Another 3Dice rant.

[silcnlayc]

Mavin1: And that's why you love us so much.

OMG you WENCH!

Nifty29: If a slot player cant accept the idea of variance, they are destined to be writing posts like these forever and ever

Yea, yea ,yea, old news, heard it a million times before...BORING...............need a new line....and not even on subject...geez...


.

 

[voltage1]

I kinda like reading them too , especially ..... when they are true and are well worded like skiny's usually are!

thanks skiny and silcnlayc for your comments and views

 

[Mavin1]

So Silc, what kind of "Wench" are we talking here?

 

[silcnlayc]

Mavin1 So Silc, what kind of "Wench" are we talking here?

OMG...I am laffin so hard can't breath..I was going to say one of them "flirty types".....but is Nifty a he or she?? Oh geezes..I am dying here..please ignore me..I am punch happy or something..

.

 

[Mavin1]

I hadn't thought of the flirty wench, was thinking, truck wench, wicked wench, like the one in Wizard of Odds, Grinch Wench.......

But seriously, you have to admit, the more we complain, the better we get at it.

 

[silcnlayc]

Mavin1: But seriously, you have to admit, the more we complain, the better we get at it.

Now I wouldn't say we complain...I think we are expanding their minds into getting out of their boxes...there is always more to a thought than just one as they always show...(stuck in a rut kinda thing with them repeating the same thing for every question outside their comfort box). So I feel we are educating many in the ways of the world..no one sees it the same way...we are EDUCATORS! Alrighty!

And you know the old saying....(don't remember which one but it was old) about not exploring other ideas you get stale and old...well...far be it for me to become stale..and persistance pays off!!

.

 

[Mavin1]

I gather from this statement that you dont understand what this thread is about, or you are not interested in understanding it. Either way is cool



Actually I was talking about something entirely different and you showed up with a fruit basket.



That actually sounds kind of scary. We’re still talking about spinning 40 cent slots, right?



Well. That’s the nicest anyone’s ever called me nuts. Usually they just say I sniff glue.



Actually I’m not the one who brought up variance and am I looking for sympathy. Many players agree with me. If some don’t that’s fine.



This started out as a rant and I’m not embarrassed in the least. Unless you’re talking about you or Nifty.



Most people who play at a casino regularly have been up on the casino at times and down at times. This has nothing to do with what I’m talking about.



The numbers don’t contradict anything because I’m not talking about lifetime RTP. I’m talking about free spin bonus behavior. (I've hit a couple of good bonuses on that game but almost all my bonuses in Coral Clams crap out.)



Cavity search was and always is the furthest thing from my mind.

Now… If anyone wants to start a thread about psychology or variance I’ll join that one too but the entire point of this conversation was that when I hit free spins they have a very good habit of hitting much less than when I’m playing regular spins. I’ve given examples earlier in this thread and in private I’ve heard and given many more examples. I fully understand variance and when I’m playing games like Squirrel Pike or Medieval Moolah the games behave exactly how I expect them to. I start those games with the expectation to hit zero after zero after zero in the regular spins and when I finally do hit something it’s usually not too bad.

I’m talking about games like Payola where I can spin 150 times before finally getting a free spin bonus and during that regular play I’m hitting anywhere from 25% of my wager to 3x my wager very regularly. Usually with a very small amount of zero hits. Then when I finally get to spin for free I get 78 free spins and 65 of them hit zero. This is what my original rant was about. This is what burns my ass. Call me crazy if you like but like I said – Free spins used to mean something. Free spins used to be the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. It used to be quite normal for free spins to win something good. Now it’s quite normal for free spins to hit nothing until your bonus feature is done.

I’ve always praised you Enzo. I’ve always said you’re a good guy. I like the staff at 3Dice probably more than they like me. I like almost everyone I know that plays there. And yes when you finally do hit something at your casino it can pay well. But when I watch the spin results change so drastically as soon as I add a multiplier and stop paying for the spins it burns my ass.

Couldn't agree more with Skiny, this is becoming an all to familiar pattern and has been for a long time. I have only occasionally played at 3Dice and although the slots do have some appeal, overall experience left me not to amused.
I found the free spins to hard to acheive to often and as Skiny said only to be dissapointed with the end result after investing so much time and money into getting them. Didn't matter how many I tried, my experience has always been the same.
If a person has a legitimate concern about such matters just as any other, this person deserves to be answered truthfully by whom he is questioning. It just really makes me wonder why some feel it is their duty to halt and stifle anything other than Kudo's.

