Club World Group and Cashout Delays?

[pianoman]

Snow?

Melbourne.

Oztralia.

38 degrees celsius here today.






ClubWorld ?

Best on the planet !
Entire group...

Trust me.

 

[pianoman]

let the results speak...

Just wanted to share this -
took a bit of time to highlight what matters.

I'm a loser in just about anything as a gambler.
From 3 floors up my cat only lands on it's feet when there's no money on it ...

Reckon however the results since going to clubworld 4 mths back are significant - hey?

Only reason I'm still in the game I'd say................

 

[jemc173]

This is just so interesting.

I had enough money in my account that it would take 3 cashouts to get it all because of their limits.

The first cashout came on the 14th. Since that time I have had several declines, delays and excuses but never a 2nd payment.
The delays and waiting played on my patience and I lost control while waiting and lost 2000usd. I still have a withdrawal that they still will not process and now another weekend is here and more temptation and more waiting. I am certain that they are only making me wait to tempt me to gamble it all away. it makes me very angry.
I had read the thread in which they were super strict with an arbitrary, poorly written term that is inconclusive about not paying a college student, per se, because there was a term broken. and no matter what the terms are the terms and when they are broken then they must be enforced.
Well then. It seems to me that since this group keeps breaking their terms then they are not entitled to keep the 2000usd that I lost back to them while waiting for a withdrawal that was past due. They clearly broke there own terms, correct? Terms are written and must be adhered to strictly both ways. I think that they owe me the 2000 back plus should process my withdrawals that are over 2 weeks delayed.
Would this not be the proper thing then? If I break their terms then they keep my money. If they break the terms then they cannot keep my money. Correct?

 

[Nifty29]

This is just so interesting.

I had enough money in my account that it would take 3 cashouts to get it all because of their limits.

The first cashout came on the 14th. Since that time I have had several declines, delays and excuses but never a 2nd payment.
The delays and waiting played on my patience and I lost control while waiting and lost 2000usd. I still have a withdrawal that they still will not process and now another weekend is here and more temptation and more waiting. I am certain that they are only making me wait to tempt me to gamble it all away. it makes me very angry.
I had read the thread in which they were super strict with an arbitrary, poorly written term that is inconclusive about not paying a college student, per se, because there was a term broken. and no matter what the terms are the terms and when they are broken then they must be enforced.
Well then. It seems to me that since this group keeps breaking their terms then they are not entitled to keep the 2000usd that I lost back to them while waiting for a withdrawal that was past due. They clearly broke there own terms, correct? Terms are written and must be adhered to strictly both ways. I think that they owe me the 2000 back plus should process my withdrawals that are over 2 weeks delayed.
Would this not be the proper thing then? If I break their terms then they keep my money. If they break the terms then they cannot keep my money. Correct?

It sucks that Club World did not pay your winnings in a timely manner - this is certainly legitimate grounds for a complaint. You might consider contacting the rep here (Tom) for assistance.

On the other hand, blaming anyone but yourself for losing the $2000 is ridiculous. It's like seeing a gun on the ground, picking it up and shooting someone with it, then claiming it was the fault of the person who left the gun there. Nobody forced you to login and reverse the cashout and play some more.

You lost the money - accept that you alone are responsible.

Cashout timeframes are not part of the terms and conditions, so your comparison to the other issue with CW and the college student is so way off it isn't funny IMO. Interesting that you would refer to it in your very first post.

Put your loss down to a bad decision and learn for next time. We have all been there and done that at some point.

 

[Mickioh]

:smilewink:Nifty - been reading all these posts and see what a bad attitude you have. I am completely new to the board and wasn't sure where to post my question. I made a mistake of posting 3 times because I didn't see my post and didn't think I had done it right. You jumped on me without asking why I did that - just assumed I was "rude" in your opinion. Why not try and be a little nicer in 2011. Happy New Year Nifty.

 

[ksech]

@jemc173, You need to take into consideration it's holiday time. I know it's no excuse, but even ewallets will post they aren't doing transactions on certain days due to the holidays. The casino isn't responsible if you decide to reverse your withdrawal, you are. And there are no T&Cs for ANY casino which will state the casino is responsible if the player plays back all their "winnings". If there was, the majority here would all be standing in line waiting for recompensation.

@Mickioh, yes, Nifty could have been a tad more patient, but before a mod comes on and tells you, you are cross-posting and deleting/combining posts, perhaps you should take the time to read some of the forum rules first.

Here is the link to the FAQs for the forum...
https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/help/

Here is the link to the accredited section...
https://www.casinomeister.com/accredited-casinos/

Here is the link to the rogue section...
https://www.casinomeister.com/rogue-casinos/

Here is a link to the Pitch-A-Bitch section (PAB)...
https://www.casinomeister.com/player-arbitration-pab/

Please take the time to read some of this stuff to prevent future "sarcasm" from some of the more prominent members of the forum. This is a great place with tons of experience in every form of online gambling. Hope you stay and join the community.

 

[Mickioh]

Thank you for your kind advice - I did read the how to post new messages, but didn't see on there where to go to post. I just wanted to post a new message and not reply to a previous one, but obviously I'm missing something. Will try to be more careful - Happy New year!

 

[greasemonkey]

I am obviously not a fan of CWC, so you can take my opinion for what it is. BUT....

It sucks that Club World did not pay your winnings in a timely manner - this is certainly legitimate grounds for a complaint. You might consider contacting the rep here (Tom) for assistance.

Good Advice.

On the other hand, blaming anyone but yourself for losing the $2000 is ridiculous. It's like seeing a gun on the ground, picking it up and shooting someone with it, then claiming it was the fault of the person who left the gun there. Nobody forced you to login and reverse the cashout and play some more.

You lost the money - accept that you alone are responsible.

I don't think it's that cut and dry. IF they would have followed their own terms then jemc would have been paid and not played, correct?

I know that you REALLLLLLLLY love club world Nifty, but coming to their defense in every single occasion and shouting down anyone with a complaint against them is just becoming nauseating.

Cashout timeframes are not part of the terms and conditions, so your comparison to the other issue with CW and the college student is so way off it isn't funny IMO. Interesting that you would refer to it in your very first post.

Firstly, if it is "interesting" about jemc's first post then it is even MORE Interesting that you would come to the defense of CWC so quickly at every turn. Some may think that you are paid to post such comments. I of course don't but who am I? Still, it is "interesting" as you say.

Regardless, here is a term. Term number 11 in their terms.

11. With the exception of Network Progressive Jackpot wins, the maximum withdrawal per week is $/£/€3,000. As such cash out requests of a larger amount will be paid in weekly instalments.

If this wasn't adhered to then they certainly seem to have broken the terms that they have on their own sight.

I took jemc's comment to be one of showing the hypocrisy of terms. How could they keep thousands from a winner if that winner broke terms that in no way helped them win but not refund a loser if the casino broke terms that aided in or caused that loss.

 

[ksech]

I'm not sticking up for Nifty here, but the way I interpreted jemc173's post wasn't due to broken terms, but to the fact that the casino didn't pay him/her in the time frame they thought they should have been paid in and they reversed their withdrawal request and lost. Did the poster take into account it's holiday time? How was their withdrawal to be processed (QT, wire transfer)? I know QT has had a notice up for a week before Christmas stating no transactions would take place on certain days.

