A letter to the casinos

[Casinomeister]

That being said, I don't ask for bonuses anywhere. I do not believe in this mentality because I think if you've reached this stage, then you need to rethink your reasons for playing online.

Amen to that!

 

[steinhaug]

Amen to that!

While this all sounds fine and dandy, I cannot help to think that if this was true - there would not be a casino business! They thrive on players like me, the ones not having the control to stop and wagering more than they intended or could afford at that particular time. The do not make money on the $20 deposits, they make it on the 2K deposits.

Anyways, nice to be sober again!

I'll take free chips any day, because I know I will lose anyway (atleast historically I always did, I have eccepted the reality that i will never be a winner!), only a question of time! I only get a rush from the big win anyways - free chips or not - still the same adrenalin boiling though the veins! I much rather make the casino let me free-ride a dry spell, than deposit more money to play through it.

Thanks for the comments people! I do wish the casinos would have change their policy though, however it doesn't really matter as I have pointed out. Lot's of cainos throw free chips at you, and as I know I have the capacity to go overboard, I require the attention of free chips if I should do so - especially since they are so easy to get when losing (that is - total balance in casino account is below zero)!

Whatever, the argument feels exhausted - what I would like to see is some casino representatives respond, not fellow members (including you Casinomeister,lol) since our views really doesn't mean squat in this matter,

 

[steinhaug]

Not to make the thread derail totally here, my question fro the a casino would be:

Scenario, say deposit is 1K, withdrawal is 10K. Last session has deposited 2K and lost all.

If loosing 2K qualifies for a $100 manager bonus if you ask for it, it should't really matter if I am a winner or loser in the long run [statistically one would lose].

Given normal practise is NOT giving any form of extra bonuses for a winning customer, even if loosing 2K straight. [I am still 7K ahead]

Question: Why would I want to keep playing at such a casino, knowing I will get minimal service? I know I need to lose 7K more to get back to scratch, and probably lose 1K more before being qualified for free chips when the going gets tough. At this point service will be superior again, since I now am VIP again, [the irony]

The other casinos have the same software and games.
The other casinos have the same deposit options
The other casinos have the same withdrawal options
The other casinos have the same live chat
The other casinos will treat you nice if losing by throwing some chips in your direction

Disclaimer:
I hope I do not sound angry or dishappy with anyone, then I applogize, this is not my intention. I have dropped my wagering much this year, and my losses are not what they used to be. I have no argument with any casino, I have no problem with their practise which by the way pretty much all casinos share regarding this thread. I am however interested in the business logic behind this way of treating the customers with manager bonus, as I simply cannot understand how this is costly for the casino - in my head I can only sum it up with the casino losing customers this way. Anyways!

 

[Jufo]

Question: Why would I want to keep playing at such a casino, knowing I will get minimal service? I know I need to lose 7K more to get back to scratch, and probably lose 1K more before being qualified for free chips when the going gets tough. At this point service will be superior again, since I now am VIP again, [the irony]

So then DON'T play at the same casino. It is their mistake if they cannot see that giving you some freebies would make you lose some of your winnings back to them. It's not like there aren't plenty of other casinos to choose from, so I don't see what's the problem.

 

[steinhaug]

So then DON'T play at the same casino. It is their mistake if they cannot see that giving you some freebies would make you lose some of your winnings back to them. It's not like there aren't plenty of other casinos to choose from, so I don't see what's the problem.

You are not getting my point here. I have no problem here, what I do not understand is how this practice accually serves the casino? It sounds to me that the the casino is not serving their own best interest here.

So look at it as a theoretical question I would like to try and understand the business logic behind, since I do not get it.

 

[jas2587]

If you don't take a bonus you will lose. Period. If you enjoy losing, go ahead and pour your money down the drain.

But here is a solution to all the non-bonus losers. Play in Fun Mode. Because I can't see the difference - you can't win not taking a bonus, and you can't win playing Fun Mode. Except in Fun Mode - you can't lose either!

.

you are wrong you say if you don't take a bonus you will lose
I dont take a bonus an I win quite often I have never had to fund my Quicktender or ewallet with cash from any banking or wire transfers etc I have always funded mine from Winning an not taking a Bonus

Cindy

So I dont have to play in fun mode
an there are casino reps that can verify that i dont take any bonus unless they force it on you as in as soon as you deposit they add it like Micro does

 

[catrina m]

I have always appreciated a little appreciation bonus, they should at least acknowledge that deposits are the means by which they survive.

