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Casumo Source of Wealth issues

Cocochanel said:
I cant understand that Casumo can get away with this nonsens about your parents money.

I read this from
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Once you have made a self-exclusion agreement, the gambling company must close your account and return any money in your account to you. It must also remove your name and details from any marketing databases it uses.

What is it they cant understand, its clear what they have to do. Obay the rules

I wish you the best of luck of getting your money.

Why didnt you get the PAB don?
Click to expand...
I breached the t's&c's of the PAB.
My own fault, I opened the PAB and then opened this thread. I didn't realise it was not right to do so.
My bad.
I'm not good at reading terms and conditions as you can probably tell!
 
Cocochanel said:
I just read this from the Gamblingcommission uk.

November 2018 Casumo and Remote casino.

satisfactory assurance in relation to the Licensee’s source of funding had not been provided , how funny is that now reading about this tread
Click to expand...

Was Mr Casumo asked to provide his mums pension statement, title deeds to the property and bank statements for 100 years as well?
 
ladyhawke said:
Wait. What is this Trivago ad of which you all speak? Is it this one, with Gabrielle Miller (Australian) and Charlotte Weston (British)? I thought our bad ads were restricted to home shores, although I actually like this one.



Wait. What? Yup, I do so #ScrewWaitWhatHaters.
Click to expand...

All trivago ads are superb
#teamtrivago
 
ladyhawke said:
Wait. What is this Trivago ad of which you all speak? Is it this one, with Gabrielle Miller (Australian) and Charlotte Weston (British)? I thought our bad ads were restricted to home shores, although I actually like this one.



Wait. What? Yup, I do so #ScrewWaitWhatHaters.
Click to expand...

This is also my personal fav
 
Iamfozzzz said:
Hi everyone,
thank you for all your comments in this thread.
I will no longer be posting in respect of the PAB Rules.

Mark
Click to expand...

Has @Iamfozzzz been allowed to re-open his PAB?

It would be great if that is the case, as Casumo's document requirements as outlined in this thread both astound and horrify me.

Besides AML and RG, these affordability checks are surely the most intrusive and insidious requirement of all.
In fact, where did this "affordability" nonsense come from - which even though aligned to SOW, is actually a totally different animal - as I fail to understand why a casino can demand access to bank statements, mortgage statements, payslips etc, current and even retrospective, and ask for documents relating to 3rd parties not even involved in the account.

The Solicitors Regulation Authority (SRA) released the following guidelines back in 2018 regarding both Source of Funds and Source of Wealth:

Source of Funds: Where do a customer's funds come from e.g. a UK bank account.

Source of Wealth: How did a customer come to be in possession of the funds in question e.g. employment, inheritance, house sale, etc. If a person’s wealth is clearly derived from legitimate means (mentioned above), there is no requirement to request evidence of this by trawling through reams of bank statements and other documents to prove the point.

So let's recap:
Casinos are not a government department.
Casinos are not registered with, or regulated by, the FSA or any other financial body in the UK.
Casinos have no legal standing in the Law of the Land.

Most of the documents being asked for in this case are private and confidential, and only should be seen by HMRC, Banks, Mortgage providers, employers, etc.

NOT by an unregulated casino, with dubious policies on the use and security of said documents.

Therefore...is not the UKGC issuing dictates that are far more unnecessarily stringent than that required by law? The result is that casinos are fast turning into mini-dictators with all these requirements, which are overriding their primary purpose - an enjoyable leisure pastime.
 
ladyhawke said:
Has @Iamfozzzz been allowed to re-open his PAB?

It would be great if that is the case, as Casumo's document requirements as outlined in this thread both astound and horrify me.

Besides AML and RG, these affordability checks are surely the most intrusive and insidious requirement of all.
In fact, where did this "affordability" nonsense come from - which even though aligned to SOW, is actually a totally different animal - as I fail to understand why a casino can demand access to bank statements, mortgage statements, payslips etc, current and even retrospective, and ask for documents relating to 3rd parties not even involved in the account.