It's not the casinos problem that jemc173 lost patience and played the money back, there is NO term for that. Jemc173 can't use the CWC problem with the student term as a standard to go by, because this isn't even the same issue (unless jemc173 is a student? or lives in France or the area of Markham Ontario).

I'm not even sure if they have broken any terms in this case. Perhaps jemc173 should talk to Maxd to see if they have a case for a PAB (before posting anything further).

 

[gaydave]

It looks like the casino definitely broke terms. That looks obvious. jemc173 says that he got paid once on the 14th. That is almost 3 weeks ago. He says he is still waiting on some amount of money. No Holiday lasts that long.

I'm not sure if jemc173 can get all that money back but he makes a compelling point about double standards here doesn't he?

It's like if a player breaks even an ambiguous term then he must lose all of his money. If the casino breaks a term then too bad, so sad for you but don't try and hold them accountable.

 

[XOXOXOXOXOX]

or lives in France or the area of Markham Ontario).

whats the deal with that? can someone enlighten me pls.

 

[Nifty29]

:smilewink:Nifty - been reading all these posts and see what a bad attitude you have. I am completely new to the board and wasn't sure where to post my question. I made a mistake of posting 3 times because I didn't see my post and didn't think I had done it right. You jumped on me without asking why I did that - just assumed I was "rude" in your opinion. Why not try and be a little nicer in 2011. Happy New Year Nifty.

Excuse me?

I would call posting the exact same thing in 3 different threads, and then attacking someone who was suggesting that it wasn't the right way to go about it as a 'bad attitude'.

If you didn't see your post, why go to another thread and post it again? and then again? Why didn't you try posting it again in the same thread? At least it would have been obvious you were having issues.

I didn't assume it was rude - multiple posting IS rude - it's like shoving it in everyone's face as if your question is more important than anyone elses'. I might have even apologised for being sarcastic in trying to help you, but your subsequent remarks about my 'attitude' tells me it wasn't misplaced.

I am obviously not a fan of CWC, so you can take my opinion for what it is. BUT....



Good Advice.



I don't think it's that cut and dry. IF they would have followed their own terms then jemc would have been paid and not played, correct?

Yes it is cut and dried. How do you know that jemc wouldn't have re-deposited $2k over the course of a week and lost it all? You don't and neither does anyone else. In fact, they may have even lost LESS by reversing a set amount and losing it - we will never know, because jemc did reverse and lose under no duress from anybody.

I know that you REALLLLLLLLY love club world Nifty, but coming to their defense in every single occasion and shouting down anyone with a complaint against them is just becoming nauseating.

The only think that is nauseating is your ignorance of the facts in relation to my relationship with Club World Casino:
From: Jan 1 2010 Submit



To: Jan 1 2011


Next >>

Date Transaction Amount
10/8/2010 1:06:21 AM DF-NETeller Deposit Approved! $100.00
10/8/2010 1:06:21 AM DF-NETeller Deposit Requested $100.00
10/6/2010 2:29:54 PM Slot Tournaments Withdrawal Approved! ($0.01)
10/6/2010 2:29:54 PM Slot Tournaments Withdrawal Requested ($0.01)
9/21/2010 3:13:30 PM Manager Deposit Approved! $0.00
9/21/2010 3:13:30 PM Manager Deposit Requested $0.00
8/17/2010 11:53:07 PM Slot Tournaments Withdrawal Approved! ($10.00)
8/17/2010 11:53:07 PM Slot Tournaments Withdrawal Requested ($10.00)
8/17/2010 11:51:16 PM DF-Moneybookers Deposit Approved! $50.00
8/17/2010 11:51:16 PM DF-Moneybookers Deposit Requested $50.00
1 2

<< Back

Date Transaction Amount
8/16/2010 8:31:33 AM Redeem Comp Points Deposit Approved! $11.51
8/16/2010 8:31:33 AM Redeem Comp Points Deposit Requested $11.51
8/14/2010 12:01:50 PM Slot Tournaments Deposit Approved! $3.12
8/14/2010 12:01:50 PM Slot Tournaments Deposit Requested $3.12
8/14/2010 8:55:23 AM Slot Tournaments Withdrawal Approved! ($0.01)
8/14/2010 8:55:23 AM Slot Tournaments Withdrawal Requested ($0.01)
1/4/2010 7:15:45 AM Coupon redeemed $50.00
1/4/2010 7:15:45 AM DF-NETeller Deposit Approved! $25.00
1/4/2010 7:15:45 AM DF-NETeller Deposit Requested $25.00
1/4/2010 7:04:34 AM Coupon requested

Any comments Greasemonkey?

This is a prime example of members who, when bereft of any logical counter-argument, descend into labelling those who don't agree with them as 'shills' and "paid lackeys" of the casinos - simply because they happen to agree with the casinos' point of view. You can see quite clearly that the reality i.e. the facts are very different.

If you were any sort of decent person you would apologise for making a false accusation of a serious nature. (it may not be serious to you, but when someone suggests I make comments and voice opinions at the behest of a commercial entity for profit, I take it very seriously)

Does the fact that you hate CW indicate that you are a 'shill' for their competitors?



Firstly, if it is "interesting" about jemc's first post then it is even MORE Interesting that you would come to the defense of CWC so quickly at every turn. Some may think that you are paid to post such comments. I of course don't but who am I? Still, it is "interesting" as you say.

Did they also pay me to say that jemc should make a complaint and that it was justified? I hope I'm not relying on my payment for that paragraph to feed my family

Regardless, here is a term. Term number 11 in their terms.

11. With the exception of Network Progressive Jackpot wins, the maximum withdrawal per week is $/£/€3,000. As such cash out requests of a larger amount will be paid in weekly instalments.

If this wasn't adhered to then they certainly seem to have broken the terms that they have on their own sight.

In that term, on their SITE, they state they will pay weekly - and they clearly didn't, so we agree on that point. It is possible that the holiday period was the cause of the delay, however this should have been communicated to the player given they were under a stated payment arrangement. It is poor form IMO.

I took jemc's comment to be one of showing the hypocrisy of terms. How could they keep thousands from a winner if that winner broke terms that in no way helped them win but not refund a loser if the casino broke terms that aided in or caused that loss.

So, based on your statements that jemc only reversed and played because the casino broke it's term regarding cashout times, then all play should be void right? What about if jemc had won $10k? Under your proposal, you would be here insisting that CW remove the $8k winnings. I sincerely doubt it, but the play was either void or is wasn't. You cannot seriously suggest that any player waiting one minute more than indicated for their withdrawal gets what is tantamount to risk-free play - if you lose, you can claim it back but if you win, you can keep it. Just think about that for a second.

It looks like the casino definitely broke terms. That looks obvious. jemc173 says that he got paid once on the 14th. That is almost 3 weeks ago. He says he is still waiting on some amount of money. No Holiday lasts that long.

I'm not sure if jemc173 can get all that money back but he makes a compelling point about double standards here doesn't he?

It's like if a player breaks even an ambiguous term then he must lose all of his money. If the casino breaks a term then too bad, so sad for you but don't try and hold them accountable.

You can spin what happened here any way you wish, but there are 3 indisputable facts:

1. The casino did not pay in the timeframe stated.

2. The player reversed $2k of their pending withdrawals.

3. The player played and lost the $2k they reversed.

The argument seems to be about who is at fault. The problem is that some people are suggesting that fact #1 was the cause of #2 and #3, when in fact they are seperate issues.

