of said children generally stating the kids are catered for, happy to be there, and that the Covid mandates have been of far greater detriment to their children anyway, i.e lack of socializing in groups, seeing doctors without their families etc, I'm sure the list is pretty extensive.

They have doctors on the ground tending to any needs.

 

[Steviedoo]

Interesting to see how it all plays out.
Will the masses turn on the truckers once the store shelves get really empty or will they turn on the officials and force them to cave?

Heroes to zeroes in a matter of weeks.

Two things are happening in the country right now.

Blockades are blocking the ports of entry at the USA/Canada border. This will have astronomical economic repercussions in both countries. It’s already started. The USA more specifically Michigan which borders Ontario, is starting to feel it and has started putting pressure on the Trudeau government to end this blockade.

The freedom convoy in ottawa has done nothing but annoy and irritate the locals. Closed down businesses of which the pandemic had already decimated.
The reality is that the federal government has no juristidiction over what the provinces will do. Whatever mandates they are demanding to be lifted are decided bu the provincial powers.

three or four provinces other than the one that the truckers are occupying at the moment have already started lifting the restrictions and by mid March they should be done with all restrictions. The lifting of restrictions in these provinces have nothing to do with the truckers and the pressure they are putting in ottawa.

The dangerous part of all this is the lack of response to the freedom convoy on the part of the provincial government. Foreign powers are watching and seeing how easy it is to take over. Does Canada have any enemies? I’m sure they do.

The blockades at the port of entry are a Trudeau problem because ports of entry are under federal jurisdiction but again he has no jurisdiction over what the provinces will decide to do with the pandemic mandates.

What should he do and should have done? He is too worried about pleasing everyone. And this makes for a weak leader. But he has nice hair and looked good in those clips.

If his father was the leader this would have been shut down within the first day.

 

[bamberfishcake]

So far in the media, I've seen the truckers associated with white supremacy, racism, child neglect, violence and disorder.

And I hardly watch the news. All in the cause of pushing a jab as we enter the endemic phase where it seems natural immunity was and still is a better course of action.

 

[Steviedoo]

So far in the media, I've seen the truckers associated with white supremacy, racism, child neglect, violence and disorder.

And I hardly watch the news. All in the cause of pushing a jab as we enter the endemic phase where it seems natural immunity was and still is a better course of action.

That’s because the two leaders, The people who have organized the freedom convoy in Ottawa are part of political parties that have very far right extreme views. So the media has jumped on this.

 

[bamberfishcake]

That’s because the two leaders, The people who have organized the freedom convoy in Ottawa are part of political parties that have very far right extreme views. So the media has jumped on this.

Oh, I was not aware. Surprised it's not been focused on more to be honest - as I said, dont watch much news but not seen any mention of that and two leaders of the convoy with direct links to white supremacist organisations is a big slur on the protest.

Also not seen anything about the convoy decimating businesses, although it's clear many will be affected, and the decimation of business through government lockdowns cant be forgotten, although, of course, two wrongs don't make a right.

Problem is that it seems only protests that have detrimental effects on big business get anything done. Like with the fuel blockades in the UK - only time the UK government backed down. Personally think we need more, and unfortunately, things will get much worse before they get better.

 

[geordiecolin]

 

[bamberfishcake]

Love this guy, his videos are hilarious but so on-point to the hypocritical tyranny of recent events.

'taking freedoms from people is the path to those people having more freedoms, freedom is not the path to more freedom' - classic

 

[Steviedoo]

Anyone who knows Canadian politics especially Quebec politics would agree that mandates were not dropped as a result of the freedom convoys. Laughable at best to think they’ve had any effect.

What made the provinces drop the mandates?
Saskatchewan and PEI have had very low numbers throughout the pandemic. They have been quick to make decisions based on common sense.

Quebec : the leader of the province is managing this pandemic by his poll numbers. He’s in an election year. His numbers were in the toilet since he was thinking of taxxing the unvaxxed. And he’s had the strictest policies during the pandemic. People are tired. His poll numbers reflected this.

 

[geordiecolin]

Love this guy, his videos are hilarious but so on-point to the hypocritical tyranny of recent events.

'taking freedoms from people is the path to those people having more freedoms, freedom is not the path to more freedom' - classic

Jacinda Trudeau- " mandates are the way to avoid further restrictions" Ha ha ha

 

[bamberfishcake]

Anyone who knows Canadian politics especially Quebec politics would agree that mandates were not dropped as a result of the freedom convoys. Laughable at best to think they’ve had any effect.

