32red, WH, Unibet and Betsson -some info.

[rainmaker]

I like to read annual reports. I will not bore you with a lot of figures. But some things might be of interest.


32 Red plc

Active customers

2010 30 933
2009 25 187


Betsson AB

Active customers

2010 300 000
2009 288 000


Unibet group

Active customers

2010 308,872 (Q4)
2009 365 865 (Q4)



Betsson is expanding to new markets. They have entered an agreement with the objective to establish operations in China, together with a Chinese state owned company . Betsson has also development centers in the Philippines, Malta, Sweden, Ukraine and India. Betsson already offers 19 different languages on their website, will it ever ends ?

William Hill had a really good year, even though they lost a legal dispute with 32Red. In contrast to 32red, William Hill did not use any space in its annual report to talk about this Anyway, profit after tax increased from £81,2M (2009) to £156,0M (2010). Strange that they still use two days to reply by e-mail.

Unibet had a profit after tax of £32.4M (2010). PAT in 2009 was £26,8. Unibet had an excellent growth in mobile betting. I have never used my cellular phone for betting, but there are apparently people who do. Maybe I'm just old-fashioned.

For 32Red, the profit before tax increased by 98% to £1.05m (2009: £0.53m)

 

[jod5413]

I wish we could see how many "active players" each different casino has. That would be interesting.

 

[rainmaker]

Just an addition; an active customer is a player who has made one or more deposits within a specified timeline. For example, Unibet Group has about 5 million registered players. 308,872 of them was active in Q4.

 

[ReignOfLight]

Interesting stuff...

hi Rainmaker,

I was trying to find good intel on gambling online business, but it's super-confidential.
These are the first telling numbers for me. With 32Red it seems to work $350/client/year, but I bet 90% of clients there are 'dormant' anyway.

I'd love to find out more about this business to find out if it's worth to invest. it seems very difficult to deal with these companies (I tried to talk to Microgaming and Playtech) and get a good info.

I'm also wondering if it's worth to hire gambling advisor (they charge about $1500/day)

I'd appreciate some help here

Best Regards
RJ

 

[ReignOfLight]

ups - that means that each of them made at least one deposit within a year? It's still not neccessarily overly active player, but that means 32red has to have about 0.5m customers with 30k playing making deposit at least once a year.

 

[rainmaker]

Hello RJ.

Microgaming is based (hidden) in Isle of Man, and they are even afraid of their own shadow in my opinion.

But there are many publicly traded casinos and providers that by law must publish financial statements and other information. You will get quite a lot information by reading those.

For example. Betsson AB has the stock symbol "betsb". You can google it and find a lot of financial information. Or you might want to go to their "investor" page on www.betsson.com. Other publicly listed casinos are e.g. Bwin and Betfair.

Both Playtech and Net Entertainment are two examples of publicly traded casino providers.

I know that "jstrike" (member of this forum) is also interested in the dream of opening a casino. You might want to talk to him. He knows a lot about technical things.

Casinos are using the term "active players" different. You can probably send a PM to the rep from 32red and ask

 

[KasinoKing]

It's worth noting that Betsson and Unibet are pretty big & well established sports books in the EU - and so those customer numbers are definitely NOT all casino players!
32Red is a much lesser known Sports Book - and so most of their customers probably ARE casino or Poker players.

KK

 

[rainmaker]

Yes KasinoKing, you're absolutely right

the figures are not meant for comparison between the different groups

 

[baldidiot]

For 32Red, the profit before tax increased by 98% to £1.05m (2009: £0.53m)

That's surprisingly low - I thought 32Red were way bigger than that?

 

[Casinomeister]

...Microgaming is based (hidden) in Isle of Man, and they are even afraid of their own shadow in my opinion...

Actually, MGS is about as open as you'll get being a privately owned company. They have a very high profile at most industry events, and make themselves available to answer questions and are responsive to suggestions. I've been to their offices at the IOM a couple of times and plan to go there in the next six months or so.

They have no fear of their own shadow

That's surprisingly low - I thought 32Red were way bigger than that?

But if you had the choice of going to McDonalds for a meal, or to the cozy mom-and-pop across the street, where would you go?

Sometimes "big" doesn't equate to "better".

 

[baldidiot]

But if you had the choice of going to McDonalds for a meal, or to the cozy mom-and-pop across the street, where would you go?

Sometimes "big" doesn't equate to "better".

I totally agree

I just thought that they were bigger - what with all the TV adverts we see for them over here.

 

[rainmaker]

Actually, MGS is about as open as you'll get being a privately owned company. They have a very high profile at most industry events, and make themselves available to answer questions and are responsive to suggestions. I've been to their offices at the IOM a couple of times and plan to go there in the next six months or so.

They have no fear of their own shadow

Thanks for the comment mister Meister

I have a question, who owns MG ?

 

[rainmaker]

Thanks for the comment mister Meister

I have a question, who owns MG ?

I forgot to add, "afraid of their own shadow"- was about financial information. Not the level of marketing. I have no doubt that they have a high profile at most industry events.