The Solicitors Regulation Authority (SRA) released the following guidelines back in 2018 regarding both Source of Funds and Source of Wealth:

Source of Funds: Where do a customer's funds come from e.g. a UK bank account.

Source of Wealth: How did a customer come to be in possession of the funds in question e.g. employment, inheritance, house sale, etc. If a person’s wealth is clearly derived from legitimate means (mentioned above), there is no requirement to request evidence of this by trawling through reams of bank statements and other documents to prove the point.

So let's recap:
Casinos are not a government department.
Casinos are not registered with, or regulated by, the FSA or any other financial body in the UK.
Casinos have no legal standing in the Law of the Land.

Most of the documents being asked for in this case are private and confidential, and only should be seen by HMRC, Banks, Mortgage providers, employers, etc.

NOT by an unregulated casino, with dubious policies on the use and security of said documents.

Therefore...is not the UKGC issuing dictates that are far more unnecessarily stringent than that required by law? The result is that casinos are fast turning into mini-dictators with all these requirements, which are overriding their primary purpose - an enjoyable leisure pastime.
Click to expand...

Bingo with bolded - proportionality and burden - it's not on the casino to PROVE you're not engaged in ML'ing.

Are any of these casinos ISO27K accredited? The staff that handle these documents etc - what's the employment/security checks being carried out on these to do so? Whole host of issues in this.

Not sure what the UKGC actually 'dictates' from the Casino's other than they must have 'appropriate policies and procedures in place' to be compliant .

Seen some folk state that 'the banks have their own AML controls in place' but i'm sure there's something in the guidance that states you can't simply place reliance on them (for example) having performed the requisite checks.
 
pinnit2014 said:
Bingo with bolded - proportionality and burden - it's not on the casino to PROVE you're not engaged in ML'ing.

Are any of these casinos ISO27K accredited? The staff that handle these documents etc - what's the employment/security checks being carried out on these to do so? Whole host of issues in this.

Not sure what the UKGC actually 'dictates' from the Casino's other than they must have 'appropriate policies and procedures in place' to be compliant .

Seen some folk state that 'the banks have their own AML controls in place' but i'm sure there's something in the guidance that states you can't simply place reliance on them (for example) having performed the requisite checks.
Click to expand...
What is your average, tin pot, Maltese clip joint going to spot on a bank statement that the fraud squad of the financial institution that said bank statement belongs to, won't?
 
Mr_Slot5 said:
What is your average, tin pot, Maltese clip joint going to spot on a bank statement that the fraud squad of the financial institution that said bank statement belongs to, won't?
Click to expand...

At a guess, coffee stain, max?

I agree - just relaying what's pottering in the guidance/law (need to dig out) - not sure if it falls under the 3rd party reliance text whereby you put agreements in place/monitor that agreement et al. Maybe someone like @ternur knows how far down the chain the AML breach goes and who, or all, is hung for it should it be taking part in the supply chain so to speak.

I was at a presentation from the Fraud Team of Police Scotland and there was, bit fuzzy mind you, a bit about common mistakes and that whole 'just because a bank is bound by this, doesn't mean you can skirt over your own duties' was mentioned - For my own curiosity purposes I'll ping the guy an email when in work later.
 
pinnit2014 said:
I was at a presentation from the Fraud Team of Police Scotland and there was, bit fuzzy mind you, a bit about common mistakes and that whole 'just because a bank is bound by this, doesn't mean you can skirt over your own duties' was mentioned - For my own curiosity purposes I'll ping the guy an email when in work later.
Click to expand...

This.
 
If this is about "affordability", doesnt the OPs bank statement showing no overdraft mean that he can afford it?

And if Casumo deem the players level of deposits "unaffordable", then surely they should prevent further deposits, not freeze the account?

Unbelievable that casinos think they can do things like this, its beyond any reason or sanity!!! I hope many people read this thread and give this rogue casino a wide berth!!!
 
