CM / Kangaroo Court

[4 of a kind]

I was going to pm Bryan, but am convinced it would do no good since it’s becoming obvious that this forum favors certain members. Based on the pm I received today from Max who by the way hates my guts, gave me a 15 point infraction for what else but insulting the moderator Niffty.

First I want to state that since Bryan warned me about returning punches to Niffty a while ago, I’ve completely since then ignored all his arrogant and obnoxious posts. Niffty masters the art of back door sarcasm and for some reason gets away with it. Maybe since most of us are adults here and have learned to ignore him, and know better then to respond since we’ll get reprimanded like children. I always take my lumps like a man, and find it childish to report members.

Most of us were participating in an informative thread when Niffty replies with this quote here:


iNetbet wouldn't necessarily know how the games they use under licence are coded surely?

I would think this is a question for RTG and not the individual operators.....unless you already know that and you are going to make something of the fact that all the operators you emailed either "don't know" or don't reply.....I hope this isn't the case.


I respond with this quote here:


This is an adult conversation. Please find another thread to toss your rhetoric around in.

Since their is no way to communicate with RTG, I've asked the reps to contact their tech. department. Please read the whole thread before you try to derail it.



I’m not sorry for what I said since I’m just fed up with his nonsense.

So for the Kangaroo Court members, I’m guilty so have your way with me.

 

[Cleveland]

I get that you're upset but the quote you chose to use wasn't bad. Your response to it in that thread was a whole lot harsher. I'm actually surprised that it's the one you used. I'm going to have to start keeping track of the winners of these battles.

Nifty: 1
4oak: 0

 

[gaydave]

I agree with cleveland. Nifty has done lots worse than that LOL. I cannot see, in that example, that Nifty did anything wrong. What am I missing?

 

[4 of a kind]

I agree with cleveland. Nifty has done lots worse than that LOL. I cannot see, in that example, that Nifty did anything wrong. What am I missing?

Like I said I'm guilty. Maybe it was an overreaction but even mature old men can only take so much shit.

I'm sure everyone including Max have been reading all the different posts all along. We all know what goes on here. I can't help but picture Max laughing his ass off when Niffty gets one up on me.

My overreaction was like when a mosquito bites you, and you smack your arm only to see the mosquito dead on your arm with your blood splattered. I'm thinking of making a glossary of back door one liners made by Niffty.

 

[maxd]

I can't help but picture Max laughing his ass off when Niffty gets one up on me.

As the saying goes "what you see depends a lot on the eyes you use for looking". Truth is I couldn't give a fat man's bowel movement what you two have to say to each other as long as (a) you keep the peace and (b) you respect the Forum Rules. I have many dozens of other people's problems to worry about, you VS whomever is not among them.

As to the OP's grumble ... Attach Removed (Old not found). If I had a penny for every time I heard him or others like him say "it’s becoming obvious that this forum <pick a kvetch>" I'd have coffee money every day of my life, and change. I've been in and around gaming forums for well over a decade and there are always a few people who make it their purpose to damage and destroy what someone else is trying to build. Statements like "it's obvious that this forum <whatever>" are easy to make, damaging to the site (almost always intentionally so) and more often than not -- especially coming from habitual whiners -- complete rubbish.

For instance these claims about certain people being given a "special pass" and so forth are based on hunches not facts. Consider the Infractions people receive which, for want of a better system, is a record of times we've had to warn and/or discipline someone for disturbing the peace, disrespecting the forums or breaking the Forum Rules.

I see that the OP, for example, has three (3) Infractions listed. The so called "favoured" person he names has ... oh!, ten (10) Infractions which includes a number of Warnings. The so-called "favoured" person has also been suspended from the forums, more than once if I recall correctly. So who was it you were saying is being given special treatment?

And before someone chimes in with the "yeah but what's an Infraction really mean?" I offer this little thought to chew on: if someone seems to me to be deserving of a "vacation" the first place I'll go to see if there is good evidence to support this would be their Infractions list. So yes, Infractions matter, especially over the long term.

And last but not least re: the OP's complaint, he took objection to being dinged 15 points for the recent Infraction. FWIW, that was a predefined Infraction -- Bryan has created a list for us to choose from, plus the option for a Custom Infraction -- and the number of points is part of that. The points on this specific Infraction -- which are temporary btw -- were no larger, or smaller, than anyone else receiving the same Infraction. Again, no special treatment.

Readers with a good memory will recall that (a) this is not the first time the OP has made these kinds of accusations about the site (which by the way takes us away from actually running and building the site) and (b) regardless of how many times he, or others like him, do it and are shown to be full of it they'll pop up sometime again to repeat the process. In fact they'll almost certainly keep doing it until they are either banned or the site is so damaged by their repeated attacks that it is no longer worth their efforts.