I generally like playing an an even field, where i can get out with a lucky win if I so chose. All the bonuses I have played have been free with no deposit sans a scant few.

If your giving out free money I will take your bonus terms no matter how ridiculous, but when I deposit hard earned money I want it to be clear, if I win I might walk with it.

 

[mojo]

I can relate to the OP except that I have never cashed out at Red Flush and deposited tons. Not to say it isn't a good casino but when I go to chat for a little something something I expect it. I dont ask for much.

I do like this casino but I get comped better elsewhere so that is where I will go. I happen to like comps because I get tired of playing with my own dam money sometimes lol. And, I like to see how a bonus request is received. Here is my chat from just tonight. I thought my request was resonable but I ended up confused. Maybe I was mixed up? I definately am treated better elsewhere. There is some confusion on loyalty or is it me? It didn't make much sense but the responses were so slow I had to get out.

Micky: Welcome to Red Flush Casino. How may I assist you?
paula: hi micky
Micky: hi Paula
paula: just wondering if i have any loyalty points. i deposited over 1000 this month already but I don't get much for loyalty
Micky: please give me one moment
paula: ty
Micky: your current loyalty balance is 2678
paula: i didnt see that. is that in the my account section?
paula: i see 101
Micky: that is loyalty balance
Micky: the points earned to this date is 2678
paula: can i redeem them for $26?
Micky: i will have to check that
paula: my loyalty shows there is only 101
Micky: And that is correct
paula: ?
Micky: you can redeemed from 1000 loyalty points
paula: i dont understand. you said i have 2678
paula: then 101
paula: then 1000?
Micky: no i said that the points that you earned to this date are 2678
paula: no you said my current loyalty balance is 2678. my history shows i have redeemed 4000 to date
Micky: your current loyalty balance is 101
paula: you have lost me micky lol
Micky: Oh my mistake.
Micky: I am sorry for that Paula
paula: no problem
Micky: so i was saying that your points earned to date are 2678
Micky: and your loyalty balance is 101
Micky: so you can redeem from 1000 loyalty points
paula: but i cannot because i only have 101 correct?
Micky: yes!!!
paula: ok so I deposit over 1000 and get about $10?
paula: i think there is something very wrong here
Micky: not if you deposit, if you earn 1000 loyalty points
Micky: you cannot buy loyalty points
paula: i should be getting more than $10 for depositing and playing over $1000. dont you agree?
paula: i earn points by playing
paula: i do much better at other microgaming casinos
paula: so i will just uninstall red flush
Micky: what do you mean?
paula: if i deposit 1000, i usually look forward to redeeming a fair amount of loyalty. not $10
Micky: most casinos have the same approach when it come to the loyalty points
paula: im sorry, i will just leave it at that and do not wish to play at red flush at this time.
paula: thank you for your assistance.
paula: i will be uninstalling. i understand i cannot re-install as i am in the usa
Micky: You are welcome Paula.
paula: best of luck to you.

 

[tofu23]

you are wrong you say if you don't take a bonus you will lose
I dont take a bonus an I win quite often I have never had to fund my Quicktender or ewallet with cash from any banking or wire transfers etc I have always funded mine from Winning an not taking a Bonus

Cindy

So I dont have to play in fun mode
an there are casino reps that can verify that i dont take any bonus unless they force it on you as in as soon as you deposit they add it like Micro does

Which casino game(s) are giving you +EV jas2587 - let us all in on the secret.

And just imagine - how much more you would have won had you taken a bonus!!

Harping on about "not taking a bonus" is an invitation for people to lose. It is attempting to make a virtue out of losing your money.

Sorry, I can't hide my contempt for such things. On another thread (Ksmiss' letter??) I read about Casino owners, Casino Managers, Casino Affiliates quaffing champagne and dining out on truffles.

I decided a long time ago that it will be a cold day in hell before I pay for truffles and the fattening of a Casino's waistline.

..