The other thing to take into account is the fact that you can borrow a lot of money with a lot less proof than this. If you go for a mortgage on a £250000 house, you would not have to supply this much information, and I've certainly never heard of a bank asking for parents financial statements to prove affordability. If I can borrow a quarter of a million £ from someone then a casino doesn't need more information than that to prove affordability for a couple of grands gambling.

Sounds to me like Casumo are struggling and stealing money from players in order to boost their finances, especially considering they are happy to keep taking deposits. If they were that concerned about if the customer can afford to gamble, then stopping deposits should be the first thing they do, not stopping withdrawals. This isn't the first time we have seen similar complaints on here about Casumo, so imagine how many people it probably affects who don't use forums.
 
cncas2123 said:
If Casumo are doing this as an affordability check, and are in anyway concerned that the OP cant afford to deposit and play shouldnt they then repay all his nett losses since the first opening of the account?
Click to expand...

No one should be telling anyone what they can and cannot afford to do with their own money. I think that's the main issue.

People need to take personal ownership of their finances and the issues that come with them.
 
Lobo said:
I tried the PAB with my hilarious SOW-case with Casumo. Not much help.
Click to expand...

As I recall the PAB I handled for you regarding Casumo ended up being about self-exclusion, not SOW. And the case was ultimately concluded by the MGA. In other words we "weren't much help" because you'd already taken it to the licensing body for a ruling and, obviously, their decision superceded anything we might have been able to do on it.
 
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maxd said:
As I recall the PAB I handled for you regarding Casumo ended up being about self-exclusion, not SOW.
Click to expand...
Casumo ended up closing my account due to "self exclution" 3-4 weeks _after_ they hit me with an impossible SOW (which I needed help with), because I gave them an harsh reply about how they had balls to keep on offering me deposit bonuses when my account was blocked for withdrawals (not deposits) while doing the SOW (checking if I could afford to gamble). So they turned that reply into a self exclution, and you dropped the case. The PAB was placed before it was any talk about "self exclution" :)

My PAB originally was about:
1, they refused to handle my withdrawal before I had sent in ID's + statements from 6 friends.
2, allowing me to deposit while they continuesly upgraded my SOW so it was impossible for me to fullfil it. And giving with big deposit bonuses to lure me in.

But at that time I kept on mixing a bunch of stuff due to I was a long time VIP with a deposit history of over €700k. So much of my communication was lost in the translation I guess. I dont blame you :)

Sorry for fucking up the thread.
 
Lobo said:
Casumo ended up closing my account due to "self exclution" 3-4 weeks _after_ they hit me with an impossible SOW (which I needed help with), because I gave them an harsh reply about how they had balls to keep on offering me deposit bonuses when my account was blocked for withdrawals (not deposits) while doing the SOW (checking if I could afford to gamble). So they turned that reply into a self exclution, and you dropped the case. The PAB was placed before it was any talk about "self exclution" :)

My PAB originally was about:
1, they refused to handle my withdrawal before I had sent in ID's + statements from 6 friends.
2, allowing me to deposit while they continuesly upgraded my SOW so it was impossible for me to fullfil it. And giving with big deposit bonuses to lure me in.

But at that time I kept on mixing a bunch of stuff due to I was a long time VIP with a deposit history of over €700k. So much of my communication was lost in the translation I guess. I dont blame you :)

Sorry for fucking up the thread.
Click to expand...
Blocked withdrawals for SOW whilst still allowing deposits? Rogue behaviour much?

@CasumoLouis whilst I am sure you are leaving UK market very soon, I just wondered what your views were on the ethics of this.
 
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SpinUk said:
Blocked withdrawals for SOW whilst still allowing deposits? Rogue behaviour much?
Click to expand...
Yes. I deposited around €3k after they locked my account for withdrawals. My VIP manager even said it was nothing to worry about etc etc. Being a VIP for 3 years I trusted the fuckers.
I won, wanted to withdraw... got denied. Tried to fight them. Got angry and frustrated. Tried to involve MGA, the PAB service here etc.