So I ask, who is really hurting the site and the reader's experience in being here? I'd say the habitual vandal (aka a "troll") is right up there as forum public enemy #1.

There are constructive ways to lobby for change on the site and there are destructive ways to (appear to) accomplish the same thing. As it happens the OP is well aware of this and has chosen, time and again, to do it the destructive way. Habitual vandalism is not a public service, it's just vandalism.

And just to make sure there is no misunderstanding:

vandalism [van-dl-iz-uhm]
noun
1. deliberately mischievous or malicious destruction or damage of property ... (

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)

Finally a comment on the "kangaroo court" thing:

A kangaroo court or kangaroo trial is a colloquial term for a sham legal proceeding or court. The outcome of a trial by kangaroo court is essentially determined in advance, usually for the purpose of ensuring conviction, either by going through the motions of manipulated procedure or by allowing no defense at all. (

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)

Casinomeister is not a court, never pretended to be, and makes no such claims. We don't offer "legal proceedings" so it's difficult to imagine how something which doesn't exist can be seen as "a sham". To suggest that our conclusions on casino issues are predetermined is a very serious accusation and a serious attack on the site.

 

[jetset]

The very use of the title "Kangaroo Court" followed by these apparently obsessive accusations that CM favours certain members is imo deliberately insulting and merits a vacation...but that's someone else's decision.

I'm really getting vexed by these repetitive and distracting, time-wasting allegations of improper conduct by CM and the moderators and I would really like to see them stopped.

Frankly I don't know how Max finds the patience to keep responding to this obsessive-compulsive behaviour, never mind the time in what must be a heavy and more valuable workload sorting out player disputes (for just one).

I think it's a pity that 4oak cannot leave his personally-perceived problem alone, or at least take it off the forum to pursue privately, because he is capable of interesting contributions when not rabbiting on about how hard done by he feels he is.

Once again one has to ask: if this site is such a bummer why would you continue to so relentlessly frequent it...unless your mission is perhaps to cause damage for some reason known only to yourself?

 

[ShayDrew]

It is a shame to read the above as I really enjoy 4OAK's posts and the fact he has taken the stance on online gambling that he has AND backs it up by not playing online any further. Generally his posts are informative and get his view across.

Here is hoping we see the old 4OAK back in the near future.

 

[Nate]

One of the biggest issues on the Forum is that Posters are constantly 'baited' with sarcastic remarks. It sometime doesn't help reporting issues because they are not always considered.

I have reported posts in the past and the mods have replied to the individual in a very tame manner. Consistent sarcasm, baiting and attacking other posters is OK when done by some and not others.

This problem has been highlighted by several members and is consistently overlooked.

In any event, my purpose is not to turn this into a bashing thread and I will also refrain 'Thanking' as it has already started to become a thank fest.

Nate

 

[Simmo!]

One of the biggest issues on the Forum is that Posters are constantly 'baited' with sarcastic remarks.

I agree and there is a fair bit of action "behind the scenes" to try and minimise this. We have some quite heated debates with users via PM sometimes

Some users just rub others up the wrong way - only takes one run-in and it can soil that relationship forever. I'd re-iterate the use of the "Ignore" button for users you don't like and "Report Post" buttons in other cases. We do review all of those and act accordingly.

Like Max says, we're not about protecting people's egos, we're here to try and make the board interesting and fun so tools like "Ignore", "Report Post" and the "Private Message" system should be used to sort out petty squabbles IMO. Of course we will step in when it starts to get abusive, vindictive or starts to derail or detract from the topics.

 

[Silencio]

In my opinion one of the biggest problems everywhere is the complaining. Focusing on what's bad instead of what's good. Negativity doesn't produce anything except negativity. (I'm no saint here btw, I struggle to hold down the cynic within myself)

Some time ago I replied to a blog post by a certain banned member who was complaining about Nifty. I told him sure Nifty has some issues but so do you, I didn't mean anything by stating this. As we all have issues, and probably I'm in the top 10 of people with issues myself Probably way ahead of Nifty too..

I mostly like the posts he makes. And lately he's been very friendly to everyone, at least from what I've read. Which means allot, with the recent attacks on him. Many other people wouldn't have had the backbone to do so.

 

[The Dude]

I was going to pm Bryan, but am convinced it would do no good since it’s becoming obvious that this forum favors certain members. Based on the pm I received today from Max who by the way hates my guts, gave me a 15 point infraction for what else but insulting the moderator Niffty.

First I want to state that since Bryan warned me about returning punches to Niffty a while ago, I’ve completely since then ignored all his arrogant and obnoxious posts. Niffty masters the art of back door sarcasm and for some reason gets away with it. Maybe since most of us are adults here and have learned to ignore him, and know better then to respond since we’ll get reprimanded like children. I always take my lumps like a man, and find it childish to report members.

Most of us were participating in an informative thread when Niffty replies with this quote here:


iNetbet wouldn't necessarily know how the games they use under licence are coded surely?

