Question Casino Cruise ridiculous KYC procedure

[Chiumento]

Evening all, first post! I've been playing online for a number of years, recently opened an account with Casino Cruise, initially impressed with the site and its choice of slots. About a month in I finally had some luck and won £1200. Then the hell started! I have been 5 days now trying to pass their unbelievable KYC procedure! I have sent mobile phone bills, letters from my council, utility bills, pay slips, and finally my BT bill, and I am still yet to have my withdrawal processed! Their customer service is shocking and getting a reply is almost impossible. I always expect a verification stage but this has become ridiculous! I feel stressed, and completely fed up! I'm sure others have had this experience, I just wanted to warn anyone thinking of joining...DONT! I wish casinos would just get the verification stage done on registration, and CasinoCruise should certainly make it easier! I fear I will never get my winnings!!

 

[jjezebel37]

Evening all, first post! I've been playing online for a number of years, recently opened an account with Casino Cruise, initially impressed with the site and its choice of slots. About a month in I finally had some luck and won £1200. Then the hell started! I have been 5 days now trying to pass their unbelievable KYC procedure! I have sent mobile phone bills, letters from my council, utility bills, pay slips, and finally my BT bill, and I am still yet to have my withdrawal processed! Their customer service is shocking and getting a reply is almost impossible. I always expect a verification stage but this has become ridiculous! I feel stressed, and completely fed up! I'm sure others have had this experience, I just wanted to warn anyone thinking of joining...DONT! I wish casinos would just get the verification stage done on registration, and CasinoCruise should certainly make it easier! I fear I will never get my winnings!!

Try contacting the rep Lloyd. They are accredited here.


https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/members/

 

[Chiumento]

Have added him as a friend, hopefully he can resolve this mess!! Thanks

 

[jjezebel37]

Have added him as a friend, hopefully he can resolve this mess!! Thanks

You would be better of sending him a message instead and point him to this thread.

I know you are new but it's forum rules that you contact rep first.


Just a heads up.

 

[vinylweatherman]

The bills all have to be less than 3 months old, and prepared "just right" before sending.

Make absolutely sure that the entire piece of paper can be seen, as some scanners tend to crop the page based on the writing, and what casinos need to see are the full page, including the "white space" that is the margin.


Unfortunately, casinos are not at all helpful when it comes to offering guidance to players about how to prepare the bills, they simply give a "yes, no" verdict to any sent in. This can lead to players who have an obscure issue, such as their scanner cropping the edges or corners, trying again and again and feeling that the effort is futile because the whole thing is a scam designed to never let them be paid.

Luckily, the CMA is investigating this kind of issue, where complex terms and procedures are making it too hard for players to claim their winnings. This is really a "complex procedure" rather than an issue with "smallprint", but the cause is the lack of guidance for players on how, exactly, they should prepare and send the documents. It's usually a simple "scan a bill less than 3 months old and send it in".

Mobile phone bills tend not to be accepted, but a landline bill, letter from the council, and utility bills should be no problem.

 

[Mouche12]

Hang in there Chiumento, you WILL get paid eventually after you've PMed the rep. Whatever you do, don't touch that balance, that's what they're hoping for.

... and welcome to the forum!

 

[slotter999]

Mouche is on the money there - don't fall into the reverse your withdrawal trap.

I hope you vote with your feet once you finally get paid.

 

[Harry_BKK]

Welcome to the forum.

However, have to repeat myself: Get verified before you deposit!!! .....prevents this kind of situations and the stress that is coming with it.

If a casino refuses to verify you upfront then never play there. I told those, who tried this old trick of the trade, that I will not deposit until I am fully verified and suddenly....hey, presto, send the docs, we will do the KYC.....never waited more than a few hours to receive the OK.

Hope you get it sorted soon but CC have some chequered past here at CM regarding KYC problems, so please, please, please don't do them the favor to play it all back because that is all they want. Worst case we had was this one here where they screwed an old lady out of her winnings by refusing to verify her: https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...-not-willing-to-verify-me-pl-advice-me.72020/ ...interestingly they verified her/locked her account exactly at the moment she had lost all her winnings....so be warned!!

 

[jjezebel37]

Welcome to the forum.

However, have to repeat myself: Get verified before you deposit!!! .....prevents this kind of situations and the stress that is coming with it.