 

[Nifty29]

Skiny and Co. - you really are getting the wrong end of the stick.

I am not ridiculing your opinions, or dismissing your experiences, or calling you liars etc. If I was, I would expect to get some of the personal jibes I am getting....as it is, I think they are unwarranted.

What I am trying to do is help you by trying to explain the realities of how slot games work. Why do I bother? Well Im asking myself right now, but I can tell you that it is because I used to complain a lot and someone else took the time to educate me on the whole slots thingie and I took the time to listen and think about what they said. If you think this whole argument is new, search back in the forums over the last 5 years or more and you will find it isnt -now, if the payouts etc really have been decreasing that much over that time then nobody would be winning anything, which isnt the case.

There is nothing at all wrong with complaining about losing or getting crappy bonus rounds. All I was trying to do is help you understand why they happen - just like other members did for me years ago.

I really must say Im disappointed in the reaction of some people. The mob mentality thing is understandable when there is a fraudster or rogue about the place, but its pretty lame when someone is trying to help you.

I dont have a personal issue with anyone in this thread BTW so, again, its disappointing to have my statements ridiculed. Its also clear to me now why many members dont bother assisting with many issues.

I will try to answer this question however:

The POINT....the OBJECT..the REASON for a bonus round is.......say it here :_____________________________......to provide a 'game within a game' and an entertaining way of winning some $ apart from the usual spinning of the reels. Slots with bonus rounds will payout less on the reel combinations, to pay for the wins from the bonus round.

Its just my point of view, but there is nothing Ive seen or read that says bonus rounds are there to 'win back some of what it cost to reach them' - in fact, I would go so far as to say it is completely unrelated. Remember, a slot can still reach its RTP by paying out 999 bonus rounds of less than 5x bet and pay out 5000xbet on the 1000th bonus round. Its all about the way the RTP is distributed. Would you rather have every bonus round pay a minimum of 10xbet but never more than 50xbet, or the example above? You cant have both.

Silc - you say people think you have an agenda etc and dont take you seriously. I dont see it, but I can probably think of a reason why - but its not my place to point it out.

 

[silcnlayc]

Nifty29: What I am trying to do is help you by trying to explain the realities of how slot games work.

Same ole box....

Nifty29; to provide a 'game within a game' and an entertaining way of winning some $ apart from the usual spinning of the reels

now you are getting it....so..if I have 18 free spins with a 5x multiplier spins @ $2.25 and still walk away with 3 bucks...that is what I am supposed to reach for? You just said it yourself...it is a game within a game to MAKE money..how does one accept $0 for 5 rounds in a row???? Most casinos used to give you a great return on bonus rounds, and here again, I will point out the changes in the casinos mentality....because we (us old players) got used to getting SOMETHING in these rounds for YEARS...now..the norm is to get nOTHING....how can you account for that? More and more casinos are hitching their ride to this seeing how other casinos are getting away with it...so I say...from your lips to this page...to provide a 'game within a game' and an entertaining way of winning some $ apart from the usual spinning of the reels. Thank you for making that CLEAR ....
At least we agree on SOMETHING!

Silc - you say people think you have an agenda etc and dont take you seriously. I dont see it, but I can probably think of a reason why - but its not my place to point it out.

Why not? I do not take offense if truth is spoken...I have feelings but they run deep and if one feels their is truth in what they say, I can respect that.. What I cannot respect is the innuendoes, the dismissing of ideas etc....the group mentality has always been here and you can pick "the group" out by just reading some of these posts...so yes, tell me your opinion why my thoughts and opinions have been dismissed as of no consequence? I think many of us loose thinkers would like to know this....the ones not stuck in a box believing everything that is force fed to us by a rote from others..they do say...if you hear it enough, you get to believe it is true..yes? This goes for all....including me...but the difference is....I have played for many years..every game possible INLUDING black jack unlike others that claim they know nothing about it but yet have an opinion about it...how can one do that? Ahh yes, they HEARD about it...and there my friend is the problem...

Sorry for such a long post...going over to the next one...I have no issue with you......Have a nice day...
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[skiny]

Jokes, jibes and sarcasm is all part of the fun of any debate. I don't outright insult people. That would just be mean. If all of us spoke in plain mathematical monotones what a boring place this would be. If it's not funny, it's not fun.