I would think this is a question for RTG and not the individual operators.....unless you already know that and you are going to make something of the fact that all the operators you emailed either "don't know" or don't reply.....I hope this isn't the case.


I respond with this quote here:


This is an adult conversation. Please find another thread to toss your rhetoric around in.

Since their is no way to communicate with RTG, I've asked the reps to contact their tech. department. Please read the whole thread before you try to derail it.



I’m not sorry for what I said since I’m just fed up with his nonsense.

So for the Kangaroo Court members, I’m guilty so have your way with me.

Unfortunately you are way, way off base here. Max does not hate your guts, or anyone's guts in this forum. He was only doing his job with the infraction - and if he wasn't going to do it, you would have received one from me, Simmo!, or Webzcas as well. All four of us are trying to keep the peace here, and forum posts like this - which seem to be yet another call for martyrism - makes all of our jobs much more difficult.

There is no reason whatsoever for you to have not PMd us your dissatisfaction upon receiving an infraction. Hell, everybody else does it. I don't know if you like the drama, or if you're bored or what. And it really takes away the wind from your sails - I find most of your posts helpful and informative and you lose a lot of respect from me and your fellow members when you post crap like this: "CM/kangaroo court". WTF?

I have been trying for days now to implement a number of new functions in this forum to make it more interesting, more interactive, more fun for everyone, but instead I have been getting bogged down with this petty bickering between seasoned members - it is a total waste of time for me and does nothing but piss me the f*** off.

Please - please by all means, use the functions that are there to serve you. "Report a post", "ignore" functions etc. We have close to 2000 documented "Report a posts" - none are from you. If something is really bothering you, please deal with it in a more constructive manner. Thank you.


edited to add: @felicie and secret2 - "Thanking" 4 of a kind's initial post doesn't help matters at all. Please use a bit more discretion on what you are thanking. It could be seriously misinterpreted and can result in you "thanking" privileges being revoked. Thank you.

 

[Diane]

Unfortunately you are way, way off base here. Max does not hate your guts, or anyone's guts in this forum. He was only doing his job with the infraction - and if he wasn't going to do it, you would have received one from me, Simmo!, or Webzcas as well. All four of us are trying to keep the peace here, and forum posts like this - which seem to be yet another call for martyrism - makes all of our jobs much more difficult.

There is no reason whatsoever for you to have not PMd us your dissatisfaction upon receiving an infraction. Hell, everybody else does it. I don't know if you like the drama, or if you're bored or what. And it really takes away the wind from your sails - I find most of your posts helpful and informative and you lose a lot of respect from me and your fellow members when you post crap like this: "CM/kangaroo court". WTF?

I have been trying for days now to implement a number of new functions in this forum to make it more interesting, more interactive, more fun for everyone, but instead I have been getting bogged down with this petty bickering between seasoned members - it is a total waste of time for me and does nothing but piss me the f*** off.

Please - please by all means, use the functions that are there to serve you. "Report a post", "ignore" functions etc. We have close to 2000 documented "Report a posts" - none are from you. If something is really bothering you, please deal with it in a more constructive manner. Thank you.


edited to add: @felicie and secret2 - "Thanking" 4 of a kind's initial post doesn't help matters at all. Please use a bit more discretion on what you are thanking. It could be seriously misinterpreted and can result in you "thanking" privileges being revoked. Thank you.

Bryan - Thank you for being very direct and specific in this post. It was great to see.

I think you and the MODS tolerate too much before you jump in, so I found this to be very refreshing and didn't want to just "Thank" you via button. I appreciate all you do to provide this forum, but it is frustrating when it appears you give people too much rope. I know its a balancing act, but I don't think I could keep my cool and control as long as you and your team do.

This post was a personal insult to you, Max, and your team and the SERVICE you provide.

Perhaps there needs to be more reminding members that if you don't like it (CM), please stop coming here. Like a restaurant owner who just can't please a difficult customer no matter what they do ------at some point, you just explain that "obviously we are not going to meet your standards, I am sorry, but please take your business elsewhere where you can be happier".

IMO,
Diane

 

[DiamondGeezer]

Since we are in a Kangaroo Court perhaps an appropriate sentance should be an apology from 4oak to Nifty and the mods.

 

[Nate]

This post was a personal insult to you, Max, and your team and the SERVICE you provide.

We all Applaud Bryan and Max for the jobs they do. They provide a good service and Bryan does have a very level headed approach.

Your comment above is stirring the pot which is really not necessary at this time. I'm not modding, I'm not insulting but I feel its inappropriate and will only further serve to fuel the fire.

@ Bryan - I agree with the majority of your post BUT - Everybody else that made a post that was Anti towards 4OAK's post was thanked and yet you never mentioned a word. Everybody else applauding something that intimates he has another agenda or personal issues can also be construed as 'not helping matters' either ...Why single out Felicie and secret2?