My opinion based on the facts is:

1. The casino is responsible for not paying in a timely manner.

2. The player is reponsible for reversing their withdrawal. It was their own decision to take that risk and nobody forced them to do so. The player could have uninstalled the casino etc to help resist the temptation or just simply decided against it. As I said, there is no reason to suggest that jemc wouldn't have deposited that much in the week they were waiting had the withdrawal been paid, so to say they wouldnt have risked that money if it weren't for the delay is illogical.

3. The player is responsible for losing their money.

I am constantly amazed at how little responsibility people are prepared to accept for their own actions.

 

[gaydave]

Nifty, I think that you are losing the point of this whole thing.

What should club world do now? They clearly broke terms we all agree now (I am glad that you now admit that and have changed course.).

So then if they didn't break terms and the poster lost the money it would be all good. But they DID break the terms. I am not interested in playing "what if". I am just saying that there cannot be a double standard allowed. If I break the terms I will lose all of my money. If they break the terms then......... what? They should lose any money gained also.

It cannot work in their favor both ways. They have broken terms. I don't care what the reason. Holiday is no excuse for 3 weeks of negligence. They broke terms. Give the guy his money back. He surely wouldnt have lost THAT money. He may have deposited and lost I will grant you that, but he DIDNT. He did lose money that should have been processed already. He may very well go on and lose money in the future. But not now. Not that money that should be safely in his account and out of the casino.

They broke terms. There has to be the same consequences as that of a player who breaks terms. If not then their terms are worthless and meaningless and should never be inforced at any time.

 

[Nifty29]

Nifty, I think that you are losing the point of this whole thing.

What should club world do now? They clearly broke terms we all agree now (I am glad that you now admit that and have changed course.).

So then if they didn't break terms and the poster lost the money it would be all good. But they DID break the terms. I am not interested in playing "what if". I am just saying that there cannot be a double standard allowed. If I break the terms I will lose all of my money. If they break the terms the
......... what? They should lose any money gaineid also.

It cannot work in their favor both ways. They have broken terms. I don't care what the reason. Holiday is no excuse for 3 weeks of negligence. They broke terms. Give the guy his money back. He surely wouldnt have lost THAT money. He may have deposited and lost I will grant you that, but he DIDNT. He did lose money that should have been processed already. He may very well go on and lose money in the future. But not now. Not that money that should be safely in his account and out of the casino.

They broke terms. There has to be the same consequences as that of a player who breaks terms. If not then their terms are worthless and meaningless and should never be inforced at any time.

If you are going to comment on my posts, you should at least read them properly.

I said from the beginning that the casino should have paid on time. At no time did I state any different.

The point that YOU are missing is that being made to wait longer than usual for a cashout doesn't give a player carte blanche to blow that money and expect the casino to credit any losses. It is the most ridiculously long bow I've seen drawn for a very long time . You are seriously living in fantasy land if you think that any casino ever would ever do that for any reason.

The simple fact is that the player blew some of their winnings and got angry about it - let's face it most people would - they just directed that anger in the wrong direction.

I can just imagine what the post would have been if they reversed and won...."I'm so glad CW didn't pay me! I reversed my cashout and hit a random jackpot! Boy I'm so glad I decided to reverse and play!!"

Jemc took a GAMBLE and LOST.

And THAT, gaydave, is the point.

 

[ksech]

whats the deal with that? can someone enlighten me pls.

Not sure, but it is in the Club World T&Cs. I found it when I reviewed the T&Cs during the student clause discussion. Club World has NOT addressed this, as far as I know. And the addition of France was new also.

 

[ksech]

The point that YOU are missing is that being made to wait longer than usual for a cashout doesn't give a player carte blanche to blow that money and expect the casino to credit any losses. It is the most ridiculously long bow I've seen drawn for a very long time . You are seriously living in fantasy land if you think that any casino ever would ever do that for any reason.

The simple fact is that the player blew some of their winnings and got angry about it - let's face it most people would - they just directed that anger in the wrong direction.

I agree, the casino was wrong by not paying when they plainly stated in their T&Cs they payout once a week. BUT, if going by this you all expect the casino should reinburse because the player is lacking in self-control, then every single member of this forum should be receiving money from casinos for breach of this term. (I'm sure Club World isn't the only casino who has reneged on a term such as this at one point or another).

So point me in the direction of "waiting for my refund cause the casino breached their own T&Cs" line. I'm sure I'm due some sort of recompense from the last 10 years.

 

[XOXOXOXOXOX]

Not sure, but it is in the Club World T&Cs. I found it when I reviewed the T&Cs during the student clause discussion. Club World has NOT addressed this, as far as I know. And the addition of France was new also.

this does not sound like a proper definition, as far as i know there is no legal jurisdictions named "the area of Markham in Canada."

Do they refer to the Town of Markham or Municipality of York or the whole Greater Toronto Area(GTA)??
would be nice if the rep will clarify.

10.does not currently accept any real money wagers from the legal jurisdictions of the Netherlands Antilles, Costa Rica, Israel or the area of Markham in Canada.

sorry- this probably belongs to the T&C thread.

 

[colly]

So point me in the direction of "waiting for my refund cause the casino breached their own T&Cs" line. I'm sure I'm due some sort of recompense from the last 10 years.

Me to- i would be rich!

I think most of us have kicked ourselves at some point for hitting the reverse button. I would personally love to see that button removed from all casinos- or the instant flush option but its not going to happen.

If it makes the Op feel better I recall back at WOL there was a thread on reversals and one player admitted to reversing and blowing a 25K royal flush- now that would really hurt!

I am usually safe from reversing a win over 500 but admit I have blown numerous smaller wins over the years. My fault entirely but I wish the option was removed- self control is NOT a gamblers strongest point.

In an attempt to compensate/control I now try to only play at casinos with pending less than 24 hrs or if they are 48hrs play these casinos first while I still have my gambling budget to allow play others without reversing

Cheers
Colly

 

[greasemonkey]

OK then. What should the casino do then? What is the consequence of them breaking terms?

If a player wins and breaks terms then the player must forfeit any and all winnings. If the player loses and breaks terms then who cares because the casino already has their money......
....now lets switch it. The player wins and the casino breaks terms. what should be the consequence? The player LOSES and the casino breaks tems. What should be the consequence?

SOMETHING must be done. As stated earlier, the casino cannot benefit when a player breaks terms and then also benefit when they break terms. You cannot hope to have the casinos have their cake and eat it too.

Now this particular casino likes to keep thousands if any term is broken. Well then, when they are the one's breaking the term then what?

That is the whole point that I am getting out of this. Not if jemc has self control or deserves money or whatever. Just that the casino cannot keep someone's money if they break terms and then not refund it if they are the term breakers.

 

[greasemonkey]

The only think that is nauseating is your ignorance of the facts in relation to my relationship with Club World Casino:


Any comments Greasemonkey?

Yes, thank you.

I made no statement about any fact of any relationship. Read more carefully before you start an arguement on yet another thread. It must be tiresome keeping up these types of posts with all the people that you anger with your undying backing of CW and the mods. This one wasn't needed. Read carefully. quoted at the bottom of this post.