 

[chuchu59]

Tofu,

A bit too harsh on someone who just happens to disagree with you. I always take a bonus when I want to play slots because it extends my playing time. Sometimes, when I am down to the last few dollars of my bonus and where the depsit was already lost, I bounced back with a good profit. However, there were also occasions where I had a healthy profit early in my slot play but eventually busted out because of the WRs. So, if you dont take a bonus, you hope to win big and early because the longer you play the more the -EV will bear on you. On the other hand, if you take a bonus you should examine the terms carefully. Anything over 15x deposit+bonus or unwithdrawable bonus is not to my liking as you are likely to bust 90% of the time. That said, I still play a couple of these and bet big at high variance slots.

In summary, to each his own. You wouldnt expect KK to play without a bonus and you are unlikely to see Bryan, Simmo or Pinababy playing with one. Both ways work sometimes though I guess everybody knows that we lose in the long run.

 

[Jufo]

You are not getting my point here. I have no problem here, what I do not understand is how this practice accually serves the casino? It sounds to me that the the casino is not serving their own best interest here.

So look at it as a theoretical question I would like to try and understand the business logic behind, since I do not get it.

I know, it shows a very bad business sense to turn away past winners from returning. On the other hand giving a free chip is always financial risk, because you might win from it and never come back. They cannot be sure that you will return to gamble.

Some casinos have different policies though. Some time ago I won 5000$ from a MG casino and after I cashed out, they made me a golden member and invited me to nice promotions, as well as putting some 100$ free chips on my account. I got the treatment that is commonly reserved for losing players only.

 

[LaurieJim]

I know, it shows a very bad business sense to turn away past winners from returning. On the other hand giving a free chip is always financial risk, because you might win from it and never come back. They cannot be sure that you will return to gamble.

Some casinos have different policies though. Some time ago I won 5000$ from a MG casino and after I cashed out, they made me a golden member and invited me to nice promotions, as well as putting some 100$ free chips on my account. I got the treatment that is commonly reserved for losing players only.

a good casino will always take care of it's loyal customers, if they want to continue to have that player's custom imo....laurie

 

[steinhaug]

Some time ago I won 5000$ from a MG casino and after I cashed out, they made me a golden member and invited me to nice promotions, as well as putting some 100$ free chips on my account. I got the treatment that is commonly reserved for losing players only.

Just for the point of argument, did you ever return to that casino and made more deposits as a result of this great treatment?

If you did - giving you that same treatment as if you were on the other end of the stick - infact made you becoma a loyal customer instead of throwing you away.

If I didn't ask for a chip here and there this would not be any problem for me, but since I isually do this, and since I usually get one while losing I can't help being frustrated by the flawed logic from the casino denying me this since I won. (that is - they lose a customer).

You say they have no way of knowing I am going to lose? Well that is just bollocks. If I lose 1K in a fresh account and can get $100 with wagering requirements, why would loosing 1K a week after you won be any different? 1K should be 1K. If I won the last weel, surely the ods of me winning again would be slim! Infact - close to none - unless the system itself is flawed and serve the wins in cycles that is. Again - I just cannot see what the casino stands to gain by this.

Anyway, it's friday, time for beer!

 

[jas2587]

Which casino game(s) are giving you +EV jas2587 - let us all in on the secret.

And just imagine - how much more you would have won had you taken a bonus!!

Harping on about "not taking a bonus" is an invitation for people to lose. It is attempting to make a virtue out of losing your money.

Sorry, I can't hide my contempt for such things. On another thread (Ksmiss' letter??) I read about Casino owners, Casino Managers, Casino Affiliates quaffing champagne and dining out on truffles.

I decided a long time ago that it will be a cold day in hell before I pay for truffles and the fattening of a Casino's waistline.

..

your post just reeks of contempt or hate either 1 you hate the fact that some people win an win with their own style of play I have winning screen shots in the screenshot 2 from the same day an they aint for penny's either but they are not for 1000's either but damn I made heck of a wage at those 2casino's for 4 hrs playing time

if I would have taken a bonus I do not think I would have cashed out as the WR would have eaten away at my wins

I am not harping I was stating a Fact that I don't take a bonus even when I open a New account

so they ate truffles big deal they didn't have to pay for it they was doin it at the casino's exspense gee when I worked oppps I haven't worked in 28 yrs so it was called a buisness exspense tax right off what ever

You have a great day cause I know I will I don't worry bout others style of play just my own

Cindy

 