Nate

 

[Simmo!]

I tried to convince Bryan in Vegas to let me do a month of "Zero Tolerance" moderating ...but he wouldn't let me, dammit

 

[BingoT]

Keep up the great job Bryan and Max

 

[samoas]

We all Applaud Bryan and Max for the jobs they do. They provide a good service and Bryan does have a very level headed approach.

Your comment above is stirring the pot which is really not necessary at this time. I'm not modding, I'm not insulting but I feel its inappropriate and will only further serve to fuel the fire.

@ Bryan - I agree with the majority of your post BUT - Everybody else that made a post that was Anti towards 4OAK's post was thanked and yet you never mentioned a word. Everybody else applauding something that intimates he has another agenda or personal issues can also be construed as 'not helping matters' either ...Why single out Felicie and secret2?

Nate

And I am thanking Nate for voicing exactly what I was thinking, in reference to chastising Felicie and secret2. 4oak has made many wonderful contributions to this forum in the form of intelligent debate and keeping us current on issues he has encountered via online gaming. I for one appreciate that and the many other forum members/mods who also provide information to this venue.

Do I think 4OAK's gripe is valid? Those are his feelings and I have learned in life you can't ever tell someone how to feel.

This all comes down to a respect issue on both sides, IMO.

 

[Diane]

We all Applaud Bryan and Max for the jobs they do. They provide a good service and Bryan does have a very level headed approach.

Your comment above is stirring the pot which is really not necessary at this time. I'm not modding, I'm not insulting but I feel its inappropriate and will only further serve to fuel the fire.

@ Bryan - I agree with the majority of your post BUT - Everybody else that made a post that was Anti towards 4OAK's post was thanked and yet you never mentioned a word. Everybody else applauding something that intimates he has another agenda or personal issues can also be construed as 'not helping matters' either ...Why single out Felicie and secret2?

Nate

And if Bryan or any MOD feels I was "stirring the pot" - I will accept their decision and penalty. I don't believe they play favorites, so if I deserve it, I will accept it and be quiet.

Diane

 

[Nate]

And if Bryan or any MOD feels I was "stirring the pot" - I will accept their decision and penalty. I don't believe they play favorites, so if I deserve it, I will accept it and be quiet.

Diane

My apologies if I came across the wrong way. I was just trying to point out that I don't believe in kicking a man when he is already on the ground. Thank you for the level headed response.

Nate

 

[LHofsdal]

First, let me start off by saying I am not trying to insult or piss anyone off here, but if I do, please let me say I am sorry because that is not my intention. BUT....

Aren't we all adults here? Does this forum not have dedicated Mods? I mean really, Bryan has an excellent point, USE THE FEATURES THAT ARE OFFERED!!!!! If you report a post and you think it is being ignored, report it again, let the mods know how you feel about it, they will reply accordingly I am sure. You may not like their repsonse, you may love their repsonse, but unless you report it how you going to know?

What is the big deal with Nifty? We all know he can be sarcastic, we all have seen it, so when he replies to a post why does it come as a shock to some? Yes, it is true he gets under my skin at times, and I let him know it but I don't start another thread about it. Hell, my hubby of 15 years, (we have been together for 21 years total) gets under my freakin' skin on a daily basis, he hasn't learned to stop. He will never stop, he has been doing it for 21 years, he gets a kick out of it. You don't like what Nifty has to say, ignore him, it is that simple.

C'mon folks, we are not in grade school anymore, Bryan, Max, Simmo and Webcaz are not baby sitters. Whos fault is it if Nifty "baits" someone, and they come back at him with insults and jabs? Who took the "bait"? You can't blame anyone but the person who took the bait. It is their decision to take the "Bait", no one elses. Starting all these threads to complain about Nifty, saying how the Mods treat people, how the Mods have favorites is just getting way out of hand. Use the damn features that are offered to us and move on.

End of Derail/rant.

LH

 

[Nifty29]

We all Applaud Bryan and Max for the jobs they do. They provide a good service and Bryan does have a very level headed approach.

Your comment above is stirring the pot which is really not necessary at this time. I'm not modding, I'm not insulting but I feel its inappropriate and will only further serve to fuel the fire.

@ Bryan - I agree with the majority of your post BUT - Everybody else that made a post that was Anti towards 4OAK's post was thanked and yet you never mentioned a word. Everybody else applauding something that intimates he has another agenda or personal issues can also be construed as 'not helping matters' either ...Why single out Felipcie and secret2?

Nate

There is huge difference between secret2 and felicie thanking that post and other members thanking otherposts.

It isn't about "anti"-anybody.

The OP was deliberately inflammatory and insulting about specific people, and the two peoplewho thanked it have a history of thanking posts that deliberately insult me....and that is not a personal attack it is a fact.