You seem to think that I know nothing about a lot of things. You might be surprised what I know. You might also be surprised that some people can enter a conversation without feeling the need to be educated by people who assume they know more.

I understand variance. I understand statistics. I also understand mechanical advantage, euclidean geometry and trigonometry. That doesn't mean it doesn't burn my ass every time I hit a free spin bonus and the game suddenly clamps down and hit zero 65 times in a row.

Jesus. I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue.

 

[maxd]

Jesus. I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue.

Always a decision that requires careful thought: anytime is *not* necessarily a good time.

 

[jelsmith]

Jokes, jibes and sarcasm is all part of the fun of any debate. I don't outright insult people. That would just be mean. If all of us spoke in plain mathematical monotones what a boring place this would be. If it's not funny, it's not fun.

You seem to think that I know nothing about a lot of things. You might be surprised what I know. You might also be surprised that some people can enter a conversation without feeling the need to be educated by people who assume they know more.

I understand variance. I understand statistics. I also understand mechanical advantage, euclidean geometry and trigonometry. That doesn't mean it doesn't burn my ass every time I hit a free spin bonus and the game suddenly clamps down and hit zero 65 times in a row.

Jesus. I picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue.

Skiny def knows his math.....and his sarcasm and humor generally make me wet my pants most of the time....

 

[skiny]

Skiny def knows his math.....and his sarcasm and humor generally make me wet my pants most of the time....

I thought I told you to sit on a towel.

 

[killipso]

3dice

Agree with Skiny 100 %

I would go as far to say the settings on the bonus rounds have been changed this year.

Played enough of 3dice slots to see the difference.

Just played fortune falls in tournament the other day.

15 times I hit the bonus rounds one was 25 at 4x. I started the tourney late and started with 2500 dollars.

I believe I played 20 minutes and ended up with 600 bucks left.

The bonus rounds are coming up alot more and paying less.

Since Enzo wanted to comment on recent luck with Skiny lets dive into my account.

Deposits : (and this is me adding it up roughly could be more)

$12,500 dollars

Withdrawals: $5380

I have had 5 checks sent in about a year.

I have all the screenshots of my deposits...

My last check was Oct 21st 2009

So I guess "psychologically" I must have Post Traumatic Syndrome..

But hey we still have those big promo for depositing...

Up to 30 dollars match once a month...

Enough said

 

[skiny]

Maybe someone can explain the difference to me between high variance and medium variance.

Payola is supposed to be medium variance. (Pays more per spin on average but has fewer "Big" payouts?) I'm playing this game for real money tonight hitting zero every single spin. (Literally zero. Literally every single spin.) You can't spin like this forever and you shouldn't have to. This is after all "medium variance."

Squirrel pike is supposed to be "High Variance." (Pays less per spin on average but has higher "big" payouts?) I'm playing this game at 3 coins per line and the squirrels I'm clicking in the bonus feature are paying 3 cents each.

Seems to me it makes no difference which you play. low, med, high, very high. They all pay the same. Usually nothing.

 

[bernynhel]

Maybe someone can explain the difference to me between high variance and medium variance.

Payola is supposed to be medium variance. (Pays more per spin on average but has fewer "Big" payouts?) I'm playing this game for real money tonight hitting zero every single spin. (Literally zero. Literally every single spin.) You can't spin like this forever and you shouldn't have to. This is after all "medium variance."

Squirrel pike is supposed to be "High Variance." (Pays less per spin on average but has higher "big" payouts?) I'm playing this game at 3 coins per line and the squirrels I'm clicking in the bonus feature are paying 3 cents each.

Seems to me it makes no difference which you play. low, med, high, very high. They all pay the same. Usually nothing.

When's the last time you logged out of the casino for 4 hours or more? Are you betting more than 1% of your balance? - ex. bal = $60/bet = $0.60. Did you start each slot with min bet (all lines X 1 coin) before raising? After trying all of the above, did you move on to another slot after a handful of spins with 0 or < bet payouts? I've played many spins on slots only to drop the bet to 1% of my balance and start hitting. Of course, I deposit and bust, balance straight down - too but much less when I control my play using the above guidelines. GL!

 

[skiny]

I log out of the casino for 20 hours or more. Every single day.

3 cents per squirrel in squirrel pike on at 3 coins per line shouldn't even be possible.

Zero on every single spin for dozens of spins in a row is NOT medium variance. In fact it's no variance. It's the same every spin.