This is a prime example of members who, when bereft of any logical counter-argument, descend into labelling those who don't agree with them as 'shills' and "paid lackeys" of the casinos - simply because they happen to agree with the casinos' point of view. You can see quite clearly that the reality i.e. the facts are very different.

If you were any sort of decent person you would apologise for making a false accusation of a serious nature. (it may not be serious to you, but when someone suggests I make comments and voice opinions at the behest of a commercial entity for profit, I take it very seriously)

I didn't label you. I clearly said that I don't believe that you are a shill or getting paid for your propaganda. I said that others might and that it was "interesting' the way you carried on for them. So you are making a false accusation of a false accusation

Not fun when somebody makes little vailed jabs and has you respond in anger now is it?

I certainly never came right out and said that you were a shill. You must have thought that I inferred it. Kinda "Nifty style" if you will.

Quite clearly the only one "bereft" of facts and intelligent opinion here is you once again.

Does the fact that you hate CW indicate that you are a 'shill' for their competitors?

sure. If that is what you think you are free to think it. I certainly won't be angry at you and I have read posts of yours that have made vailed jabs more outrageous than that so I am not shocked if you really do think it anyways.

Firstly, if it is "interesting" about jemc's first post then it is even MORE Interesting that you would come to the defense of CWC so quickly at every turn. Some may think that you are paid to post such comments. I of course don't but who am I? Still, it is "interesting" as you say.

Did they also pay me to say that jemc should make a complaint and that it was justified? I hope I'm not relying on my payment for that paragraph to feed my family
.[/QUOTE]



For now, Nifty, instead of us derailing the thread like it so often happens when you get going like this, lets just let the people voice their opinions on this subject and not get into a personal debate. I am going to abide by that. I hope that you will also. I hate when threads get derailed by bickering with you.

 

[colly]

OK lets all calm down!

WHile it sucks for the player =CWC broke a payment framework not a T and C.

CWC did not put the money back into the OP's account as sometimes happens while casinos are waiting for doc's- the OP took a very deliberate step to reverse a large chunk gambling on a further win and lost. The OP is responsible for there own actions. SHould CWC consider a goodwill gesture for their tardiness- probably = should that be the 2K definitley not.

Hypotheticals-Would the OP be be offering to pay back CWC if she won on that reversal- I think not. If CWC refused to pay such a win because the money shouldnt have been available as out of the payment timeframe would we be supporting them - once again I think not.

Yes CWC should have stuck to there timeframe but risking the 2 K was the OP's choice.

In the interests of openess let me say I do receive the odd free chip from CWC- but its based on play not defence. (LOL) and i will support or criticise both casinos or players based on WHO IS RESPONSIBLE as I see it (and I have both supported and criticised both in the past).

I dont see this forum as us v the casinos nor do I think we should always take the side of the casino or the OP but form an opinion on the evidence available to us.

Cheers

 

[greasemonkey]

OK lets all calm down!

WHile it sucks for the player =CWC broke a payment framework not a T and C.

CWC did not put the money back into the OP's account as sometimes happens while casinos are waiting for doc's- the OP took a very deliberate step to reverse a large chunk gambling on a further win and lost. The OP is responsible for there own actions. SHould CWC consider a goodwill gesture for their tardiness- probably = should that be the 2K definitley not.

Hypotheticals-Would the OP be be offering to pay back CWC if she won on that reversal- I think not. If CWC refused to pay such a win because the money shouldnt have been available as out of the payment timeframe would we be supporting them - once again I think not.

Yes CWC should have stuck to there timeframe but risking the 2 K was the OP's choice.

In the interests of openess let me say I do receive the odd free chip from CWC- but its based on play not defence. (LOL) and i will support or criticise both casinos or players based on WHO IS RESPONSIBLE as I see it (and I have both supported and criticised both in the past).

I dont see this forum as us v the casinos nor do I think we should always take the side of the casino or the OP but form an opinion on the evidence available to us.

Cheers

Now, before I say anything else I have to say. YES, it IS a term. It is under terms/conditions and it is term number 11. So that was broken.

Colly I don't disagree with you but I am thinking of this differently and not specifically to this case.

Lets take this particular case out of it. Not even talking about jemc now or whom was at fault or anything to do with this particualar scenario.



What is done of the casino breaks a term? Not in this case but in any case? Why is it OK for a casino to do it but if a player does it they lose all money? If you defend the casino then you are, in essence, saying it is OK for a casino to profit from a player mistake AND more importantly you are saying it is advantageous for them not to follow their own terms. Why would they? It increases their profits to not do it and if nobody holds them accountable then they are free to do it with no recourse.

Like has been said a million times. It cannot be tolerated that a casino breaks terms and it is ok but if a player does it then the casino gets to keep all of the money.

Going back to the student thing: How can they keep money for term breakage and also keep money when they break terms? It cannot be tolerated. Just giving a free chip or some rubbish isn't right. Heck, I bet the student would have given the casino a free chip or even $100 free for their mistake. That wasnt allowed though. ALL money was confiscated. Not cool if they don't have to lose out when they don't follow terms.

 

[colly]

Colly I don't disagree with you but I am thinking of this differently and not specifically to this case.

Lets take this particular case out of it. Not even talking about jemc now or whom was at fault or anything to do with this particualar scenario.

Perhaps in that case a new thread would be better?- certainly I am responding in the context of Jemc's position.

As a general principle T and C should be applied equally by BOTH casino and OP with the conseqences for both clearly stated.

This is something that is not currently addressed by casino T and C's and a "your rights if we break the terms (like a customer charter)" would be a great step forward.

Cheers

 

[jemc173]

What is done of the casino breaks a term? Not in this case but in any case? Why is it OK for a casino to do it but if a player does it they lose all money? If you defend the casino then you are, in essence, saying it is OK for a casino to profit from a player mistake AND more importantly you are saying it is advantageous for them not to follow their own terms. Why would they? It increases their profits to not do it and if nobody holds them accountable then they are free to do it with no recourse.

Like has been said a million times. It cannot be tolerated that a casino breaks terms and it is ok but if a player does it then the casino gets to keep all of the money.

.

I wanted to put a little "thanks" at the bottom of your post but I cannot figure out how to do it Greasemonky.

Nifty, you didn't understand what I was getting at here I don't believe. What I quoted from greasemonkey is exactly the point I was trying to make.

By the way, I didn't reverse the cashout. THEY DID. Several times actually and when I would ask support they had no idea why other than 'maybe it was a system error'.

Then they broke terms. Reversed my cashout without my consent and they did it several times and they did it after their terms for payout timeframes. Finally, I played some of it. My fault? sure. Would it have ever happened if they would have just followed their terms? NO.

They broke their terms. Why would they get a free pass when clearly they will never allow a player a free pass?

 

[ksech]

@jemc173, have you contacted Tom the casino rep for this group? He usually does pretty good sorting through this stuff. I'm sure they probably WON'T refund your 2k as you have to take responsibility for not using some self-control. You could have left it sitting there until your situation was straightened out. This is NOT the only group who does these withdrawal reversals, usually there is a reason behind it (and since no rep has come on board to defend the casino we are only hearing your side of the story), unless they are "rogue". What was your method of withdrawal, was it to an ewallet? Wire transfer? If a wire transfer, did your bank bounce it back to the casino?