No other post in this thread is demeaning or insulting to anyone, so I don't see any problem with them receiving thanks.

 

[silcnlayc]

LHofsdal
: Whos fault is it if XXXX (put name here) "baits" someone, and they come back at him with insults and jabs? Who took the "bait"? You can't blame anyone but the person who took the bait. It is their decision to take the "Bait", no one elses.

You have only somewhat of a point here...but you forgot that you can only poke at a bear so many times even when they are in hibernation before he gets his back up and charges you...and it takes a LOT of poking and prodding to wake a sleeping bear....

<back to the cave>


.

 

[jod5413]

I gotta admit, Silc, a cave sounds Damn fine when slogging through threads like this. Adult? Reasonable? Just the facts? Not quite what it ought to be, IMO.

 

[4 of a kind]

I’d just like to touch on a few things that were said throughout this thread. First I recent what Max says here as I'm certain many feel about my thread.

I've been in and around gaming forums for well over a decade and there are always a few people who make it their purpose to damage and destroy what someone else is trying to build. Statements like "it's obvious that this forum <whatever>" are easy to make, damaging to the site (almost always intentionally so) and more often than not -- especially coming from habitual whiners -- complete rubbish.

I’ve enjoyed this forum for many reasons and for many years and think I’ve brought to the table a great deal of good information, and a great deal of educated debate. Why would you accuse me of trying to destroy what someone else is trying to build and on top of it intentional?

It appeared in the past that everything was fine with my postings until I became suspicious of online gaming and began sharing with other members here my endless research and the possibilities of not getting a fair game. There’s no need for me to participate in the rogue rip off casino threads (although on the rare occasion I do), since that appears to be endless and myself was never involved in any of that when I played online. But because I question and challenge posters for confirmed facts rather then for hear say, is no different then someone challenging me for the same and that in itself doesn’t give you the right to classify me a habitual whiner. Your name slugging fest considering me a habitual whiner, habitual vandal, and troll, because I constantly stress the importance of being an educated gambler, and if that isn’t flaming I’m not sure what is. Bryan said you don't hate my guts. Based on those comments I would have to disagree, and find it surprising he thanked your post after taking into consideration what you said. What would happen to me if I said that about you?

I think I’ve opened the eyes of many online gamblers that were just taking the words of others. Gambling and losing money is part of the gambling deal, my only concerns are losing it fairly. I got pissed off maybe more then once and you have the nerve to run me over with a steam roller. My contributions are all worthless now because I disagree with something here?

This site deals with gambling conversations, and sometimes emotions especially losing emotions run a stray. I tend to think that posters need to understand that and find a way of having more patients when that happens. Yet, there are posters here that seem to be waiting on the sidelines endlessly for their opportunity to strike, as their always the first ones there striking.

As far as you or anyone else that wants to endlessly stress the point that favoritism doesn’t exist here, are in complete denial. Favoritism exists in every walk of life; friends, family, the work place, business transactions, and that list is endless. So for you to say it doesn’t exist here, try blowing that smoke up someone else's butt.

I agree the title I choose for this thread was out of line, but will admit that after opening that e-mail, I responded with an emotion which is something I’m aware of not doing but let myself down. We’re not machines here including you and unfortunately it takes a great deal of practice and wisdom to control those emotions.

One last question if you don’t mind. I have 3 infractions, what are the chances of me making it to ten without being permanently banned?

I never had or intend to present myself as a Martyr here or anywhere else. Whoever mentioned that is viewing my opinions like Max says here: "what you see depends a lot on the eyes you use for looking"

 

[Simmo!]

@4oak: I think even if I had started a thread entitled "CM Kangaroo Court" and started it with the line "I was going to pm Bryan, but am convinced it would do no good since it’s becoming obvious that this forum favors certain members." I'd get some harsh words from Bryan and Max who spend their lives looking after this baby, don't you? It's instantly and deliberately provocative and confrontational. You expect them to sit back and go "You know what? You're absolutely right. Well, I'll be damned!"?

You're taking things too personally accusing Max of hating you IMO. It's not about you, it's about what you said and how you said it.

And that aside, why does it even matter that some people appear to be favourites (ignoring the fact, once again, that it's not who they are but what you say and more importantly, how you say it that wins you friends)? It's beyond me why anyone would even care tbh. If I was at a forum where I felt victimised or unwanted, or where the membership annoyed me, I simply wouldn't stick around.

Or I'd stick those people on ignore and get on with it.

Not saying I want you to leave - I agree with others that, normally, your opinions add something to the forum but I do think you are being a bit over-sensitive myself. Plus we covered the whole bruised ego/favouritism topic in another thread recently so it's just going over the same ground.

We'll never keep everyone happy and we're not here to. We're here to try and make this forum enjoyable for those people who come to engage in industry discussion and 9 times out of 10 they couldn't give a toss for someone arguing over he said/she said stuff.