What made the provinces drop the mandates?
Saskatchewan and PEI have had very low numbers throughout the pandemic. They have been quick to make decisions based on common sense.

Quebec : the leader of the province is managing this pandemic by his poll numbers. He’s in an election year. His numbers were in the toilet since he was thinking of taxxing the unvaxxed. And he’s had the strictest policies during the pandemic. People are tired. His poll numbers reflected this.

Well, mandates were dropped whilst the freedom convoy is underway, so hardly laughable to believe there could have been some influence.

Happy to have that one chalked up as a victory for the brave truckers honking their horns for freedom. Viva la revolution! Down with tyranny! Rejoice real democracy! and Yay to freedom of speech!

Didn't see anyone bothered about the worldwide BLM protests during the pandemic. As I say, don't watch the news much but I will hedge a bet Trudeau made no objections, after all, it didn't affect the economy or his agenda, and only served to dangerously spread the virus.

 

[dionysus]

Well, economy affected a bit - a million + a day affected in trade.
Anyway, a rather small revolution - 85% of the pop is vacced and 90% of truckers; it's a pretty small, though vocal minority, but really, didnt have much impact on mandates, as mentioned, it's a provincial not federal issue so a premiere issue not a prm/Trudeau one.

We're all for peaceful proests, not unlawful ones and especially blockades...and 2/3rds the pop is opposed to the 'freedom' convoy
PS, we arent the states, there isnt a constitutional right to free speech

 

[bamberfishcake]

The revolution was part in jest, although it would take a revolution to change the corporate dictatorships we live in.

I think every human being has a right to free speech, regardless of opinion or constitutions Oppressing speech is a mind-numbingly stupid thing to do unless you're trying to control populations and thought, and maybe impose mandates and force people to be jabbed with chemicals.

I find it hard to believe, jabbed or not, that people don't agree with freedom of choice.

p.s. I wonder if the mandates are imposed on individuals with strong anti-vax religious beliefs such as Jehovahs Witnesses?

 

[goatwack]

Well, economy affected a bit - a million + a day affected in trade.
Anyway, a rather small revolution - 85% of the pop is vacced and 90% of truckers; it's a pretty small, though vocal minority, but really, didnt have much impact on mandates, as mentioned, it's a provincial not federal issue so a premiere issue not a prm/Trudeau one.

We're all for peaceful proests, not unlawful ones and especially blockades...and 2/3rds the pop is opposed to the 'freedom' convoy
PS, we arent the states, there isnt a constitutional right to free speech

That has to be the most in-depth analysis I've ever seen from a Leninist

Only joking of couяse. It wasn't that in- depth

 

[dionysus]

Sure. Everyone should enjoy free speech and do what you want...providing you want to live off somewhere in a cave and not be part of a society where the whole is considered important; people always seem to be happy to enjoy the perks of civilization until something is asked in return, like, a modicum of decency.
We don't WANT constituionall guarnteed rights to bear arms and walk around gun in pocket on the streets. I enjoy the fact I can walk down any dark alley at 2am and no I'll arrive home.
We don't WANT freedom of speech where every hate monger gets a platform.

We have freedom of expression - under that umbrella, thought, opnions, expression, belief. But people are still bound by the laws of the society they live in.
Protest? Have at 'er.
Illegally block roads, highways, trade routes impacting millions? Not so much
There's a reason people linternationally look at the 2 sides of the border in very distinct ways

 

[dionysus]

It's..hard to put into words. It's just, generally, a very different mind-set here.
Comparing Americans to Canadians is like comparing apples to hoseshoes

 

[slotplayer]

Well, economy affected a bit - a million + a day affected in trade.

Where did you get than number? I think you mean a billion at least or do you mean people?

 

[dionysus]

Where did you get than number? I think you mean a billion at least or do you mean people?


View attachment 164421

Sorry, meaning the cities the convoy rolls though; the 2-way trade is a whole new kettle of fish due t the blockade

 

[dionysus]

To note, the convoy and blockade(s) doesnt represent the whole - shelves here are still full. 90% of truckers are vacced. The entire country borders the south. I hit the liquor store and grocery mart yesterday, still piled high.
Do blockades hurt? Sure do. Has the country ground to a halt? No.

 

[bamberfishcake]

Sure. Everyone should enjoy free speech and do what you want...providing you want to live off somewhere in a cave and not be part of a society where the whole is considered important; people always seem to be happy to enjoy the perks of civilization until something is asked in return, like, a modicum of decency.
We don't WANT constituionall guarnteed rights to bear arms and walk around gun in pocket on the streets. I enjoy the fact I can walk down any dark alley at 2am and no I'll arrive home.
We don't WANT freedom of speech where every hate monger gets a platform.

