Casino Complaint Advise re gametech group

Rach23

Newbie member
PABnononaccred
Joined
Dec 13, 2017
Location
Uk
Hi

I did something silly and played at several sites owned by the gametech group not knowing they didn't have a UKGC license. (I'm only just learning about these things).

There are lots of withdrawals out of my bank and I have since found out that they shouldn't have let me play and if I had won the likelihood of them paying out is very slim.

I wrote to the asking them to refund my deposits and got this response from one of them. Can anyone give me any advice on how to respond to them please. I'd be very grateful.

My email

Hi

I have been playing at the game tech group but it has come to my attention that they are legally not entitled to take my money in the uk as they do not have a UKGC licence and thus are breaking Uk law by accepting my play. The UKGC states it is illegal to transact with, or a advertise to consumers in great Britain without a licence. They are operating under master licence num
ber 1668/JAZ from caracco though.
I am getting no response from any of the casinos I have played at. So I am now reporting them to the Caracco licencing authority.
I am asking for all deposits to be refunded as it was illegal to take my money in the first place. These are in excess of £1500.
I will also be following this up with the UKGC, the financial ombudsmen for the UK, the police actionline against UK fraud and tax evasion and my payment provider.

Their response


Thank you for your email.

Your question about the legality of your playing at our casino has been referred to me.

It is a serious question and I will try to answer you as best I can. Please understand that I am not giving you legal advice. As our Terms and Conditions state: (2.2) “It is your responsibility to know whether the registration or use of an Account is allowed within your jurisdiction.”

Having said that let me get to the gist of the matter.

In November of 2014 your government passed a law obligating all off shore online casinos, even those not located at all in the UK, to acquire a UK license if they wish to serve UK players.

The obvious difficulty with this is: how can UK law control the actions of others who are not UK citizens or located in the UK? The answer is this: There is a principle in international law that says that a country can legislate to anyone having an impact within that country’s borders. However, the application of this principle is still largely undetermined.

The effect of the UK law outside the borders of the UK has primarily been to cause highly regarded casinos in white label licensing jurisdictions to acquire licenses that offer players no more protection than they had before, since such casinos were above reproach anyway. Casinos with little connection to the UK continue unhindered. Many around the world consider the UK to be unenforceable, disproportional and possibly in violation of international laws governing free trade.

To make matters even more obscure, the UK has not -- so far as I am aware-- limited the freedom of UK players to gamble wherever they like. It is quite understandable that many licensing authorities have taken a “wait and see” attitude. Our licensing authority (Curacao Gaming Commission) has not required us to bar UK players out of our establishments

By the law of your country, you are allowed to play wherever you like. By the law of our country we are allowed to let you play. When you agree to the Terms and Conditions, you are entering in to an agreement governed by the laws of Curacao. No-one can deny the validity of this agreement.

Your account at Casino Blu was closed on 26/11/17 but we will not be able to refund any of your deposits as they have been used on our games and it is legal for you to play at Casino Blu.

Kind Regards,

Morgan Richards
VIP Manager
Casino BLU
 

Casinomeister

Forum Cheermeister
Staff member
Joined
Jun 30, 1998
Location
Bierland
It's a load of bollocks. They ought to be reported to the UKGC, and possibly to the fraud department your local metro police station.

This unlicensed company not only takes UK bets from punters in the UK, they have a history of stealing software from companies like Netent and Novomatic. This has been reported a number of times. Just google "1668/JAZ" and you will see.
 

dunover

Unofficial T&C's Editor
Staff member
webmeister
PABnonaccred
PABnononaccred
CAG
mm3
Joined
May 22, 2012
Location
the bus shelter, opposite GCHQ Benhall
Hi

I did something silly and played at several sites owned by the gametech group not knowing they didn't have a UKGC license. (I'm only just learning about these things).

There are lots of withdrawals out of my bank and I have since found out that they shouldn't have let me play and if I had won the likelihood of them paying out is very slim.

I wrote to the asking them to refund my deposits and got this response from one of them. Can anyone give me any advice on how to respond to them please. I'd be very grateful.

My email

Hi

I have been playing at the game tech group but it has come to my attention that they are legally not entitled to take my money in the uk as they do not have a UKGC licence and thus are breaking Uk law by accepting my play. The UKGC states it is illegal to transact with, or a advertise to consumers in great Britain without a licence. They are operating under master licence num
ber 1668/JAZ from caracco though.
I am getting no response from any of the casinos I have played at. So I am now reporting them to the Caracco licencing authority.
I am asking for all deposits to be refunded as it was illegal to take my money in the first place. These are in excess of £1500.
I will also be following this up with the UKGC, the financial ombudsmen for the UK, the police actionline against UK fraud and tax evasion and my payment provider.

Their response


Thank you for your email.

Your question about the legality of your playing at our casino has been referred to me.

It is a serious question and I will try to answer you as best I can. Please understand that I am not giving you legal advice. As our Terms and Conditions state: (2.2) “It is your responsibility to know whether the registration or use of an Account is allowed within your jurisdiction.”

Having said that let me get to the gist of the matter.

In November of 2014 your government passed a law obligating all off shore online casinos, even those not located at all in the UK, to acquire a UK license if they wish to serve UK players.