 

[felicie]

One of the biggest issues on the Forum is that Posters are constantly 'baited' with sarcastic remarks. It sometime doesn't help reporting issues because they are not always considered.

I have reported posts in the past and the mods have replied to the individual in a very tame manner. Consistent sarcasm, baiting and attacking other posters is OK when done by some and not others.

This problem has been highlighted by several members and is consistently overlooked.

In any event, my purpose is not to turn this into a bashing thread and I will also refrain 'Thanking' as it has already started to become a thank fest.

Nate

Very well put and simply the truth. Thanks Nate

 

[LaHutti]

Sorry, but you guys have to be kidding.
If you would ... (I wouldn't) go through Nifty's posts on this forum, half the time they're not just sarcastic remarks, but he's telling people more or less straight to their faces, that they're stupid, for having the opinions they have. Don't tell me, that this is not a known fact among our moderators. In every other post, he makes the statement that "The intelligent" people on this forum knows that what he is saying is correct, implying that everyone with a different opnion are stupid.
Now when that happens once too often, how on earth can you guys blame people for swinging back at a person like that, and how the hell can you wonder, why this keeps comming up ?????
We've seen it over and over and over, and the moderators keep denying it ? People have been banned, have their "thanks" buttons removed and what have we, over stupid shit, started by Nifty.
Sorry, but are you guys blind, or just in total denial about the facts here ???
How can you even say, that it has nothing to do with the persons, but it's what they say, and the way thy say it ? GEEZ do you even READ what Nifty is saying, OR the way he says it almost every single day ? Most other people do, and must be wondering....
Well...one can only shut up about the obvious facts being denied for so long, and there it is...again.
And no Nifty...I do NOT want to search for posts as examples of anything, because everyone, who has spent more than a day and a half on this forum, know that I'm right.

 

[Simmo!]

@LaHutti:What you are saying might be right. But the way you said it is rude and disrespectful IMO... no different to what you are saying Nifty does in fact! I'm not going to infract you though because you're one of my "favourites"

PS. Those who don't like Nifty or any other poster for that matter, please, please, please just put them on Ignore! Over and over again people point out the tools available in this forum to help you get over personal issues and time and time again people decide they prefer the drama. Just do it and let's get back to proper issues.

 

[LaHutti]

@LaHutti:What you are saying might be right. But the way you said it is rude and disrespectful IMO... no different to what you are saying Nifty does in fact! I'm not going to infract you though because you're one of my "favourites"

PS. Those who don't like Nifty or any other poster for that matter, please, please, please just put them on Ignore!

Simmo...I've never been anyones favourites before..lol....and you are absolutely right, if you see me posting like that every single day, I would probably not last long. Nifty does it every single day, and keeps surviving the people he picks a fight with. THAT'S what's so hard for people to understand, and what pees people off, and THAT'S the reason why this bs keeps comming up imo.
I don't know how you guys miss that.

 

[Simmo!]

Simmo...I've never been anyones favourites before..lol....and you are absolutely right, if you see me posting like that every single day, I would probably not last long. Nifty does it every single day, and keeps surviving the people he picks a fight with. THAT'S what's so hard for people to understand, and what pees people off, and THAT'S the reason why this bs keeps comming up imo.
I don't know how you guys miss that.

Now that's a MUCH better way of putting it

We do see what's going on and we do take actions behind the scenes - there are conversations and stuff does happen. Doesn't mean we get it right every time though - sometimes we are over-tolerant just like sometimes we act a bit hastily.

Anyway, I for one am happy to listen to - and consider - anyone's opinion as long as it's put respectfully and in a reasonable manner.

 

[funeral979]

Sorry, but you guys have to be kidding.
If you would ... (I wouldn't) go through Nifty's posts on this forum, half the time they're not just sarcastic remarks, but he's telling people more or less straight to their faces, that they're stupid, for having the opinions they have. Don't tell me, that this is not a known fact among our moderators. In every other post, he makes the statement that "The intelligent" people on this forum knows that what he is saying is correct, implying that everyone with a different opnion are stupid.
Now when that happens once too often, how on earth can you guys blame people for swinging back at a person like that, and how the hell can you wonder, why this keeps comming up ?????
We've seen it over and over and over, and the moderators keep denying it ? People have been banned, have their "thanks" buttons removed and what have we, over stupid shit, started by Nifty.
Sorry, but are you guys blind, or just in total denial about the facts here ???
How can you even say, that it has nothing to do with the persons, but it's what they say, and the way thy say it ? GEEZ do you even READ what Nifty is saying, OR the way he says it almost every single day ? Most other people do, and must be wondering....
Well...one can only shut up about the obvious facts being denied for so long, and there it is...again.
And no Nifty...I do NOT want to search for posts as examples of anything, because everyone, who has spent more than a day and a half on this forum, know that I'm right.