If a casino refuses to verify you upfront then never play there. I told those, who tried this old trick of the trade, that I will not deposit until I am fully verified and suddenly....hey, presto, send the docs, we will do the KYC.....never waited more than a few hours to receive the OK.

Hope you get it sorted soon but CC have some chequered past here at CM regarding KYC problems, so please, please, please don't do them the favor to play it all back because that is all they want. Worst case we had was this one here where they screwed an old lady out of her winnings by refusing to verify her: https://www.casinomeister.com/forum...-not-willing-to-verify-me-pl-advice-me.72020/ ...interestingly they verified her/locked her account exactly at the moment she had lost all her winnings....so be warned!!

Harry I just knew you'd pop on and say this.
Actually, I don't open new accounts much but I have started to do this and it's way safer.

 

[spintee]

This casino is known for doing this, They are a site that will pay, But do not let it get to you, Hold on and DO NOT spend it, Like VWM said make sure all 4 corners are showing, Hell knows why casino want 4 corners, Abit overboard there

 

[charpet55]

This casino is known for doing this, They are a site that will pay, But do not let it get to you, Hold on and DO NOT spend it, Like VWM said make sure all 4 corners are showing, Hell knows why casino want 4 corners, Abit overboard there

Hi.

Same thing happened to me , get payed and give them the flick there are more honest casinos out there.

 

[The Blue Anchor]

Casinocruise have just opened a sister casino "Spinit'.

You can open an a/c at Spinit even if SE'd from Casino Cruise - and live chat confirmed to me they would also SE you, but only as part of the verification process. So the EM trick - let you play as long as you lose. Not good enough.

 

[Chiumento]

Thanks all, finally been verified! Haven't had the withdrawal processed yet though! Now on day 6! Crazy. Have also requested to close the account which they have done promptly. So certainly won't be playing it back. Wait and see how long the withdrawal takes now. Shocking practices!!

 

[Mouche12]

Well done Chiumento, and congrats on your win!

 

[kavaman]

I highly doubt that you can make an account at spinit if you have been self excluded from casino cruise. Live support must have told this? Im pretty sure its not true, since all everymatrix casinos basicly deny winnings if you have been self excluded from another everymatrix site.

 

[brianmon]

I highly doubt that you can make an account at spinit if you have been self excluded from casino cruise. Live support must have told this? Im pretty sure its not true, since all everymatrix casinos basicly deny winnings if you have been self excluded from another everymatrix site.

Unless EveryMatrix have changed their procedures recently. you WILL be able to register at another EM casino, even if SE'd elsewhere.
They don't, or at least, didn't, make any checks UNTIL a withdrawal was requested and/or KYC checks were made.

That's why there are so many problems

 

[slotter999]

Unless EveryMatrix have changed their procedures recently. you WILL be able to register at another EM casino, even if SE'd elsewhere.
They don't, or at least, didn't, make any checks UNTIL a withdrawal was requested and/or KYC checks were made.

That's why there are so many problems

In my case they only enforced SE once I made withdrawals which had put me into profit. Withdrawals whilst I was down overall were processed perfectly fine and for reasonably large amounts sums of money.

 

[vinylweatherman]

In my case they only enforced SE once I made withdrawals which had put me into profit. Withdrawals whilst I was down overall were processed perfectly fine and for reasonably large amounts sums of money.

Well, that is very damning indeed! This is a clear breach of the UK regulations, and they can't argue that they are not manipulating the SE system for their own ends because they should have done the full KYC once you were withdrawing "large sums", which is where the SE check should have been done even with EMs shoddy system.

It suggests that they are not checking for SE until a player not only submits a withdrawal, but on that puts them in profit at the site. This is where they break the RG regulations because they are using it to prevent SE players from ever being able to win more than their net deposits, but are happily taking bets from "problem gamblers" for so long as they are losing money to the casino. The whole point of these regulations is to stop people from being able to play if they have a gambling problem, and it's losing even more money whilst trying to win back past losses that is by far the biggest problem.

 

[slotter999]

Well, that is very damning indeed! This is a clear breach of the UK regulations, and they can't argue that they are not manipulating the SE system for their own ends because they should have done the full KYC once you were withdrawing "large sums", which is where the SE check should have been done even with EMs shoddy system.