Through your anger and lose of patience you are now blaming the casino for YOUR lack of self-control. Yes, the casino should have stayed within their payout time frame, BUT if it was a case of an ewallet/wire transfer issue then the casino is not to blame. And yes, using holiday time as an excuse is pretty lame, but you have to consider 2 weeks (I believe QT had their "holiday" times posted a week or two before the holidays), of money being tied up DUE to the holidays.

The issue of how fast the casinos take the deposit vs. how slow they are to return a win will always be cause for player dissatisfaction. My advice, before you post anything more, PM their rep (https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/) and see what happens. Maybe a goodwill gesture will see some of your money returned (although, IMO highly improbable).

 

[P.V.]

Read the entire thread and it appears to be a subterfuge on jemc173 behalf.

 

[Nifty29]

Read the entire thread and it appears to be a subterfuge on jemc173 behalf.

???

What's on your mind P.V. ?

 

[jemc173]

@jemc173, have you contacted Tom the casino rep for this group? He usually does pretty good sorting through this stuff. I'm sure they probably WON'T refund your 2k as you have to take responsibility for not using some self-control. You could have left it sitting there until your situation was straightened out. This is NOT the only group who does these withdrawal reversals, usually there is a reason behind it (and since no rep has come on board to defend the casino we are only hearing your side of the story), unless they are "rogue". What was your method of withdrawal, was it to an ewallet? Wire transfer? If a wire transfer, did your bank bounce it back to the casino?

Hi ksech403850,

My post indicated that I was paid once so far but that was 3 weeks back. It is for QT for the record. My particular situation has nothing to do with anything here at the moment. We are talking about casinos breaking terms with no consequences.

Through your anger and lose of patience you are now blaming the casino for YOUR lack of self-control. Yes, the casino should have stayed within their payout time frame, BUT if it was a case of an ewallet/wire transfer issue then the casino is not to blame. And yes, using holiday time as an excuse is pretty lame, but you have to consider 2 weeks (I believe QT had their "holiday" times posted a week or two before the holidays), of money being tied up DUE to the holidays.

Everyone needs to stop and really read what is being typed on these pages. Really read it and stop assuming that my objective is to get paid losses by the casino.

STOP IT. (not ksech specifically, but everyone who is posting about whether I have rights to losses specifically. I did not file a complaint here or with a rep).

My objective is to see accountability from the casinos. This particular group has no problem taking thousands from a player if they break terms. Now if they break terms you want to give them a free pass? WHY are you willing to do that? THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ME. I have not contacted anyone for anything nor do I plan at this point to file a complaint with this site. If you get past MY PERSONAL SITUATION for just a moment you may see this issue with more clarity.
Some of you can just NOT get past this point of "you lost - your fault". So what? Let's concentrate on the following:

When a casino breaks terms then what should be done? Should it be on a case by case basis? Should players who had terms broken against them get to act like a casino and Keep all winnings or get reimbursed all losses? That is exactly what happens to a casino if the player breaks a term. They either keep their winnings (your losses) or they keep their losses and often your deposit as well (their losses).
So then, if they break terms why are they not required to lose their money just like the player?
Again, for those having a really, really hard time understanding this --- This is not about my specific issue. IF anyone, at this point, answers to my specific situation then they are not very bright.
]

 

[ksech]

Since I'm not so bright...
I have never stated I was willing to give them a "free pass". I was simply trying to point out, in YOUR situation it may have been an ewallet issue (which apparently now seems the case as QT posted the days they weren't doing "business" due to the holidays). I agree, casinos who break terms need to be confronted. Perhaps, and I repeat once more, you need to speak to the casino rep to see if THIS is the reason your withdrawal was reversed, if so, then it isn't a case of the casino breaking terms, it's the ewallet.

In Danls' case, which has nothing to do with THIS case, he lied to everyone here and to those who went out on a limb for him trying to help him. Yes, the term is ambiguous, and it's been rehashed over and over again. Time will only tell what the casino does to change this term so others aren't caught unsuspectedly.

And once again, since I'm not so bright, your postings tend to lean towards your anger towards the casino for a term you think they broke. I interpreted your first posting as you felt the casino owed you your winnings back. Forgive me for misreading what you posted...

Well then. It seems to me that since this group keeps breaking their terms then they are not entitled to keep the 2000usd that I lost back to them while waiting for a withdrawal that was past due. They clearly broke there own terms, correct? Terms are written and must be adhered to strictly both ways. I think that they owe me the 2000 back plus should process my withdrawals that are over 2 weeks delayed.

 

[Nifty29]

Everyone needs to stop and really read what is being typed on these pages. Really read it and stop assuming that my objective is to get paid losses by the casino.

Ksech quoted you in the past post - "I think they owe me $2k because...."

Don't pretend you are trying to make it about casinos in general. If you wanted to do that you would not have mentioned your specific situation..

STOP IT. (not ksech specifically, but everyone who is posting about whether I have rights to losses specifically. I did not file a complaint here or with a rep).

You don't have the right to tell other members what they can and can't comment on. Grow up.

My objective is to see accountability from the casinos. This particular group has no problem taking thousands from a player if they break terms.

When did a casino break their own terms to take thousands from a player? Can you please point me to the thread?

If it is the danl situation, then don't bother - the casino didn't break any of their own terms. The argument in that case was about whether they considered him a student, not whether they broke their own terms. It turns out they classed him as a student, and hence confiscated his winnings according to their terms not in breach of their terms.

Maybe it is you who needs to stop and read.

Now if they break terms you want to give them a free pass? WHY are you willing to do that? THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ME. I have not contacted anyone for anything nor do I plan at this point to file a complaint with this site. If you get past MY PERSONAL SITUATION for just a moment you may see this issue with more clarity.

Who said anything about free passes. Everyone in this thread including me agreed that CW should have abided by their payment arrangement.

YOUR PERSONAL SITUATION is the very basis for your original post.

Are you saying you would have posted this if you had won with those reversed funds, or if you hadn't played them at all? Give me a break.

It is obvious to everyone that you were angry when you began the thread - hell I would be too if just flushed $2k down the toilet - but as I said earlier, you were angry at the wrong party.

Some of you can just NOT get past this point of "you lost - your fault". So what? Let's concentrate on the following:

When a casino breaks terms then what should be done? Should it be on a case by case basis? Should players who had terms broken against them get to act like a casino and Keep all winnings or get reimbursed all losses? That is exactly what happens to a casino if the player breaks a term. They either keep their winnings (your losses) or they keep their losses and often your deposit as well (their losses).
So then, if they break terms why are they not required to lose their money just like the player?

The point you were making, on more than one occasion in this thread, is that it was the casinos fault in the first place because they shouldn't have placed the funds back into your account, and that they owe you $2k as a result.

As I said, it is the very basis for your OP! Now, when just about everyone disagrees with you, you say "So what?"

It was the casinos fault that they didn't pay you on time......the rest was 100% down to you.

You also need to consider there is no sanction mentioned in the terms that results from the casino not paying on time. It doesn't say 'we will cover any losses incurred as the casino as a result of any delays we experience in paying you'. If it did, you would have a case. It doesn't, so you don't.

Again, for those having a really, really hard time understanding this --- This is not about my specific issue. IF anyone, at this point, answers to my specific situation then they are not very bright.

Trying to stifle debate by suggesting that further comments will only come from the mentally incompetent is just plain rude.

If you don't want people to comment on your specific situation - don't post about it in the first place.