Thank you for saying what so many of us have wanted to say for a long time.

Years ago, before Nifty was a member here, we didn't have all these threads popping up about the way members are being treated, petty arguments, thanking priveleges taken away, etc etc etc. Is that a coincidence??

Sure, there was drama, but it wasn't in your face down right rude and sarcastic like we now see on the forums everyday. Funny how one poster can bring down the whole vibe of the forum.

How many threads have been closed and members banned because of his goading??
I really mean no disrespect, but perhaps another outlet besides an internet forum would be better suited for this posters anger towards life or whatever the case may be.

 

[jetset]

@4oak: I think even if I had started a thread entitled "CM Kangaroo Court" and started it with the line "I was going to pm Bryan, but am convinced it would do no good since it’s becoming obvious that this forum favors certain members." I'd get some harsh words from Bryan and Max who spend their lives looking after this baby, don't you? It's instantly and deliberately provocative and confrontational. You expect them to sit back and go "You know what? You're absolutely right. Well, I'll be damned!"?

You're taking things too personally accusing Max of hating you IMO. It's not about you, it's about what you said and how you said it.

And that aside, why does it even matter that some people appear to be favourites (ignoring the fact, once again, that it's not who they are but what you say and more importantly, how you say it that wins you friends)? It's beyond me why anyone would even care tbh. If I was at a forum where I felt victimised or unwanted, or where the membership annoyed me, I simply wouldn't stick around.

Or I'd stick those people on ignore and get on with it.

Not saying I want you to leave - I agree with others that, normally, your opinions add something to the forum but I do think you are being a bit over-sensitive myself. Plus we covered the whole bruised ego/favouritism topic in another thread recently so it's just going over the same ground.

We'll never keep everyone happy and we're not here to. We're here to try and make this forum enjoyable for those people who come to engage in industry discussion and 9 times out of 10 they couldn't give a toss for someone arguing over he said/she said stuff.

Well said, imo, Simmo.

I find myself wrestling with the 4oak conundrum; here's a guy that has apparently already concluded that everything to do with online gambling is a rip-off (his posts repeatedly express the view). He no longer gambles online, yet still frequents this and perhaps other online gambling forums, usually fulminating against the industry, the RTP disclosure issue, the importance of government regulation or whingeing about other posters, moderators and mein host himself here.

On the plus side, he is capable of good arguments when he disciplines himself, and has clearly spent an enormous amount of time looking for factual information to support his contentions, often with frustrating outcomes.

Where does his interest lie? Is it an altruistic and commendable desire to warn others that the industry is unsafe and should be eschewed? Is it a personal crusade against what he perceives as an evil entity that must be exposed? Is it frustration because he has been unable to make headway in disseminating his opinions and converting others to his convictions? Is it merely a more mundane desire to remain in touch with an industry he despises? Hopefully it is not a need for personal profile boosting.

I've not been able to form a conclusion, and unfortunately the issue has become clouded by the addition of this personal antipathy with some members and moderators here, and the imo mistaken allegation that favouritism rules...a view that some members support, and others do not. Regrettably that is a debate that routinely goes nowhere but is repeatedly and negatively resurrected.

I can therefore only suggest the advice already expressed so many times here by others - use the site facilities if a particular poster is bugging you - please don't clog up the forum with yet another testy thread on members who just p*** you off, and the licence they are allegedly given by the mods.

 

[maxd]

I pretty much agree with all of the recent posts but feel I need to add this: no matter how much person X pisses you off that is (a) no excuse to respond by attacking them on the forums and (b) is no justification for calling Casinomeister a shit heap, or whatever the phrase de jour might be.

As pretty much every one is saying there are constructive ways and means of addressing one's complaints. Still, some forum members keep saying "I fight back on the forums because you guys never listen". That's BS -- as we've shown (with proof) time and again -- and it's a piss-poor excuse for ignoring our directions regarding the reporting/Ignore facilities.

If you're old enough to post here you should be responsible enough to hold your tongue and hit the Report and/or Ignore button(s). At no point are you free to decide "don't like doing it that way, I slag them off on the forum instead". That is no longer an option and you'll be penalized if you do it, regardless of what you think your personal reasons or justification may be.

And for those that have decided that CM is a lost cause and that our ways and means of handling things are terminally inadequate I put it to you straight: you know where the door is. Use it if you must but keep your "this place sucks" messages to yourself. Play ball or piss off but we've had enough pointless belly-aching thanks very much. Feel free to PM us your parting thoughts but if you find yourself posting such grumbles then YOU are part of the problem and what you are doing is not even close to being part of the solution.

Either way, have a nice day.

PS. As much as some of you would like to blame Nifty and Nifty alone for the troubles we've been having on the forums recently I have to tell you that you are seriously mistaken. There are many contributors to the Bickersville ambiance that so many thread have acquired and all of you that are contributing to the problem deserve your share of the blame.