It suggests that they are not checking for SE until a player not only submits a withdrawal, but on that puts them in profit at the site. This is where they break the RG regulations because they are using it to prevent SE players from ever being able to win more than their net deposits, but are happily taking bets from "problem gamblers" for so long as they are losing money to the casino. The whole point of these regulations is to stop people from being able to play if they have a gambling problem, and it's losing even more money whilst trying to win back past losses that is by far the biggest problem.

Yep I'm straight up certain of that. The withdrawal was several thousand pounds and processed by casinoluck with full KYC checks performed so they knew exactly who I was. Only when I went into overall profit at playhippo did they suddenly find the SE (which I'm still unsure of the exact nature of to this day).

 

[spintee]

Yep I'm straight up certain of that. The withdrawal was several thousand pounds and processed by casinoluck with full KYC checks performed so they knew exactly who I was. Only when I went into overall profit at playhippo did they suddenly find the SE (which I'm still unsure of the exact nature of to this day).

Thats terrible, That is full blown proof of what they are doing,

Now if the U.K regs and other regulations had just a slight bit of knowledge than they would be struck off or at least a huge fine, And told to pay back all deposits

In reality this has to be one of the biggest casino scandals of all time, Taking deposits untill a withdraw is hit, Only paying back the last deposit, Or if paying out withdraws than untill such time player is in profit, There is a lot more too it but I seen what was going on a long time back,

Not only that but look at the licence they was passing out to rouge sites

 

[vinylweatherman]

Yep I'm straight up certain of that. The withdrawal was several thousand pounds and processed by casinoluck with full KYC checks performed so they knew exactly who I was. Only when I went into overall profit at playhippo did they suddenly find the SE (which I'm still unsure of the exact nature of to this day).

If it's over the magic £2300 they are damned because this is the point at which full KYC is required, and this is the total of all money movements, not necessarily a transaction of this size. The full KYC should include a SE check, so either they are breaking the RG rules by failing to make this check with their own internal group database, or worse, they are doing this check but choosing to ignore the fact that they have a "problem gambler" playing on site until such time as the problem gambler wins more than their total deposits.

This of course enables them to profit, because under the RG rules they MUST refund all deposits once they have determined that a previously SE player has been playing, but this of course means losing all the profit they have made from them. Instead, they are ignoring the SE so that they can avoid giving back all the deposits, but once it reaches the point where the player is in profit, it then suits them to discover the SE and then quote the regs "all bets void and deposits returned".

Of course, they recently lost in court over this SE fiasco, albeit on a technicality, but if a player in the above situation took EM to court, even if they employed a more competent legal team for the defence, the hearing will still reveal the fact that the SE was only applied once the player was in overall profit, even though all the trigger points for full KYC had been met and exceeded earlier on, with the player being paid "winnings" from some of the deposits. So even if they win and the player only gets the deposits back, the UKGC should be all over the case transcript with a view to levying a heavy fine for breaches of RG regulations.

 

[slotter999]

If it's over the magic £2300 they are damned because this is the point at which full KYC is required, and this is the total of all money movements, not necessarily a transaction of this size. The full KYC should include a SE check, so either they are breaking the RG rules by failing to make this check with their own internal group database, or worse, they are doing this check but choosing to ignore the fact that they have a "problem gambler" playing on site until such time as the problem gambler wins more than their total deposits.

This of course enables them to profit, because under the RG rules they MUST refund all deposits once they have determined that a previously SE player has been playing, but this of course means losing all the profit they have made from them. Instead, they are ignoring the SE so that they can avoid giving back all the deposits, but once it reaches the point where the player is in profit, it then suits them to discover the SE and then quote the regs "all bets void and deposits returned".

Of course, they recently lost in court over this SE fiasco, albeit on a technicality, but if a player in the above situation took EM to court, even if they employed a more competent legal team for the defence, the hearing will still reveal the fact that the SE was only applied once the player was in overall profit, even though all the trigger points for full KYC had been met and exceeded earlier on, with the player being paid "winnings" from some of the deposits. So even if they win and the player only gets the deposits back, the UKGC should be all over the case transcript with a view to levying a heavy fine for breaches of RG regulations.

So yeah my plan is to reluctantly begin legal proceedings to see what happens. If I get my net deposits back then it's worth £1100 if I get my confiscated winnings back it's £1300 but my intention is to go for the confiscated winnings using the Daz B case as a precedent.