At the end of the day, it is all academic anyway because they will never refund your $2k.

 

[JAMES50]

CCG has in the past year reversed my cash outs 3 times in the past 6 months with no explanation, cs or tom couldn't answer except to give me a free chip (whooppy)..We have deleted them as well as requested NO more of there offers.(they are honoring).They have gone to hell as well as some of the assholes in this place who make CM there world..To play online any longer just to lose or to have no hope of cashing out is totally obsurd..Of coarse this is my oppinion,,and is what matters to me..I will go to land based casinos,,Atleast I am being smiled at while being screwed....Good Luck to you all

 

[colly]

,Atleast I am being smiled at while being screwed..:

I've always been smiled at in that situation

Cheers
Colly

 

[jemc173]

Ksech quoted you in the past post - "I think they owe me $2k because...."

Don't pretend you are trying to make it about casinos in general. If you wanted to do that you would not have mentioned your specific situation..

Don't ever tell me what my intention or meaning was again. That is more than ignorant. You obviously have no idea what was in my mind and to make a statement that you know something is retarded. So stop being retarded. I said it wasnt about me. i meant it. Would u like it if i started calling you a shill? You sure do act like one.

Can you ever just make a response on this board without coming across as a horses a_ _?
without being insulting? Gawsh, I hate reading anything you type.

/////////////////////
Clearly you are of low intelligence or are hard headed. I was saying the above tongue in cheek. Giving an example. Can you only understand direct speak? Why don't you go and carry on one of your hundred or so OTHER arguements that you already have brewing on other threads than to comment on here you shill. By this time aren't you embarrassed to be constantly an uninformed, baiting, ignoramous? I am embarrassed for you since you don't have the capability obviously.

You don't have the right to tell other members what they can and can't comment on. Grow up.

I didn't say you couldnt comment. I said you werent bright if you couldnt get past the initial part of my experience. My point (as others can clearly see but a few cannot) isn't about me getting paid. If you were just a tad bit more open minded you could probably comprehend that.

"grow up"? Really? C'mon, Really? I feel sad for you and what is apparently a sad little existence.

When did a casino break their own terms to take thousands from a player? Can you please point me to the thread?

WTF R U talking about? When did I say that a casino broke terms and cost a player thousands? You really do have a reading comprehension issue don't you? I said if a player breaks terms the casino keeps thousands. READ. PAY? ATTENTION. ABSORB. QUIT INSERTING YOUR OWN BS. You want to fight online so badly..... so sad for you.

If it is the danl situation, then don't bother - the casino didn't break any of their own terms. The argument in that case was about whether they considered him a student, not whether they broke their own terms. It turns out they classed him as a student, and hence confiscated his winnings according to their terms not in breach of their terms.

I didn't say it was in breach of their terms. Your reading ability must be the worst ever. Really it must. You are arguing points you made in your own mind wierdo.

Maybe it is you who needs to stop and read.

Really? It is amazing when uninformed people are the only one's that don't realize that they are the uninformed. Wow. just wow for you. So sad really.

Who said anything about free passes. Everyone in this thread including me agreed that CW should have abided by their payment arrangement.

Then what should be done about this breach of their terms?

YOUR PERSONAL SITUATION is the very basis for your original post.

Was it now? Again, interjecting what YOU think was my motive rather than just listening to what my motive is. The essence of ignorance.
I told you my motive clear as day oh "Mr. defender of all that is Club World group". Pathetic really. How embarrassed you should be. I am for you.

It is obvious to everyone that you were angry when you began the thread - hell I would be too if just flushed $2k down the toilet - but as I said earlier, you were angry at the wrong party.

Is it now? It is obvious to everyone? I don't think so. Only "obvious" to those that cannot comprehend what is right in front of their eyes. YOU think that is the case. I don't. Nor did I state it was. The only thing obvious is that you like to belittle posters, bait them into arguements and act like a total wanker at all times.

I don't have enough invested in this forum to play nice-nice with some troll like you. Everyone else seems to be able to put their ideas in a mannered way. You do not and that is likely why you are embroiled in messy arguements at every turn. Especially relating to CW. So the gloves are off with you. I am new, but I don't like you or anything that you post or the way that you post it. Please don't offer me any advice in the future. Your opinion is worthless to me. Thank you.

The point you were making, on more than one occasion in this thread, is that it was the casinos fault in the first place because they shouldn't have placed the funds back into your account, and that they owe you $2k as a result.

As I said, it is the very basis for your OP! Now, when just about everyone disagrees with you, you say "So what?"

It was the casinos fault that they didn't pay you on time......the rest was 100% down to you.

That was not my POINT. It was my example. It is NOT the basis for my OP. Stop interjecting what you think my motive is.

If it did, you would have a case. It doesn't, so you don't.

A case for what exactly? I haven't went to any court, any rep, any mod, any complaint dept. Do you get that? Can you comprehend? I didn't lodge a "complaint" I certainly am not asking for your "help". I am not asking for money. I am asking for some sort of justice. Casinos get it both ways. That isn't right. If we lose because they are like lawyers with their terms then they should lose. Can we understand this concept nifty?

Trying to stifle debate by suggesting that further comments will only come from the mentally incompetent is just plain rude.

If you don't want people to comment on your specific situation - don't post about it in the first place.

At the end of the day, it is all academic anyway because they will never refund your $2k.

your postings make me vomit. I am not trying to stifle debate. quit derailing my threads into your a_ _ hole arguements. YOU are the obvious rude party on this board.
I was simply pointing out that if you are still commenting on MY SITUATION in specific then you are not grasping the point of the thread. Then I went out of my way to explain it. Then I mentioned that if after all that you STILL could not get past my situation and look at this as an entire issue (thus leaving me out of the equation) then you are not bright.

Congrats on that Nifty. You proved yourself to be of the dullest, nowhere near bright, because you obviously cannot understand posts.

 

[jemc173]

Since I'm not so bright...

Who said that? I only implied that if you cannot get past my personal experience and look at this whole issue. You seem to have done that. So why go and imply that I am stating your not bright?

I have never stated I was willing to give them a "free pass". I was simply trying to point out, in YOUR situation it may have been an ewallet issue (which apparently now seems the case as QT posted the days they weren't doing "business" due to the holidays). I agree, casinos who break terms need to be confronted. Perhaps, and I repeat once more, you need to speak to the casino rep to see if THIS is the reason your withdrawal was reversed, if so, then it isn't a case of the casino breaking terms, it's the ewallet.

I have checked. Its not the Ewallet. ksech I said "not ksech specifically". I meant I wasn't talking to you in specific. I quoted your post but wasnt just responding to you.

I think we are in total agreement then. We both agree that casinos should be confronted and should be held accountable as they demand of the players. There should be MORE terms for them also. Like qualifying documents in a certain time frame. Like having someone from banking available at all times to answer questions. Like responding to an email within 24 hours and responding specifically. Nothing makes me angrier than to have to contact back to live chat or email several times based on their schedule. I should contact once and either get the person I need to speak with or have whichever staff that I am speaking with make sure that I get a response from the right person. This doesn't happen, they just tell you to take more time out of your life or work and contact THEM back. It is so convoluted.

In Danls' case, which has nothing to do with THIS case, he lied to everyone here and to those who went out on a limb for him trying to help him. Yes, the term is ambiguous, and it's been rehashed over and over again. Time will only tell what the casino does to change this term so others aren't caught unsuspectedly.