If person X is being sarcastic/bitchy/whatever you have two choices:

1. do as we have asked and Report the thing and/or Ignore person X. Yes, this assumes that you have faith in us to deal with things. If you don't why are you here?
2. assume that you know best and "fight back" on the forums, or whatever you want to call it. In other words ignore our strongly worded and often-repeated advice to let us deal with it and take it into you own hands.

As we've seen time and time again option #2 solves nothing and only makes things worse. In other words if you take option #2 you become part of the problem, period. Justify it to yourself however you like but if you drag it out into the forums you are just another discipline problem in the schoolyard and you'd added yourself to the list of antagonists.

What it boils down to is this: deal with things as we have strongly and repeatedly requested you do or else you only have yourself to blame for the very things you are complaining about.

We will handle things and we need to do it our way and in our own time. Full stop. If we need your assistance we'll ask for it, or you can PM us your advice, but taking it into your own hands only means we have to start dealing with you too because you've become part of the problem. Help solve the problem by doing as we ask. Don't become the problem by assuming that you know better than us how to deal with it. Trust us, you almost certainly don't. And if you did the forums would not be the place you'd be telling us or anyone else about it.

 

[The Dude]

...
I think I’ve opened the eyes of many online gamblers that were just taking the words of others. Gambling and losing money is part of the gambling deal, my only concerns are losing it fairly. I got pissed off maybe more then once and you have the nerve to run me over with a steam roller. My contributions are all worthless now because I disagree with something here?

It was more than merely disagreeing - please read your initial post and perhaps you'll understand why Max responded as he did. It can be a two way street in Casinomeisterland.

I agree the title I choose for this thread was out of line, but will admit that after opening that e-mail, I responded with an emotion which is something I’m aware of not doing but let myself down. We’re not machines here including you and unfortunately it takes a great deal of practice and wisdom to control those emotions.

Noted - appreciate the candor.

One last question if you don’t mind. I have 3 infractions, what are the chances of me making it to ten without being permanently banned?

Depends on the infraction. We are trying to utilize the infraction system as a tool to make everyone aware on when postings go astray. Infractions can be warnings (yellow cards) that don't count for diddly squat except to warn. Red card infractions count as points (5-20 points) and can be given for minor infractions like "creating a bad vibe" "derailing threads" to the more serious "flaming" or "dissing the mods". Once a member racks up 50 points within a couple of days they end up in the "less than zero" user group for a few days until the points wear off. It's kind of like being sent to your room for a time-out.

The mods and I don't like banning anyone besides spammers. We ban or suspend normal members as a last resort - and it's usually done with more than "good cause". We can be pretty tolerant at times. Yet I've been criticized in the past for some of the banishments I've handed out, but I have met these critiques with open ears.

Simmo...I've never been anyones favourites before..lol....and you are absolutely right, if you see me posting like that every single day, I would probably not last long. Nifty does it every single day, and keeps surviving the people he picks a fight with. THAT'S what's so hard for people to understand, and what pees people off, and THAT'S the reason why this bs keeps comming up imo.
I don't know how you guys miss that.

Nifty has had his share of infractions and suspensions. I still don't understand why some of you have not noticed this. We have also stated that we have discussed this in private as well.

...We do see what's going on and we do take actions behind the scenes - there are conversations and stuff does happen. Doesn't mean we get it right every time though - sometimes we are over-tolerant just like sometimes we act a bit hastily...

What he said.

...Years ago, before Nifty was a member here, we didn't have all these threads popping up about the way members are being treated, petty arguments, thanking priveleges taken away, etc etc etc. Is that a coincidence??..

Nifty has been a member since 2001, so you're going waaay back.

Actually, there has been a lot of "to and fro" between members over the years. There have always been petty arguments, some of which have led to meltdowns, and vicious flame-wars. Actually the forum is a lot tamer then it was a few years ago when we had some really nasty spats. But then I am looking at the forum as a whole.

...On the plus side, he (4ofakind) is capable of good arguments when he disciplines himself, and has clearly spent an enormous amount of time looking for factual information to support his contentions, often with frustrating outcomes....

I feel the same way about 4ofakind, that's why threads like this really put me off.

It may not seem like it 100% of the time, but I appreciate everyone's input here. Sometimes certain members piss me off, but after the smoke clears things are usually cool with me. Those who have met me know that I am pretty easy going. It is against my nature to be a dickhead. I try to be as fair and even handed when it comes to dealing with spats and complaints - and if it seems that I favor other members over others, it's totally unintentional.

 

[The Dude]

Moved to the attic.

 

[The Dude]

I'm also closing this thread since it's turning into an attack on one of our members (Nifty). If this thread was about you, you would expect me to do the same thing.

And just a heads up. I don't expect to ever have to do this again. Grow up people.