Casino Robots

jpm

Dormant account
What do you mean Lanidar? Are you talking about the Viper software or something else?
 

Clayman

Dormant account
A little irresponsible to suggest

"Calculated after observing many thousands of hands of online Blackjack, the Casino Robots Advanced Strategy appears to eliminate the small percentage advantage usually enjoyed by online Casinos - thus tipping the scales in favour of the player."
 

jpm

Dormant account
I suppose that if you assume the scales are tipped heavily towards the casino, then tipping them back towards the player would be a more accurate statement. Unless its bringing its own cards to the table, its not going to eliminate the house edge :lolup:

Did you notice the inference to this being the way the pirate of c21 won the $1.3mil?
 

Clayman

Dormant account
jpm said:
Did you notice the inference to this being the way the pirate of c21 won the $1.3mil?
Good point. I doubt more than very much if it's true.

Guess they forgot to mention, if it were true, and people had used their product, they would not have won anything. :)
 

lanidar

Dormant account
jpm said:
What do you mean Lanidar? Are you talking about the Viper software or something else?
I'm talking about the Autoplay that can be used when playing Blackjack. Is that considered a robot?
 

jpm

Dormant account
Ok, that's what I thought you meant.

I don't think you could really call that a robot, its more of a game mode. I would think of a robot as something that would run concurrently with the casino software and take the place of the player. If its programmed correctly, it will play perfect strategy and take any 'human error' out of the game and maximize your return. But it can't give you any more return than the games odds allow. In otherwords, it can't turn a negative expectation game into a positive one, which is what they seem to be intimating in their ad.
 

lanidar

Dormant account
jpm said:
Ok, that's what I thought you meant.

I would think of a robot as something that would run concurrently with the casino software and take the place of the player. If its programmed correctly, it will play perfect strategy and take any 'human error' out of the game and maximize your return.

Thank you JPM.
I truly appreciate your response and your opinion.
(You have ALL those little GREEN squares next to your name) :thumbsup:
I'm not being argumentative...not at all. :)
I just don't know much about this and I'm curious.
When some one uses Autoplay isn't the casinos software playing against the casinos software...using perfect strategy :confused:
 
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jpm

Dormant account
No problem Lanidar, I didn't think you were being arguementative at all.

I had the same thoughts regarding the casino playing against itself with the autoplay feature. I'm still not sure why they would give you a way to play perfect strategy on almost every game (though on slots, there really isn't such a thing). More than one person has said that you need to modify the strategy tables on the BJ games in order have the correct strategy for autoplay. It looks like the VP games are all playing correct strategy, at least the ones that I've done spot checks against Winpoker were right.

I guess since almost all, if not all, have a house edge, then they are still going to make money even if everyone plays perfect strategy. I don't think either of the deuces wild games are full pay, and those would be about the only ones I could think of that could give the player an advantage.

Now, if you add in comp points to a game with a very low house edge, you could potentially have a positive return (assuming they give you comps for those games).
 

lanidar

Dormant account
jpm said:
More than one person has said that you need to modify the strategy tables on the BJ games in order have the correct strategy for autoplay.
I know what the strategy tables are.
Why and how does one modify the tables?
What would be changed?
At Lucky Nugget I play Europen Blackjack.

Thank JPM...I don't mean to be a pain.
Every little bit of an edge helps. :)
 

jpm

Dormant account
I read someone here (maybe Clayman or Grandmaster) who said to check the strategy table in the casino game against the basic strategy chart on Wizard of Odds. As I recall, there were only a couple of changes that needed to be made.

Go into the game and make sure you're in expert mode. You should see the Autoplay button and a Strategy button below it. Click on the strategy button and you can check and if necessary modify the table. Then be sure to save your change before you go back to the game.
 

lanidar

Dormant account
Thanks JPM. :notworthy
I'm going to play European Blackjack tomorrow at Lucky Nugget.
I'll post my outcome.
 

Clayman

Dormant account
jpm said:
I'm still not sure why they would give you a way to play perfect strategy on almost every game
My guess is that Viper was a good way to replace the single-deck game that had a 0.1% HA to one 4 times worse, while being able to increase WR's by claiming they have now allowed the "bad" players to play perfectly.

I really don't know what the current Viper default auto-cheat strategy table is but I do know I had to change several plays to adjust to a double-deck game at the Fortune Room.

Has anyone else had to make changes to the default strategy table? If so, I wonder how much using the default strategy table would cost the player against each of the various BJ games offered. Is the default strategy table correct for ANY offered BJ game?