The obvious difficulty with this is: how can UK law control the actions of others who are not UK citizens or located in the UK? The answer is this: There is a principle in international law that says that a country can legislate to anyone having an impact within that country’s borders. However, the application of this principle is still largely undetermined.

The effect of the UK law outside the borders of the UK has primarily been to cause highly regarded casinos in white label licensing jurisdictions to acquire licenses that offer players no more protection than they had before, since such casinos were above reproach anyway. Casinos with little connection to the UK continue unhindered. Many around the world consider the UK to be unenforceable, disproportional and possibly in violation of international laws governing free trade.

To make matters even more obscure, the UK has not -- so far as I am aware-- limited the freedom of UK players to gamble wherever they like. It is quite understandable that many licensing authorities have taken a “wait and see” attitude. Our licensing authority (Curacao Gaming Commission) has not required us to bar UK players out of our establishments

By the law of your country, you are allowed to play wherever you like. By the law of our country we are allowed to let you play. When you agree to the Terms and Conditions, you are entering in to an agreement governed by the laws of Curacao. No-one can deny the validity of this agreement.

Your account at Casino Blu was closed on 26/11/17 but we will not be able to refund any of your deposits as they have been used on our games and it is legal for you to play at Casino Blu.

Kind Regards,

Morgan Richards
VIP Manager
Casino BLU


Go to your payment provider and chargeback your deposits - they shouldn't have taken them, it's a void transaction.
 

Rach23

Newbie member
PABnononaccred
Joined
Dec 13, 2017
Location
Uk
Thank you all for your help. Any advice on charge back would be greatly appreciated. I went to my my bank and tried first tthrough a charge back and they said no because I had sent the money and then through fraud and again didn't get anywhere. I told them everything but they were totally unhelpful
 

dunover

Unofficial T&C's Editor
Staff member
webmeister
PABnonaccred
PABnononaccred
CAG
mm3
Joined
May 22, 2012
Location
the bus shelter, opposite GCHQ Benhall
Thank you all for your help. Any advice on charge back would be greatly appreciated. I went to my my bank and tried first tthrough a charge back and they said no because I had sent the money and then through fraud and again didn't get anywhere. I told them everything but they were totally unhelpful

You need to compile the evidence that the payments were fraudulent by providing a summary of the OP you made and UKGC rules, and evidence they were not lawfully entitled to take your money. This is the whole problem and they are part of it - the parasite dies if you cut their blood supply off, in this case money and the card companies and Neteller/Skrill are actively helping criminals by enabling payments to them.

If the UKGC would insist all casino transactions from the UK had their UKGC license number as part of the transaction code, thus preventing the facilitating of payments to non-UKGC sites then the problem would stop overnight.
 

PaaskeDenmark

Always think positive
webmeister
PABnoaccred
CAG
Joined
Nov 24, 2008
Location
UnKnown
Makes sure you inform your bank etc that they are a fraudulent casino. Not just say you want to do chargeback only because they are not ukgc as bank won't understand that. If you make it clear for all reasons then there is no way they can refuse to do chargebacks. Hope helps. Good luck hope it all sorts out for you.
 

Rach23

Newbie member
PABnononaccred
Joined
Dec 13, 2017
Location
Uk
I did that over the phone and they still rejected it as they said I sent my money of my own free will. I tried to argue that if I had bought a designer bag that proved to be a copy would I get my money back then but she was just funny with me
 

Rach23

Newbie member
PABnononaccred
Joined
Dec 13, 2017
Location
Uk
Just an update this is the reply from the UKGC

Thank you for contacting the Gambling Commission regarding an unlicensed website you have been playing.



We would like to thank you for bringing this matter to our attention. It is illegal to transact with, or advertise to, consumers in Great Britain without a licence, regardless of whether said company holds a licence in other jurisdictions.


At this time we have passed the details of the web-site to our specialists who look into illegal gambling-related activity.



We are unable to assist with you obtaining any money back from this website, as it is not in a illegal powers to do so. We are also not in a position to advise what your banks processes would be surrounding this and you may wish to query this with them directly.
 

sarah1234

Newbie member
Joined
Nov 11, 2017
Location
United Kingdom
Just an update this is the reply from the UKGC

Thank you for contacting the Gambling Commission regarding an unlicensed website you have been playing.



We would like to thank you for bringing this matter to our attention. It is illegal to transact with, or advertise to, consumers in Great Britain without a licence, regardless of whether said company holds a licence in other jurisdictions.


At this time we have passed the details of the web-site to our specialists who look into illegal gambling-related activity.



We are unable to assist with you obtaining any money back from this website, as it is not in a illegal powers to do so. We are also not in a position to advise what your banks processes would be surrounding this and you may wish to query this with them directly.
Rach23. Can you provide me with the email address that you got this reply from. I'm building my case against GTG and have phoned my bank. My bank was OK. It didn't phase them when I told them it was gambling. However, I'd like to build a strong case including statements from the UKGC. Cheers!
 

Borgie

Ueber Meister
MM
Joined
Jul 19, 2011
Location
United Kingdom
Rach23. Can you provide me with the email address that you got this reply from. I'm building my case against GTG and have phoned my bank. My bank was OK. It didn't phase them when I told them it was gambling. However, I'd like to build a strong case including statements from the UKGC. Cheers!
@Rach23 Has not been on since mid December maybe PM her she should get an e mail alert that she had a PM so that may prompt her
 
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