 

[just play]

Maybe someone can explain the difference to me between high variance and medium variance.

Payola is supposed to be medium variance. (Pays more per spin on average but has fewer "Big" payouts?) I'm playing this game for real money tonight hitting zero every single spin. (Literally zero. Literally every single spin.) You can't spin like this forever and you shouldn't have to. This is after all "medium variance."

Squirrel pike is supposed to be "High Variance." (Pays less per spin on average but has higher "big" payouts?) I'm playing this game at 3 coins per line and the squirrels I'm clicking in the bonus feature are paying 3 cents each.

Seems to me it makes no difference which you play. low, med, high, very high. They all pay the same. Usually nothing.

Ok this is really weird...I was playing Payola today and was hitting NOTHING. But the other night I was hitting it pretty well. Tonight I was going spin after spin with no wins, I thought it was really strange, and it's even stranger to see you spinning the same.

I HATE when you hit the Squirrel Pike feature and get 3 or 5 cents...in my opinion that feature is a waste of time unless you get 4 squirrels, I actually always sigh when I hit the feature, because I don't care for it, unless it's 4 squirrels or 5 which I have seen I think once or twice.

I wrote somewhere else here that I haven't hit squat since my Joker Jackpot win. The other night I got to cash out pennies (about $80 profit, after hundreds spent since the big win) so now I guess I am on another "unlucky streak" Oh one more thing...I HATE those tournys, I cannot win, not even close. There is always one person who gets like 10 million dollars, and there is no chance no one else can catch up.

But their support is the best.

 

[nisosbar]

Still just about my favorite casino, but like others, I've been running really, really bad over the last few days/weeks. As a low-roller, it's like, 'whatever', but yeah it's still annoying.

 

[bernynhel]

I log out of the casino for 20 hours or more. Every single day.

3 cents per squirrel in squirrel pike on at 3 coins per line shouldn't even be possible.

Zero on every single spin for dozens of spins in a row is NOT medium variance. In fact it's no variance. It's the same every spin.

I can only recommend abandoning play on any slot in favor of another long before "dozens" of empty spins transpire.

 

[RobWin]

When's the last time you logged out of the casino for 4 hours or more? Are you betting more than 1% of your balance? - ex. bal = $60/bet = $0.60. Did you start each slot with min bet (all lines X 1 coin) before raising? After trying all of the above, did you move on to another slot after a handful of spins with 0 or < bet payouts? I've played many spins on slots only to drop the bet to 1% of my balance and start hitting. Of course, I deposit and bust, balance straight down - too but much less when I control my play using the above guidelines. GL!

When that happens Bern, do you still feel the RTP and the slots themselves are still playing and paying "randomly"?
____
____

 

[skiny]

Telling me to stand on my head and sing "Somebody to love" while I spin doesn't change the fact that I'm playing a so called medium variance slot game and it's hitting zero 25 spins out of 30.

 

[bernynhel]

When that happens Bern, do you still feel the RTP and the slots themselves are still playing and paying "randomly"?
____
____

Who said I ever thought anything I've ever played online was random? I don't think any slot or video poker or table game, online, is random. I believe their all rigged and the playing patterns I've described in my earlier posts are just what I think I have to do to max my chances. I think if you just set any slot to auto play and forget about it, after some payouts if you let it go infinitely - as in forget it's running and leave the house - that it will, eventually, start spinning empty spins and if you don't stop it, then it is programmed to assume you aren't around and will simply spin consecutive goose eggs till you're busted - no matter if the balance is $10 or $10,000. Which is exactly how I'd want all my slots rigged if I ran an online casino and there was no one to tell me I couldn't!

Telling me to stand on my head and sing "Somebody to love" while I spin doesn't change the fact that I'm playing a so called medium variance slot game and it's hitting zero 25 spins out of 30.

Well, how bout you skip standing on your head just do butt-naked-backwards-booty-scoots while singing In-A-Godda-Da-Vida and quit after hitting zero 4 spins out of 5 and try playing something else? Just a suggestion!

 

[skiny]

Well, how bout you skip standing on your head just do butt-naked-backwards-booty-scoots while singing In-A-Godda-Da-Vida and quit after hitting zero 4 spins out of 5 and try playing something else? Just a suggestion!

I wish.

The judge said I'm not allowed to be naked anymore.

 

[killipso]

Waiting

Still waiting for someone from 3dice to explain my losses and deposits like they did skiny's ...

Uh huh ..