Lanidar - best thing is to get the right strategy for the game you are playing and compare it to the default table. Initially set Viper at a slow speed until you are sure it plays all the hands correctly. Strictly from memory (that means completely unreliable) I had to make it hit a 9 vs 2 rather than double. Stand on an A,7 vs 8 rather than hit, and hit an A,7 vs 10 rather than stand. These last 2 plays are rather costly if played wrong. Also I'd check out all the low pairs to make sure auto-cheat is splitting properly instead of doing goofy stuff like hitting a 6,6 vs 2.
 

chucho

Bonus Pimp
Let's start by assuming the the Wizzard Of odd's Blackjack charts are correct. Then we should play Vegas Strip at Microgaming casinos as it has the best players odds, slightly better than Euro BJ. Then we should change 4 different default split options as set in the Viper software, 2,2, 3,3, 6,6, and 7,7. You can figure out what is wrong when comparing the default MG chart to the Wizzards chart. For example, the MG default autoplay settings have you split 3's against a dealer 7, when the correct play is to hit it. Now the real question is how can someone play at, for example, a Boss Media casino using autoplay? Is their such a software that works/exists and that is not detected my the casino?
 

GrandMaster

Ueber Meister
CAG
chucho said:
For example, the MG default autoplay settings have you split 3's against a dealer 7, when the correct play is to hit it.
No, the correct play is to split 3,3 vs 7 under any set of rules I can think of.

Here is my list of corrections to Viper autoplay default strategy:

Euro BJ
9 vs 2: double/hit
Soft 18 vs 8: stand
Soft 18 vs 10: hit
6,6 vs 2: split/hit

Vegas Downtown
Soft 18 vs 4,5,6: Double if possible, else stand

Atlantic City
Soft 18 vs 4,5,6: Double if possible, else stand
6,6 vs 7, 7,7 vs 8: Hit

Vegas Strip
Soft 18 vs 4,5,6: Double if possible, else stand
6,6 vs 7, 7,7 vs 8: Hit
9,9 vs 8 or 9: Split if possible, else stand.
 

Clayman

Dormant account
GrandMaster said:
Euro BJ
9 vs 2: double/hit
Soft 18 vs 8: stand
Soft 18 vs 10: hit
6,6 vs 2: split/hit
Just what I remembered! I'm amazed.

I guess you have confirmed that the default is wrong for EVERY BJ game they offer.

If they were honest, they would make it play perfectly for at least one of the games. Heck, it would be simple to make auto-cheat play perfectly for each of the games - just make 4 or 5 tables. If they can do it for different VP games, they could do it for BJ.

Any chance you can easily figure out, guesstimate, how costly playing the default would be for any/all of the BJ games you mentioned? Just wondered how much extra the poor sucker who knows know better pays for using the auto-cheat. Probably not a huge amount but still....
 

chucho

Bonus Pimp
GrandMaster said:
No, the correct play is to split 3,3 vs 7 under any set of rules I can think of.

Here is my list of corrections to Viper autoplay default strategy:

Euro BJ
9 vs 2: double/hit
Soft 18 vs 8: stand
Soft 18 vs 10: hit
6,6 vs 2: split/hit

Vegas Downtown
Soft 18 vs 4,5,6: Double if possible, else stand

Atlantic City
Soft 18 vs 4,5,6: Double if possible, else stand
6,6 vs 7, 7,7 vs 8: Hit

Vegas Strip
Soft 18 vs 4,5,6: Double if possible, else stand
6,6 vs 7, 7,7 vs 8: Hit
9,9 vs 8 or 9: Split if possible, else stand.
I only checked Vegas Strip against the wizzards chart and the only thing that needs to be changed is 6,6 against a dealer 7 hit, not split, and 7,7 against a dealer 8, hit not split. Everything looked the same as the wizzards chart.
 

lanidar

Dormant account
lanidar said:
Thanks JPM. :notworthy
I'm going to play European Blackjack tomorrow at Lucky Nugget.
I'll post my outcome.
I deposited $50 got the $200 bonus....
I was destroyed!!!
ALL GONE

My sons played here and this was the FIRST time we ever lost . :confused:
Just a bad day. :oops:
 

GrandMaster

Ueber Meister
CAG
chucho said:
I only checked Vegas Strip against the wizzards chart and the only thing that needs to be changed is 6,6 against a dealer 7 hit, not split, and 7,7 against a dealer 8, hit not split. Everything looked the same as the wizzards chart.
Read carefully what I wrote and check again.
 
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