We have freedom of expression - under that umbrella, thought, opnions, expression, belief. But people are still bound by the laws of the society they live in.
Protest? Have at 'er.
Illegally block roads, highways, trade routes impacting millions? Not so much
There's a reason people linternationally look at the 2 sides of the border in very distinct ways

I fail to see how freedom of speech has a detrimental impact on society. Opinions are changed through discussions.

Not sure where you got platforms for hate from. I'm not saying freedom of speech means allowing insults. Big difference in my world.

What do you mean by looking at two sides of the border in distinct ways?

Also not sure what you're going on about with being allowed guns. Going way off-piste here again Dio

I'm simply stating that when a government uses Police to turn up at your door with information about what you're allowed to say on social media, you're turning into a dictatorship, fascist country, totalitarian state or whatever else you want to label it as. Talking solves problems, shutting people down encourages them.

 

[goatwack]

I'm just not sure Canadians know what Hate Speech even is. Calling someone 'meanie' instead of 'buddy'?

 

[dionysus]

You fail to see how freedom of speech has a detrimental impact on society?
Toss around the N word here on the forum, I give you a hot minute before your acct is red. Chuck it around on your FB and bethe acct goes bye bye. Employers hear you dropping slurs in the office, not a keen way to a promotion.
Freedom of speech has limits. As does here, freedom of expression.
If you're talking free exchange of opinions, we enjoy that. As stated, freedom of expression enveloped opinion, thought and belief. And even those, to a reasonable degree.
Freedom of speech or freedom of expression is not freedom of consequences.
We just apply different semantics is all.

Platforms for hate? I'm pretty sure it was pointed out to you regarding the organizers and agendas and that the vocal minority tends to swing in pretty..ugly...conservative ways.
It isnt too far back and currently, you can clearly see the divisive nature of other countries, because of platforms of vitriol
I'm all for peaceful protests.

to the guns, it was an anology - ie constitutional rights and amendants.

And granted, talking solves problems. Hate speech, bile, not so much.

@goatwack sure we do, we say, 'Excuse me, SIR' and put a sour look out when we emphasize 'sir'

Kidding aside, we aint perfect, we have bigots and racists and hate mongers. We're generally polite. But not a one-size fits all, just...fits, most

 

[dionysus]

Currently, a bit less than half 'sympathize' with the convoy.
We're as tired as everyone else with restrictions and covid.
People can point out, but look, look, I SEE the comments. Well, sure, the minority is loud and vocal. The majority, unless those counter-protesting, arent up in arms and loud, because, well, we take our shots, pop on our masks and go about our day

 

[dionysus]

The politics here, as in anywhere, are divisive, when it comes to covid. The gap just isnt as...broad, nor the response. The convoy, while, still, a minority, is loud and newsworthy. We arent on the brink of a civil war, call it...a kerfuffle.

Again, we are ALL tired, we all want back to normalcy.

 

[bamberfishcake]

You fail to see how freedom of speech has a detrimental impact on society?
Toss around the N word here on the forum, I give you a hot minute before your acct is red. Chuck it around on your FB and bethe acct goes bye bye. Employers hear you dropping slurs in the office, not a keen way to a promotion.
Freedom of speech has limits. As does here, freedom of expression.
If you're talking free exchange of opinions, we enjoy that. As stated, freedom of expression enveloped opinion, thought and belief. And even those, to a reasonable degree.
Freedom of speech or freedom of expression is not freedom of consequences.
We just apply different semantics is all.

Platforms for hate? I'm pretty sure it was pointed out to you regarding the organizers and agendas and that the vocal minority tends to swing in pretty..ugly...conservative ways.
It isnt too far back and currently, you can clearly see the divisive nature of other countries, because of platforms of vitriol
I'm all for peaceful protests.

to the guns, it was an anology - ie constitutional rights and amendants.

And granted, talking solves problems. Hate speech, bile, not so much.

@goatwack sure we do, we say, 'Excuse me, SIR' and put a sour look out when we emphasize 'sir'

Kidding aside, we aint perfect, we have bigots and racists and hate mongers. We're generally polite. But not a one-size fits all, just...fits, most

But Dio, I mentioned freedom of speech, it was you who said that freedom of speech should be allowed if you want to live in a cave, doesn't consider the whole of society, is indecent and creates platforms for hate. All very different to what I would call freedom of speech.

Now you're pretty much suggesting that I want the N-word to be allowed.

Another discussion between us I have zero interest in continuing, perhaps that's a win on your part....enjoy your day!