I should add that I made the UKGC fully aware of all of this but they really weren't that interested and almost certainly did not follow up with everymatrix in any way, shape or form. I should further add that the tone of the emails from everymatrix suggested to me that they do not fear the UKGC in the slightest.

 

[vinylweatherman]

So yeah my plan is to reluctantly begin legal proceedings to see what happens. If I get my net deposits back then it's worth £1100 if I get my confiscated winnings back it's £1300 but my intention is to go for the confiscated winnings using the Daz B case as a precedent.

I should add that I made the UKGC fully aware of all of this but they really weren't that interested and almost certainly did not follow up with everymatrix in any way, shape or form. I should further add that the tone of the emails from everymatrix suggested to me that they do not fear the UKGC in the slightest.

The case itself was won on a technicality, the EM defence was simply struck out, not tested in court. They probably won't make that mistake again, and will probably come back with a proper defence backed by the statement from the UKGC about it not being in the interests of problem gamblers to be paid winnings.

What you could aim to do is flush out as much info as possible by forcing disclosure of how they operated the SE in your case that lead to you being able to gamble and lose thousands despite having a formal SE on their system, that they belatedly discovered when they confiscated the final £1300 win on grounds of SE policy.

Although the UKGC don't seem that interested, the CMA might be, and the media probably will be prepared to run a story based on the misuse of the SE system in a manner that allows problem gamblers to play with thousands of pounds, but only having the SE system kick in if they are lucky enough to win everything back plus a little more. This of course leaves most problem gamblers completely unprotected because they tend not to withdraw after a nice session, but keep on playing until they lose everything back.

Strictly speaking, you would be due back all deposits from ALL sites that are covered by the group SE database, and this would appear to be ALL EM sites, not just the ones they quote when confiscating the winnings. This would be a useful piece of information to force out of them in the run up to a court case, and it had better be true and include the full extent of all sites that are covered by the EM group SE system, which of course would reveal that these casinos are not "fully independent" as they would have us believe, including revealing the true relationship between EM and the rogues like Slotobank that officially have had their EM permissions withdrawn, yet still seemed to be using the EM platform.

It may be that they don't want to have to disclose such information, and they will simply settle out of court for the full £1300 claimed rather than produce this information just to save themselves £200. Finding a way to force them to settle out of court is if anything a better thing for players who have been getting screwed by this system.

If there was a full audit, it might reveal that EM owe significant refunds of deposits to a large number of players who were allowed to play and lose at EM sites when there was zero chance of them ever being able to win because the SE would have then been employed and only the deposits from that one site refunded.

 

[asm]

Casinocruise have just opened a sister casino "Spinit'.

You can open an a/c at Spinit even if SE'd from Casino Cruise - and live chat confirmed to me they would also SE you, but only as part of the verification process. So the EM trick - let you play as long as you lose. Not good enough.

Regardless of the self exclusion hijinks, they seem to have difficulties paying out either way, so I would avoid this casino at least for now

 

[spintee]

Regardless of the self exclusion hijinks, they seem to have difficulties paying out either way, so I would avoid this casino at least for now

Agred, But there is a few good casino running under that platform, For what reason is beyond me, BUT some casino are stuck between two stones, There trying to do what is right withen the U.K terms but than being told by EM other things,

Take slotter999 statement I should further add that the tone of the emails from everymatrix suggested to me that they do not fear the UKGC in the slightest.

So I guess they are telling there casinos what to do and let them deal with it, I do no a few casino have jumped ship, & member when EM rep came on to say they suspended a license from a casino or two but still let them run from there platform
Any good Brief and abit of info from players and there encounters would put EM in alot of trouble with the courts, EM DO NOT want to risk any court case as if they did turn up and it went in a players fafour than there up the shit creek, Hense why they do not go court as they have nothing to lose,

Player would get the cash and they may have to pay a bit of cash exrta at best, But look at all the secrets that would be kept behind closed doors

 

[colinsunderland]

So yeah my plan is to reluctantly begin legal proceedings to see what happens. If I get my net deposits back then it's worth £1100 if I get my confiscated winnings back it's £1300 but my intention is to go for the confiscated winnings using the Daz B case as a precedent.