2 things:

THIS is NOT a case. That is what I am saying over and over and over and over and over and over. THIS is NOT a CASE. I am not making a case for myself for goodness sakes. UGHHHHHHH.

However, In Danls' case, he broke terms. He had all money taken from him. What happens when the casino breaks terms? Nothing? Unacceptable. THAT IS MY POINT.

And once again, since I'm not so bright, your postings tend to lean towards your anger towards the casino for a term you think they broke. I interpreted your first posting as you felt the casino owed you your winnings back. Forgive me for misreading what you posted...

I understand that it was not written well and you cannot hear inflections and such over the internet. So I am not saying you aren't bright. I WOULD say your not bright if after reading all this you still couldn't move past MY particular situation. You clearly have grasped it though. So you must be VERY bright

UPDATE:

CWC banking dept not in today.

now 20 days since my last payment...

 

[maxd]

... That is more than ignorant. ... stop being retarded. ... a horses a_ _? ... Clearly you are of low intelligence ... aren't you embarrassed to be constantly an uninformed, baiting, ignoramous? ... (etc etc)

Before you get a ban nailed to your behind you might want to look over our Forum Rules (https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/help/). In particular the following should receive your special attention:

1.1 - No "Flaming": Please do not post any messages that harass, insult, belittle, threaten or flame another member or guest. Abusive behavior will not be tolerated and your account may be suspended. Please refrain from potty mouth language.

 

[BingoT]

Just my two cents.

It Saddens Me to see the word retarded where all here in this forum are pretty normal and have all fatalities working.
The word to use is Mentally Challenged or Handicapped or Disabilities.
The word retarded to me is like the F word.
If you like I would love to show you what Mentally Challenged or Handicapped adults & children are like & I bet you will never use that word again.
I am sorry but that word gets my goat if people use it in the wrong way.
I have worked many years with adults & children with disabilities.
Thanks
~T~

 

[jemc173]

Before you get a ban nailed to your behind you might want to look over our Forum Rules (https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/help/). In particular the following should receive your special attention:

Don't pretend you are trying to make it about casinos in general. If you wanted to do that you would not have mentioned your specific situation..

You don't have the right to tell other members what they can and can't comment on. Grow up.

Maybe it is you who needs to stop and read.

Are you saying you would have posted this if you had won with those reversed funds, or if you hadn't played them at all? Give me a break.

It is obvious to everyone that you were angry when you began the thread - hell I would be too if just flushed $2k down the toilet -

If you don't want people to comment on your specific situation - don't post about it in the first place.

So my response to this trolling gets me a warning? Yet this trolling of his is allowed to go on and cause an argument in most threads that he is involved in?

If that is the way it is on this forum then you wont need to ban me. I will just not be a party to it by my own decision. Having that type of poster rile everyone and then the members that are insulted by him get scolded for their response is not for me.

 

[RedAndi]

So my response to this trolling gets me a warning? Yet this trolling of his is allowed to go on and cause an argument in most threads that he is involved in?

If that is the way it is on this forum then you wont need to ban me. I will just not be a party to it by my own decision. Having that type of poster rile everyone and then the members that are insulted by him get scolded for their response is not for me.

Got to say Jem the difference is not in what was said but in HOW it was said.
No reason for you to leave, just adjust (and edit) your words when you post in anger. The ignore button works wonders also
The name calling is something that just doesn't fly here.

 

[jemc173]

Just my two cents.

It Saddens Me to see the word retarded where all here in this forum are pretty normal and have all fatalities working.
The word to use is Mentally Challenged or Handicapped or Disabilities.
The word retarded to me is like the F word.
If you like I would love to show you what Mentally Challenged or Handicapped adults & children are like & I bet you will never use that word again.
I am sorry but that word gets my goat if people use it in the wrong way.
I have worked many years with adults & children with disabilities.
Thanks
~T~

As I told T personally. I apologize if I offended any reader other than nifty with the use of any word. That was not my intent at all. I admittedly did try to offend Nifty however. I don't apologize for that in the least and wish I could have done it more effectively. For everyone else, I apologize if I have offended any of you in any way. Truly. That is from my heart. I couldn't care less if I am banned after this fiasco but good people, like I feel most of you are, didn't deserve to feel offended from my post. Sorry sincerely.

 

[BingoT]

I understand Jemc173 Apologies Accepted
We all know we all say things out of anger.
They say "Time Heals All Wounds." & I know this is so true.
Lets all move forward for a better tomorrow.
~T~

 

[ksech]

Grrr, I'm out of thanks usage.
@RedAndi, well stated, thank you
@Bingo T, very well stated, thank you

@jemc173, I'm truly disappointed you needed to stoop to derogatory remarks. It isn't the fact that we weren't understanding you, but the fact your posts were leading us in the wrong direction. Very true, online you canNOT hear voice inflection or see the body language, so you need to compensate by proper usage of word skills. Your "attack" on Nifty, whether in your eyes OR not, will lower the standards of how other posters will interprete future replies to any of your posts. I'm not trying to be mean about this, just realistic. I may not agree with certain posters, but that is NO excuse for rudeness and flaming. I do, however, accept your apology.

@Nifty, the horse has been beaten enough, lets stick a fork in it, it's done...

 

[maxd]

So my response ... gets me a warning?

Still haven't read the Forum Rules, huh? If you had you would know that the answer is "Yes, absolutely". Ask around, if anyone but a newbie had done what you've done they would already be chillin' with a little 'vacation' from the forums. You got off with a warning because you should have, but apparently did not, know better. You won't be given the liberty to make that mistake again.

Yet this trolling of his is allowed to go on and cause an argument in most threads that he is involved in?

The day he resorts to petty name-calling and insults is the day he'll get his butt kicked for it. Regardless of what his opinions are or how little you may think of him you do not have the right to flagrantly disregard the Forum Rules. Period. There is no excuse for bad behaviour so don't bother trying to come up with one, especially not one as underwhelming as "I don't like what he said".

If you've got something to say you'll need to find an acceptable way to say it. If that's not something you can or will do then don't post, simple as that.

As to Nifty and his opinions/observations/whatever I suggest you might want to have a look around the forums a little before you go passing judgment so freely. Sure, he stands on one side of the issues and isn't particularly subtle about it, but there are plenty of other folks who stand on the other side taking their shots too. His jabs are bad but theirs are good? It's not as simple as that, almost never is. If you can't live with that then use the 'Ignore' button.

The bottom line is that there are plenty of ways to play nicely here without violating the Forum Rules. Everyone else manages it, so should you.

 

[jod5413]

Just my two cents.

It Saddens Me to see the word retarded where all here in this forum are pretty normal and have all fatalities working.
The word to use is Mentally Challenged or Handicapped or Disabilities.
The word retarded to me is like the F word.
If you like I would love to show you what Mentally Challenged or Handicapped adults & children are like & I bet you will never use that word again.
I am sorry but that word gets my goat if people use it in the wrong way.
I have worked many years with adults & children with disabilities.
Thanks
~T~

Well said, Tom. That is such a hurtful word, it feels like a kick to the chest when folks use that word as a slam at someone. Hopefully, someone will read your post and think about not using it anymore.