[LaurieJim]

your post just reeks of contempt or hate either 1 you hate the fact that some people win an win with their own style of play I have winning screen shots in the screenshot 2 from the same day an they aint for peeny's either but they are not for 1000's either but damn I made heck of a wage at those 2casino's for 4 hrs playing time

if I would have taken a bonus I do not think I would have cashed out as the WR would have eaten away at my wins

I am not harping I was stating a Fact that I don't take a bonus even when I open a New account

so they ate truffles big deal they didn't have to pay for it they was doin it at the casino's exspense gee when I worked oppps I haven't worked in 28 yrs so it was called a buisness exspence tax right off what ever

You have a great day cause I know I will I don't worry bout others style of play just my own
Cindy

this is true cindy, we all have our own style of playing, some do well on bonuses, while some dont, if it was a 10X no max cashout bonus, id love it it is easier to complete the w/r imo, but these ones with 20 or 30 or even 50 x's , well they spell nightmare for me, as for a free chip, to me thats a chance to recoup maybe a fraction of money that i may have lost or atleast have some free playing time, like i said, everyone is different, if we all had the answer on how to win, the casino's would be out of bizz........laurie

 

[steinhaug]

I respect people for not wanting bonuses, and I respect people for wanting bonuses. However my initial reasoning for the post has derailed since my point was not what many in here now are arguing.

The point is not bonus or not, and if you are a person not asking for free chips this thread do not apply to you at all - honestly. Some of us after a long period of deposits, and low payout, feel that further deposits is a dumb thing to do since obviously history tells us whatwill happend. In this event we kindly ask CS for a little attention, to keep us going. Given the scenario, usually CS will accomodate with this, free chips with requirements. However - the gesture - that you do get a little - is usually enough for the player (that is my kind of player) to come back and deposit more when you have more funds available. After all - if you do want to keep wagering at casinos and keep losing - you might aswell do it where they look after you when your down.

Again - my question is the definition of being down. By this reasoning in a casinogroup, take Spin Palace as example, if I won 5K at Mumys Gold, losing at Spin Palace would not give me any credits since I am still ahead at Mumys Gold.

Maby I am the only one having interest in theese matters, however I still havn't seen a satisfactory explernation why giving free chips to winning customers is bad for business.

Will I play more, sure I will. Will I deposit at casinos I know will not be able to throw free chips at me if I lose big, no. I will still deposit - however somewhere else. Since this is a protective, most likely, descission from the casino - how is this in the casinos best interest losing a custome over a few free credits?

I also notice that no casino representatives has commented anything in this thread, and they probably wont either, which means this thread is pretty much over. I love to hear other players views, so don't be offended by me asking you not to comment further, but as I noted earlier what we believe has nothing to do or does not affect anything in theese descissions in the end. I could state the earth is flat, I could say it a million times, it's still round.

I guess this is one of those questions that will never be answered in public.

 

[I BEEN THERE]

kimms said:

Maby I am the only one having interest in theese matters, however I still havn't seen a satisfactory explernation why giving free chips to winning customers is bad for business.

I highly doubt you are the only one interested in this matter. This should be a very important issue to ALL whether or not you ever take a bonus. Every single player wants to be appreciated and acknowledged at some point they are valued by the Casino, Bingo Site etc.. It is not so hard for ANY site to say thank you ( although these days it is ). As for ASSUMING that asking for or expecting a bonus means you have a problem, I disagree. I think it is simply good business to offer~! Bottom line, if not for the players, they would not be around. This is not like a grocery store where as people have to eat or a utility they must have. It is a play at your own risk ( game of chance ) that in the end we ALL lose, unless of course we hit & run and sites won't like that too much. Sadly, that is what they are now asking for by NOT acknowledging ALL their supporting players !

I BEEN THERE

 

[Jasminebed]

At my favourite land based casinos, you have to ask for meal comps. I get coupons and room offers by mail or email as well, and it was a while before I knew you could ask for extras.

 

[steinhaug]

It is a play at your own risk ( game of chance ) that in the end we ALL lose, unless of course we hit & run and sites won't like that too much. Sadly, that is what they are now asking for by NOT acknowledging ALL their supporting players !

The irony, by asking to close the account one suddenly gets the attention and service one would expect after losing in the first place. While this should be considered something, I can't help thinking of the double standard it really shows. The damage has already been done, unfortunately!

To bad no industry people would like to grab a piece of this argument, I would love to listen to some business logic and how they make money this way!