Dont do that, in fact don't even mention it, especially in the initial claim. If you can get a copy of their defence in that case from the Claimant, both the original and amended ones, they 'might' be useful but I would 100% suggest not to mention it at all on the initial claim form.

I would also do a DPA request before starting any claim, specifically asking for any live chat and email logs along with everything else.

Don't forget you must send a pre action letter asking for payment and telling them that you will take legal action if they don't pay within 14 days.

I would also suggest keeping most details off the forum as they obviously have staff on here reading. I would also suggest printing off and also saving a copy of their terms and conditions in case they magically get changed.

I think there is enough evidence on this forum alone to show EM are dodgy, hopefully the whole group is in the rouge pit before long. I know some of the casinos are ok, but if they choose to operate under the EM banner then thats their choice and they have to take what comes.

 

[slotter999]

Dont do that, in fact don't even mention it, especially in the initial claim. If you can get a copy of their defence in that case from the Claimant, both the original and amended ones, they 'might' be useful but I would 100% suggest not to mention it at all on the initial claim form.

I would also do a DPA request before starting any claim, specifically asking for any live chat and email logs along with everything else.

Don't forget you must send a pre action letter asking for payment and telling them that you will take legal action if they don't pay within 14 days.

I would also suggest keeping most details off the forum as they obviously have staff on here reading. I would also suggest printing off and also saving a copy of their terms and conditions in case they magically get changed.

I think there is enough evidence on this forum alone to show EM are dodgy, hopefully the whole group is in the rouge pit before long. I know some of the casinos are ok, but if they choose to operate under the EM banner then thats their choice and they have to take what comes.

Yes all sound advice thank you. I'll probably stay silent on the matter now until there is some sort of worthy update or conclusion.

Cheers

 

[colinsunderland]

Yes all sound advice thank you. I'll probably stay silent on the matter now until there is some sort of worthy update or conclusion.

Cheers

I obviously don't know if you have any experience with the court system but if you need anyone to look over anything you are sending to them or the court feel free to pm me and I'll have a look.

 

[interlog]

So yeah my plan is to reluctantly begin legal proceedings to see what happens. If I get my net deposits back then it's worth £1100 if I get my confiscated winnings back it's £1300 but my intention is to go for the confiscated winnings using the Daz B case as a precedent.

I should add that I made the UKGC fully aware of all of this but they really weren't that interested and almost certainly did not follow up with everymatrix in any way, shape or form. I should further add that the tone of the emails from everymatrix suggested to me that they do not fear the UKGC in the slightest.

For your information, County Courts can't set precedents. Each case will be heard on its own merits. You can use previous cases to back your own case, but the Judge doesn't have to agree with previous decisions.

 

[Serilla]

Spinit

Well, Spinit's KYC seems to be just as ridiculous as Casino Cruise...

 

[asm]

I had no trouble with casinocruise back when I was a customer there, but spinit really seems to be hesitant to pay out. I send every document asked of me, even the ones that have nothing to do with my gambling there but all I get in return isn't euros, but excuses.

 

[slotter999]

I had no trouble with casinocruise back when I was a customer there, but spinit really seems to be hesitant to pay out. I send every document asked of me, even the ones that have nothing to do with my gambling there but all I get in return isn't euros, but excuses.

Can I ask what documents they asked for which are not related to gambling?

 

[asm]

Can I ask what documents they asked for which are not related to gambling?

my bank account, when I have not deposited through there (only skrill)

 

[slotter999]

my bank account, when I have not deposited through there (only skrill)

I see. It's any old bollocks these days isn't it to stall you. I used a casino promoted by someone here who wouldn't pay out until I showed them the actual deposit transactions taken from my credit card statement which of course takes ages to show up and proves what exactly? Needless to say that casino website and the person promoting them won't be seeing me again.

 

[asm]

After sending documents (one being renewed because of camera flash issues, the picture in question being the back of my ID which shows ABSOLUTELY NOTHING)... I had my withdrawal cancelled three times. After getting irate about this, I asked why. They cited technical issues. Then, I was assured it'll be fixed (it wasn't, 4th withdrawal cancelled). Funny, now that I posted in this thread and suggested in the chat that I have been patient, but I'm getting tired of this and will contact MGA, the withdraw was processed while I was going out and buying a pack of smokes.