Still haven't read the Forum Rules, huh? If you had you would know that the answer is "Yes, absolutely". Ask around, if anyone but a newbie had done what you've done they would already be chillin' with a little 'vacation' from the forums. You got off with a warning because you should have, but apparently did not, know better. You won't be given the liberty to make that mistake again.

The day he resorts to petty name-calling and insults is the day he'll get his butt kicked for it. Regardless of what his opinions are or how little you may think of him you do not have the right to flagrantly disregard the Forum Rules. Period. There is no excuse for bad behaviour so don't bother trying to come up with one, especially not one as underwhelming as "I don't like what he said".

If you've got something to say you'll need to find an acceptable way to say it. If that's not something you can or will do then don't post, simple as that.

As to Nifty and his opinions/observations/whatever I suggest you might want to have a look around the forums a little before you go passing judgment so freely. Sure, he stands on one side of the issues and isn't particularly subtle about it, but there are plenty of other folks who stand on the other side taking their shots too. His jabs are bad but theirs are good? It's not as simple as that, almost never is. If you can't live with that then use the 'Ignore' button.

The bottom line is that there are plenty of ways to play nicely here without violating the Forum Rules. ]Everyone else manages it,[/B so should you.

Well, some of us have to try really hard, but a forum needs rules to keep it's popularity, a free for all only snags the crap posters who mouth off at everyone but have nothing of importance to say, rules make us all act like civil people(usually). That is much better.

Really good post, Max.

 

[jemc173]

Max,

I see your point. No excuse for me.


It does seem like when I look around the forum and read the threads Like THIS ONE that angered me so much that I see Nifty breaking these rules:

1.1 - No "Flaming": Please do not post any messages that harass, insult, belittle, threaten or flame another member or guest. Abusive behavior will not be tolerated and your account may be suspended. Please refrain from potty mouth language.

I just want to explain my reaction and where I was coming from a little bit. I KNOW there is no excuse. You have made that clear. I think this needs to be clarified though since it has came up on this board numerous times regarding Nifty.........

His type and him in particular doesn't get anything nagative from you or miester and its just wrong of you to say anything to others but not to him.

He posts and it just begs of a strong reply from other members. Obviously not with my insults but he starts these things then sits back and watches others get scolded.

His post told me to "grow up" for example. Is that not belittling, insulting and harrassing?

His post "basically" called me a liar and he implied that I was not being honest about my motive or post. Is that not insulting and harrassing?

Was not the total tone of his entire post belittling and harrassing and insulting and inciting? Again, the entire post he is rude and makes me out to be a liar. That seems to go directly against the rules and it incites these types of responses that he gets. They aren't just from me either as you know.

I just got to this board and this is the first topic I have posted in. With the way he treated me I would not like to post anymore if his attacks are allowed and other's responses are scolded. My first impression of this place and my first impresson left is very poor.

 

[jelsmith]

You are so asking for it

 

[Mousey]

.....

I just got to this board and this is the first topic I have posted in. With the way he treated me I would not like to post anymore if his attacks are allowed and other's responses are scolded. My first impression of this place and my first impresson left is very poor.

but.... ummmm... you don't sound like a newbie... and you sound very familiar...

If I do you a disservice, I apologize.

 

[BingoT]

but.... ummmm... you don't sound like a newbie... and you sound very familiar...

Oh please tell us who you think it is.
Maybe Max or Bryan can tell us.

 

[LaurieJim]

but.... ummmm... you don't sound like a newbie... and you sound very familiar...

If I do you a disservice, I apologize.

Was thinking the same thing Mousey

I just went back and re-read all these posts and damn do I need a couple of Advils about now.

So much bickering and name calling , its the beginning of a New Year , hasnt this thread just about ran its course, hasnt enough feelings been hurt by some who have been forum friends on here for a long time?

Someone stated earlier, put a fork in it, its done, with that said, I 100% agree


Laurie

 

[Nifty29]

Max,

I see your point. No excuse for me.

...but keep reading I will go ahead and make excuses anyway....


It does seem like when I look around the forum and read the threads Like THIS ONE that angered me so much that I see Nifty breaking these rules:

1.1 - No "Flaming": Please do not post any messages that harass, insult, belittle, threaten or flame another member or guest. Abusive behavior will not be tolerated and your account may be suspended. Please refrain from potty mouth language.

Please point out where this occurred. Specific examples, not 'he sounded insulting etc etc". You cannot 'sound' anything in a Forum - that is the whole point. What you say is what you say.

I just want to explain my reaction and where I was coming from a little bit. I KNOW there is no excuse. You have made that clear. I think this needs to be clarified though since it has came up on this board numerous times regarding Nifty.........

Given you 'just got to this board'.....how would you know?? Unless you are not new to the board of course.....

His type and him in particular doesn't get anything nagative from you or miester and its just wrong of you to say anything to others but not to him.

I've been told off before. I also apologised the few times that it has occurred - everyone makes mistakes and poor judgements, the difference is that I will admit them rather than use foul language and insult people by calling them 'r*tards' etc just because I got boned in an argument.

He posts and it just begs of a strong reply from other members. Obviously not with my insults but he starts these things then sits back and watches others get scolded.

I challenge claims and comments made by others. If you aren't prepared to accept comments or criticism, then don't post in a public forum. Same goes for if you can't control your anger or language.

Members get 'scolded' for what they say - nobody forces anybody to say anything. The problems occur when people refuse to accept responsibility for what they say/post - it is far easier to blame someone else.

His post told me to "grow up" for example. Is that not belittling, insulting and harrassing?

If 'grow up' is the only example you can give then your case is looking pretty thin. I considered your comment childish, hence the remark. It wasn't a personal insult, I was referring to the comment you made.

His post "basically" called me a liar and he implied that I was not being honest about my motive or post. Is that not insulting and harrassing?

How do you 'basically' call someone a liar? Show me where I did that. I did not say at any point that you were being dishonest.

Was not the total tone of his entire post belittling and harrassing and insulting and inciting? Again, the entire post he is rude and makes me out to be a liar. That seems to go directly against the rules and it incites these types of responses that he gets. They aren't just from me either as you know.

WTH? What is a 'total tone' of a post? I addressed your comments on their content. I agree with some things you stated, and disagreed with others. If having a contrary opinion is 'harrassing and belittling' then we're all in for a vacation.

If you want an example of 'rude' try beginning with your own posts.

The people who complain about being 'incited' to behave like neanderthals are the ones who have little or no self-control and who cannot sustain a reasonable and logical argument.

Show me where I ended a post with "and now I would like another member to call me an a**hole or a f***ing moron in response to this post', I will agree that I incited those kind of responses.

Personal insults are, and always have been, the last (or sometimes even the first) resort of the ignorant and ill-informed.



I just got to this board and this is the first topic I have posted in. With the way he treated me I would not like to post anymore if his attacks are allowed and other's responses are scolded. My first impression of this place and my first impresson left is very poor.

Well we will see what we'll see.....

 

[Nifty29]

Was thinking the same thing Mousey

I just went back and re-read all these posts and damn do I need a couple of Advils about now.

So much bickering and name calling , its the beginning of a New Year , hasnt this thread just about ran its course, hasnt enough feelings been hurt by some who have been forum friends on here for a long time?

Someone stated earlier, put a fork in it, its done, with that said, I 100% agree


Laurie

You are probably right Laurie about putting a fork in it - I have just had my final say in this thread. I just don't like being told I did something when I didnt.