But they made a smart move turning my case into a "self exclution" at the end. That seemed to justify all the shitty things they did to me.
 
I have said this around 20 times before on this forum: NEVER EVER deposit at Casumo if your bank records are not 100% clean. If you have a transaction from a friend, your grandmother etc on there... you might have to send in the ID's of your grandmother + statement from her.
 
Struggling to understand why the casino hasn't been rogued based on several accounts detailed on this forum?

If they're not rogued it sets a dangerous precedent to other casinos who will think they can get away with such shithousery without consequence IMO.

Several reports of people not being paid for spurious reasons, people still able to deposit whilst having their account 'frozen' for SOW, impossible demands etc etc.
 
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Not sure what's going on but feels hard to understand OP situation well that is done here. Casinos don't have any magic button to keep players deposits added to their income.

Would be nice to see some facts that have happened instead of all of us giving our opinions to be the truth.
 
SpinUk said:
Blocked withdrawals for SOW whilst still allowing deposits? Rogue behaviour much?

@CasumoLouis whilst I am sure you are leaving UK market very soon, I just wondered what your views were on the ethics of this.
Click to expand...

Are you a Highroller? BEWARE of CASUMO

Louis stated there that they were looking into improvements on the allowing deposits and not withdrawals, 6 months ago.
Seems the improvement was to do nothing.
 
Slottery said:
Not sure what's going on but feels hard to understand OP situation well that is done here. Casinos don't have any magic button to keep players deposits added to their income.

Would be nice to see some facts that have happened instead of all of us giving our opinions to be the truth.
Click to expand...

Casumo won't comment so that isn't going to happen. However, the fact that the same sort of complaints have been made going back 6 months here and elsewhere, allowed to deposit, refused withdrawals, and told they won't payout unless third party documentation is supplied, suggests this complaint is real.
 
In my opinion they are only acting this way because they know if they pay players the money without the player providing any documents, the casino will never get the money back. The player will just go elsewhere for their slotting.

Which then begs the question, why be so intrusive in the first place :confused:
 
dealer wins said:
If this is about "affordability", doesnt the OPs bank statement showing no overdraft mean that he can afford it?

And if Casumo deem the players level of deposits "unaffordable", then surely they should prevent further deposits, not freeze the account?

Unbelievable that casinos think they can do things like this, its beyond any reason or sanity!!! I hope many people read this thread and give this rogue casino a wide berth!!!
Click to expand...

My mate also got asked for stupid amounts of SOW stuff and was also at withdrawal time, and was less than 1000 about 800 i think, he managed to get it after nearly 3 weeks and then closed his account, and so did I, no way i'm risking them doing that to me, this was about 6 months ago so clearly nothing has improved!

I really think people need to have a serious think about playing there to be honest, high or low roller it don't seem to matter.

They really should lose some rating on here too, as its not good at all.
 
@Casinomeister is this how an accredited casino should act? If it were a one off then possibly more than meets the eye, but this isn't the first time they've held withdrawals to ransom over a customer not supplying someone elses ID/Financial details, and plenty of other threads about their over the top SoW requests, the one by @dunover for example, where they want information from years ago.
 
I think we do need to wait for the PAB conclusion, with the reasoning and analysis for the decision either way.

with the computer says no and talk to the hand responses the player has had from the casino, I hope Max is able to even get a response from them, looks like to me they're digging their heels in and ignoring the official process. I also hope the PAB doesn't switch to the self exclusion issue as that was secondary imo.
 
mack341 said:
I also hope the PAB doesn't switch to the self exclusion issue as that was secondary imo.
Click to expand...

Absolutely. I believe the OP only went down that route as according to everything I have read - and hopefully understood - is that when a customer self-excludes, all funds in the account must be returned, and he felt that was the only route left to him in order to get his winnings.
 

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