Does anyone want to guess would I recommend this casino to anyone?

 

[pinnit2014]

After sending documents (one being renewed because of camera flash issues, the picture in question being the back of my ID which shows ABSOLUTELY NOTHING)... I had my withdrawal cancelled three times. After getting irate about this, I asked why. They cited technical issues. Then, I was assured it'll be fixed (it wasn't, 4th withdrawal cancelled). Funny, now that I posted in this thread and suggested in the chat that I have been patient, but I'm getting tired of this and will contact MGA, the withdraw was processed while I was going out and buying a pack of smokes.

Does anyone want to guess would I recommend this casino to anyone?

Sorry, oldish thread but exactly the same...

I deposited from Skill and then cancelled to....withdraw to my VISA?!

Then when i said it needs to be back to original method then went on about needing to send in docs.

Shocking casino.

 

[spintee]

Sorry, oldish thread but exactly the same...

I deposited from Skill and then cancelled to....withdraw to my VISA?!

Then when i said it needs to be back to original method then went on about needing to send in docs.

Shocking casino.

Deposit than cancealed it it???


Thats looking for trouble,

But yes normally sites pay back to last deposit but here is the trouble the rules are not 100% right across sites, I can deposit by bank and withdraw to skrill at VS but all depends whats been put in and took out from alot of sites, Just the other day I withdraw from a site, I forget now but stated you can withdraw certain amount like £40 to to one method and the rest has to be back to the other, It was ok as wanted it to where the 40 had to go any way,

But thats the trouble what if I closed my bank or shut down skrill? Casino have to take this in consideration, They do do but send out check, Perfect ok with me but not very convenient

 

[linastante]

Their sister casino SpinIt was equally stubborn and oversensitive with the documents. Definitely turned me off.

 

[hoff1985]

i really don't know why they are accredited, there are reports of slow payouts everywhere on the internet. i didn't toich them again since i've heard all these reports about payout delays etc.

 

[brianmon]

Their sister casino SpinIt was equally stubborn and oversensitive with the documents. Definitely turned me off.

READ THIS THREAD..... https://www.casinomeister.com/forums/threads/spinit-casino-any-experiences-with-this-casino.76664/

They will actually pay you.... Eventually.
But any document submission will take the maximum 72hrs+ to process, and if the initial submission is not accepted, then each subsequent submission will take another 72hrs+, each time, to process, and when your documents are FINALLY accepted, your withdrawal will still be subject to their mandatory pending period.

It's all stalling tactics, in the hope you'll reverse and lose your withdrawal.

... and, yeah, Hof1985, some accredited casinos do work this way.....

 

[chiya]

Sorry, oldish thread but exactly the same...

I deposited from Skill and then cancelled to....withdraw to my VISA?!

Then when i said it needs to be back to original method then went on about needing to send in docs.

Shocking casino.

Depositing and withdrawing immediately is considered as money laundering. Most casinos want you to wager your deposit at least once. Sorry but your own fault if they want docs - should consider yourself lucky if they even want to pay you back at all w/o wagering.

 

[pinnit2014]

Spinit

Apologies if I wasn't clear. Or you didn't get it

I didn't deposit and withdraw immediately. I deposited via skrill, played on and on and made request to skrill- as always.

Point made is that they wanted me to cancel it and put it to visa. All after 72 hrs plus pending

The point about docs is that I'm, like many others who've had issues, fully verified. Again, point made that their support changed reason why withdrawal needed to be changed.

Thanks for an utterly useless statement.

 

[colinsunderland]

Apologies if I wasn't clear. Or you didn't get it

I didn't deposit and withdraw immediately. I deposited via skrill, played on and on and made request to skrill- as always.

Point made is that they wanted me to cancel it and put it to visa. All after 72 hrs plus pending

The point about docs is that I'm, like many others who've had issues, fully verified. Again, point made that their support changed reason why withdrawal needed to be changed.

Thanks for an utterly useless statement.

Bit harsh considering you've been a member over 2 years and contributed nothing to the site, yet when someones tries to help you, you have a go at them. Maybe if you bothered to explain properly people would understand you

I deposited from Skill and then cancelled to....withdraw to my VISA?!

That clearly sounds like you deposited then wanted to cancel it and they made you withdraw to another method.